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Message no. 1
From: Loki <daddyjim@**********.COM>
Subject: FASA Answers on Red Widow and GAQS
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:02:55 -0700
---FASACorp2@***.com wrote:

Q. Red Widow's special is that she is allowed to TAP, in order to join
the current Shadowrun. I know she sould not turn to join a Shadowrun
that ALREADY has 6 runners. Now what if one runner of a team that
previously held 6 is trashed or fragged, can you then send in Red
Widow to replace him/her?


A. Only 6 Runners can participate in a shadowrun.

~~~~~~~~~~

Ok this set of questions on on a timing issue. Let's say I send in
Lord Torgo and Nightshade on a run. The challenge that gets flipped
over is Yak Attack. Lord Torgo's trait of Anti Social triggers the
alarm. Right now the only spell on Nightshade is Astral Sense, but
I'll sill clean up in combat with Torgo. Realizing this my opponent
plays Green Apple Quicksteps (GAQS) on Torgo to send him home and more
than likely kill off my mage. Questions:

Q. Is it OK timing-wise for him to throw out GAQS at this time? Must a
stinger like GAQS come out as soon as the challenge is turned over,
or at any time while figuring out sleaze or combat?

A. It's okay. He played after the alarm is triggered and before
combat. It just can't be used in the middle of combat.

Q. If GAQS sent Torgo home, is the alarm still triggered from his Anti
Social trait?

A. Yes--if it's played after the alarm is triggered.

Q. I have used GAQS to send a runner home that held the necessary
skill(s) to sleaze a challenge thus triggering the alarm. (i.e. an
opponent has Sam the Sleuth and Nightshade in on a run. The challenge
revealed is Lone Star Patrol. Sam's Street 2 and Stealth would sleaze
it so I toss out a GAQS and get rid of him.) I was just wondering how
the same applies to sending home a runner who has triggered it (the
same might apply to using GAQS on a runner with stealth that triggered
Eyekillers).

A. If you play GAQ when the Challenge is revealed and before the alarm
is triggered, it's okay. People think WAY too hard about timing on
this card. It takes effect when it's played--it's that simple. The
reason you can't use it to "interrupt" a combat is that once combat
begins, it's instantaneous. All da mage is dealt simultaneously so it
can't be interrupted.

I hope that clears it all up for you.

> Jim N.

===
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"You're calling me Bitch like it's a bad thing."
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Message no. 2
From: Michael/Tamara Lorenz-Pease <treehugr@****.ON.ROGERS.WAVE.CA>
Subject: Re: FASA Answers on Red Widow and GAQS
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:46:32 -0400
Loki wrote:
> Q. Red Widow's special is that she is allowed to TAP, in order to join
> the current Shadowrun. I know she sould not turn to join a Shadowrun
> that ALREADY has 6 runners. Now what if one runner of a team that
> previously held 6 is trashed or fragged, can you then send in Red
> Widow to replace him/her?
> A. Only 6 Runners can participate in a shadowrun.


No offence, but this reply does not answer my inital question. We
already knew that we could not send Red Widow in as a 7th runner. We
merely wanted to know if she could be sent in to replace a killed off
runner. By his answer, I am assuming that you can, as "...only 6 Runners
can participate in a shadowrun..." then it looks like you *can* use her
to "top" the team back up to 6....

> A. If you play GAQ when the Challenge is revealed and before the alarm
> is triggered, it's okay. People think WAY too hard about timing on
> this card. It takes effect when it's played--it's that simple. The
> reason you can't use it to "interrupt" a combat is that once combat
> begins, it's instantaneous. All da mage is dealt simultaneously so it
> can't be interrupted.
> I hope that clears it all up for you.

Well, no as far as I am concerned it did not clear it up at all. He
avoided directly answering the SOLE question. Which was, "If Sammy the
Sleuth and team approaches a challenge that SAmmy himself could sleaze,
and no one does anything <ie: casting GAQS until after I have said that
I am sleazing the challenge> can they still cast GAQS and then say, "
SAmmy must return home? Is the challenge sleazed prior to his being sent
home... That was the simple question, and I am afraid that TIMING is
relevant to this card no matter what the FASA people seem to think.

Btw, I am grateful that you sent in my questions Loki :-), I was just
hoping for some clarification. No worries...

