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Message no. 1
From: Helge Diernaes <ecocide@***.CBS.DK>
Subject: Astral Presences of Non-living materials.
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 23:56:37 +0100
The difference between a Human aura and a large boulder is described, I
believe, as a stark difference in intensity, but the stone has still
gotten an aura. So being a "natural" element, it blocks astral perception
as well as passage (Somewhere in Grimy).
This must also hold for small stones, like sand particles.

What then is the reason for the Astal passability of cement walls? Not that I
complain, but inconsistencies - if such one exists - doesn't sit well with
me, as they disturb PC creativity.

So assuming that neither FASA nor I have made a blunder here, what does
the Forum think account for the aural difference between a stone in
nature and stone in artifical settings?

I've thought shortly on the following;
1. The stones have been de-naturelised by (M)-humans.
: How? i'm sure that gravel in nature would have auras too. If this
argument should have weight, that would be because of the far proximity
from nature in a city.

2. There is metal and lots of other artifical materials in walls.
: Even if so, the amount of sand should still hinder Astral passage, much
the same way as would a haze of microbes. This ofcourse depends on GM
interpretation.

What does the Forum think?

--
Silhouette

___________
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___________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________________
Helge Diernaes | "I'm going slightly mad..."
ecocide@***.cbs.dk | Freddy Mercury, Queen
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Message no. 2
From: Robert Watkins <bob@**.NTU.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Astral Presences of Non-living materials.
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 09:44:38 +0930
Helge Diernaes wrote:
>
> The difference between a Human aura and a large boulder is described, I
> believe, as a stark difference in intensity, but the stone has still
> gotten an aura. So being a "natural" element, it blocks astral perception
> as well as passage (Somewhere in Grimy).

Ah... a boulder doesn't block astral passage... :) The Earth does, but
that's different.

> This must also hold for small stones, like sand particles.
>
> What then is the reason for the Astal passability of cement walls? Not that I
> complain, but inconsistencies - if such one exists - doesn't sit well with
> me, as they disturb PC creativity.

The sand has been mechanically processed, killing the connection to the
Earth, and removing it's astral properties. It still has an aura (but
fainter ones).

> So assuming that neither FASA nor I have made a blunder here, what does
> the Forum think account for the aural difference between a stone in
> nature and stone in artifical settings?
>
> I've thought shortly on the following;
> 1. The stones have been de-naturelised by (M)-humans.
> : How? i'm sure that gravel in nature would have auras too. If this
> argument should have weight, that would be because of the far proximity
> from nature in a city.

Gravel in nature is formed by natural processes, and left alone. Gravel in
cement is processed... :)

> 2. There is metal and lots of other artifical materials in walls.
> : Even if so, the amount of sand should still hinder Astral passage, much
> the same way as would a haze of microbes. This ofcourse depends on GM
> interpretation.

A haze of microbes DOESN'T affect astral passage or perception. The air is
full of microbes as it is. :) There's also this idea that, below a certain
size, it doesn't have much affect.

--
Robert Watkins bob@**.ntu.edu.au
Real Programmers never work 9 to 5. If any real programmers
are around at 9 am, it's because they were up all night.
*** Finger me for my geek code ***
Message no. 3
From: Jani Fikouras <feanor@**********.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: Astral Presences of Non-living materials.
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 1995 16:11:46 +0100
Helge Diernaes wrote:
>
> The difference between a Human aura and a large boulder is described, I
> believe, as a stark difference in intensity, but the stone has still
> gotten an aura.

Yes

> So being a "natural" element, it blocks astral perception
> as well as passage (Somewhere in Grimy).

No, only living earth can block your passage and a boulder is not
living earth to me (at least not most of the time).

> This must also hold for small stones, like sand particles.

Sand is living earth, its not the same as a compact boulder.

> What then is the reason for the Astal passability of cement walls? Not that I
> complain, but inconsistencies - if such one exists - doesn't sit well with
> me, as they disturb PC creativity.

Cement walls are man-made (dead) objects, they do not contain life
and hence they can be traversed.

--
GCS d s+: p1 a-->? C++++ UA++$S++L+++>++++ L+++ E--- W+ N+ w(--) M-- !V(--)
PS+ PE Y+ PGP-- @*++ 5++ X++ R+++ tv++ b++ G+++ e++ h+(*) r

"In my mind I see the matrix, and in the matrix is held the power. The lock
to the matrix is my will, and in the matrix my will becomes the power."
Message no. 4
From: Jani Fikouras <feanor@**********.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: Astral Presences of Non-living materials.
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 1995 16:24:33 +0100
Robert Watkins wrote:
> The sand has been mechanically processed, killing the connection to the
> Earth, and removing it's astral properties. It still has an aura (but
> fainter ones).

Are we talking proceced sand here or natural beach sand ? Beach sand is
pretty much alive I assure you.

--
GCS d s+: p1 a-->? C++++ UA++$S++L+++>++++ L+++ E--- W+ N+ w(--) M-- !V(--)
PS+ PE Y+ PGP-- @*++ 5++ X++ R+++ tv++ b++ G+++ e++ h+(*) r

"In my mind I see the matrix, and in the matrix is held the power. The lock
to the matrix is my will, and in the matrix my will becomes the power."
Message no. 5
From: Glenn Robertson <GLENN.ROBERTSON@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Astral Presences of Non-living materials.
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 1995 11:10:49 -0700
> > So being a "natural" element, it blocks astral perception
> > as well as passage (Somewhere in Grimy).
>
> No, only living earth can block your passage and a boulder is not
> living earth to me (at least not most of the time).
>
> > This must also hold for small stones, like sand particles.
>
> Sand is living earth, its not the same as a compact boulder.
OK, wait. I have become confused or hypoxic here. Define (if you
please) "Living Earth," and tell me how sand is such.

