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Message no. 1
From: The Deb Decker <RJR96326@****.UTULSA.EDU>
Subject: Revised Ammunition Post (2.2)
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 1993 03:43:31 -0500
Rob, consider this an update to my previous post. It includes the explosive
re-write, cost/availability, and legality ratings. You can can delete the
last one.
Ammunition

Design: Consolidated Ammo
Author: J Roberson
E-Mail: RJR96326@****.utulsa.edu
Description: Consolidated Ammo provides an alternate set of rules for
both ammunition mentioned in the game and left out of it, including:
AP, APDS, Explosive, HEAP, Hollow Point, Flechette, Teflon-coated, and
Depleted Uranium.

>>>>>[Even the greatest pacifist in the modern age is aware of who
manufactures
guns in the world. Names like Ares, Colt, and Fichetti have become synonimous
with Death by Kinetic Energy. Police reports, the news, and other media have
always give the manufacturer with the name of the gun. But who can name the
maker of the bullets themselves? Without bullets, those big names would be
so much dead weight on dead meat. Today we've put together a report on
Consolidated Ammo, Inc, supplier of small arms munitions the world over
and considered a leader in the industry and the standard against which all
others are compared.. Our guide is Wesley Neville Smith.

"Call me Wes"

Very well. Could you describe your ammunition to us?

"Certainly. Here's a copy of our pamphlet,"See Dick Die".

Odd title.

"It's meant for kindergarteners, to introduce them to the wonderful and
colorful world of handguns. It's quite successful."

Armor
Let's talk about armor, shall we? Today's armor is measured in both
its ability to stop high-speed kinetic damage and any sort of edged penetration.
These are the Ballistic and Impact ratings of armor.
Ballistic armor is made of a high-tech polymer that is woven together
to for a mesh. Imagine cloth, which consists of a number of strings woven
together. You can't poke a whole through it very easily with a pencil
eraser, not unless you poke very hard. But a knife will slip through with
little pressure. Ballistic armor is the same way; only very powerful
bullets can smash their way through the weave, but sharp objects like
knives and arrows will slip through with no trouble.
That's why they add Impact armor. This is hardened plates that
work like traditional armor; they offer a solid barier that cannot be
penetrated easily. It's weakness is its rigidity; at a certain point, it
will shatter or fail. Bullets tend to have the speed to punch holes through
this stuff, which is why you have ballistic armor to spread their energy out
over the surface, resulting in less force per square inch.
This lecture on armor waas brought to you so that you can see why
some of the rounds below work the way they do.


Standard round
List Damage
The standard round is made of lead. It can be cased or caseless.

General Armor-Piercing round
-2 Ballistic
This is different from APDS (described below). Instead of firing a saboted
sub-calibre round, the bullet is made of denser materials (Tungsten or
Depleted Uranium) and given a sharp point. It does not splatter as easy as
lead bullets. resulting in less of its force being spread out by ballistic
armor.

Armor-Piercing Discarding Sabot (APDS)
Goes against Impact rather than Ballistic
This is a sub-calibre round. Imagine a tungsten-carbide nail held in
place by plastic that flies away in flight. It flies like a small high-
speed arrow, thin and pointed to go right through ballistic armor. It
is resisted with Impact armor. Similar to Needle rounds in NAGRL, but
effective against up to 5 points of Impact. Useless vs vehicles.

Flechette
+1 wound level on unarmored targets; Resist with higher of Ballistic or double
Impact. Exactly like in the rules.
This is a number of tiny flechettes, like pellets from a shotgun. Unlike
APDS, they do not have penetrate armor efficiently because they have a
very erratic trajectory and little individual mass. They shred unarmored
people, but who doesn't wear armor these days?
Additionally, Flechettes don't fly as far as normal bullets. Treat them
as having a choke setting equal to the Power of the standard round. (SR2
p 95).

AP Flechette
+1 wound level; resist with Impact.
These work exactly like flechettes, but are stabilized in flight and
made of denser materials. They don't lose power as easily and consequently
don't have as difficult a time with penetrating armor.

Explosive
-2 Power; Special
An explosive warhead is mounted in the bullet. It detonates on contact,
adding slightly to the power of the bullet. If it detonates in meat, woe
be the casualty of war.
A clean miss is a clean miss. If you can stage the
ballistic damage to nothing with Combat Pool alone, you are not affected
by the explosive at all. If you stage it to nothing using body dice, you
take the external (4M) explosion using body, remaining combat pool, and external
bioware such as dermal armor and orthoskin to. Impact armor protects. If you take damage
from the
ballistic round, you must resist the internal 4S explosion with nothing but Body Dice;
Bone Lacing and other internal 'ware will help, but not Dermal Armor, Orthoskin,
or armor worn.

AttackerUs successes do NOT stage explosive damage.

This round is prohibited by most conventions on modern warfare but is still
in use by vioent revolutionaries, terrorists, and smaller nations, as well as
clandestine operations for more advanced nations and corporations.

High-Explosive Armor Piercing (HEAP)
Special
The explosive is placed behind a more stable penetrator, negating the
-2 Power for the inital attack. It is otherwise the same as the regular
HE round.

Hollow Point
+1 wound level vs people only, +2 Ballistic Armor
There is a myth that Hollow Point is the standard round of our century.
Given that they are relatively ineffective against armor, that is simply
not the case. When they hit, air is compressed in the bullet tip, which then
expands the round, increasing the surface and resulting in greater damage.
However, the wider surface's kinetic energy is more easily absorbed by
armor.