Tamara
Message no. 3
From: Loki <daddyjim@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: FASA Answers on Red Widow and GAQS
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:00:51 -0700
---Michael/Tamara Lorenz-Pease wrote:
>
> Loki wrote:
> > Q. Red Widow's special is that she is allowed to TAP, in order to
join
> > the current Shadowrun. I know she sould not turn to join a
Shadowrun
> > that ALREADY has 6 runners. Now what if one runner of a team that
> > previously held 6 is trashed or fragged, can you then send in Red
> > Widow to replace him/her?
> > A. Only 6 Runners can participate in a shadowrun.
>
>
> No offence, but this reply does not answer my inital
question. We
> already knew that we could not send Red Widow in as a 7th runner. We
> merely wanted to know if she could be sent in to replace a killed off
> runner. By his answer, I am assuming that you can, as "...only 6
Runners
> can participate in a shadowrun..." then it looks like you *can* use
her
> to "top" the team back up to 6....

I feel the question was answered. Perhaps it would be better for your
concerns to word it as "only 6 Runners may be comitted to a shadowrun."

Or would you rather I resubmit the question to them once more?

===
@>--,--'--- Loki <gamemstr@********.com>

Fearless Leader of the Shadowrun Trading Card Game Mailing List
Web Page: Poisoned Elves at www.primenet.com/~gamemstr

"You're calling me Bitch like it's a bad thing."
--> CrapGame during the Drive in the Country tournament

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Message no. 4
From: Forrest <eness@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: FASA Answers on Red Widow and GAQS
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:00:54 -0700
---Michael/Tamara Lorenz-Pease <treehugr@****.ON.ROGERS.WAVE.CA> wrote:

[avoiding the 6 runner max. debate for now, I'm still not sure which
way I'm leaning on this one...]


> > A. If you play GAQ when the Challenge is revealed and before the
alarm
> > is triggered, it's okay. People think WAY too hard about timing on
> > this card. It takes effect when it's played--it's that simple. The
> > reason you can't use it to "interrupt" a combat is that once combat
> > begins, it's instantaneous. All da mage is dealt simultaneously so
it
> > can't be interrupted.
> > I hope that clears it all up for you.
>
> Well, no as far as I am concerned it did not clear it up at
all. He
> avoided directly answering the SOLE question. Which was, "If Sammy
the
> Sleuth and team approaches a challenge that SAmmy himself could
sleaze,
> and no one does anything <ie: casting GAQS until after I have said
that
> I am sleazing the challenge> can they still cast GAQS and then say, "
> SAmmy must return home? Is the challenge sleazed prior to his being
sent
> home... That was the simple question, and I am afraid that TIMING is
> relevant to this card no matter what the FASA people seem to think.
>

Once you declare that the challenge is sleazed, it is sleazed. I take
it that you've played M:TG in the past, with all it's spell stacks and
reverse play and what not (not that that's a bad thing :-) ). From
what I understand of the rules of this game, it doesn't exist. So in
your example, if your opponent sends Sam back before you say you've
sleazed it, then Sam is gone and you can't sleaze. If you say the
objective is sleazed before he sends Sam back, then Sam returns to the
safehouse and the rest of the runners move on.

The only question that that leaves, and I'm sure this has been
answered and I just overlooked it. What happens when a Luck of the
Irish (LotI) is played on a LotI. Given the above it would be useless
since the first LotI has already been played and is going to be
trashed anyway. Makes LotI more powerful and the concept of
interrupts goes out the window :( but it also makes the game a bit
simpler :)


#include std.disclaimers
Forrest
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Message no. 5
From: Loki <daddyjim@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: FASA Answers on Red Widow and GAQS
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:12:22 -0700
---Forrest wrote:

<snip>

> The only question that that leaves, and I'm sure this has been
> answered and I just overlooked it. What happens when a Luck of the
> Irish (LotI) is played on a LotI. Given the above it would be
useless
> since the first LotI has already been played and is going to be
> trashed anyway. Makes LotI more powerful and the concept of
> interrupts goes out the window :( but it also makes the game a bit
> simpler :)

I'd say an LotI that is played on another LotI must be played before
the die roll is made to determine the outcome of the first. Once an
LotI is played and the die roll is made to cancel a Special, the
effect has happened, the original LotI is trashed, and it's too late
to do anything about it.

Just trying to keep with the simpler timing methods of the game. ;o)

===
@>--,--'--- Loki <gamemstr@********.com>

Fearless Leader of the Shadowrun Trading Card Game Mailing List
Web Page: Poisoned Elves at www.primenet.com/~gamemstr

"You're calling me Bitch like it's a bad thing."
