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Message no. 1
From: Fade <runefo@***.UIO.NO>
Subject: Animal intelligence and cybernetic enhancement
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 03:00:50 +0000
I was thinking a little on the importance of language. Some say that
without language, we wouldn't be able to formulate complex thoughts,
which means that without language we can't really think.

This line of thought implies that humans are intelligent because we
can speak a language.

Then what happens if you plug an encephalon with a language chip into
a lion, and gives him a 'speech box' ?





--
Fade

And the Prince of Lies said:
"To reign is worth ambition, though in Hell:
Better to reign in hell than to serve in heaven."
-John Milton, Paradise Lost
Message no. 2
From: Matb <mbreton@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Re: Animal intelligence and cybernetic enhancement
Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 05:23:20 -0700
> I was thinking a little on the importance of language. Some say that
> without language, we wouldn't be able to formulate complex thoughts,
> which means that without language we can't really think.

Language is more about expression than conceptualization; most language
is learned at such an early age, however, that it's nearly impossible to
separate the two. In other words, you're folloring one branch of logic;
there are others.

> This line of thought implies that humans are intelligent because we
> can speak a language.

> Then what happens if you plug an encephalon with a language chip into
> a lion, and gives him a 'speech box' ?

Unh - there's a specific short I have in mind; but damn, I can;t
remember the name or the author. It's the trial of a chimpanzee, and a
scientist has basically outfitted ehr with a means toward expression
---- argh.
Message no. 3
From: Timothy Little <t_little@**********.UTAS.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Animal intelligence and cybernetic enhancement
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:58:24 +1000
At 03:00 AM 9/11/97 +0000, you wrote:
>
>I was thinking a little on the importance of language. Some say that
>without language, we wouldn't be able to formulate complex thoughts,
>which means that without language we can't really think.
>
>This line of thought implies that humans are intelligent because we
>can speak a language.

Well, logically it says that language use is a necessary condition for
intelligence (but may not be a sufficent condition), but nits aside,

>Then what happens if you plug an encephalon with a language chip into
>a lion, and gives him a 'speech box' ?

You probably have an insane lion, since the SR line seems to imply that
animals don't adapt well to cyber; I expect heavily neural cyber like
Encephalons would make things worse.

However, it's an interesting idea. If the lion does not go insane(*), but
adapts to the new capabilities, then you may have an animal becoming
increasingly more fluent in the human concepts behind the language. It
would still have its animal upbringing at the base of its personality, and
so would probably think very much like a Shapeshifter.

And we all know how they think ;-)


(*) What sort of definition do you use for insanity, when the subject is way
outside any previous norms of capabilities, personal circumstances, and
social
situation?

--
Tim Little
Message no. 4
From: MC23 <mc23@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: Animal intelligence and cybernetic enhancement
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 00:59:35 -0400
Fade once dared to write,

>I was thinking a little on the importance of language. Some say that
>without language, we wouldn't be able to formulate complex thoughts,
>which means that without language we can't really think.

Laurie Anderson says language is a virus from outer space. Since I
think in, well, concepts (since I can't put it firmly into words, that
description will do), I can't support that postulate. I believe language
is limiting.

>This line of thought implies that humans are intelligent because we
>can speak a language.

Sounds like the same logic that can prove 1 equals 0. These types of
discussion is fine for a theoretical posturing with friends over a few
drinks but not for where you're heading with it.

>Then what happens if you plug an encephalon with a language chip into
>a lion, and gives him a 'speech box' ?

You might just get a lion with incredible senses, rudimentary logic,
and a strong desire to rip that disturbing buzzing out of its head.

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

"Say what you mean, and say it mean!"
-Scraping Foetus off the Wheel, Ramrod

I am MC23
Message no. 5
From: Mike Bobroff <AirWisp@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Animal intelligence and cybernetic enhancement
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:03:24 -0400
In a message dated 97-09-10 21:03:38 EDT, you write:

> This line of thought implies that humans are intelligent because we
> can speak a language.
>
> Then what happens if you plug an encephalon with a language chip into
> a lion, and gives him a 'speech box' ?

The one thing that would need to happen is for the lion be able to understand
the language, just because it is slotted and accessible by the lion does not
confer understanding of the information within. However, give that same lion
a Translate quickening, and maybe you'll find out just exactly what part of
lunch you really are ...

AirWisp

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Thwap!