Back to the main page

Mailing List Logs for ShadowRN

Message no. 1
From: Debbie <joew@******.NET>
Subject: Hello...and a few questions
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 1997 01:11:59 -0600
Hi...been lurking for awhile and thought it was high time to pipe in a
few of our questions. We will also be posting a trade list very soon.

1. Can you have more than four of a single objective in a deck?

2. Can you play two Troll Bouncers on one location to force your
opponent to pay 2Y?

3. Can Hawkwind use her Biotech ability between the last challenge and
the objective?

4. Once you face the last challenge on an objective, can you pull out,
or do you have to attempt to face the requirement of the objective?


Thanx in advance.
Joe and Debbie
Message no. 2
From: Crane <jack9@*********.NET>
Subject: Re: Hello...and a few questions
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 1997 00:03:40 -0800
NOTICE: SHADIS no longer carries back-issues of the magazine that had the
Fuchi Industries Promo.
If you wish to order from me, they will now be 10$ each and there are very
few! If you call SHADIS (according to who you get and what their mood is)
you may even get them mailed for free-5$. Don't call them on Tuesdays,
that's the day they choose for no work all play as they playtest everything
the will be reviewing. I know some of the people there, and I saw that they
had some of the promos left a couple weeks ago, so that's all I can tell you!

Now on to the game:
I actually Read the Rulebook all the way thru!

So I have questions-

1) When you hit Runners on Retainer, it states in the rulebook that when
Runner vs. Runner combat occurs, afterward, both teams go home. For Runners
on Retainer too?

1.1)Is having someone alive after 1 round vs. the opposing team considered
"defeating" Runners on Retainer?

1.2)The rulebook states that a runner goes home after Runner vs. Runner
combat and returns to the safehouse turned or unturned. Is this implying
that a runner can fight/be fought (a la bar fight) if turned?

1.2.1)Is it possible to be turned AND in the Safehouse?

1.3)How many (and in what state) of your runners participate as 'the
runners on retainer'?

2)Let me make sure I heard this right...Can you have all/some of your
deckers visit Fuchi and still have your Street Samaurai's go on a Shadowrun?

3)When you trash a challenge, does the alarm trigger?

4)Has there been any FASA ruling on whether you may discard or rearrange or
insert challenges (into your challenge stack) after having placed them?

5)How can I get a hold of who's working on the Netplay Shadowrun:TCG
program (or whatever it's called)?

6)Why isn't everyone submitting their own Shadowrun Card Characers!

Jack Crow - Street Samaurai
6/2
Leadership
<Picture> Street
<Here >
Prime Runner Human
Jack Crow adds 1 to all
rolls required by equipment
he is holding.
Message no. 3
From: Crane <jack9@*********.NET>
Subject: Re: Hello...and a few questions
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 1997 00:04:58 -0800
At 01:11 AM 12/8/97 -0600, you wrote:
>Hi...been lurking for awhile and thought it was high time to pipe in a
>few of our questions. We will also be posting a trade list very soon.
>
>1. Can you have more than four of a single objective in a deck?

Yes.


>2. Can you play two Troll Bouncers on one location to force your
>opponent to pay 2Y?
>
I hesitate <why>? Yes.


>3. Can Hawkwind use her Biotech ability between the last challenge and
>the objective?
>
Yes.

>4. Once you face the last challenge on an objective, can you pull out,
>or do you have to attempt to face the requirement of the objective?
>
Yes, you may stop before the objective.

>
>Thanx in advance.
>Joe and Debbie
>
>
Message no. 4
From: "Abadia, Teos" <Teos.Abadia@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Hello...and a few questions
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 1997 11:40:10 -0500
> ----------
> From: Crane[SMTP:jack9@*********.NET]
>
> NOTICE: SHADIS no longer carries back-issues of the magazine that had
> the
> Fuchi Industries Promo.
>
They will give you a few if you subscribe to the magazine!

> 1.2)The rulebook states that a runner goes home after Runner vs.
> Runner
> combat and returns to the safehouse turned or unturned. Is this
> implying
> that a runner can fight/be fought (a la bar fight) if turned?
>
Read the paragraph right above that (page 68): " Only unturned runners
may voluntarily enter combat with other runners. Turn runners to attack
opposing runners." So, if you have unturned runners, you may use them
to intercept or to play a Wanted! card, or turn Tempest, or in Bar
Fight, Drive By, or a program if they are a decker. For the defending
player, any card can be the target (such as a turned character can be
affected by Riots, or Tempest's attack, or Wanted!, etc.). If the card
is unturned, it remains unturned after the combat (so, if you fight
because someone played Wanted! on you, you take damage, and if you
survive you are unturned).

