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Message no. 1
From: Jessica Grota <grota@*********.COM>
Subject: A question of Grand Scale
Date: Sun, 10 May 1998 02:23:32 -0400
* Jett hides from incoming thwaps once people read this message and then
look at the subject again * Okay, here's a question for you.

A team of PCs, but some miracle, killed an Eastern Dragon when the
rigger crashed their transport plane into its head. The PCs proceeded to
loot the corpse, taking blood, claws, etc from the corpse.
Okay, so the question is this. Several PCs managed to get a hold of a
bunch of scales. If you were to make a plated vest out of the scales,
what would its rating be? I checked the critter table, and according to
that, Eastern Dragons have a composite natural armor of 8. So would a
vest made from said critter's scales be 8/8? Or less?

--Jett
Message no. 2
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: A question of Grand Scale
Date: Sun, 10 May 1998 02:22:10 -0500
On Sun, 10 May 1998 02:23:32 -0400 Jessica Grota <grota@*********.COM>
writes:
>* Jett hides from incoming thwaps once people read this message and then
>look at the subject again * Okay, here's a question for you.
>
>A team of PCs, but some miracle, killed an Eastern Dragon when the
>rigger crashed their transport plane into its head. The PCs proceeded to
>loot the corpse, taking blood, claws, etc from the corpse.
>Okay, so the question is this. Several PCs managed to get a hold of a
>bunch of scales. If you were to make a plated vest out of the scales,
>what would its rating be? I checked the critter table, and according to
>that, Eastern Dragons have a composite natural armor of 8. So would a
>vest made from said critter's scales be 8/8? Or less?
>
>--Jett

"Grand Scale"? "Dragon Scales"? Ick bad pun! bad pun! (like I'm one to
talk ;)

Hmmm... I would use the stats for normal armor (clothing - security
armor, maybe Milspec if you're feeling particularly generous [and I mean
*real* generous!]) the big thing would be the ability to use the scales
as radicals or whatever (maybe Virgin Telsma or Arcana?) in enchanted
(see grimmy). Ya might want to get some one more familiar with
Enchanting.

Of course, what's another dragon gonna do when he/she sees you walking
down the street wearing kin's skin?

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum)

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Message no. 3
From: MC23 <mc23@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: A question of Grand Scale
Date: Sun, 10 May 1998 03:56:55 -0400
Once upon a time, Jessica Grota wrote;

>* Jett hides from incoming thwaps once people read this message and then
>look at the subject again * Okay, here's a question for you.
>
>A team of PCs, but some miracle, killed an Eastern Dragon when the
>rigger crashed their transport plane into its head. The PCs proceeded to
>loot the corpse, taking blood, claws, etc from the corpse.
>Okay, so the question is this. Several PCs managed to get a hold of a
>bunch of scales. If you were to make a plated vest out of the scales,
>what would its rating be? I checked the critter table, and according to
>that, Eastern Dragons have a composite natural armor of 8. So would a
>vest made from said critter's scales be 8/8? Or less?

Flaunting the violation of a dragon with that armor aren't you?
Dragon's have a hardened armor of 8 which is magical in nature (which is
why it's a critter). No live dragon, no 8/8 armor. It's great Telsma
though.
I would suggest the runners doing anything blatant with the spoils.
There's bound to be another dragon out there to make an example out of
the runners. And not all dragons are against one another, there is at
least one out there mourning the loss to its kind.

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

Ancient cultures believed that names held great power, personal names
more so and they were guarded very closely. To protect themselves, they
answered to another name, because if another discovered their real name,
it could be used against them.
History repeats itself.
Welcome to the Digital Age.
I am MC23
Message no. 4
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: A question of Grand Scale
Date: Sun, 10 May 1998 10:37:38 +0100
Jessica Grota said on 2:23/10 May 98...

> Okay, so the question is this. Several PCs managed to get a hold of a
> bunch of scales. If you were to make a plated vest out of the scales,
> what would its rating be? I checked the critter table, and according to
> that, Eastern Dragons have a composite natural armor of 8. So would a
> vest made from said critter's scales be 8/8? Or less?

Less, I'd say. IMO the dragon's armor rating takes into account the fact
that it's a very large critter and so isn't as easily hurt as smaller
ones; the actual armor rating of the scales would be about 4 or so, I'd
say. That would put a vest made from the scales in the order of armor 4/4.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
Just passing time.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

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Message no. 5
From: Airwasp <Airwasp@***.COM>
Subject: Re: A question of Grand Scale
Date: Sun, 10 May 1998 07:53:54 EDT
In a message dated 5/10/98 6:19:45 AM !!!First Boot!!!, grota@*********.COM
writes:

> A team of PCs, but some miracle, killed an Eastern Dragon when the
> rigger crashed their transport plane into its head. The PCs proceeded to
> loot the corpse, taking blood, claws, etc from the corpse.
> Okay, so the question is this. Several PCs managed to get a hold of a
> bunch of scales. If you were to make a plated vest out of the scales,
> what would its rating be? I checked the critter table, and according to
> that, Eastern Dragons have a composite natural armor of 8. So would a
> vest made from said critter's scales be 8/8? Or less?

Jett, this is not a flame question, but it is a good one none-the-less. It
would not have an armor rating of 8/8 as the armor rating has other factors in
it besides what the skin is made of. What I would do is treat it as something
along the lines of Partial and Full Armor (depending on the coverage), but
perhaps let the armor retain the properties of the Hardened Armor most dragons
have for a couple of months (no more than 3-4, IMHO).

