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Message no. 1
From: Sorrow <sorrow@*******.ORG>
Subject: Still more questions
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 10:18:05 -0500
I'm sure you guys are hating me by now... :p

* The Crawler Patrol Drone: Do you turn the drone or both the
Rigger and the drone to Recon?

* Is there (or will there be) any skill cards that will be able to be
used by Mages/Shamans to increase their Conjure/Sorcery?

Sorrow
---
I don't want to be alone | I hurt, therefore I am
anymore |--------------------------------
I don't want to be anyone | "What are you looking at...?
anymore | you never seen anyone try to
I don't need a reason to kill myself | commit suicide before?" - Anon
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 2
From: Felix Hoefert <FHoefert@********.DE>
Subject: Re: Still more questions
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 22:10:13 +0200
Sorrow wrote:
>
> I'm sure you guys are hating me by now... :p
>
> * The Crawler Patrol Drone: Do you turn the drone or both the
> Rigger and the drone to Recon?
>
> * Is there (or will there be) any skill cards that will be able to be
> used by Mages/Shamans to increase their Conjure/Sorcery?
>
a) You turn only the Rigger, since heīs getting the Recon. Since heīs
turned then, the drone canīt be used except for defense.

b) There are none. A few have been suggested. Maybe some will be
produced... who knows... ---Felix
Message no. 3
From: Loki <daddyjim@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: Still more questions
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 13:09:43 -0700
---Sorrow <sorrow@*******.ORG> wrote:
>
> * The Crawler Patrol Drone: Do you turn the drone or both the
> Rigger and the drone to Recon?

Just the drone.

> * Is there (or will there be) any skill cards that will be able to be
> used by Mages/Shamans to increase their Conjure/Sorcery?

None in anything released to date. Though I could see something like
Metamagic, Foci or such that add +1 to an existing Sorcery or Conjuring skill.

<RPG reference>
Anyone for a "Tutor" card. EGMG
</RPG reference>

-== Loki ==-
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Message no. 4
From: David Reis <david.reis@*****.COM>
Subject: Re: Still more questions
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 13:28:32 -0700
>> * Is there (or will there be) any skill cards that will be able to be
>> used by Mages/Shamans to increase their Conjure/Sorcery?
>>
>b) There are none. A few have been suggested. Maybe some will be
>produced... who knows... ---Felix
>
IIRC, Outstanding Performance allows you to increase an existing skill
after a successful shadowrun.

David
Message no. 5
From: David Reis <david.reis@*****.COM>
Subject: Re: Still more questions
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 13:31:37 -0700
>> * The Crawler Patrol Drone: Do you turn the drone or both the
>> Rigger and the drone to Recon?
>>
>a) You turn only the Rigger, since he´s getting the Recon. Since he´s
>turned then, the drone can´t be used except for defense.
>
I believe the drone is turned, not the rigger. Otherwise, using the
Crawler Patrol Drone would limit a rigger with piloting skill of 2 or 3 to
only using one drone on that turn.

David
Message no. 6
From: "Bourgault, Patrick" <pbourgau@***.CA>
Subject: Re: Still more questions
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 16:29:00 PDT
---Sorrow <sorrow@*******.ORG> wrote:
>
> * The Crawler Patrol Drone: Do you turn the drone or both the
> Rigger and the drone to Recon?

Just the drone.

So this mean you can use Recon only once per turn and not "as long as you
can afford it! ??
Message no. 7
From: Loki <daddyjim@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: Still more questions
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 14:06:07 -0700
---"Bourgault, Patrick" <pbourgau@***.CA> wrote:
>
> ---Sorrow <sorrow@*******.ORG> wrote:
> >
> > * The Crawler Patrol Drone: Do you turn the drone or both the
> > Rigger and the drone to Recon?
>
> Just the drone.
>
> So this mean you can use Recon only once per turn and not "as long as you
> can afford it! ??

Exactly. For 2 nuyen the Crawler gets recon until end of turn, not Recon-2 or
Recon-3 for 6 or 9 nuyen...

