Back to the main page

Mailing List Logs for ShadowRN

Message no. 1
From: The Deb Decker <RJR96326@****.UTULSA.EDU>
Subject: 2nd Time
Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1993 18:41:41 -0500
Hy, I thought I posted this before but it bounced, in response to the Rat.

Right. Shadowrun IS like a movie, where the characters are the protagonists
and therefore better than the bad guys. Regardless of moral definition, that's
what I meant by broad-based, middle-of-the-road appeal. The thing is, when
you do that, you dress down the bad aspects of the characters and emphasize
the good. If you do that enough it's easy to forget that the "typical"
Shadowrunner is a thief, murderer, and on top of that a mercenary who does
these things for money rather than out of conviction.

Examina a Shadowrun from the other end of the gun: A young husband is informed
that his wife, a researcher, was fatally wounded by unidentified assailants
the previous evening. Or Mrs Howell, 85 and on whatever counts for social
security in 2054, discovers her savings gone, apparently legitimately, the
victim of a decker. Or a son told that his father is now a puddle of
liquid flesh after a mage cast the now outdated Turn to Goo while doing his
job. That's life in the 21st century :).

Add to that the potential for alcoholism, drug and chip addiction, and
other problems and the Shadowrunning community seems a lot less friendly.
But I understand the need to make the main characters look good; I'm writing
a script about two women pirates, kind of Thelma & Louise at sea. I want
the audience to like them and feel for them when they are in danger, but in
real life one of them slept around and the other killed a man in cold blood,
and both were regarded as "the moste vicious and savage women I have ever
seen, so muche so that they make the Vermin they sailed with appeare t'be
Honorable Men" (from a Carolinia court officer's diary). They and others
like them set men adrift at sea, tied them to posts and threw broken bottles
at them, and shot their friends to keep them in line. But they're still "the
good guys".

Logiaclly, to me anyway, Shadowrunners aren't the good guys. So why wouldn't
they participate in Blood Magic. Because FASA says so. Because the 'runners
ARE the good guys, and we need to do what we can to keep them likable and
acceptable to whoever reads the books. The adventures are similar; many
of them start out as "typical" runs, but wind up with the PCs stopping a
definite evil: Insect Totems, a Bottled Demon,or chipheads set on puree'.

So once again, the reason they tone down the bad things is because the
'runners are the protaginists, and protaginists must look good because
most people want to like their heroes--not because Shadowrunners are
inherently good.

J Roberson
Message no. 2
From: Richard Pieri <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Subject: Re: 2nd Time
Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1993 20:38:59 EDT
>>>>> "RJR" == RJR96326 <RJR96326@****.UTULSA.EDU> writes:

RJR> If you do that enough it's easy to forget that the "typical"
RJR> Shadowrunner is a thief, murderer, and on top of that a mercenary who
RJR> does these things for money rather than out of conviction.

Warning! Stereotype alert!

The "typical" Shadowrunner shouldn't be a PC... correction, PCs shouldn't
be typical Shadowrunners. None of my 'runners have money as a motivation.
Dreamline, an ex-cop who really wants to make life in his 'hood a bit
better, and 'running against corps is a way of striking out at them.
Vision's doing it for inspiration; the money is getting funneled back into
her band. Lillith's out for revenge against a terrorist/runner team that
raped and mutilated her and her co-workers two years ago. Squeak... well...
he is a thief, but cut from the same cloth as Slippery Jim; it's not the
money, he just likes stealing things.

RJR> Examina a Shadowrun from the other end of the gun: A young husband is
RJR> informed that his wife, a researcher, was fatally wounded by
RJR> unidentified assailants the previous evening. Or Mrs Howell, 85 and on
RJR> whatever counts for social security in 2054, discovers her savings
RJR> gone, apparently legitimately, the victim of a decker. Or a son told
RJR> that his father is now a puddle of liquid flesh after a mage cast the
RJR> now outdated Turn to Goo while doing his job. That's life in the 21st
RJR> century :).

All things that "typical" Shadowrunners eventually get geeked for.

[...]

RJR> Logiaclly, to me anyway, Shadowrunners aren't the good guys.

Then who are? Nobody. That's one of the things that separates cyberpunk
from other forms of SF. But in all the cyberpunk fiction I've read, the
protagonists always have something or do something or are something that
makes them a cut above the common, makes them better then the rest. Cally
and Ice Berg who have their love for each other, for example (just finished
reading _Dreams of Flesh and Sand_ [*finally!*]--excelent book, highly
recommended). Or Cowboy from _Hardwired_, who wouldn't let the Orbital
Blocs stand in his way. Or Sarah from the same book, who pretty much sold
herself out to those same Blocs for a shot at a better life for herself and
her brother. And Case, Molly, and Jonny Mnemonic all have their pride that
puts them above the corps that want to crush them down.

Yes, money is a major incentive. But for most of these characters it's not
their goal. And when it is, it's always as a means to something better, not
the end in itself.


Now, you can run the Shadows trying to get rich, but I'll tell ya,
chummers, there are plenty of easier ways to rake in the nuyen. And most of
them are far less hazardous to your precious body.

The rest you can figure out.

Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> Northeastern's Stainless Steel Rat
PGP Public Key Block available upon request Ask about rat-pgp.el v1.6
||||| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |||||
God made man, but he used a monkey to do it
Apes is the plan, we're all here to prove it
I can walk like an ape, talk like an ape, I can do what monkeys do
God made man, but the monkeys applied the glue. --DEVO, Jocko Homo

Further Reading

If you enjoyed reading about 2nd Time, you may also be interested in:

Disclaimer

These messages were posted a long time ago on a mailing list far, far away. The copyright to their contents probably lies with the original authors of the individual messages, but since they were published in an electronic forum that anyone could subscribe to, and the logs were available to subscribers and most likely non-subscribers as well, it's felt that re-publishing them here is a kind of public service.