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Message no. 1
From: Jarrod D Steeley <tinyskullhane@****.COM>
Subject: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Sun, 2 Feb 1997 13:49:26 EST
I wrote and GMed an adventure last night. I thought it was pretty good
but it turns out that it really sucked. I was the one who got everybody
else interested in Shadowrun about 3 weeks ago. There was a friend of
mine that never played before and decided to join up with the group in
playing Shadowrun. He kind of brought down the mood because he is always
negative. That set the stage for my adventure. I had so many things that
just came out of no where, people said it sucked. Along with people
making stupid sexual related comments which at times it can make it
funny, but in this instance it made all my characters try to kill each
other thanks to the newcomer, because he just had to get his revenge on
everybody which made the game an hour longer and twice as boring as it
would have been if he'd not been there. Now nobody really wants to play
anymore.
How do I get everybody else interested in Shadowrun again and him to calm
down.

Tiny Skull Hane <Tulsa,OK USA>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SID LIVES, Elvis is dead.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 2
From: David Buehrer <dbuehrer@****.ORG>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Sun, 2 Feb 1997 12:22:20 -0700
Jarrod D Steeley wrote:
|
| How do I get everybody else interested in Shadowrun again

Well, first take responsibility for anything that was your
fault, and learn from it (everything from writing to
running the adventure, to dealing with your players, to not
having a good grasp of the Shadowrun world, whatever). I'm
not saying you're a bad GM, I'm just saying that you should
figure out what went wrong on your end and take steps to
fix it.

Then tell the players that you want to run Shadowrun
again. That this time it'll be better, cuz hey, it
couldn't possibly get worse :) There's one advantage to
starting in the basement, you've got nowhere to go but up.

And truth be told it wasn't all your fault. The players
have a responsibility to play the game. It's the GM's
responsibility to provide the adventure. It's *everyone's*
responsibility to have fun. So if they start screwing with
your game call them on it.

| and him to calm down.

Oi. Well, you've said that this guy is a friend, and in
the same sentance that he's a negative person. Hmmm.
Okay, he's gotta have some good qualities. Be right up
front with him. Tell him to give it a chance, and to try
to have a good time. Tell him that if he isn't willing to
do that, then he isn't welcome. Think of it this way - if
you got a pebble in your shoe, whould you take it out, or
spend the entire day walking around with a pebble in your
shoe saying, "Man this sucks, I got a pebble in my shoe."?