-== Loki ==-
+----------------------------------------------------------------------+
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Message no. 8
From: "James E. Frazer" <jimmicane@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: Still more questions
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 14:05:13 -0700
>>> * The Crawler Patrol Drone: Do you turn the drone or both the
>>> Rigger and the drone to Recon?
>>>
>>a) You turn only the Rigger, since he´s getting the Recon. Since he´s
>>turned then, the drone can´t be used except for defense.
>>
>I believe the drone is turned, not the rigger. Otherwise, using the
>Crawler Patrol Drone would limit a rigger with piloting skill of 2 or 3 to
>only using one drone on that turn.
>
>David
>

Exactly...

Look at it this way. The card itself is a 1/3 Drone, it has an ability to receive recon
at a cost of 2 nuyen. It doesn't give the rigger the ability to recon, but the rigger
still has to use his skill to control the drone. In other words, a rigger still uses one
of his alloted piloting skills for the turn if he uses the drone, but he doesn't have to
turn, much the same way a decker can nuke an electrical challenge with a Crash, but he
doesn't have to turn himself to do it.

Another way to think of it is this: a Vindicator says that it gives the user a +4/+0, it
also says "4 nuyen: burst fire", now the user doesn't recieve the ability to
burst fire (unless of course he had a bunch of burritos the night before), the gun does.

That's just my opinion, I could be wrong...

Hurricane



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Message no. 9
From: Matb <mbreton@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Re: Still more questions
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 15:28:03 -0700
Sorrow wrote:

> * Is there (or will there be) any skill cards that will be able to be
> used by Mages/Shamans to increase their Conjure/Sorcery?

There are three in the game.

- Site of Power increases Sorcery and Conjuring (as appropriate) for
Mages and Shamans. This is, of course, limited to the length og the
shadowrun. Handy fo rsleazing unwanted Gargoyles, though, or running
around Guardian Elementals.

- Moment of Clarity (UW) is a Stinger that pumps up a Runner's skill for
one combat during a shadowrun. This one gets kind of loopy, as the
bonus is only used "to sleaze or fight the just-revealed Challenge."
I'm not sure if pumping up Sorcery to get a better benefit out of Combat
Fetishes is a legitimate reason. Aw, hell, I'm a nice guy, I'd let it
fly.

- Outstanding Performance pumps up one skill when the Runner scores an
Objective. 2Y for a permanent increase. It's in all the decks.


- Matt

------------------------------------
In a dark time, the eye begins to see. - T. Roethke

GridSec: SRCard
Teen Poets FAQ: http://pw1.netcom.com/~mbreton/poetry/poetfaq.htm
SRTCG Website: http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Station/2189/ccgtop.htm
Message no. 10
From: Donald Arganbright <jayden63@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Still more questions
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 14:55:29 PDT
>Sorrow wrote:

(snip)

>> * Is there (or will there be) any skill cards that will be able to be
>> used by Mages/Shamans to increase their Conjure/Sorcery?

(snip)

>b) There are none. A few have been suggested. Maybe some will be
>produced... who knows... ---Felix
>

Actually doesn't Outstanding Performance allow you to raise one runners
skill if they are present on a sucessful shadowrun?

*** In ruling, the Sage attends to the heart, not the eye ***
*** - Tao ***


Donald Arganbright
Jayden Stormwalker


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Message no. 11
From: Apone <mpcheval@********.FR>
Subject: Re: Still more questions
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 00:30:22 +0200
> Sorrow wrote:
>
> > * Is there (or will there be) any skill cards that will be able to be
> > used by Mages/Shamans to increase their Conjure/Sorcery?

Don't forget the Owl Totem.
On 4 and more on a dice roll, the target Shaman gets Conjure +2 for a
shadowrun.
It may not be really reliable, but the card is free to deploy and stays
in play.

so long,

Apone.
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------
"You may bury my body down by the highway side,
So my old evil spirit can catch a Greyhound bus n'ride."
Robert Johnson
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 12
From: Donald Arganbright <jayden63@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Still more questions
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 16:20:39 PDT
>> Sorrow wrote:
>>
>> > * Is there (or will there be) any skill cards that will be able to
be
>> > used by Mages/Shamans to increase their Conjure/Sorcery?