Thanks
Glenn Robertson ___
Microbiologist Extraordinaire /***\
A.K.A. Miniature Livestock Manager |nasty|
|virus|
"My Homework Ate My Dog!" \***/
[-]
/^+++^\ /\
_/ / # \ \/
/ \ \_
| \
/
Message no. 6
From: Jani Fikouras <feanor@**********.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: Astral Presences of Non-living materials.
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 1995 19:42:45 +0100
Glenn Robertson wrote:
> > > So being a "natural" element, it blocks astral perception
> > > as well as passage (Somewhere in Grimy).
> >
> > No, only living earth can block your passage and a boulder is not
> > living earth to me (at least not most of the time).
> >
> > > This must also hold for small stones, like sand particles.
> >
> > Sand is living earth, its not the same as a compact boulder.
> OK, wait. I have become confused or hypoxic here. Define (if you
> please) "Living Earth," and tell me how sand is such.

Living earth is soil (most of the time) that can support/is filled
with life. Sand definitely does fulfill both conditions, a boulder may
or may not fulfill them, manmade concrete definitely doesn't.
A rule of thumb is that dirt/soil/rocks/sand not touched by man count
as living earth. Processed stuff generally is not.

--
GCS d s+: p1 a-->? C++++ UA++$S++L+++>++++ L+++ E--- W+ N+ w(--) M-- !V(--)
PS+ PE Y+ PGP-- @*++ 5++ X++ R+++ tv++ b++ G+++ e++ h+(*) r

"In my mind I see the matrix, and in the matrix is held the power. The lock
to the matrix is my will, and in the matrix my will becomes the power."
Message no. 7
From: Robert Watkins <bob@**.NTU.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Astral Presences of Non-living materials.
Date: Sun, 15 Oct 1995 14:04:33 +0930
Jani Fikouras wrote:
>
> Robert Watkins wrote:
> > The sand has been mechanically processed, killing the connection to the
> > Earth, and removing it's astral properties. It still has an aura (but
> > fainter ones).
>
> Are we talking proceced sand here or natural beach sand ? Beach sand is
> pretty much alive I assure you.

Not by the time it gets through the cement mixer, it isn't... :)

And I was down at the beach last night, and although I say lots of
critters, I didn't see the kind of life you get in, say, garden soil which
would make me think that was "living earth".

--
Robert Watkins bob@**.ntu.edu.au
Real Programmers never work 9 to 5. If any real programmers
are around at 9 am, it's because they were up all night.
*** Finger me for my geek code ***
Message no. 8
From: Robert Watkins <bob@**.NTU.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Astral Presences of Non-living materials.
Date: Sun, 15 Oct 1995 14:02:53 +0930
Jani Fikouras wrote:
> > This must also hold for small stones, like sand particles.
>
> Sand is living earth, its not the same as a compact boulder.
>

I dunno, Jani... "living earth" sounds to me like soil, not sand, which is
pretty dead, actually...

--
Robert Watkins bob@**.ntu.edu.au
Real Programmers never work 9 to 5. If any real programmers
are around at 9 am, it's because they were up all night.
*** Finger me for my geek code ***
Message no. 9
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Astral Presences of Non-living materials.
Date: Sun, 15 Oct 1995 12:28:35 +0100
Jani Fikouras said on 14 Oct 95...

> Living earth is soil (most of the time) that can support/is filled with
> life. Sand definitely does fulfill both conditions, a boulder may
> or may not fulfill them, manmade concrete definitely doesn't.
> A rule of thumb is that dirt/soil/rocks/sand not touched by man count as
> living earth. Processed stuff generally is not.

So the matrass on your bed is living earth, eh? :)

That's a thought... Matrasses are crawling with life, mites mostly, which
are too big to pass through according to FASA (if FAB is blocking astral
passage, then mites should certainly do so too -- about 0.3 mm long,
against a few micrometers for large bacteria). Keep magicians out of your
house by lining the walls with used matrasses :)

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Living day by day
-> NERPS Project Leader & Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-

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Y PGP- t(+) 5+ X+ R+++>$ tv+(++) b+@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(--) y?
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
Message no. 10
From: Glenn Robertson <GLENN.ROBERTSON@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Astral Presences of Non-living materials.
Date: Sun, 15 Oct 1995 11:50:53 -0700
> > Are we talking proceced sand here or natural beach sand ? Beach sand is
> > pretty much alive I assure you.
>
> Not by the time it gets through the cement mixer, it isn't... :)
>
> And I was down at the beach last night, and although I say lots of
> critters, I didn't see the kind of life you get in, say, garden soil which
> would make me think that was "living earth".
With my education serving as a background on that one, I can assure you
that that natural beach sand is every bit alive with critters as garden
soil. The majority of critters in garden soil are microscopic. The same
is true for the water and sand.

Glenn Robertson ___
Microbiologist Extraordinaire /***\
A.K.A. Miniature Livestock Manager |nasty|
|virus|
"My Homework Ate My Dog!" \***/
[-]
/^+++^\ /\
_/ / # \ \/
/ \ \_
| \
/

Further Reading

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