--> CrapGame during the Drive in the Country tournament
_____________________________________________________________________
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Message no. 6
From: Brett Barksdale <brett@***.ORST.EDU>
Subject: Re: FASA Answers on Red Widow and GAQS
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:58:47 -0700
To be blunt, I have to say that this is the WORST bunch of rulings
I've seen in any card game in a /long/ while.

>Ok this set of questions on on a timing issue. Let's say I send in
>Lord Torgo and Nightshade on a run. The challenge that gets flipped
>over is Yak Attack. Lord Torgo's trait of Anti Social triggers the
>alarm. Right now the only spell on Nightshade is Astral Sense, but
>I'll sill clean up in combat with Torgo. Realizing this my opponent
>plays Green Apple Quicksteps (GAQS) on Torgo to send him home and more
>than likely kill off my mage. Questions:

>Q. Is it OK timing-wise for him to throw out GAQS at this time? Must a
> stinger like GAQS come out as soon as the challenge is turned over,
>or at any time while figuring out sleaze or combat?

>A. It's okay. He played after the alarm is triggered and before
>combat. It just can't be used in the middle of combat.

Ye gods... GAQS now has been promoted to one of the most powerful
cards in the game BY FAR. And this isn't even considering the
/defensive/ uses of this card yet...

This game already has a serious endgame problem with each player ending
up with HORDES of runners. If you allow GAQS to be /this/ effective,
small running groups are toast. Just sit back and kill them off with
GAQS by sending the right runner home.

>Q. If GAQS sent Torgo home, is the alarm still triggered from his Anti
>Social trait?

>A. Yes--if it's played after the alarm is triggered.

Great, another advantage for GAQS. Get the most out of it. Set the
alarm off AND send the big gun home.

You know, kids. GAQS only costs TWO FRAGGIN NUYEN. Can you say "game
play imbalance". If you can't yet, play a few more games using this
ruling. You'll learn, trust me...

There are a host of other stingers that cost more and don't screw over
an enemy running team even HALF as bad as GAQS can using this
interpretation.

I suppose I shouldn't be too surprised, though. It took FASA actual
playtesting to realize that False Mentor, costing only 4 nuyen and
not being unique, would unbalance and dominate a game.

Duh. :-)

I think it took us about 10 seconds to read it and realize its implications.

>Q. I have used GAQS to send a runner home that held the necessary
>skill(s) to sleaze a challenge thus triggering the alarm. (i.e. an
>opponent has Sam the Sleuth and Nightshade in on a run. The challenge
>revealed is Lone Star Patrol. Sam's Street 2 and Stealth would sleaze
>it so I toss out a GAQS and get rid of him.) I was just wondering how
>the same applies to sending home a runner who has triggered it (the
>same might apply to using GAQS on a runner with stealth that triggered
>Eyekillers).

>A. If you play GAQ when the Challenge is revealed and before the alarm
>is triggered, it's okay. People think WAY too hard about timing on
>this card. It takes effect when it's played--it's that simple. The
>reason you can't use it to "interrupt" a combat is that once combat
>begins, it's instantaneous. All da mage is dealt simultaneously so it
>can't be interrupted.

What kind of stupid *$&^%_)#! ruling is this? Is Jim SERIOUSLY claiming
that there is no hard and fast ruling on timing for GAQS? How the /hell/
does one determine that infinitesimal time between when the challenge
card is flipped up and when it registers in the players brains that a
challenge has not been sleazed? Is the first person to yell out "no
sleaze"? What if a person incorrectly yells out "no sleaze" every time
someone ELSE is on a run just to make sure that they're first? Do we
now have to have rules to punish such actions? If no punishment, then
there's no fraggin reason NOT to yell out "no sleaze" each and every
time.

This is just the tip of the iceberg if one subscribes to this idiotic
interpretation of timing in SRTCG.

I don't mean to sound this nasty, but FASA needs to RETHINK THEIR
POSITION on this in a big bad way. This ruling effectively ruins
the game - almost as bad as the cheap, non-unique GAQS.

I understand the desire to have simpler timing rules than Magic, but
this is ridiculous.

>I hope that clears it all up for you.

