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Mailing List Logs for ShadowRN

Message no. 1
From: Simon Fuller sfuller@******.com.au
Subject: zodiac
Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 15:56:48 +1100
-----Original Message-----
From: Simon Fuller <sfuller@******.com.au>
To: Shadowrn <shadowrn@*********.com>; sfuller@******.com.au
<sfuller@******.com.au>
Date: Saturday, February 26, 2000 4:44 PM
Subject: zodiac


>Remember when I asked for Zodiac totems? Well, I've put it up on my web
site
>and I'd like you to give me your opinion, personally might be better for
the
>mailing list, unless you want a discussion. Now that it's all up I'm not
>sure what to do with it, any ideas to reach a wider base of people that may
>be interested?
Bugger. Here it is again:
http://home.iprimus.com.au/342/sfuller/web_pages/s_pages/Zodiac/zodiac.htm
Message no. 2
From: Simon Fuller sfuller@******.com.au
Subject: zodiac
Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 15:55:19 +1100
Remember when I asked for Zodiac totems? Well, I've put it up on my web site
and I'd like you to give me your opinion, personally might be better for the
mailing list, unless you want a discussion. Now that it's all up I'm not
sure what to do with it, any ideas to reach a wider base of people that may
be interested?
Simon's zodiac page
Message no. 3
From: Simon Fuller sfuller@******.com.au
Subject: zodiac
Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 16:52:35 +1100
-----Original Message-----
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.com>
To: shadowrn@*********.com <shadowrn@*********.com>
Date: Saturday, February 26, 2000 5:30 PM
Subject: Re: zodiac
>
>> Bugger. Here it is again:
>>
>http://home.iprimus.com.au/342/sfuller/web_pages/s_pages/Zodiac/zodiac.ht
>m
>
>What about different astrological systems (for lack of a better phrase)?
>Ie, the Chinese calender (complete with different elements for each
>animal; ie, Fire Dragon, Metal Monkey, etc)
>
>--
I'm rat. Only problem is I have a book handy about regular astrology, but
not on Chinese astrology. I didn't actually know about the elements being
part of the Chinese zodiac, which probably further disqualifies me from
turning it into Shadowrun material.

BTW, before anyone gets smart, our public library is about twice the size
of my lounge room, so there is not much range to choose from, and I spend
far too much time on the net already to go surfing for it. For now anyway.

Hey, has anyone actually asked a dragon if the story of the zodiac was true,
with the animals going to see Buddha and all that? A dragon was there...
Message no. 4
From: Alfredo B Alves dghost@****.com
Subject: zodiac
Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2000 00:44:59 -0800
On Tue, 1 Feb 2000 15:56:48 +1100 "Simon Fuller" <sfuller@******.com.au>
writes:
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Simon Fuller <sfuller@******.com.au>
> >Remember when I asked for Zodiac totems? Well, I've put it up on my
web
> site
> >and I'd like you to give me your opinion, personally might be
> better for
> the
> >mailing list, unless you want a discussion. Now that it's all up
> I'm not
> >sure what to do with it, any ideas to reach a wider base of people
> that may
> >be interested?

> Bugger. Here it is again:
>
http://home.iprimus.com.au/342/sfuller/web_pages/s_pages/Zodiac/zodiac.ht
m

What about different astrological systems (for lack of a better phrase)?
Ie, the Chinese calender (complete with different elements for each
animal; ie, Fire Dragon, Metal Monkey, etc)

--
D. Ghost (Btw, I'm a Fire Dragon and my sister is a Metal Monkey ;)
A Mathmatician is a machine for turning coffee into theorems
--Paul Erdos

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Message no. 5
From: Alfredo B Alves dghost@****.com
Subject: zodiac
Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2000 01:42:00 -0800
On Tue, 1 Feb 2000 16:52:35 +1100 "Simon Fuller" <sfuller@******.com.au>
writes:
<SNIP>
> I'm rat.

I don't give a Simon Fuller's ass ... nah, rat sounds better ;)

> Only problem is I have a book handy about regular astrology, but
> not on Chinese astrology. I didn't actually know about the elements
being
> part of the Chinese zodiac, which probably further disqualifies me from
> turning it into Shadowrun material.

I didn't either until I read a book my mom bought. If you give me the
year, I can tell you what element goes with your rat. :)

<SNIP>
> Hey, has anyone actually asked a dragon if the story of the zodiac
> was true,
> with the animals going to see Buddha and all that? A dragon was
> there...

Next time I see a dragon, I'll ask ... ;-P~

--
D. Ghost
A Mathmatician is a machine for turning coffee into theorems
--Paul Erdos

________________________________________________________________
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit:
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
Message no. 6
From: Mark A Shieh SHODAN+@***.EDU
Subject: zodiac
Date: Wed, 1 Mar 2000 13:40:45 -0500 (EST)
Excerpts from ShadowRN: 26-Feb-100 Re: zodiac by Alfredo B Alves@****.com
> What about different astrological systems (for lack of a better phrase)?
> Ie, the Chinese calender (complete with different elements for each
> animal; ie, Fire Dragon, Metal Monkey, etc)

A bit of web searching gave me a few hits that seem to mesh with my
(limited) existing knowledge of the 60 year cycle:
http://www.chinese-zodiac.com
http://www.ramtechnology.com/mystical/chinesezodiac.html

IMHO, you're better off ignoring the 60 year cycle and treating the
12 animals and the 5 elements separately. When I talked to my parents
and my officemate about this, they told me that the 60 year cycle was
not considered all that important, as far as determining meaning. Most
people just don't pay attention to the 10 year cycle produced by the
heavenly stems or the constellation signs, which provides the years with
elements. Mainly, people know what Gregorian date signifies the Chinese
New Year, and know the animal of the year. People don't generally keep
track of the Chinese dates any more except for the oldest generations,
and use the western dates for most things. As an example of this, my
parents really have no idea what element was dominant during the year I
was born, though they could look it up like anyone else if they felt it
was important.

