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Message no. 1
From: Chris <chris_hayes@*******.COM>
Subject: Astral Masking...
Date: Fri, 27 Mar 1998 09:45:55 -0800
Beware...this is a Beyond the Pale spoiler. You have been warned.


B
E
Y
O
N
D

T
H
E

P
A
L
E

S
P
O
I
L
E
R
.
.
.
.
.
Okay, that should be adequate room. Now...I know this has been discussed
before (I think) but I never wanted to read any of these threads because I
still wanted to read the books. Now that I'm finished, I want just one
question answered. (By the way, If Mr. Koke is reading this...Hats off to
you. An excellent series. I read Beyond the Pale in two nights. Kept me
riveted. Please continue to write, and I promise that I will continue to
buy your books.)

As all of you know, if you read the series, the spirit Lethe was able to
not only mask Burnout's meat body on the physical plane, but also mask him
on the astral also. Now, I've never seen this power before, I've never
known Spirits to have this power either. So I'm basically chalking this one
up as something that Lethe/Dunklezahn was able to do, just because he was
who he was. This is not a normal power, nor can it be accomplished with our
current mana power. However, since Lethe was a "special" type of spirit, he
had "special" powers.

If this has already been discussed to death, than maybe a few posts of
"Yes, this is a special power" and "No, you can't normally do this"
would be
more than sufficient. However, if for some reason this thread has never
seen the light of day before now, than I would be interested in what my
fellow collegues on the ol' list have to say.

Christopher Hayes
(Previously known as Jag, Wynter, Lupo, and a few other dead runners.)
chris_hayes@*******.com
(Still looking for a deep and thoughtful .sig, or one to just make you fall
out of your seat laughing.)
Message no. 2
From: Ashlocke <woneal@*******.NET>
Subject: Re: Astral Masking...
Date: Fri, 27 Mar 1998 21:10:23 -0005
On 27 Mar 98 at 9:45, Chris wrote:

> Beware...this is a Beyond the Pale spoiler. You have been warned.
>
>
> B
> E
> Y
> O
> N
> D
>
> T
> H
> E
>
> P
> A
> L
> E
>
> S
> P
> O
> I
> L
> E
> R
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
<snip>
> As all of you know, if you read the series, the spirit Lethe was able to
> not only mask Burnout's meat body on the physical plane, but also mask
> him on the astral also. Now, I've never seen this power before, I've

That's pretty much standard Masking ability per any initiate. It's
never stated that you can make yourself invisible on the astral with it,
though some play that you can and there are one or two references that
seem to imply you can. One more things I'm hoping gets cleared up in SR3.

> never known Spirits to have this power either. So I'm basically chalking

Free Spirits can have the power of Aura Masking (GRII, p79-80) which
works the same was as the metamagical ability of Masking that Initiates
get.

--
@>->,-`---
Ashelock
o=<======-

GM's Theme: "I am the eye in the sky, looking at you, I can see your lies.
I am the maker of rules, dealing in fools, I can cheat you blind."
Message no. 3
From: MC23 <mc23@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: Astral Masking...
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 1998 11:57:05 -0500
Once upon a time, Ashlocke wrote;

> That's pretty much standard Masking ability per any initiate. It's
>never stated that you can make yourself invisible on the astral with it,
>though some play that you can and there are one or two references that
>seem to imply you can. One more things I'm hoping gets cleared up in SR3.
>
>> never known Spirits to have this power either. So I'm basically chalking
>
> Free Spirits can have the power of Aura Masking (GRII, p79-80) which
>works the same was as the metamagical ability of Masking that Initiates
>get.

Wrong. Aura Masking cannot hind your presence on the Astral Plane.
Alter yes, hide no. The Faerie power Fading (PNoE) is the only known
instance of this happening in Shadowrun mechanics. Faeries are still
considered an unexplained creature and even their existence is debatable
(in game at least).