I don't think so. :-(

- Brett
Message no. 7
From: Phillip G Jaros <phillip_jaros@**.US.SWISSBANK.COM>
Subject: Re: FASA Answers on Red Widow and GAQS
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:01:40 CDT
Brett Barksdale <brett@***.ORST.EDU> wrote:
>
>To be blunt, I have to say that this is the WORST bunch of rulings
>I've seen in any card game in a /long/ while.

I'ld have to concure.

>>Ok this set of questions on on a timing issue. Let's say I send in
>>Lord Torgo and Nightshade on a run. The challenge that gets flipped
>>over is Yak Attack. Lord Torgo's trait of Anti Social triggers the
>>alarm. Right now the only spell on Nightshade is Astral Sense, but
>>I'll sill clean up in combat with Torgo. Realizing this my opponent
>>plays Green Apple Quicksteps (GAQS) on Torgo to send him home and more
>>than likely kill off my mage. Questions:
>
>>Q. Is it OK timing-wise for him to throw out GAQS at this time? Must a
>> stinger like GAQS come out as soon as the challenge is turned over,
>>or at any time while figuring out sleaze or combat?
>
>>A. It's okay. He played after the alarm is triggered and before
>>combat. It just can't be used in the middle of combat.
>
>Ye gods... GAQS now has been promoted to one of the most powerful
>cards in the game BY FAR. And this isn't even considering the
>/defensive/ uses of this card yet...
>
>This game already has a serious endgame problem with each player ending
>up with HORDES of runners. If you allow GAQS to be /this/ effective,
>small running groups are toast. Just sit back and kill them off with
>GAQS by sending the right runner home.

THat is how I've been running my decks since I first played the game in
July. Three of us at the Chicago Comicon were given both sets of
demo decks. We went home wrote down the contents of the decks and built
3 more specialized decks to play with. I went with the low on characters,
high on specials/challenges deck, which is how I've been playing ever since.

>>Q. If GAQS sent Torgo home, is the alarm still triggered from his Anti
>>Social trait?
>
>>A. Yes--if it's played after the alarm is triggered.
>
>Great, another advantage for GAQS. Get the most out of it. Set the
>alarm off AND send the big gun home.
>
>You know, kids. GAQS only costs TWO FRAGGIN NUYEN. Can you say "game
>play imbalance". If you can't yet, play a few more games using this
>ruling. You'll learn, trust me...
>
>There are a host of other stingers that cost more and don't screw over
>an enemy running team even HALF as bad as GAQS can using this
>interpretation.

Yep GAQS tends to be a NERPs (ie Good for just about every situation... )

>I suppose I shouldn't be too surprised, though. It took FASA actual
>playtesting to realize that False Mentor, costing only 4 nuyen and
>not being unique, would unbalance and dominate a game.

Tis a very nice card, unfortunately I only have the demo deck variety....

>I don't mean to sound this nasty, but FASA needs to RETHINK THEIR
>POSITION on this in a big bad way. This ruling effectively ruins
>the game - almost as bad as the cheap, non-unique GAQS.

I have to agree with you again, GAQS should only take effect before or
after sleazing takes place but not either/or. It's a great card even
with a limitation like that.

This brings me again to the question:

What type of decks do you play? I go with characters that are cheap or
come with free stuff, so I can free up newyen for pumping up challenges
or playing specials....


--
Phil Jaros 888888888 Chicago Tech Support
jarosph@**.us.swissbank.com O=O=O=O=O SBC Warburg
___________aaaaaaaaaaaaa___________

___...aaaad8888888888888888p"""""q8888888888888888baaaa...___
``"""""q8888888888888|
|8888888888888p"""""''
``"""""< `=-~-='
>"""""''
Chakan `| ^ |'
The Forever Man / | =-= | \
/ `__.__' \
Message no. 8
From: Brett Barksdale <brett@***.ORST.EDU>
Subject: Re: FASA Answers on Red Widow and GAQS
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:22:38 -0700
>What type of decks do you play? I go with characters that are cheap or
>come with free stuff, so I can free up newyen for pumping up challenges
>or playing specials....

Random thoughts...

If I'm playing non-competitively, it varies a lot. Various theme
decks based on the character archetypes and the various running
groups I play in/run in SR tabletop are fun.

