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Mailing List Logs for ShadowRN

Message no. 1
From: The Deb Decker <RJR96326@****.UTULSA.EDU>
Subject: Mo' Money
Date: Fri, 10 Sep 1993 14:02:55 -0500
>Take, for example, the Renraku Arcology Mall. Just about anyone going
>in there will have no problem spending 'Raku scrip. But Mitsuhama
>scrip is next to worthless in the 'cology. Not because of any law, but
>because it belongs to a rival corp.

That much is obvious. What I think of when I consider "other merchants"
accepting the scrip is the independents, the mom&pops trying to
scrape what they can, to the point of accepting any currency they think
may be valuable. Like street vendors in the Third World, or the way
dollars, blue jeans, and other sundry goods were good in the Soviet
underground.

>Take another example, the VISA card adds in the US: "And don't forget
>your VISA card, because they don't <blah> and they don't take American
>Express."

Right, but mom&pop don't need a credit check to accept the scrip. You just
need to hand it over to them.

>Right; kind of like the credit card readers you find at most stores
>today. If they don't have a reader with a modem to connect to a
>specific credit company, you can't use their cards at that store. Try
>using your VISA at McDonald's sometime :-).

Similar, but not quite the same. I'll re-read Real Life, but I assumed
that the stick just records the transaction, and the transaction only
becomes "real" after one or the other stick has been plugged into the
back to upload the data. But that's another thread entirely.

BTW, McDonald's in Germany (and I assume other nations as well) take
dollars as well as the local currency. That's how I envision scrip;
areas dominated by a corps will take both local/Nuyen and corp scrip.

>. . .it costs the corp practically nothing to pay in scrip.

Not true. You can't make nothing from nothing. If the corp says "this
is worth X, they had better be able to back it up or they will go
bankrupt. If everyone tries to cash in their chips, the system collapses.

/
\ I / J Roberson
- 0 - "Women are from Venus. Men are from Mars.
/ I \ Me? I'm from Earth."
+ --Me, except I'm sure someone else thought of it, too.
Message no. 2
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Mo' Money
Date: Fri, 10 Sep 1993 15:31:51 EDT
>>>>> "R" == RJR96326 <RJR96326@****.UTULSA.EDU> writes:

>> Take, for example, the Renraku Arcology Mall. Just about anyone
>> going in there will have no problem spending 'Raku scrip. But
>> Mitsuhama scrip is next to worthless in the 'cology. Not because of
>> any law, but because it belongs to a rival corp.

R> That much is obvious. What I think of when I consider "other
R> merchants" accepting the scrip is the independents, the mom&pops
R> trying to scrape what they can, to the point of accepting any
R> currency they think may be valuable. Like street vendors in the
R> Third World, or the way dollars, blue jeans, and other sundry goods
R> were good in the Soviet underground.

Right; on the flip side, there's nothing out there that enforces them
to accept it. But they might. And thus a shadow economy is born.

>> Take another example, the VISA card adds in the US: "And don't
>> forget your VISA card, because they don't <blah> and they don't
>> take American Express."

R> Right, but mom&pop don't need a credit check to accept the scrip.
R> You just need to hand it over to them.

Assuming they accept it... :-).

[...]

R> BTW, McDonald's in Germany (and I assume other nations as well)
R> take dollars as well as the local currency. That's how I envision
R> scrip; areas dominated by a corps will take both local/Nuyen and
R> corp scrip.

Hey, neat! :-).

>> . . .it costs the corp practically nothing to pay in scrip.

R> Not true. You can't make nothing from nothing. If the corp says
R> "this is worth X, they had better be able to back it up or they
R> will go bankrupt. If everyone tries to cash in their chips, the
R> system collapses.

Who said the corp has to allow the scrip-to-nuyen conversion? I'll
tell ya something. Up until about 50 years ago, bills printed in the
US were either "silver certificates" or "gold certificates". They were
printed with a logo that stated that you could take said bill to any
bank and exchange it for it's face value in the appropriate metal.
Guess what would happen to what's left of the US economy if they did
that with gold today.

Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> Northeastern's Stainless Steel Rat
PGP Public Key Block available upon request Ask about rat-pgp.el v1.61
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Character is what you are in the dark. --Lord John Whorfin

Further Reading

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Disclaimer

These messages were posted a long time ago on a mailing list far, far away. The copyright to their contents probably lies with the original authors of the individual messages, but since they were published in an electronic forum that anyone could subscribe to, and the logs were available to subscribers and most likely non-subscribers as well, it's felt that re-publishing them here is a kind of public service.