>
> Don't forget the Owl Totem.
>On 4 and more on a dice roll, the target Shaman gets Conjure +2 for a
>shadowrun.
>It may not be really reliable, but the card is free to deploy and stays
>in play.
>
>so long,
>
Ohh that brings up an interesting question.... Lets say I have
a runner with conjure -1. I play owl totem on that runner.
On my next turn I roll the dice and get a 5. The runner is now
conjure-3. I deploy an ally spirit on the runner. The next turn
I roll for the owl totem and get a 2. The runner goes back to
conjure-1. What happens to the ally spirit that requires a
runner with conjure-2. I would say that the spririt is trashed.
What does anyone else think?

*** In ruling, the Sage attends to the heart, not the eye ***
*** - Tao ***


Donald Arganbright
Jayden Stormwalker


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Message no. 13
From: Matb <mbreton@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Re: Still more questions
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 17:44:14 -0700
Donald Arganbright wrote:

> Ohh that brings up an interesting question.... Lets say I have
> a runner with conjure -1. I play owl totem on that runner.
> On my next turn I roll the dice and get a 5. The runner is now
> conjure-3. I deploy an ally spirit on the runner. The next turn
> I roll for the owl totem and get a 2. The runner goes back to
> conjure-1. What happens to the ally spirit that requires a
> runner with conjure-2. I would say that the spririt is trashed.
> What does anyone else think?

You never deployed the Ally. :) The Owl Totem's bonus starts at the
beginning of the shadowrun, and continues to the end; there's no means
of deploying Gear on a Runner in the middle of a shadowrun.

But, if you were using Clutch (who pumps up in Piloting skill) and
deployed a Dobey-drone (which requires Pilot-2), the Drone would be
trashed once Clutch deflates.


- Matt

------------------------------------
In a dark time, the eye begins to see. - T. Roethke

GridSec: SRCard
Teen Poets FAQ: http://pw1.netcom.com/~mbreton/poetry/poetfaq.htm
SRTCG Website: http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Station/2189/ccgtop.htm
Message no. 14
From: Norman McLeod <mcleodn@***********.NET>
Subject: Re: Still more questions
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 19:36:54 -0400
>In other words, a rigger still uses one of his alloted piloting skills for
the turn if he uses >the drone, but he doesn't have to turn, much the same
way a decker can nuke an >electrical challenge with a Crash, but he doesn't
have to turn himself to do it.


Doesn't the decker have to be either assisting or on the run? (Thus turned)
Message no. 15
From: Donald Arganbright <jayden63@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Still more questions
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 16:39:23 PDT
>Donald Arganbright wrote:
>
>> Ohh that brings up an interesting question.... Lets say I have
>> a runner with conjure -1. I play owl totem on that runner.
>> On my next turn I roll the dice and get a 5. The runner is now
>> conjure-3. I deploy an ally spirit on the runner. The next turn
>> I roll for the owl totem and get a 2. The runner goes back to
>> conjure-1. What happens to the ally spirit that requires a
>> runner with conjure-2. I would say that the spririt is trashed.
>> What does anyone else think?
>
>You never deployed the Ally. :) The Owl Totem's bonus starts at the
>beginning of the shadowrun, and continues to the end; there's no means
>of deploying Gear on a Runner in the middle of a shadowrun.
>
>But, if you were using Clutch (who pumps up in Piloting skill) and
>deployed a Dobey-drone (which requires Pilot-2), the Drone would be
>trashed once Clutch deflates.
>
I forgot that the bonus only applies for the shadowrun phase...
(hangs his head in shame...:) But thanks for the side example
of clutch.

*** In ruling, the Sage attends to the heart, not the eye ***
*** - Tao ***


Donald Arganbright
Jayden Stormwalker


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Message no. 16
From: David Reis <david.reis@*****.COM>
Subject: Re: Still more questions
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 16:36:48 -0700
>Ohh that brings up an interesting question.... Lets say I have
>a runner with conjure -1. I play owl totem on that runner.
>On my next turn I roll the dice and get a 5. The runner is now
>conjure-3. I deploy an ally spirit on the runner. The next turn
>I roll for the owl totem and get a 2. The runner goes back to
>conjure-1. What happens to the ally spirit that requires a
>runner with conjure-2. I would say that the spririt is trashed.
>What does anyone else think?
>
Since you only roll the dice for Owl Totem before you begin a shadowrun,
the Legwork phase is already past, so there is no opportunity to deploy the
Ally Spirit on the runner.