> 1.2.1)Is it possible to be turned AND in the Safehouse?
>
From what we have discussed on this list, no. A turned runner is not
"present" with unturned runners in the Safehouse.

> 2)Let me make sure I heard this right...Can you have all/some of your
> deckers visit Fuchi and still have your Street Samaurai's go on a
> Shadowrun?
>
Topic is up for debate and no official stance has been heard from FASA.
It hinges on the wording. So far, I have heard two say no, one say yes.
(I asked the original question). I would say that you should do
whatever is more balanced in your game (in mine I play that you can't
send others on a regular Shadowrun if you have been to Fuchi) until FASA
responds.

> 3)When you trash a challenge, does the alarm trigger?
Yes. Failure to sleaze means the alarm is triggered unless the card
says otherwise (like Mafia Goons).

> 4)Has there been any FASA ruling on whether you may discard or
> rearrange or
> insert challenges (into your challenge stack) after having placed
> them?
>
You can not rearrange them (see rulebook) or discard them or insert any.
You can look at challenges you played, but once they are down, they are
down until revealed, and the opponent faces the topmost first (unless
using Fastjack).

> 5)How can I get a hold of who's working on the Netplay Shadowrun:TCG
> program (or whatever it's called)?
The address is http://pages.infinit.net/harl/srtcg.html , and his e-mail
is on that page.
Message no. 5
From: Matb <mbreton@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Re: Hello...and a few questions
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 1997 17:45:59 -0800
> > 1.2.1)Is it possible to be turned AND in the Safehouse?

Ref. Green Apple Quicksteps: "Target Runner must immediately return to
the safehouse."
Given that the Runner must have turned to leave, the usage of the card
will result in
the Runner being a) turned and b) in the safehouse.

The definition in the RBT (p. 14, iirc) specifically includes unturned
Runners, but
does not exclude turned Runners.

> > 2)Let me make sure I heard this right...Can you have all/some of your
> > deckers visit Fuchi and still have your Street Samaurai's go on a
> > Shadowrun?

Given the precedent set by the Z-zone, not to mention the difference in
timing (viz,
you visit Locations in your Legwork and go on a shadowrun on the
Shadowrun phase),
as well as game-balance issues, it is my lasting opinion that you cannot
both visit
the Location and go on a shadowrun.

At the very least, the wording would be redundant: Any turned Runner
(who has visited
a Location, turned to Recon, turned by McDeven, or what-have-you) cannot
participate
in a shadowrun.

> > 3)When you trash a challenge, does the alarm trigger?

This depends on the method of trashing.

> > 4)Has there been any FASA ruling on whether you may discard or
> > rearrange or insert challenges (into your challenge stack) after having placed
> > them?

After playing, Challenges remain face down. You may not look at them
(unless you
use Recon or other means) or trash or rearrange them. This is one of
the reasons
Security Consultant rocks as a card..

Although I'm officially in lurk status at the moment, I feel I had to
comment.


-Mb
Message no. 6
From: Matb <mbreton@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Re: Hello...and a few questions
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 1997 18:49:47 -0800
Missed a few qyuestions the last time around...

> 1) When you hit Runners on Retainer, it states in the rulebook that when
> Runner vs. Runner combat occurs, afterward, both teams go home. For Runners
> on Retainer too?

See below...

> 1.1)Is having someone alive after 1 round vs. the opposing team considered
> "defeating" Runners on Retainer?

There really are no "rounds" of combat; it's divided up into three loose
sections (basically, pair Runners up, compare Threat and Body, and trash
those
who get trashed).

I've always assumed that if the shadowrunning team can kill off the
entire "Retainer" team, the shadowrun continues. This is similar to
defeating a Challenge -- if it's got any Body left, it ain't dead,
and the shadowrun is cancelled.

> 1.3)How many (and in what state) of your runners participate as 'the
> runners on retainer'?

Any and all. This is an improvement over interception (but of course it
is: you're spending a card in the effort.)

> 6)Why isn't everyone submitting their own Shadowrun Card Characers!

See several net.expansion sets at:
http://pw1.netcom.com/~mbreton/srccg/spoilers.htm

Included are the Shadowrun TCG First Run and the High Seas
net.expansion; I am in the process of formatting an
earlier submission to FASA, the Containment Zone, and should probably
get around to asking Forrest for permission to post the Rising Sun
net.expansion we collaborated on.

