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From:	David 'Vanyel' Ramsden <PH93122@****.SCI.PORT.AC.UK>
Subject:	Astral movement through living things
Date:	Fri, 10 Mar 1995 12:33:04 GMT

Message no. 1 If all living things have a presence how is it that astral mages
can move through astral space at all. The air is full of bacteria,
which are living. Also how would he see beyond the end of his
astral nose. Moving through astral space would be like wading
through fog in all but the most sterile conditions.

********************************************************************
David Ramsen
Alias :-Vanyel on MBA4,Surfers,Monochrome and loads of other places.
Mist on Shadowtk.
Kieran on The Storyteller Circle and Angreal MOO.

If you can't find me on MBA4 (jumper.mcc.ac.uk 3214) try Emailing
me on ph93122@****.sci.port.ac.uk.

********************************************************************

From:	Jani Fikouras <feanor@**********.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject:	Re: Astral movement through living things
Date:	Fri, 10 Mar 1995 13:54:10 +0100

Message no. 2 > If all living things have a presence how is it that astral mages
> can move through astral space at all. The air is full of bacteria,
> which are living. Also how would he see beyond the end of his
> astral nose. Moving through astral space would be like wading
> through fog in all but the most sterile conditions.

The question has been asked before, and it is not the only
inconsistency in the astral movent rules. If you wana get really
thorough take water - water contains far more living organisms
than air and yet mages can still move through water. The only answer
is IMHO that it either is just another superstion (i.e. mages
believe they can go through living beings and so they effectively
block themselves) or living matter has to have a certain density
to prove effective in blocking astral movent.

--
"Believe in Angels." -- The Crow

GCS d>- H s+: !g p? !au a- w+ v-(?) C+++ UA++S++L+>++++ P-- (aren't we all?)
L+>+++ 3 E--- N+ K W(+)(---) M-- !V(--) -po+(---) Y+ t++ 5+ !j(-) R+++(--)
!G tv(++) b++ D+ B- e+ u++(-) h*(+) f+ r- n!(----) y?

From:	Damion Milliken <adm82@***.EDU.AU>
Subject:	Re: Astral movement through living things
Date:	Sat, 11 Mar 1995 00:04:16 +1000

Message no. 3 Jani Fikouras writes:

> The question has been asked before, and it is not the only
> inconsistency in the astral movent rules. If you wana get really
> thorough take water - water contains far more living organisms
> than air and yet mages can still move through water. The only answer
> is IMHO that it either is just another superstion (i.e. mages
> believe they can go through living beings and so they effectively
> block themselves) or living matter has to have a certain density
> to prove effective in blocking astral movent.

Yeah, you're right. It has no real explanation in SR. A major kludge is
neccessary for it to be employed in play. Your explanation is as close to
anything as I have seen that explains it to a decent degree.

--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong E-mail: adm82@***.edu.au

(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+@ H s++:-- !g p0 !au a18 w+ v(?) C++ US++>+++ P+ L !3
E? N K- W M@ !V po@ Y+ t+ 5 !j R+(++) G(+)('''') !tv(--@)
b++ D B? e+ u@ h* f+ !r n----(--)@ !y+

From:	Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject:	Re: Astral movement through living things
Date:	Sat, 11 Mar 1995 12:19:36 +0100

Message no. 4 >If all living things have a presence how is it that astral mages
>can move through astral space at all. The air is full of bacteria,
>which are living. Also how would he see beyond the end of his
>astral nose. Moving through astral space would be like wading
>through fog in all but the most sterile conditions.

And in sterile conditions, it's dark in astral space :) I was thinking about
this too some time ago, and I think it's best to discard such things as
bacteria otherwise it just gets totally useless to use astral
perception/projection at all...

Gurth@******.nl - Gurth@***.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
The story you have just heard is true.
The names have not been changed to protect the guilty.
Geek Code v2.1: GS/AT/! -d+ H s:- !g p?(3) !au a>? w+(+++) v*(---) C+(++) U
P? !L !3 E? N++ K- W+ -po+(po) Y+ t(+) 5 !j R+(++)>+++$ tv+(++) b+@ D+(++)
B? e+ u+@ h! f--(?) !r(--)(*) n---->!n y?

From:	Luke Kendall <luke@********.CANON.OZ.AU>
Subject:	Re: Astral movement through living things
Date:	Mon, 13 Mar 1995 13:58:20 +1000

Message no. 5 >If all living things have a presence how is it that astral mages
>can move through astral space at all. The air is full of bacteria,
>which are living.

The way we resolved this was to say that the Astral Body was a bit
like a sponge, and internally slightly fluid, so that it would
flow around small obstacles - think of physical bacteria colliding
with an astral form as bubbles moving through a liquid. This
explanation, while weird, works.

> Also how would he see beyond the end of his
>astral nose. Moving through astral space would be like wading
>through fog in all but the most sterile conditions.

The visibility modifiers for Astral Space in the Grimoire indicate
that this isn't the case. I've never been able to think of a
justification for it, though.

I wonder how Robert Watkins FAQ on the shadowrun game itself, is
going? :-)

luke

From:	Robert Watkins <bob@**.NTU.EDU.AU>
Subject:	Re: Astral movement through living things
Date:	Mon, 13 Mar 1995 14:17:18 +0930

Message no. 6 Luke Kendall wrote:
> I wonder how Robert Watkins FAQ on the shadowrun game itself, is
> going? :-)
>

Getting there... I'm waiting to see if the one on rec.games.cyber gets
posted at all in the next few weeks before I release a copy on you. (Give
it another two,three weeks max)

--
Robert Watkins bob@**.ntu.edu.au
Real Programmers never work 9 to 5. If any real programmers
are around at 9 am, it's because they were up all night.
Finger me for my geek code

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