David
Message no. 17
From: "James E. Frazer" <jimmicane@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: Still more questions
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 07:35:22 -0700
>>In other words, a rigger still uses one of his alloted piloting skills for
>the turn if he uses >the drone, but he doesn't have to turn, much the same
>way a decker can nuke an >electrical challenge with a Crash, but he doesn't
>have to turn himself to do it.
>
>
>Doesn't the decker have to be either assisting or on the run? (Thus turned)
>

Last time I checked, a runner didn't have to turn to assist a run from the safehouse.
Sniper's Roost doesn't require you to turn, and I don't think using indirect fire turns
your runner either, but I could be wrong about that one. We always played it that if a
decker uses something like a Steamroller from the safehouse, then he wasn't required to
turn, he's just doing something that affects the challenges in the same way that Browse
lets the runner recon the challenges without turning.

That's just my opinion, I could be wrong...

Hurricane



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Message no. 18
From: Loki <daddyjim@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: Still more questions
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 09:13:21 -0700
---"James E. Frazer" <jimmicane@**********.COM> wrote:
>
> >>In other words, a rigger still uses one of his alloted piloting skills for
> >the turn if he uses >the drone, but he doesn't have to turn, much the same
> >way a decker can nuke an >electrical challenge with a Crash, but he doesn't
> >have to turn himself to do it.
> >
> >
> >Doesn't the decker have to be either assisting or on the run? (Thus turned)
> >
>
> Last time I checked, a runner didn't have to turn to assist a run from the
safehouse. Sniper's Roost doesn't require you to turn, and I don't think
using indirect fire turns your runner either, but I could be wrong about that
one. We always played it that if a decker uses something like a Steamroller
from the safehouse, then he wasn't required to turn, he's just doing something
that affects the challenges in the same way that Browse lets the runner recon
the challenges without turning.
>
> That's just my opinion, I could be wrong...

Cut and pasted from the online rulebook (FASA's site):

Indirect Fire: Indirect Fire allows a Runner to use a weapon to assist a
shadowrun without leaving the safehouse. Turn the Runner holding the weapon to
add that weapon's Attack Value to the cumulative Attack Value of the
shadowrunning team. The Runner using the weapon does not add his Attack Value
to the team's and is not eligible to take damage from the shadowrun.

...

Unless otherwise noted, a Decker uses Programs to assist or affect a shadowrun
in progress without leaving the safehouse. Because the Decker remains in the
safehouse, he cannot be attacked by Challenges.

...

Step 2: Select Runners
Designate up to six unturned Runners as your shadowrunning team (or Runner
team). Spirits and Drones do not count toward this total. Turn those Runners.

~!~!~!~!~!

Cut and pasted form the SRTCG spoiler list:

Sniper Roost

May be used by an unturned Runner with Firearms in your Safehouse to assist a
shadowrun. This Runner does not turn and cannot be damaged. Each time Sniper
Roost is used, roll D6. On 5+, trash Sniper Roost and the Runner using it.
Cannot be used against Indoor Challenges.

~!~!~!~!~!

Anytime a runner is assisting or joining in a Shadowrun, they are turned to do
so. Whether present on the run, riding matrix cover or lobbing bullets in via
indirect fire, they turn to show they're committed to the run.

Sniper's Roost, by it's card text, becomes an exception to this rule. It
specifically states that the runner does not turn, thus allowing itself to be
outside the norm.

If Decker's didn't turn to aid a run, as you were trying to suggest, it could
be argued they didn't count towards the max six runners for a run. Thus you
could go in with four Stompers, two Tinkerbells and have Dodger and Static
runner matrix cover with Steamroller, Sleaze and Redirect Data Trail.

Also, your example of a Decker not having to turn to use Browse and thus not
having to turn on a run with Steamroller isn't valid. Browse is used during
the Legwork phase, thus only the program is turned. Steamroller is used while
a Decker is on a run (either matrix-side or physically present).