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

Ancient cultures believed that names held great power, personal names
more so and they were guarded very closely. To protect themselves, they
answered to another name, because if another discovered their real name,
it could be used against them.
History repeats itself.
Welcome to the Digital Age.
I am MC23
Message no. 4
From: Ashlocke <woneal@*******.NET>
Subject: Re: Astral Masking...
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 1998 18:59:35 -0005
On 30 Mar 98 at 11:57, MC23 wrote:

> Once upon a time, Ashlocke wrote;
>
> > That's pretty much standard Masking ability per any initiate. It's
> >never stated that you can make yourself invisible on the astral with it,
> >though some play that you can and there are one or two references that
> >seem to imply you can. One more things I'm hoping gets cleared up in SR3.
> >
> >> never known Spirits to have this power either. So I'm basically chalking
> >
> > Free Spirits can have the power of Aura Masking (GRII, p79-80) which
> >works the same was as the metamagical ability of Masking that Initiates
> >get.
>
> Wrong. Aura Masking cannot hind your presence on the Astral Plane.
> Alter yes, hide no. The Faerie power Fading (PNoE) is the only known

Like I said:

<<<<< It's never stated that you can make yourself invisible on the astral
with it, >>>>>
--
@>->,-`---
Ashelock
o=<======-

GM's Theme: "I am the eye in the sky, looking at you, I can see your lies.
I am the maker of rules, dealing in fools, I can cheat you blind."
Message no. 5
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Astral Masking
Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 11:44:46 -0500
I was thinking about masking astral forms nd came up with this. Please
tell me what you think :)

Astral Masking (Illusion Spell)
Works similar to the Intiate ability Masking. Each Success generated
acts as 1 level of Masking.
Type: Mana Range: Touch Target: 4
Duration: Sustained Drain: (F/2)M

Limitations:
1) Can not be learned at Force higher than current Intiate grade (If you
lose your intiation grades, you lose this spell)
2) for determining if the spell does physical drain, compare against
Intiate grade - magic loss intsead of current magic attribute.
3a) The mage can not maintain more successes than his/her current
Intiate Grade (extra successes are ignored); OR
3b) The mage can not maintain more successes than double his/her current
Intiate Grade (extra successes are ignored)

I tried to slap on as many "reasonable" limitations to make this balanced
... I don't know if it worked ;) and I think I forgot one ...

This was just an idea for "higher mysteries" of magic beyond those in
Grimmy ... and to allow mages to mask things like allie spirits ...
Optionally, you could replace standard Masking with this spell... Jsut a
thought ... Like several of my other "Just a thought" posts I won't be
using this but rather thought the list might find it interesting ....

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)
"Let he who is without SIN cast the first stone"

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Message no. 6
From: K is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Astral Masking
Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 13:05:09 EDT
In a message dated 7/7/98 11:50:25 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
dghost@****.COM writes:

> I was thinking about masking astral forms nd came up with this. Please
> tell me what you think :)

Okay, but please note...you have been warned :P

> Astral Masking (Illusion Spell)
> Works similar to the Intiate ability Masking. Each Success generated
> acts as 1 level of Masking.
> Type: Mana Range: Touch Target: 4
> Duration: Sustained Drain: (F/2)M

Okay, first and foremost, everyone is going to throw tizzies over this because
of the current way that Illusion magic functions. Anyone that is assensing is
going to see right on through the Illusion. May I suggest making this either
a Mental or Transformation Manipulation, going on the concept that "Astral
Static" falls under the latter category. A variation could readily do what
you are suggesting. Yes, I know the drain is higher...

> Limitations:
> 1) Can not be learned at Force higher than current Intiate grade (If you
> lose your intiation grades, you lose this spell)

ooo, one of those -weird concept spells forms-

> 2) for determining if the spell does physical drain, compare against
> Intiate grade - magic loss intsead of current magic attribute.

We actually have an entire collection of magic that is like this. Hell, we
have spell design rule ideas that let you alleviate certain modifiers in
exchange for not being able to use "X" points of Initiation in any test
concerning the spell in question.

> 3a) The mage can not maintain more successes than his/her current
> Intiate Grade (extra successes are ignored); OR

Not a bad consideration.

> 3b) The mage can not maintain more successes than double his/her current
> Intiate Grade (extra successes are ignored)

I personally believe the 3a version is better.

> I tried to slap on as many "reasonable" limitations to make this balanced
> ... I don't know if it worked ;) and I think I forgot one ...

But what you gave is not so terrible.