Mike
Message no. 6
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: A question of Grand Scale
Date: Sun, 10 May 1998 10:34:53 EDT
In a message dated 5/10/98 2:36:00 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
dghost@****.COM writes:

<snipped sections about dragon body raiding>

> Hmmm... I would use the stats for normal armor (clothing - security
> armor, maybe Milspec if you're feeling particularly generous [and I mean
> *real* generous!]) the big thing would be the ability to use the scales
> as radicals or whatever (maybe Virgin Telsma or Arcana?) in enchanted
> (see grimmy). Ya might want to get some one more familiar with
> Enchanting.

Yeah, what a nice idea. However, something really interesting occured to us
some time back about this little concept.

If you want to remove the parts of the body for use later in any magical way,
you would have to make the Enchanting (Talismongering) test as per the rules
in Gathering Materials. This takes time. Also, as most enchanters (please
note, I did say most) have probably never dealt with "recovering body parts
from a dragon", it suddenly becomes a +1 modifier to the test as it is a new
thing.

Gathering Tests take some time (24 hours base), and would probably not be able
to yield more RAW units than the body attribute in any case (minimum of 1).
And the more time the person is sitting around, the worse things are likely
gonna get...

-K
Message no. 7
From: Nexx <nexx@********.NET>
Subject: Re: A question of Grand Scale
Date: Sun, 10 May 1998 13:42:44 -0500
----------
> From: MC23 <mc23@**********.COM>

> I would suggest the runners doing anything blatant with the spoils.
> There's bound to be another dragon out there to make an example out of
> the runners. And not all dragons are against one another, there is at
> least one out there mourning the loss to its kind.

Not to mention, most dragons would think, even if just for an instant, "If
they can take out xxxxxx, maybe they know how to take out me?" That is
sufficient reason to destroy those mortals in a dragon's mind, and I don't
think the UCAS makes a habit of prosecuting dragons.

***************
Rev. Mark Hall, Bardagh
aka Pope Nexx Many-Scars, PML FAQ Cop
aka Ellegon
ICQ 8108180 AIM: Nexx3
"How much wood could a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck could chuck wood?"
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Message no. 8
From: Jessica Grota <grota@*********.COM>
Subject: Re: A question of Grand Scale
Date: Sun, 10 May 1998 20:02:19 -0400
Ereskanti wrote:

<snip snip snip>

> If you want to remove the parts of the body for use later in any magical way,
> you would have to make the Enchanting (Talismongering) test as per the rules
> in Gathering Materials. This takes time. Also, as most enchanters (please
> note, I did say most) have probably never dealt with "recovering body parts
> from a dragon", it suddenly becomes a +1 modifier to the test as it is a new
> thing.


Hehe. We just made a test with the retrieving character's knife skill to
see if she could actually hack the scales off. She could, BTW, however
slipped with the knife while trying to take off a claw and wound up
nearly taking off her hand instead. She has NO idea what to do with the
scales as far as enchanting or anything. The chars just figured that
seeing as they're so hard to come by, dragon body parts could fetch a
high price.

--Jett
Message no. 9
From: Lehlan Decker <decker@****.FSU.EDU>
Subject: Re: A question of Grand Scale
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 10:46:16 -0500
>
> * Jett hides from incoming thwaps once people read this message and then
> look at the subject again * Okay, here's a question for you.
>
> A team of PCs, but some miracle, killed an Eastern Dragon when the
> rigger crashed their transport plane into its head. The PCs proceeded to
> loot the corpse, taking blood, claws, etc from the corpse.
> Okay, so the question is this. Several PCs managed to get a hold of a
> bunch of scales. If you were to make a plated vest out of the scales,
> what would its rating be? I checked the critter table, and according to
> that, Eastern Dragons have a composite natural armor of 8. So would a
> vest made from said critter's scales be 8/8? Or less?
>
Hmm...That is a good basis to start or maybe even divided by half 4/4
with some "unusual" properties. However creating this vest, should
take perhaps a powerful enchanter, and also a skilled armorer.
Heck I may even rule that it has to be bound with karma. It all depends
on how powerful and unique you want it to be. Heh..if I were the GM
I would let you create the armor, and then several slightly upset dragons
would come looking for you to retreive their "property" from the hands
of a puny human. <EGMG>


--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Lehlan Decker 644-4534 Systems Development
decker@****.fsu.edu http://www.scri.fsu.edu/~decker
--------------------------------------------------------------------
The universe doesn't have laws, it has habits. And habits can be broken.
Message no. 10
From: Wafflemeisters <evamarie@**********.NET>
Subject: Re: A question of Grand Scale
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 15:39:58 -0500
>
> Re: A question of Grand Scale (Gurth , Sun 4:37)
>
> Jessica Grota said on 2:23/10 May 98...
>
> > Okay, so the question is this. Several PCs managed to get a hold of a
> > bunch of scales. If you were to make a plated vest out of the scales,
> > what would its rating be? I checked the critter table, and according to
> > that, Eastern Dragons have a composite natural armor of 8. So would a
> > vest made from said critter's scales be 8/8? Or less?
>
> Less, I'd say. IMO the dragon's armor rating takes into account the fact
> that it's a very large critter and so isn't as easily hurt as smaller
> ones; the actual armor rating of the scales would be about 4 or so, I'd
> say. That would put a vest made from the scales in the order of armor 4/4.
>

Also, a vest covers less than the whole body, which in SR, is reflected
by lowering the armor value. Going by CT's limb armor guides, the vest
covers chest front and back, or 2 of 5 locations. Thus its armor value
is 2/5 normal. That would be 3/3, if you allow it is still 8/8 hide, or
2/2 with gurth intepretation. Call it 3/2, and you have a normal vest,
made of rather exotic material.

-Mongoose

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