| From: | Bob Ooton <topcat@**.CENCOM.NET> |
|---|---|
| Subject: | Re: Allies for Phys Ads (needs new title) |
| Date: | Sun, 9 Apr 1995 21:46:59 -0500 |
>cybermonster may have 1 or 2 higher in some stats than the Phys Adept, but
>wouldn't have any more than that unles he specialised henously (like level 4
>Muscle Replacement or something yukky like that).
Pre-raised stats will be similar (raised includes cyberware) or could be way
different depending on how things get allocated. It's a player choice, so
there's no argument to be made one way or the other. Although the one stat
where samurai can shine off the rack is BODY. Perhaps the single most
important combat stat of them all.
>> <stuff about the few bonuses that phys ads get>
>And the fact that they can purchase Phys Adept powers, which sammies can't.
>(Natural LL/Thermo/Flare compensating eyes beat the heck out of the cyber
>versions for example.)
Anyone can be a metahuman that'll get those practically for free (wonders
why so many people use optinal rule that makes metahumans C, and then
complain about too powerful characters...wonders why our campaign uses it,
too) And the differences for cyber vs. natural vision aren't all that
glaring. (+2 difference at most, but they aren't worthless) And cybereyes
can be STACKED with stuff for practically no essence cost. Stack low-light,
thermographic, flare compensation, and optical magnification 3 (not
available to phys ads, but for argument's sake I'm letting it be) as a phys
ad and it's costing you one full magic point. Same thing costs a samurai
0.4 essence at regular costs.
>Yep, but a HTH designed Phys Adept is going to be more effective at HTH than
>a HTH designed sammy, I still beleive that.
And I'll believe otherwise. Guess it's a no-win ;^D Comparing my old
campaign's samurai with it's phys ads, the samurai would eat them up. In
fact, it was debated and agreed upon (though never tested...) that either of
the samurai could beat both phys ads at the same time. (troll samurai/elf
samurai/elf phys ad/human phys ad...elf sam had highest karma, followed by
human phys ad, elf phys ad, and troll samurai)
>Point 1) This is after initial character generation (not off the rack types
> as we were discussing).
> 2) If you took the example to grade 2, then the numbers would look
> quite different.
Not a whole lot, like I said...the phys ad may get an advantage of a point
or two, but the time that it'll take to do that is incredible. And he'll
end up around 5th level (or higher) initiate by that time.
>Assuming he doesn't buy any to begin with. For a single point of Magic he
>can be two skill points ahead of the sammy to start. _That_ is why Phys
>Adepts are usually so much better at HTH than sammies, they simply can have
>higher skill levels at earlier times. And not to forget (as you did in the
>above example) that Phys Adepts too can increase their skills directly using
>karma, rather than getting initiated, so the Phys Adept, if he really wants
>to, can stay those two points (or 4, or more) ahead of the sammy forever.
That single point of magic is 1/6 of his starting total. The particular
skills which phys ads get the BIG advantage at are atheletics and stealth.
If min/maxed "just right" then you can eek out the points a little
quicker...say 4th level initiate. Pay for the really cheap ones with magic
points and you'll end up saving more spare karma for the expensive ones.
>The only reason the sammy would be stronger is due to Muscle Replacement,
>and that particular piece of cyber is so inefficient that nobody gets it
>(unless they _really_ want to make sure they're stronger than the Phys
>Adpet). But strength does not matter if you cannot score a hit. Skill is
>more important than brawn. (And in SR Reach is more important than skill,
>but anyway... :-)).
True, but that's until bioware and alpha/beta-ware appear. Then Muscle Aug
and (improved) Muscle Replacement get to show off a bit. Another thing is
that I don't find a lot of people playing troll phys ads (although I made
one and kinda liked him...may have to break him out some day), so that bonus
is kinda lost. Elves and humans seem to be the race of choice for phys ads
as they are faster/smarter than dwarves, orcs, and trolls... but lack the
strength gained from those races.
>I was merely saying (and I still agree, you have yet to convince me
>otherwise) that the majority of Phys Adpets are HTH experts.
Yep, so are the majority of samurai. Expert = 4 points or more? 6 points
or more? Most samurai will make that at the start. We could argue this to
death...let us just agree to disagree, eh?
>Likewise with the satement "Phys Adepts are better at HTH". It is written
>into the rules - compare the costs for extra HTH skill dice with the others.
They aren't better at it, they're different at it. Never seen a phys ad so
scared as when he was facing a cybered troll with a combat axe. Oh yeah,
and the phys ad had a level 3 weapon focus (katana, was there any doubt
there?).
>Each to their own, but while stun damage might be easy for a sammy to heal
>(incidently it is just as easy for a magically active character to heal, it
>just comes with a bit of a worry), the physical damage is particularily
>worrying in my experience. While the magician can have the Phys Adpet from
>Deadly +3 to nothing in 15 seconds (or some similar small time), he'll be
>pushing it to save the sammies butt (ie get him below Deadly). But yes, you
>have a definite point, having a Magic Attribute is a bit double edged.
As is not having a magical attribute...as you said up there "(to) each his
own..."
>> Wondering if phys ads have to take geasa for every two points of magic
>> they lose, as well....
>Hmm, good question...Ponders for a bit, flicks through rule books...I don't
>think so. Geasa apply to the "use of" the characters magic. Phys Adepts
>powers will be continuously running, he doesn't need to "activate" them in
>the way that, say, a Sorcery Adept would. OTOH, I guess it is possible to
>apply the Geas to the Phys Adept all the time. But then how do you deal with
>it when he breaks the Geas? As it is, when a Geas is broke, the offender has
>+2 to has associated Target Numbers. What does the Physical Adept get? +2
>to the skill rolls of effected skills, and +2 to the rolls with effected
>attributes?
An interesting thought that is...anyone else out there got ideas on phys ad
loss of magic and whether or not they need geasa?
>> wondering why he keeps replying to magic vs. tech lines...
>Easy. Because you, like me, are a compulsive arguer. Simply can't sit by
>when there's a good argument to be had now can we? :-)
(hates to agree with this...but if he disagrees, he's proving the point)
-- Bob Ooton <topcat@******.net>
