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Message no. 1
From: Loki <daddyjim@**********.COM>
Subject: Tourney rules and ideas sought
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 20:03:34 -0800
Ok guys, this is a call to arms on behalf of your questionably
benevolent Fearless Leader.

It's been mentioned through a contact I might be considered as a judge
for the FASA SRTCG tourney at GC'98. This _really_ could mean my
chance at making it this year as it helps a chunk on expenses.

Anyways, I'm looking for tourney ideas to pass along as I'm discussing
things with the GC judging food chain. I know some good ones were
being passed around when I first proposed trying to sanction an SRCard
tourney at GC'98. I also know others were tossed about in response to
the FASA tourney rules I posted from Skuzzy and Jim.

If any of you have some tourney ideas your working on and archived
from previous posts. Hit the list with them again or send them to me
privately. I plan to give credit where credit is due and really get
the SRCard name known in the GC channels.

Thanx for maybe helping to get your favorite elven mafia hitman to
GC'98!

-== Loki ==-
+---------------------------------------------------------------+
Fearless Leader of the Shadowrun Trading Card Game Mailing List
SRCard FAQ: www.primenet.com/~gamemstr/srstuff/tcgfaq1.htm
+---------------------------------------------------------------+
Poisoned Elves: www.primenet.com/~gamemstr
SRTCG trade lists last updated 1/4/98




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Message no. 2
From: "Ken Dirk (DrugDoc)" <dirkkenn@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Tourney rules and ideas sought
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 00:00:54 -0800
Loki wrote:
>
> Ok guys, this is a call to arms on behalf of your questionably
> benevolent Fearless Leader.
>
> It's been mentioned through a contact I might be considered as a judge
> for the FASA SRTCG tourney at GC'98. This _really_ could mean my
> chance at making it this year as it helps a chunk on expenses.
>
> Anyways, I'm looking for tourney ideas to pass along as I'm discussing
> things with the GC judging food chain. I know some good ones were
> being passed around when I first proposed trying to sanction an SRCard
> tourney at GC'98. I also know others were tossed about in response to
> the FASA tourney rules I posted from Skuzzy and Jim.
>
> If any of you have some tourney ideas your working on and archived
> from previous posts. Hit the list with them again or send them to me
> privately. I plan to give credit where credit is due and really get
> the SRCard name known in the GC channels.
>
> Thanx for maybe helping to get your favorite elven mafia hitman to
> GC'98!
>
> -== Loki ==-

Oh great "questionable benevolent fearless leader", I had one tourney
thought that I wanted to post, and maybe get a response from other
members of the group. SRTCG has a number of cards (like a certain mafia
hit man that is up and coming) that target other types of cards. Has
anyone considered sideboard rules? For the uninformed, a sideboard is a
set number of cards that can be traded with the main deck during a
tournament. For Magic the gathering, the sideboard is set at fifteen (no
more, no less) cards. Fifteen may be a little much, but how about a
sideboard of, say, five cards?

Comments are welcome and encouraged (come on folks, lets get our QBFL
(thats questionably benevolent fearless leader) to gen con)!!!

Ken Dirk (DrugDoc)
Message no. 3
From: Loki <daddyjim@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: Tourney rules and ideas sought
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 06:07:25 -0800
---"Ken Dirk (DrugDoc)" <dirkkenn@***.EDU> wrote:
>
>
> Oh great "questionable benevolent fearless leader", I had one tourney
> thought that I wanted to post, and maybe get a response from other
> members of the group. SRTCG has a number of cards (like a certain
mafia
> hit man that is up and coming) that target other types of cards. Has
> anyone considered sideboard rules? For the uninformed, a sideboard
is a
> set number of cards that can be traded with the main deck during a
> tournament. For Magic the gathering, the sideboard is set at
fifteen (no
> more, no less) cards. Fifteen may be a little much, but how about a
> sideboard of, say, five cards?
>
> Comments are welcome and encouraged (come on folks, lets get our QBFL
> (thats questionably benevolent fearless leader) to gen con)!!!