> This was just an idea for "higher mysteries" of magic beyond those in
> Grimmy ... and to allow mages to mask things like allie spirits ...
> Optionally, you could replace standard Masking with this spell... Jsut a
> thought ... Like several of my other "Just a thought" posts I won't be
> using this but rather thought the list might find it interesting ....
>
And it's a neat enough idea for such.

-K
Message no. 7
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Astral Masking
Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 16:26:39 -0500
On Tue, 7 Jul 1998 13:05:09 EDT K is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
writes:
>In a message dated 7/7/98 11:50:25 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
>dghost@****.COM writes:
>
>> I was thinking about masking astral forms nd came up with this.
Please
>> tell me what you think :)

>Okay, but please note...you have been warned :P

:) Noted :P

>> Astral Masking (Illusion Spell)
>> Works similar to the Intiate ability Masking. Each Success
generated
>> acts as 1 level of Masking.
>> Type: Mana Range: Touch Target: 4
>> Duration: Sustained Drain: (F/2)M

>Okay, first and foremost, everyone is going to throw tizzies over this
because
>of the current way that Illusion magic functions. Anyone that is
assensing is
>going to see right on through the Illusion. May I suggest making this
either
>a Mental or Transformation Manipulation, going on the concept that
"Astral
>Static" falls under the latter category. A variation could readily do
what
>you are suggesting. Yes, I know the drain is higher...

I thought they'd throw a tizzie because it was a spell that replicated a
metamagical ability... :) But I really think that this should remain an
Illusion spell since it doesn't change anything just makes them appear to
be what they're not... Also, please note: I didn't really calc the drain
using Grimmy, I just assigned it the drain for invisiblity. This was
because I didn't know where the effect fell into things ... If anyone has
any ideas I'm open to them :)

>> Limitations:
>> 1) Can not be learned at Force higher than current Intiate grade (If
you
>> lose your intiation grades, you lose this spell)

>ooo, one of those -weird concept spells forms-

>> 2) for determining if the spell does physical drain, compare against
>> Intiate grade - magic loss intsead of current magic attribute.

>We actually have an entire collection of magic that is like this. Hell,
we
>have spell design rule ideas that let you alleviate certain modifiers in
>exchange for not being able to use "X" points of Initiation in any test
>concerning the spell in question.

Now that you mention it, I think I remember that ...

>> 3a) The mage can not maintain more successes than his/her current
>> Intiate Grade (extra successes are ignored); OR

>Not a bad consideration.

>> 3b) The mage can not maintain more successes than double his/her
current
>> Intiate Grade (extra successes are ignored)

>I personally believe the 3a version is better.

I included 3b when I thought of replacing Masking with this spell ... so
GM's would have the following options (organized from most powerful to
least, IMO):

1) This spell is in addition to masking using option 3b for successes.
2) This spell is in addition to masking using option 3a for successes.
3) This spell is in place of masking using option 3b for successes.
4) This spell is in place of masking using option 3a for successes.

>> I tried to slap on as many "reasonable" limitations to make this
balanced
>> ... I don't know if it worked ;) and I think I forgot one ...

>But what you gave is not so terrible.

Good. I was worried :)

>> This was just an idea for "higher mysteries" of magic beyond those in
>> Grimmy ... and to allow mages to mask things like allie spirits ...
>> Optionally, you could replace standard Masking with this spell...
Jsut a
>> thought ... Like several of my other "Just a thought" posts I won't
be
>> using this but rather thought the list might find it interesting ....

>And it's a neat enough idea for such.
>
>-K

Thanks I was also thinking of making two other spells along these lines
but wanted to think of what the list thought of this one before I
designed them ...

1) If you didn't design it like this already (I can't remember), make
your astral changeling spell like this.

2) A astral transform spell. This one would be ... odd. What I have in
mind for this "spell" is the mage spends "x" amount of time
"casting" it
(ie the duration is Permanent(8 hrs or something) ...) per day and
resists drain when he/she finishes casting the spell for the day. Then
after casting it for "y" number of days (say 7 or 30), he/she makes a
success test and the number of successes determine what kind of changes
are made to his/her aura/spell signature ... (The downside is that
manipulating your self image can have -NASTY- effects on your personality
... <eGMg>) ...

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)
"Let he who is without SIN cast the first stone"

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Further Reading

If you enjoyed reading about Astral Masking..., you may also be interested in:

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Thwap!