For competition, head up, I play a 60 card deck with 30 obnoxious
challenges. I've noticed that games get to the point where both
players tend to field large armounts of runners. So, I focus on
challenges that have a good chance to end the run regardless of how
much firepower they bring. (i.e. maglocks, gut check, nets). I
keep 4 riots in each deck to punish when too much damage is absorbed
by opponent and to kill off the 3/2 fame rocker. I utilize bits
of Kromagnus and the 3/3 rocker (because he can handle a single riot).
4 GAQS is a must - even with a sane ruling, much less the GAQS=God
FASA ruling. And, of course, 1 False Mentor. The actual runners I
use depend on theme or what I'm experimenting with, but I definitely
play for quality of runner and not quanity. Body is favored over threat
because being able to soak damage seems more important than dishing
it out against most challenges.
Lucky Wabbit's Foot is a potentially undervalued card because it
is the only thing I know of that 100% splats those annoying Stingers
like GAQS. :-) I tend to save using it for the final push to an
objective which is where everyone saves their stinger for. It's also
nice to have 100% insurance vs. False Mentor.
Rampaging mutant is always fun as well... :-)

In multiplayer games, I cut back to 20 obnoxious challenges out of 60
because you don't need as many. I toss in things like Bugged Deck to
take advantage of enemy deckers (someone always has one... :-) and I
never have a decker of my own (in multiplayer).

- Brett
Message no. 9
From: Bull <chaos@*****.COM>
Subject: Re: FASA Answers on Red Widow and GAQS
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:33:59 -0400
At 04:46 PM 9/12/97 -0400, Michael/Tamara Lorenz-Pease wrote these timeless
words:
>Loki wrote:
>> Q. Red Widow's special is that she is allowed to TAP, in order to join
>> the current Shadowrun. I know she sould not turn to join a Shadowrun
>> that ALREADY has 6 runners. Now what if one runner of a team that
>> previously held 6 is trashed or fragged, can you then send in Red
>> Widow to replace him/her?
>> A. Only 6 Runners can participate in a shadowrun.
>
>
> No offence, but this reply does not answer my inital question. We
>already knew that we could not send Red Widow in as a 7th runner. We
>merely wanted to know if she could be sent in to replace a killed off
>runner. By his answer, I am assuming that you can, as "...only 6 Runners
>can participate in a shadowrun..." then it looks like you *can* use her
>to "top" the team back up to 6....
>
I disagree... It doesn;t say that only 6 runners can particiate at any one
time. It says that only 6 runners can participate. Period.

>> A. If you play GAQ when the Challenge is revealed and before the alarm
>> is triggered, it's okay. People think WAY too hard about timing on
>> this card. It takes effect when it's played--it's that simple. The
>> reason you can't use it to "interrupt" a combat is that once combat
>> begins, it's instantaneous. All da mage is dealt simultaneously so it
>> can't be interrupted.
>> I hope that clears it all up for you.
>
> Well, no as far as I am concerned it did not clear it up at all. He
>avoided directly answering the SOLE question. Which was, "If Sammy the
>Sleuth and team approaches a challenge that SAmmy himself could sleaze,
>and no one does anything <ie: casting GAQS until after I have said that
>I am sleazing the challenge> can they still cast GAQS and then say, "
>SAmmy must return home? Is the challenge sleazed prior to his being sent
>home... That was the simple question, and I am afraid that TIMING is
>relevant to this card no matter what the FASA people seem to think.
>
I think you're still thinking too hard. There is no "response" time, I
think. basically you do things with a challenge in a certain order:

A) Declare you are going to attempt the challenge.

B) Reveal the Challenge.

C) Attempte to sleaze challenge

D) If sleaze attempt fails, deal with any consequences, such as combat,
damage, etc.

GAQ could be played at any point between those steps, but not during any
step. thus, you could play GAQ after the challenge is revealed, but BEFORE
the player says he's sleazing. It's simply a matter of defining and
following the steps, as far as I can see...:]

Bull
--
Bull, aka Steven Ratkovich, aka Rak, aka a lot of others! :]

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Message no. 10
From: Loki <daddyjim@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: FASA Answers on Red Widow and GAQS
Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:33:58 -0700
---Brett Barksdale wrote:
>
> To be blunt, I have to say that this is the WORST bunch of rulings
> I've seen in any card game in a /long/ while.

Would you like to write FASA and offer them your side of the coin?

If so, I'd like to see any response if you could post it.

===
@>--,--'--- Loki <gamemstr@********.com>

Fearless Leader of the Shadowrun Trading Card Game Mailing List
Web Page: Poisoned Elves at www.primenet.com/~gamemstr

"You're calling me Bitch like it's a bad thing."