IMHO, any further detail than animal would be like taking the
western zodiac and introducing detailed horoscopes based on birthday
rather than just sign. You can do it if you really want, but only a
fortune teller is going to know what you're talking about. As I believe
that SR magic is somewhat dependent on WYTIWYG, and W(other
people)TIWYG, it makes the most sense only to use the parts of the
zodiac that are commonly known.

My recommendation is to associate the elements with magic spheres,
and make that separate from zodiac animal totems. Then, you can
specialize in an element or an animal, but not both. Too much risk of
munchiness otherwise...

I forget: What was the sphere breakdown based on historical meaning?

Sphere West East
Combat Fire Fire
Detection Air Earth
Illusion Water Water
Healing Spirit Wood
Manipulation Earth Metal

(Where canonical SR has Air and Water reversed, and I'm guessing at East)

> D. Ghost (Btw, I'm a Fire Dragon and my sister is a Metal Monkey ;)

Heh. I'm a Fire Dragon and a Pisces. How's that for pain in the ass to
interpret? (It's like trying to interpret someone who would be both Leo
and Pisces. An interpretation can still be made when you consider that
I'm somewhat bipolar in mood and personality, but some amount of
stretching is involved.)

*rolls eyes*

Mark
Message no. 7
From: Simon Fuller sfuller@******.com.au
Subject: zodiac
Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 10:24:08 +1100
-----Original Message-----
From: Mark A Shieh <SHODAN+@***.EDU>
To: shadowrn@*********.com <shadowrn@*********.com>
Date: Thursday, March 02, 2000 5:45 AM
Subject: Re: zodiac


>Excerpts from ShadowRN: 26-Feb-100 Re: zodiac by Alfredo B Alves@****.com
>> What about different astrological systems (for lack of a better phrase)?
>> Ie, the Chinese calender (complete with different elements for each
>> animal; ie, Fire Dragon, Metal Monkey, etc)
>
>A bit of web searching gave me a few hits that seem to mesh with my
>(limited) existing knowledge of the 60 year cycle:
>http://www.chinese-zodiac.com
>http://www.ramtechnology.com/mystical/chinesezodiac.html
>
> IMHO, you're better off ignoring the 60 year cycle and treating the
>12 animals and the 5 elements separately. When I talked to my parents
>and my officemate about this, they told me that the 60 year cycle was
>not considered all that important, as far as determining meaning. Most
>people just don't pay attention to the 10 year cycle produced by the
>heavenly stems or the constellation signs, which provides the years with
>elements. Mainly, people know what Gregorian date signifies the Chinese
>New Year, and know the animal of the year. People don't generally keep
>track of the Chinese dates any more except for the oldest generations,
>and use the western dates for most things. As an example of this, my
>parents really have no idea what element was dominant during the year I
>was born, though they could look it up like anyone else if they felt it
>was important.
>
> IMHO, any further detail than animal would be like taking the
>western zodiac and introducing detailed horoscopes based on birthday
>rather than just sign. You can do it if you really want, but only a
>fortune teller is going to know what you're talking about. As I believe
>that SR magic is somewhat dependent on WYTIWYG, and W(other
>people)TIWYG, it makes the most sense only to use the parts of the
>zodiac that are commonly known.
>
> My recommendation is to associate the elements with magic spheres,
>and make that separate from zodiac animal totems. Then, you can
>specialize in an element or an animal, but not both. Too much risk of
>munchiness otherwise...
>
>I forget: What was the sphere breakdown based on historical meaning?
>
>Sphere West East
>Combat Fire Fire
>Detection Air Earth
>Illusion Water Water
>Healing Spirit Wood
>Manipulation Earth Metal
>
>(Where canonical SR has Air and Water reversed, and I'm guessing at East)
>
>> D. Ghost (Btw, I'm a Fire Dragon and my sister is a Metal Monkey ;)
>
>Heh. I'm a Fire Dragon and a Pisces. How's that for pain in the ass to
>interpret? (It's like trying to interpret someone who would be both Leo
>and Pisces. An interpretation can still be made when you consider that
>I'm somewhat bipolar in mood and personality, but some amount of
>stretching is involved.)
>
>*rolls eyes*
>
>Mark
>
That's volunteering if ever I heard it. Do all that stuff (which I admit I
don't quite understand) in detail and put it up on a web site, man. If you
don't have a web site, email me privately and we can work it out.
My zodiac site, again, is:
http://home.iprimus.com.au/342/sfuller/web_pages/s_pages/Zodiac/zodiac.htm
Message no. 8
From: Mark A Shieh SHODAN+@***.EDU
Subject: zodiac
Date: Wed, 1 Mar 2000 21:34:20 -0500 (EST)
Excerpts from ShadowRN: 2-Mar-100 Re: zodiac by "Simon Fuller"@******.co
> That's volunteering if ever I heard it. Do all that stuff (which I admit I
> don't quite understand) in detail and put it up on a web site, man. If you
> don't have a web site, email me privately and we can work it out.

DOH! I hate it when I open my mouth. Prod me in a week if I
haven't sent out a draft. Prod me now if you want a draft when I finish
it.

Mark

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These messages were posted a long time ago on a mailing list far, far away. The copyright to their contents probably lies with the original authors of the individual messages, but since they were published in an electronic forum that anyone could subscribe to, and the logs were available to subscribers and most likely non-subscribers as well, it's felt that re-publishing them here is a kind of public service.