In addition are some very loosely formatted ideas from this list (but it
is in serious need of an overhaul).

I really enjoy generating new cards, so I'd love to hear your opinion on
the net.expansion (and if you'd like to collaborate....)

Jack Crow
Type: Prime Runner/Street Samurai
Rarity: Rare
Cost: 6/2
Text: (A/B?) Human. Leadership-1, Street-1. Jack Crow adds +1 to
all
rolls required by equipment he is using.

Comments: I certainly hope the 6/2 wasn't referring to the Threat
Rating. Interesting special ability; there's a Runner in the High Seas
expansion -- Postal -- who adds a bonus to all Burst Fire rolls. This
effect sort of supercedes it... Crow's ability cuts two ways, however:
better on the Burst Fire -- worse on the Stun Gloves. Better on the
Monofilament Whip.. much worse on Armor.

Sure you want that ability still? :)
Message no. 7
From: Crane <jack9@*********.NET>
Subject: Re: Hello...and a few questions
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 1997 16:19:11 -0800
>I really enjoy generating new cards, so I'd love to hear your opinion on
>the net.expansion (and if you'd like to collaborate....)
>
>Jack Crow
>Type: Prime Runner/Street Samurai
>Rarity: Rare
>Cost: 6/1
>Text: (4/4) Human. Leadership-1, Street-1. Jack Crow adds +1 to
>all
>rolls required by equipment he is using.
>
>Comments: I certainly hope the 6/2 wasn't referring to the Threat
>Rating. Interesting special ability; there's a Runner in the High Seas
>expansion -- Postal -- who adds a bonus to all Burst Fire rolls. This
>effect sort of supercedes it... Crow's ability cuts two ways, however:
>better on the Burst Fire -- worse on the Stun Gloves. Better on the
>Monofilament Whip.. much worse on Armor.
>
>Sure you want that ability still? :)
>
>
Message no. 8
From: Crane <jack9@*********.NET>
Subject: Re: Hello...and a few questions
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 1997 16:23:36 -0800
At 05:45 PM 12/8/97 -0800, you wrote:
>> > 1.2.1)Is it possible to be turned AND in the Safehouse?
>> > 2)Let me make sure I heard this right...Can you have all/some of your
>> > deckers visit Fuchi and still have your Street Samaurai's go on a
>> > Shadowrun?
>
>Given the precedent set by the Z-zone, not to mention the difference in
>timing (viz,
>you visit Locations in your Legwork and go on a shadowrun on the
>Shadowrun phase),
>as well as game-balance issues, it is my lasting opinion that you cannot
>both visit
>the Location and go on a shadowrun.

I did not imply that a runner should be able to visit a location AND go on
a Shadowrun, I am asking if you have to give up your 1 shadowrun in your
shadowrun phase if you have a decker(s) go after Fuchi?
Message no. 9
From: Matb <mbreton@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Re: Hello...and a few questions
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 1997 19:45:01 -0800
> >> > 1.2.1)Is it possible to be turned AND in the Safehouse?
> >> > 2)Let me make sure I heard this right...Can you have all/some of your
> >> > deckers visit Fuchi and still have your Street Samaurai's go on a
> >> > Shadowrun?

> >Given the precedent set by the Z-zone, not to mention the difference in
> >timing (viz, you visit Locations in your Legwork and go on a shadowrun on the
> >Shadowrun phase), as well as game-balance issues, it is my lasting opinion that
you cannot
> >both visit the Location and go on a shadowrun.

> I did not imply that a runner should be able to visit a location AND go on
> a Shadowrun, I am asking if you have to give up your 1 shadowrun in your
> shadowrun phase if you have a decker(s) go after Fuchi?

Allow me to explain: Normally a Runner cannot both visit a Location and
take part in a
shadowrun. (Runners have to turn to visit, and only unturned Runners
can participate in a
shadowrun.) This is handled by the core rules; to repeat this on a card
is unecessarily redundant, and leads to the belief that some other
effect was intended. Namely, that in using
Fuchi, you bypass your shadowrun phase -- again, this matches with the
Z-zone, and balances
out the Fuchi card. Otherwise, you just send teams of two or three
deckers in waves, and build
up a lot of nuyen very quickly (or, with the right deckers and decks,
score as much Rep as
another player might get on a shadowrun with Challenges on it).

So the answer is, no, you may not use Fuchi and go on "another"
shadowrun with non-Deckers.