--> CrapGame during the Drive in the Country tournament
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Message no. 11
From: Loki <daddyjim@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: FASA Answers on Red Widow and GAQS
Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 01:01:51 -0700
---Brett Barksdale wrote:
>
> I don't mean to sound this nasty, but FASA needs to RETHINK THEIR
> POSITION on this in a big bad way. This ruling effectively ruins
> the game - almost as bad as the cheap, non-unique GAQS.
>
> I understand the desire to have simpler timing rules than Magic, but
> this is ridiculous.

This may be an inside joke to those who've played the Shadowrun RPG or
are on the ShadowRN list. Still, does anyone else get the impression
that GAQS = the SRCard version of grounding through a quickening?

:o)

===
@>--,--'--- Loki <gamemstr@********.com>

Fearless Leader of the Shadowrun Trading Card Game Mailing List
Web Page: Poisoned Elves at www.primenet.com/~gamemstr

"You're calling me Bitch like it's a bad thing."
--> CrapGame during the Drive in the Country tournament
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Message no. 12
From: Tony Glinka <glinka@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Re: FASA Answers on Red Widow and GAQS
Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 01:36:01 -0700
Loki wrote:

> This may be an inside joke to those who've played the Shadowrun RPG or
> are on the ShadowRN list. Still, does anyone else get the impression
> that GAQS = the SRCard version of grounding through a quickening?

I am with you on this one. This has got to be the biggest and
messiest topic we have covered on the list to date. In business a few
weeks and we already have the making of a topic for the ages. Though we'll
have to see if it has the power to spark the chaos that a good grounding
through quickening debate brings.
My group of players is mixed on what to do with GAQS and I am afraid
it could get ugly. Even worse is that there is no GM to lay down the
law. :)

Tony
Message no. 13
From: Loki <daddyjim@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: FASA Answers on Red Widow and GAQS
Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:37:32 -0700
---Tony Glinka wrote:
>
> Loki wrote:
>
> > This may be an inside joke to those who've played the Shadowrun
RPG or
> > are on the ShadowRN list. Still, does anyone else get the
impression
> > that GAQS = the SRCard version of grounding through a quickening?
>
> I am with you on this one. This has got to be the biggest and
> messiest topic we have covered on the list to date. In business a
few
> weeks and we already have the making of a topic for the ages. Though
we'll
> have to see if it has the power to spark the chaos that a good
grounding
> through quickening debate brings.
> My group of players is mixed on what to do with GAQS and I am
afraid
> it could get ugly. Even worse is that there is no GM to lay down the
> law. :)

Since neither Skuzzy nor Jim N. are on the list to respond, I've taken
Brett's response to them and hope I'll have some feedback to give you
guys in a few days.

I'd like to get the whole timing/GAQS thing put to bed before it
starts to just linger there and smell like a 1,000 year old carp.

===
@>--,--'--- Loki <gamemstr@********.com>

Fearless Leader of the Shadowrun Trading Card Game Mailing List
Web Page: Poisoned Elves at www.primenet.com/~gamemstr

"You're calling me Bitch like it's a bad thing."
--> CrapGame during the Drive in the Country tournament

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Message no. 14
From: Forrest <eness@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: FASA Answers on Red Widow and GAQS
Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 20:09:17 -0700
---Phillip G Jaros <phillip_jaros@**.US.SWISSBANK.COM> wrote:

[snip]
>
> This brings me again to the question:
>
> What type of decks do you play? I go with characters that are cheap
> or come with free stuff, so I can free up newyen for pumping up
> challenges or playing specials....
>
>

The decks I have so far:
- The GoGo gang (mentioned in another mail message).
- A rigger deck with a couple of mages in support (my first deck since
I got 4 riggers in the first starter ;-) No drones, but 4 riggers :-) )
- A mage/decker deck (untested)
- A decker/bodyguard deck (just got the cards to finish this one this
weekend so I haven't tested it yet)

I also have a couple of deck ideas:
- Uncle Joe/skillsoft (Well actually until I read that ruling from
Skuzzy. I was going to throw in Uncle Joe with a variety of
skillsofts. I would then use a decker to browse the challenges,
jackin what is needed and head on. Once the challenges have been
sleazed I could use Red Widow's ability to back up Uncle Joe to face
the final requirement on the objective.)
