| From: | Avenger <Avenger@*******.DEMON.CO.UK> |
|---|---|
| Subject: | Final note - from me anyway - was re: Ehran's Speech - as |
| Date: | Fri, 25 Jul 1997 03:18:53 +0100 |
little bit away from the original purpose of the post, buexpected when
enquiring minds get together.
I'll not carry the conversation on myself, as I really don't want to
have to dig around in this pile of paperwork I call a desk and find
references and other such things just to carry an argument that is
essentially pointless.
The problem with using real life to reflect a game is that it can't be
done. And I was wrong to use RL examples to extrapolate concepts for
Shadowrun, and indirectly the list. However, this is not to say that
at another time and place I would not continue the conversations. There
are interesting thoughts and ideas a plenty in this thread, and although
it holds a great deal of interest for me, (and yes I admit I was
"Danikenising" for the sake of it)it isn't really fitting for this list
or Shadowtk, which the original post concerned.
Whether FASA ever explain their decision to link Shadowrun and Earth
Dawn, something that I personally consider to be a gross mistake is only
known by them, we can speculate on this for many months and still not
really achieve an answer that will likely cut in with FASA view.
I do know that Mike Mulvihill has an attitude towards Immortal Elves and
their world shaking efforts that melds with many others. he hates it.
So I don't really expect much to happen withint he world that will
refelct their influence. Hopefully he'll bring Shadowrun back down into
the realms of the darkness first promised by the game, at least during
his tenureship of the throne.
I will apologise to Jeffrey Mach regarding the flippant comments towards
Christianity. They were a little too generic to have been used
successfully and it wasn't until I re-read what I'd written (after
posting) that I realised how loose those statements were. Nuff said on
that subject.
Regarding the suggestions to go to the library. No need. I have a wife
with a degree in archeology/geology and her books are within reach if I
can be bothered to get off my butt and walk across the room :) however,
being basically a lazy git, I didn't. If I do get into this kind of
conversation again, I promise all concerned, I will not be quite so
"generic" in my comments.
One thing that was mislaid along the route of this thread is that much
of the speculation used should have been in relation to the game world,
not real life. Believe me I am more than well aware that things are a
bit more cut and dried in our time than I admitted, but... as has been
the experience of science, and I'm sure of the people on this list,
things are disproved, reinforced and discovered on a relatively regular
basis.
The exploration of this planet is admittedly something that is quite
extensively covered. However, although satellites do exist that can see
deeper into the deserts and oceans, though our knowledge is great
concerning this planet there is still a lot to be discovered. That may
be only my opinion and not one that is generally agreed with, but things
are discovered that we had no knowledge of, things that logically we
believed couldn't exist. for example the "life-form" that lives in a
toxic area of the sea next to volcanic outlets. Supposedly these areas
were unihabitable. OK, that's a poor illustration when the main
conversation centred around civilisations, but it fits in a way.
The Israelis are digging around in the desert and finding buried
sections of cities, presumably that have been there from biblical times,
I can only wonder what else is buried under the sands. Or for that
matter what is really contained within the ice of Antarctica. Probably
nothing, but maybe something wonderous.
Deep sea exploration is going ahead in leaps and bounds. Yet even with
new technology, it still takes time to search. For example, JG Ballards
search for the Titanic. There are still mysteries on this planet that
we haven't found, still things to be discovered things to be learned. I
find it difficult to accept that we can be so confident that we know so
much, when there are still things that aren't fully explored.
Another thing is that technology in the form of satellite imaging is
albeit stunning, not 100% reliable. I use here an example of an Incan
city, it was discovered by an explorer earlier this century, but
unfortunately his maps were either lost or destroyed. The city has
remained hidden from other expeditions, aerial reconnaissance and
satellite imaging. It's there, they know it is, just not where.
I'm rambling a little bit, (you may have noticed) <grin> but I still
like to see this planet as something we are still learning about, still
coming to grips with the scale of things here, and I still think ther
are things that we have not discovered yet that will alter the way
scientists et al will look at things in the future.
A piece of martian rock with possible evidence of bacterial life was
found and instigated the resurge of interest in exploration and
investigation of our system. This very investigation and exploration
will have dramatic effects on the way we see things, though I don't
suppose we'll be lucky enough to find evidence of another civilisation,
it is not beyond the realms of possibility, just highly improbable. I
vaguely recall a news thingy were a couple of things that the rover has
"unearthed" have altered the way Mars is viewed in the circles that
matter.
Without trying to be insulting or patronising to anyone here, don't you
think it a little arrogant to assume we know nearly everything, when in
actuality we don't, not really. Mankind knows a lot about this planet
and itself, but how much do we _really_ know, compared to what we dont'?
And I don't mean on a system/galatic scale either, just local to our own
planet.
I don't wish to demean the achievements made by mankind. Some of them
are truly staggering. There are other staggering achievements yet to be
made.
Not so long ago, the atom was the smallest building block in nature,
then someone split it, revealing a number of interesting little things
wizzing around inside (yeah OK, I'm being simplistic again, but it's
late), I believe that there is reason to believe that there is something
further into the atom beyond the original discoveries.
Also, wasn't there a program on earlier this year regarding a particle
accelerator somewhere in the states that had discovered a particle they
believed "could" travel faster than light. Rather than breaking up, it
simply vanished or something, yet left a definable trace, or have I
confused myself?
Anyways, I shan't be commenting any further on this thread for the
simple reason that in many ways I am out of my depth in this sort of
thing, I have a workable knowledge of the subject, but it is not of any
great depth. The intention was to speculate on the Shadowrun universe
and try to rationalise some of the things FASA have done to their game
world. I suppose the most rational explanation came from Mark N, and is
the main reason why I am fropping this conversation.
<quote>
Because FASA is _lame_ sometimes? Sorry, but it's the observation that
most directly fits the facts....
</quote>
Thanks Mark for that rational comment from the wilderness.
In retrospect it may be better if the conversation I intended to have
between my characters doesn't actually take place, because it will
basically be re-uttering many of the comments voiced here, and things
that have been said in some of my other posts. A shame, but I don't
personally support an ED/SR crossover, and have denied it's existence in
my RL game, and don't really feel too comfortable with the concept here
either. So, I'll drop it.
I'll find something else for them to argue about. Like robotics,
androids and positronic brains - or something. <grin>
(it's OK, I jest)
I really have no desire to argue genetics (of which I know next to
little) archaeology, (which my wife is better qualified to do) or the
possibilities of intelligent civilised life before our time. Which none
of us are really qualified to do.
One day, the questions asked here will be answered, unfortunately, I
don't think many of us will be around to hear the answers.
That's enough from me. Thanks for the input, thanks for distracting me,
thanks for making me play Daniken again... it's so much fun <not> and
thanks for making my mind up about the character post.
I'll go and delete it from my hard drive this instant.
--
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