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Mailing List Logs for ShadowRN

Message no. 1
From: "J.W.Thomas" <cm5323@***.AC.UK>
Subject: Astral and the living
Date: Thu, 13 Oct 1994 13:15:47 +0100
So mages cannot pass through living things when astrial, right?
(see earlier 'punching a mage' post)
So what happens when the living thing contacts the mage in
astrial space?
Does the physical odject slow down or stop?
does it act like a normal impact?
will the mage 'ride' out the impact? be displaced? stop dead?

Questions questions.
this could lead to all sorts of sillyness.
Mages being run down by bus loads of peaple.Trolls throwing live
animals at where they think mages are. Hamsters in the walls of
buildings to keep out the mages.

Jackfrost thinks an impact would simply displace the mage
slightly.
So what if you had a room with living walls and then you moved
them closer together? Could you crush the mage?

CHOPPER
Be free to all things of sense and rapture
there is no god on earth that will deny you this
Message no. 2
From: MILLIKEN DAMION A <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Astral and the living
Date: Fri, 14 Oct 1994 11:12:12 +1000
CHOPPER writes:

[Q's on getting astral mages from the physical]

This isn't the first time this has come up. Last time we didn't come to a
conclusion either, and I assume this is why you asked again. I say we should
add it to the growing list of things for Doom to ask the DLoH next time he
sacrifices his sister to communicate with the greater being.

--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au

(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
Message no. 3
From: Marc A Renouf <jormung@*****.UMICH.EDU>
Subject: Re: Astral and the living
Date: Thu, 13 Oct 1994 22:12:55 -0400
On Fri, 14 Oct 1994, MILLIKEN DAMION A wrote:

> This isn't the first time this has come up. Last time we didn't come to a
> conclusion either, and I assume this is why you asked again. I say we should
> add it to the growing list of things for Doom to ask the DLoH next time he
> sacrifices his sister to communicate with the greater being.
^^^^^^
Doom has a sister?!!?!?! (drool) ;) We can only hope she's not
so frippin' verbose as he is. I've never seen one person use so much
verbal drivel to say something so simple. Oh, well, at least most of his
usage is correct. I hate it when people speak outside their vocabulary
and fail miserably.

Marc
Message no. 4
From: "D.O.A. SECURITY" <MKNABUSCH@****.ALBION.EDU>
Subject: Re: Astral and the living
Date: Thu, 13 Oct 1994 22:22:25 -0500
I think (once again, from the book Burning Bright) that Dowd just
answered it.

Mages in astral are moved aside (mundane never notices) by mundanes/people
in the physical world, if the physical person walks through the space the
astral mage is standing in.
Like wise a bus of people will brush aside (the people will, not the bus)
a mage standing the the street.

Michael
aka Harlequin
Message no. 5
From: Luke Kendall <luke@********.CANON.OZ.AU>
Subject: Re: Astral and the living
Date: Fri, 14 Oct 1994 12:19:18 +1000
Astral beings don't have mass, so punching them with a physical
object will just distort them or move them aside, I'd say.

Certainly, an astral presence is completely undetectable to a
(mundane) physical person - otherwise you could build machines
that could detect spirits. The rules clearly state that this
will never be achievable.

You need a magic weapon to hurt them - so a Phys Adept would
need astral sight and killing hands or a magical weapon.

You can use willpower to attack manifesting spirits, so if you
follow the SR rules and allow astral mages to similarly manifest,
I guess you could attack them in the same way (willpower-driven
physical attacks), then. If they don't manifest, though, no way.

As far as crushing a mage between living walls - I really don't
know. I'd suggest it would cause them pain, and squeeze them
to an arbitrarily tiny size, but that it couldn't actually kill
them. You could certainly trap them, though, and they'd have no
chance of escape. So after Magic Rating hours, their Essence
will have dropped to zero and they'd die then, anyway.

Refer back to the discussion of putting astral mages in a headlock.


Keep in mind that astral space is not a place where the laws of
physics (and science in general) work. It's a world where
emotion and life are concrete things.

Oh, one final thing. Damion said that when a character astrally
perceives, they are dual natured. My recollection is different.

I think that it forms a link to astral space, and become vulnerable
to Grounding (following the rules strictly). Like, their eyes
are dual natured, but not their whole bodies. Maybe the astral
perceiver could remove an eyeball, and hit the mage with that. :-0

luke
Message no. 6
From: Luke Kendall <luke@********.CANON.OZ.AU>
Subject: Re: Astral and the living
Date: Fri, 14 Oct 1994 12:48:56 +1000
Damion writes:

> [Q's on getting astral mages from the physical]
>

> This isn't the first time this has come up. Last time we didn't come to a
> conclusion either, and I assume this is why you asked again. I say we should
> add it to the growing list of things for Doom to ask the DLoH next time he
> sacrifices his sister to communicate with the greater being.

Agreed. But I'd much prefer these questions to be answered by Paul Hume.

luke
Message no. 7
From: MILLIKEN DAMION A <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Astral and the living
Date: Fri, 14 Oct 1994 18:34:34 +1000
luke writes:

> Oh, one final thing. Damion said that when a character astrally
> perceives, they are dual natured. My recollection is different.
>
> I think that it forms a link to astral space, and become vulnerable
> to Grounding (following the rules strictly). Like, their eyes
> are dual natured, but not their whole bodies. Maybe the astral
> perceiver could remove an eyeball, and hit the mage with that. :-0

Well, on page 145 of SR II it says: "The character can touch and be touched
by other astrally active things...". That to me indicates that the whole of
the mages body is present in the astral, not just his eyes. Also recall that
an astrally perceiving physical adept is allowed to use sorcery skill in
astral combat, but there is no restriction on him having to have killing
hands to attack on the astral.

--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au

(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
Message no. 8
From: Stephane Lafrance <Stephane.Lafrance@***.ULAVAL.CA>
Subject: Re: Astral and the living
Date: Fri, 14 Oct 1994 09:46:09 EDT
----------------------[Reply - Original Message]----------------------
Sent by:Marc A Renouf <jormung@*****.UMICH.EDU>
On Fri, 14 Oct 1994, MILLIKEN DAMION A wrote:

Oh, well, at least most of his
usage is correct. I hate it when people speak outside their vocabulary
and fail miserably.

Marc
=====================================================================
I'd say, when you fail to speak an elaborated vocabulary, it's because
you're outside of it. But if you don't fail, you're in it!

Just my 0.02$ can.

Stephan
Message no. 9
From: Stephane Lafrance <Stephane.Lafrance@***.ULAVAL.CA>
Subject: Re: Astral and the living
Date: Fri, 14 Oct 1994 09:53:16 EDT
----------------------[Reply - Original Message]----------------------
Sent by:Luke Kendall <luke@********.canon.oz.au>
I think that it forms a link to astral space, and become vulnerable
to Grounding (following the rules strictly). Like, their eyes
are dual natured, but not their whole bodies. Maybe the astral
perceiver could remove an eyeball, and hit the mage with that. :-0

luke
=====================================================================
If I remember correctly, an astral perceiving adept (or mage), has to
place his astral body out of phase with his physical body. That would
make him a dual beeing.

Stephan

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