- "The Untouchables" (not a very original name I know ;-) Anyway, this
is going to be based on our SR:RPG characters)
- An AmerIndian deck (w/ Macabre, Ghost Who Walks and some shamans.
Throw in some Iron Lungs and I'm hoping that I'll be able to get the
credit everytime and use the Macabres to draw cards.)
- A rocker deck. (I haven't really used them so far so I figure I
should give them a try. Thrash with Sudden Goblinization shouldn't be
that bad :-) )

I find I tend to prefer runners with stamina over anything else. I
try to choose challenges that either automatically end the run, or
have unusual requirements (preferably demo or leadership since those
seem to be "rare" skills). Objectives I still more or less grab at
random. I might have 1 or 2 geared toward the deck, but the others I
just fill in randomly (probably short sighted on my part). I find I
rely more on gear than specials. Usually I put everything else in the
deck and then fill up to 60 with specials. The one exception so far
was the "go go" deck since the Bar Fights and Riots kind of fit the
theme.

As a final note. Something that I discovered by accident in one of my
games this weekend. Stilleto/Eyekiller ;-) Sorry if it seems
obvious, I just happened to throw both of them in the same deck and it
came up...

Later!
Forrest
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Message no. 15
From: Matb <mbreton@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Re: FASA Answers on Red Widow and GAQS
Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 07:42:49 -0700
> I also have a couple of deck ideas:
> - Uncle Joe/skillsoft (Well actually until I read that ruling from
> Skuzzy. I was going to throw in Uncle Joe with a variety of
> skillsofts. I would then use a decker to browse the challenges,
> jackin what is needed and head on.

I've been shying away from Recon lately - there are more than a few
effects which can screw it up (Knock Knock, Security Decker, even Bugged
Deck), while there are 'untouchable' cards like the Corporate Secretary,
Microskimmer, and Watcher Spirit also out there. (Crawler Drone is kind
of buggy: would you Knock Knock the Drone or the Runner controlling it?)

> - An AmerIndian deck (w/ Macabre, Ghost Who Walks and some shamans.
> Throw in some Iron Lungs and I'm hoping that I'll be able to get the
> credit everytime and use the Macabres to draw cards.)
> - A rocker deck. (I haven't really used them so far so I figure I
> should give them a try. Thrash with Sudden Goblinization shouldn't be
> that bad :-) )

Certainly can't hurt none. Works well with the skillsoft deck you
mentioned above - goblinization in the CCG doesn't rip out cyber at all.

> I find I tend to prefer runners with stamina over anything else. I
> try to choose challenges that either automatically end the run, or
> have unusual requirements (preferably demo or leadership since those
> seem to be "rare" skills). Objectives I still more or less grab at
> random. I might have 1 or 2 geared toward the deck, but the others I
> just fill in randomly (probably short sighted on my part). I find I
> rely more on gear than specials. Usually I put everything else in the
> deck and then fill up to 60 with specials. The one exception so far
> was the "go go" deck since the Bar Fights and Riots kind of fit the
> theme.
>
> As a final note. Something that I discovered by accident in one of my
> games this weekend. Stilleto/Eyekiller ;-) Sorry if it seems
> obvious, I just happened to throw both of them in the same deck and it
> came up...

There's the question of whether Stiletto can effect other player's
runners, but he seems designed for this combo. This combo works best
with Crossfire or Up and Over, where you can make the Eyekiller really
fearsome!
Message no. 16
From: "Ojaste,James [NCR]" <James.Ojaste@**.GC.CA>
Subject: Re: FASA Answers on Red Widow and GAQS
Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 11:22:19 -0400
Loki[SMTP:daddyjim@**********.COM] wrote:
> ---Brett Barksdale wrote:
> >
> > I don't mean to sound this nasty, but FASA needs to RETHINK THEIR
> > POSITION on this in a big bad way. This ruling effectively ruins
> > the game - almost as bad as the cheap, non-unique GAQS.
> >
> > I understand the desire to have simpler timing rules than Magic, but
> > this is ridiculous.
>
> This may be an inside joke to those who've played the Shadowrun RPG or
> are on the ShadowRN list. Still, does anyone else get the impression
> that GAQS = the SRCard version of grounding through a quickening?

Heh heh. I'm with you there... Any idea if they're going
to bring out PhysAds? I'm looking to kick some Sammy butt!
<ducks flying fish>

James

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Thwap!