Tungsten/Depleted Uranium Core
+1/+2 power
This option is already assumed for AP and APDS, and would be counter-
productive on exploding and hollow point rounds. The size of Flechette
makes their material moot. However, standard bullets can be forged of
Tungsten or DU for a general increase in power. Unlike AP, they are not
brought to a point. Tungsten is +1, DUC is +2.

Teflon coating
Halve Ballistic, -1 wound level.
This coating keeps the bullet from losing it's shape, making ballistic
armor much easier to penetrate. However,it also tends to continue
traveling in a straight line, meaning it doesn't tumble and spin as much,
which is what causes so much of a bullet's damage. It goes right on through.
It may only be applied to standard, Tungsten and DUC rounds.

Incendiary Rounds
+2 Ballistic; Special
Theses contain a hot chemical that continues to burn, even after
penetrating the body. The effect continues for 3 rounds. At the start of
each round, roll Body dice (no combat pool) against a 6L attack.

AP Incendiary Rounds
Special
As above, but no penalty vs armor.

Silver Bullets
Double Ballistic; Silver Allergy
Very popular with paranormal hunters and certain magical groups.

Ammunition (per 10 rounds)
Conc Damage Wt Avail Cost SI
Standard 8 Weapon .5 2/24h 20 .75
Gen AP 8 -2 Bal .75 4/4d 50 2
APDS 8 Impact .25 14/14d 70 4
Flechette 8 See rules .5 3/36h 100 .8
AP Flech 8 Impact .5 6/3d 150 3.5
Explosive 8 Special 1 16/21d 150 4
HEAP 8 Special 1 18/21d 200 5
Hollow Point 8 +1 wound .5 3/24 30 1
Tungsten 8 +1 Power .6 6/6d 50 1.5
DUC 8 +2 Power .75 8/12d 75 2
Teflon 8 Halve Bal Rnd +2 +25 3
Incendiary 8 +2 Bal;Special .75 8/48h 75 2
AP Incend 8 Special .75 10/48h 100 3
Silver 8 Allergy .5 6/6d 50 2

Legality
All legal except:
General AP 4-L
APDS 3-L
AP Flechette 5-L
Explosive 2-L
HEAP 2-L
DUC 4-L
Teflon 3-L
Incendiary 4-L
AP Incendiary 3-L






Well, that's certainly a good-sized array in your arsenal of democracy.

"Capitalism. We defend the free market now, not free government."

"Of course."]<<<<
--Guns 'n' Ammo ELectronic Edition Aug 2054
Message no. 2
From: "Jason Carter, Nightstalker" <CARTER@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Revised Ammunition Post (2.2)
Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1993 20:25:01 -0700
J Roberson posted:

>>Explosive
>>-2 Power; Special
>> An explosive warhead is mounted in the bullet. It detonates on
>>contact, adding slightly to the power of the bullet. If it detonates in meat,
>>woe be the casualty of war.

I think we've been here before...

>> A clean miss is a clean miss. If you can stage the ballistic damage
>>to nothing with Combat Pool alone, you are not affected by the explosive at
>>all.

Duh!

>>If you stage it to nothing using body dice, you take the external (4M)
>>explosion using body, remaining combat pool, and external bioware such as
>>dermal armor and orthoskin to. Impact armor protects.

Wait a minute! Your saying that even if I reduce the damage to nothing that
I still take damage. I feel that M-Word creeping up.

And you resist the external explosion with body and remaining combat pool! What
remaining combat pool! You just used it to resist the attack in the first
place! And you just used your Body to reduce the damage to nothing, yet you
have to roll again!

>>If you take damage from the ballistic round, you must resist the internal 4S
>>explosion with nothing but Body Dice; Bone Lacing and other internal 'ware
>>will help, but not Dermal Armor, Orthoskin, or armor worn.

If you don't resist the damage fully in the first place you take even more
damage! And your still rolling Body dice again! And who says that just because
you took damage from the "ballistic round" that it got past your armor? You
can be killed by a bullet that never penetrates your armor.

I'm sorry old buddy, but this is a Munchkin Round. Hit the target and he has
to make two damage resistance test! Internal or External explosion? This is
too complicated for being hit with just one bullet.

Put your GURPS High Tech away and come back to Shadowrun! If +1 Power is too
little for an explosive round (actually I agree about that) why don't you just
make it something like +1 Damage Level instead of making a overcomplicated and
munchkin rules system?

See Ya in Shadows, "I can count the number of days I've worked
Jason J Carter since graduation on one hand." - ME!
The Nightstalker Carter@***.EDU
Message no. 3
From: "Robert A. Hayden" <hayden@*******.MANKATO.MSUS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Revised Ammunition Post (2.2)
Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1993 23:04:43 -0500
Can anyone give me the stats for a nuclear-tipped HMG round?

Thanks.

{[> Robert A. Hayden ____ <[} Question Authority
{[> \ /__ <]} -=-=-
{[> aq650@****.INS.CWRU.Edu \/ / <]} Finger for PGP 2.3a Public Key
{[> hayden@*******.mankato.msus.edu \/ <]} # include <std_disclaimer.h>
-=-=-=-=-=-
(GEEK CODE 1.0.1) GSS d- -p+(---) c++(++++) l++ u++ e+/* m++(*)@ s-/++
n-(---) h+(*) f+ g+ w++ t++ r++ y+(*)

Further Reading

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