I've forgotten who posed the original conecpt; it seems ridiculously
rules-lawyerish the more I think about it.



-Mb
Message no. 10
From: Crane <jack9@*********.NET>
Subject: Re: Hello...and a few questions
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 1997 20:56:14 -0800
At 07:45 PM 12/8/97 -0800, you wrote:
>> >> > 1.2.1)Is it possible to be turned AND in the Safehouse?
>> >> > 2)Let me make sure I heard this right...Can you have all/some of
your
>> >> > deckers visit Fuchi and still have your Street Samaurai's go on a
>> >> > Shadowrun?
>
>> >Given the precedent set by the Z-zone, not to mention the difference in
>> >timing (viz, you visit Locations in your Legwork and go on a shadowrun
on the
>> >Shadowrun phase), as well as game-balance issues, it is my lasting
opinion that you cannot
>> >both visit the Location and go on a shadowrun.
>
>> I did not imply that a runner should be able to visit a location AND go on
>> a Shadowrun, I am asking if you have to give up your 1 shadowrun in your
>> shadowrun phase if you have a decker(s) go after Fuchi?
>
>Allow me to explain: Normally a Runner cannot both visit a Location and
>take part in a
>shadowrun. (Runners have to turn to visit, and only unturned Runners
>can participate in a
>shadowrun.) This is handled by the core rules; to repeat this on a card
>is unecessarily redundant, and leads to the belief that some other
>effect was intended. Namely, that in using
>Fuchi, you bypass your shadowrun phase -- again, this matches with the
>Z-zone, and balances
>out the Fuchi card. Otherwise, you just send teams of two or three
>deckers in waves, and build
>up a lot of nuyen very quickly (or, with the right deckers and decks,
>score as much Rep as
>another player might get on a shadowrun with Challenges on it).
>

Let me go on...ad-nauseam to ask one more quetion....
Does it make sense/is it legal that you can visit it with more than 1 group
of deckers?
Message no. 11
From: Matb <mbreton@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Re: Hello...and a few questions
Date: Tue, 9 Dec 1997 06:31:01 -0800
> Let me go on...ad-nauseam to ask one more quetion....

> Does it make sense/is it legal that you can visit it with more than 1
> group of deckers?

Sorry if I seemed kind of futzy last night: bad week, and it's only
Monday.

If Fuchi were a normal Location, then yes, you could visit it more than
once. Replacing a shadowrun with a visit to Fuchi also limits the
player to just one visit. Allowing Deckers to visit Fuchi while others
go shadowrunning would seem to allow multiple groups to visit Fuchi
(they're not limited to six, since they're not part of the shadowrun
"team"; and under normal circumstances, any number of Runners can visit
a Location in any given turn.)

So as to the first -- does it make sense -- well, not to me, it
doesn't. Fuchi's a powerful card already; in fact, if you could use it
multiple times in the same round, you really don't need to go
shadowrunning at all: say four Kraker Jacks, even, with -- and a few
Excaliburs between them -- and you should be able to pop off ten Rep a
turn with a little hassle, maybe bleeding a Deja Vu or Loaded Dice now
and then. (Once you're in the ballpark, Deja is probably the better
choice). Toss in some Rockers, toss out a Block Party, and suddenly -
with the exception of Wanted - you're the only one who can get Rep.

Is it legal? Well, I really don't think the "can visit Fuchi and still
shadowrun" idea is legal, and that seems the only possible loophole in
toward allowing multiple groups visit. (After all, if you give up a
shadowrun to visit, you can't give up two shadowruns in the same turn to
visit twice, since you don't get two. Speaking of which: from a
mechanics viewpoint, Bulldog Van doesn't work with either Fuchi or the
Z-zone, either.)


-Mb
Message no. 12
From: "Abadia, Teos" <Teos.Abadia@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Hello...and a few questions
Date: Tue, 9 Dec 1997 15:49:15 -0500
> > Does it make sense/is it legal that you can visit it with more than
> 1
> > group of deckers?
>
I have to agree with Matb. You can't visit more than once in a round,
and a Rapier or similar card would not help to visit more than once.

Further Reading

If you enjoyed reading about Hello...and a few questions, you may also be interested in:

Disclaimer

These messages were posted a long time ago on a mailing list far, far away. The copyright to their contents probably lies with the original authors of the individual messages, but since they were published in an electronic forum that anyone could subscribe to, and the logs were available to subscribers and most likely non-subscribers as well, it's felt that re-publishing them here is a kind of public service.

Thwap!