I haven't heard too mcuh talk on sideboards. I remember Matb once
posted an idea for using earned rep as Karma between rounds for
different effect. I'll paste what he was suggesting below, as some of
the effects were a way to work in a sideboard.

~!~!~!~!~!

So, lately I've been trying to come up with some nice rules for running
a tournament of Shadowrun. Most of it is pretty basic stuff -- this
many cards, reversed-polish type advancement, win after ten zillion
Reputation, yadda, yadda, yadda.
Then I started thinking: wouldn't it be nice if you could use previous
Rep in the game you're currently playing? So, I came up with the
following (still sketchy) rules:
Advancement: Players accumulate Reputation from game to game. The
total amount of Reputation they have at the end of the game is added or
subtracted from their "Good Reputation". The following modifiers
alsoapply:
Winning a game: +15 Good Reputation Tieing a game: +5
Reputation
(No, I have no idea how you would tie a game, I just want to make sure
all the bases are covered).
In addition, Good Reputation may be spent *before a game begins* in the
following ways: +1 Y to Crestick: 40 Good
Reputation
+1 card in hand: 50 Good Reputation
Begin with card of choice: 100 Good Reputation
Remove a card from your deck: 15 Good Reputation
Return card to deck: 30 Good Reputation
Go first in game: X Good Reputation
Notes: Remove a card from the deck -- Players must still meet the
minimum deck limits (ie 60/6 cards). This is a possible way to enact
sideboards, however.
Go first in game: Each player may write down (secretly) the amount of
Good Reputation he is willing to spend to go first. The player who bid
the most goes first; the plaeyr(s) who bid the least divide the
Reputation among themselves.
This provides some interesting effects late in the tourney; Given that
the game is considered "won" at 100 Reputation, I don't think I'd see
anyone using the "begin with card of choice" option.
Additionally, I was going to create some rules for players to place
side-bets on other games, although that might speed the gameplay up
*too* much (and if there are ever $10,000 prizes in SRTCG, might lead to
collusion....)

~!~!~!~!~!

Other than that, I agree that perhaps a sideboard of five cards could
be allowed for adjusting deck between games. You'd have to list that
with deck registration though. Any other comments or suggestions?

-== Loki ==-
+---------------------------------------------------------------+
Fearless Leader of the Shadowrun Trading Card Game Mailing List
SRCard FAQ: www.primenet.com/~gamemstr/srstuff/tcgfaq1.htm
+---------------------------------------------------------------+
Poisoned Elves: www.primenet.com/~gamemstr
SRTCG trade lists last updated 1/4/98

_________________________________________________________
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Message no. 4
From: Noah Overton <NOAH_OVERTON@*************.OM.HP.COM>
Subject: Re: Tourney rules and ideas sought
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 07:52:54 -0800
heres something to chew on. If you go with a total of rep. points wins
the tourney. no one would be out Intel all games are played.
heres what i mean. say you have forty players.

round one: 10 games of four players. players get rep. points that
they have at end of the game. plus any other that might come from
winning the game. or some thing like that.

round two: 10 games of four players. random pick so no one should play
again the same people twice. players get rep. points they have at end
of game add to total.

round three: 12 games of three and 1 game of four. random pick so no
one should play again the same people twice. players get rep. points
they have at end of game add to total.

this is a nice way to keep every one playing. you can change the
number of rounds and games or players in games any way you want.
but this way you could bomb on the first round and still have a chance
if you kick in the other rounds. and is it not the intent of every one
to play and have fun. this way every keeps playing and hopefully
having fun.

just my 2 pennies
Noah
Message no. 5
From: "Whitehill, Chris" <chwh@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Tourney rules and ideas sought
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 10:40:31 -0700
This is a really good idea.
Maybe give the winner a 10 or 15 rep bonus for winning.
-Chris-