-== Loki ==-
+----------------------------------------------------------------------+
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Message no. 19
From: "James E. Frazer" <jimmicane@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: Still more questions
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 09:55:36 -0700
>Cut and pasted from the online rulebook (FASA's site):
>
>Indirect Fire: Indirect Fire allows a Runner to use a weapon to assist a
>shadowrun without leaving the safehouse. Turn the Runner holding the weapon to
>add that weapon's Attack Value to the cumulative Attack Value of the
>shadowrunning team. The Runner using the weapon does not add his Attack Value
>to the team's and is not eligible to take damage from the shadowrun.
>
>...
>
>Unless otherwise noted, a Decker uses Programs to assist or affect a shadowrun
>in progress without leaving the safehouse. Because the Decker remains in the
>safehouse, he cannot be attacked by Challenges.
>
>...
>
>Step 2: Select Runners
>Designate up to six unturned Runners as your shadowrunning team (or Runner
>team). Spirits and Drones do not count toward this total. Turn those Runners.
>
>~!~!~!~!~!
>
>Cut and pasted form the SRTCG spoiler list:
>
>Sniper Roost
>
>May be used by an unturned Runner with Firearms in your Safehouse to assist a
>shadowrun. This Runner does not turn and cannot be damaged. Each time Sniper
>Roost is used, roll D6. On 5+, trash Sniper Roost and the Runner using it.
>Cannot be used against Indoor Challenges.
>
>~!~!~!~!~!
>
>Anytime a runner is assisting or joining in a Shadowrun, they are turned to do
>so. Whether present on the run, riding matrix cover or lobbing bullets in via
>indirect fire, they turn to show they're committed to the run.
>
>Sniper's Roost, by it's card text, becomes an exception to this rule. It
>specifically states that the runner does not turn, thus allowing itself to be
>outside the norm.
>
>If Decker's didn't turn to aid a run, as you were trying to suggest, it could
>be argued they didn't count towards the max six runners for a run. Thus you
>could go in with four Stompers, two Tinkerbells and have Dodger and Static
>runner matrix cover with Steamroller, Sleaze and Redirect Data Trail.
>
>Also, your example of a Decker not having to turn to use Browse and thus not
>having to turn on a run with Steamroller isn't valid. Browse is used during
>the Legwork phase, thus only the program is turned. Steamroller is used while
>a Decker is on a run (either matrix-side or physically present).
>
Well, I knew he counted towardsthe maximum number of runners, but I didn't realize he had
to turn even though he wasn't running.

Sooo... does that mean you have to turn the runner when you turn all the other runners, or
can you bring him in with his program at any time? IE: Lets say I have 2 Moles, 1 with
Sleaze and another with Steamroller and both deckers are in the safehouse. Can I send 5
runners on the run and leave the deckers home, then wait to see what program I'm going to
want to use, or do I have to say "Ok, the one with the Steamroller is going to
assist" as I'm declaring the run?

Both indirect and the decker description say to turn to do something that effects the
shadow running team, but no where does it say when you can do it. I would think you could
declare assisting runners at any time during the run (similar to blowing a Rapier or
turning Red Widow).


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Message no. 20
From: Grahamdrew <grahamdrew@***.NET>
Subject: Re: Still more questions
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 16:56:03 -0400
> * Is there (or will there be) any skill cards that will be able to be
> used by Mages/Shamans to increase their Conjure/Sorcery?

Well, the totems in the Underworld expansion sound like what your
looking for...
--
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that is the only reason I am posting. Yeah, that's the ticket!
All my postings are just test data! Yeah!!
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Message no. 21
From: Norman McLeod <mcleodn@***********.NET>
Subject: Re: Still more questions
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 23:18:12 -0400
>Sooo... does that mean you have to turn the runner when you turn all the
other runners, or can you bring him in with his program at any time? IE:
Lets say I have 2 Moles, 1 with Sleaze and another with Steamroller and both
deckers are in the safehouse. Can I send 5 runners on the run and leave the
deckers home, then wait to see what program I'm going to want to use, or do
I have to say "Ok, the one with the Steamroller is going to assist" as I'm
declaring the run?

You must declare it at the beginning, just like a runner who is actually
going on a run. You can say "Okay, I'll send three Skwaaaaaark!s, and one
Static on the run (So I can use his Technical skill), and Ceaser through the
Matrix (So I can use his Stemroller without fear of damage).

>Both indirect and the decker description say to turn to do something that
effects the shadow running team, but no where does it say when you can do
it. I would think you could declare assisting runners at any time during
the run (similar to blowing a Rapier or turning Red Widow).
>
>
>Free web-based email, Forever, From anywhere!
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>

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