>-----Original Message-----
>
> heres something to chew on. If you go with a total of rep. points wins
> the tourney. no one would be out Intel all games are played.
> heres what i mean. say you have forty players.
>
> round one: 10 games of four players. players get rep. points that
> they have at end of the game. plus any other that might come from
> winning the game. or some thing like that.
>
> round two: 10 games of four players. random pick so no one should play
> again the same people twice. players get rep. points they have at end
> of game add to total.
>
> round three: 12 games of three and 1 game of four. random pick so no
> one should play again the same people twice. players get rep. points
> they have at end of game add to total.
>
> this is a nice way to keep every one playing. you can change the
> number of rounds and games or players in games any way you want.
> but this way you could bomb on the first round and still have a chance
> if you kick in the other rounds. and is it not the intent of every one
> to play and have fun. this way every keeps playing and hopefully
> having fun.
>
> just my 2 pennies
> Noah
Message no. 6
From: "Abadia, Teos" <Teos.Abadia@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Tourney rules and ideas sought
Date: Sun, 1 Mar 1998 23:59:20 -0500
> ----------
> From: Loki[SMTP:daddyjim@**********.COM]
>
> Anyways, I'm looking for tourney ideas to pass along as I'm discussing
> things with the GC judging food chain. I know some good ones were
> being passed around when I first proposed trying to sanction an SRCard
> tourney at GC'98. I also know others were tossed about in response to
> the FASA tourney rules I posted from Skuzzy and Jim.
>
I already wrote to Loki with my previous ideas. Here is a new one.

I was thinking about the tourney, and it hit me again that the
tournament rules emphasize Rep above all. Now, when I play, I
concentrate on putting cards together to build an effective deck that
will beat other decks, be able to win my objective cards, and hopefully
be able to win some of my opponents' objectives. I choose challenges
that will slow or defeat my opponents, but it's okay if they get some
rep.

Now, this is different in a tourney! In a tourney, the emphasis is on
getting rep, and getting lots of it! This means that cards such as
Chomps, Media Chick, Motion Detectors, False Mentor and Bad Reputation
become more important, because they specifically change the amount of
Rep gained. They, in other words, affect the outcome by which
performance is measured.

Similarly, overall deck strategy shifts. it might make sense to not use
tough big rep objectives, if it will take too long to get a team
together that will take the objective. A deck with a team that can be
assembled quickly and win three 25 point objectives is better than a
deck that takes half the game to win one 40 point objective.

Has anyone given this much thought? It seems like a big strategy issue
to me. I haven't made up my mind if I like this. Then again, I'm not
sure I want the tournament to use a set Rep number, such as saying that
each match is played to 80 Rep, for example, because that would again
influence deck design, and then it would be really hard to decide how to
rank the players that win the game (since all winners would have just
about 80 Rep).

Teos.
Message no. 7
From: Doug <d.clarke@*****.COM>
Subject: Re: Tourney rules and ideas sought
Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 13:56:32 -0800
>Has anyone given this much thought? It seems like a big strategy issue
>to me. I haven't made up my mind if I like this. Then again, I'm not
>sure I want the tournament to use a set Rep number, such as saying that
>each match is played to 80 Rep, for example, because that would again
>influence deck design, and then it would be really hard to decide how to
>rank the players that win the game (since all winners would have just
>about 80 Rep).
>
>Teos.

If the round was played to 80 Rep, you could use the amount
you win by as the way to determine rank. A skunk would be worth 80.
If your opponent had 60 then you would only get 20 points.
You could even get more that 80 points is your opponent went neg.

This of course would also change the way you build your deck. Not only do
you have to win, you have to win well (read stomp)

In a three or four player game, the loser would get zero, the second
place would
get the amount over the loser and the winner would get the amount of the
loser (or may the amount over the loser and the amount of the second
place guy)

-------------------------------------------------
Example 1 player C stomps them both

player A - 20, Player B 60, Player C 80

Player A would get zero
Player B would get 40
Player C would get 60 (or 100)
-------------------------------------------------

Example 2 player C only stomps them one

player A - 20, Player B 75, Player C 80

Player A would get zero
Player B would get 55
Player C would get 60 (or 65)
-------------------------------------------------

This is how I've seen some Star Trek CCG tournaments played.

Doug

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Thwap!