-David
--
/^\/^\/^\/^\/^\/^\/^\ dbuehrer@****.org /^\/^\/^\/^\/^\/^\/^\
"His thoughts tumbled in his head, making and breaking
alliances like underpants in a dryer without Cling Free."
~~~http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1068/homepage.htm~~~~
Message no. 3
From: GRANITE <granite@**.NET>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Sun, 2 Feb 1997 15:20:24 -0700
I have to agree with just about everything David Buehrer said...You
do havve to take responsibility for your part..And you do have to
talk to your players and get them interested..But Here is how in
general I would deal with the following...more or less..

> There was a friend of
> mine that never played before and decided to join up with the group in
> playing Shadowrun

1] You should sit down with Mr. I'mNewToSR and explain the best you
can the SR universe..The have him read the intro stuff in the rule
book..This should get him heading in the right direction..

. He kind of brought down the mood because he is always
> negative

With this for knowledge you should have talked to the guy and asked
him to try and pick his mood up a bit..Not so much that he isn't
having fun..but enough he isn't ruining things for everyone
else..explain it is about working together...

>. I had so many things that
> just came out of no where, people said it sucked.

This is a common GM prob...Unfortunately there is no cure..players
will always pull curve balls out of the stratosphere and send them
the GMs way at light speed...The only thing you can do is to stay on
your toes and just flow with it..if all of a sudden the players take
you down an alley you weren't prepared to go down..think about it for
a second...and pull something right out of your arse...The players
won't mind and might not even notice..I have found that the more you
try and hem the players in..the harder they strive to break free..I
had to pull an entire 4 hour gaming session right out of thin air one
night..Every time I thought I'll get control of this by doing that
and upping the ante..Wrong..they just got deeper and deeper into this
little side trip...But when it was all said and done..THe players had
a blast..they hadn't made any progress in the direction of the
storyline..but they had fun and that was the main thing..I guess I'm
trying to say be prepared to be surprised..And the more linear a
module is the harder the players will try to make a left turn..

> Along with people
> making stupid sexual related comments which at times it can make it
> funny, but in this instance it made all my characters try to kill each
> other thanks to the newcomer

Hmmm..This is an easy one...If one of your PCs make this sort of
comment..Wait a min..
..If this is a problem with the players making
this sort of comments and then wanting to get revenge with their
PCs..TAKE CONTROL and put a stop to it as it is happening..With
comments like "Grow up!" "Quit being and [youe fav explicative
here]"or a simple "That sort of talk is not helping things let's play
the game"
..If it a PC problem..this is much simpler..Make the PCs comments
come true..but in a way that will teach a lesson..For instance:
[little human PC] "Hey fag boy..wher's your tutu?"
[Fag Bob]turns and replies,"Hiya sweetheart...With my
boytoy..."points to the biggest meanest looking troll the earth has
ever seen, "But he's kinda jealous." Giganto-Troll sees and starts to
react..[and it turns out they belong to a gang of like minded folks
who don't mind forcing themselves on the PCs..Let them know]
OR
PC is constantly cruising for chicks when he should be paying
attention to what is going on..Let him find a VERY drunk female..Who
appears to approve of his attentions..And just when he is
thinking..I'm gonna get lucky..have her BARF all over him...This
should put an end to the cruising..Or you can choose that time to
start shooting at him...Nothing like surprise to get in a few extra
rounds..Afterall she has a boy friend that is very jealous..And if he
gets killed..She will hate him forever...Women..who can figure
them...
-------------------------------GRANITE
=================================================================
Lord, Grant Me The Serenity To Accept The Things I Cannot Change,
The Courage To Change The Things I Can,
And The Wisdom To Hide The Bodies Of Those People I Had To Kill
Because They Pissed Me Off.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ShadowRunner's Serenity Prayer
Message no. 4
From: MC23 <mc23@****.NET>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Mon, 3 Feb 1997 04:18:15 -0500
Tiny Skull Hane wrote,
>How do I get everybody else interested in Shadowrun again and him to calm
>down.

Wait. Give the people enough time to get over their dissatisfaction
while you are preparing your next game which involves things your players
want to do, not just what you want to do. The lesson I learned early on
when I ran Champions is that players really do pay a lot more attention
when the plot involves their character as opposed to just something they
need to do. Now the trick is finding out what they would like to do.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-



Ancient cultures believed that names held great power, personal
names more so and they were guarded very closely. To protect themselves,
they answered to another name, because if another discovered their real
name, it could be used against them.
History repeats itself.
Welcome to the Digital Age.
I am MC23
Message no. 5
From: "Arno R. Lehmann" <arlehma@***.NET>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Tue, 4 Feb 1997 03:06:05 +0100
On Sun, 2 Feb 1997 15:20:24 -0700, GRANITE wrote:

>..if all of a sudden the players take
>you down an alley you weren't prepared to go down..think about it for
>a second...and pull something right out of your arse...The players
>won't mind and might not even notice..I have found that the more you
>try and hem the players in..the harder they strive to break free..I
>had to pull an entire 4 hour gaming session right out of thin air one
>night..Every time I thought I'll get control of this by doing that
>and upping the ante..Wrong..they just got deeper and deeper into this
>little side trip...But when it was all said and done..THe players had
>a blast..they hadn't made any progress in the direction of the
>storyline..but they had fun and that was the main thing..I guess I'm
>trying to say be prepared to be surprised..And the more linear a
>module is the harder the players will try to make a left turn..

I'd even go a little further here: I think the best gaming sessions
were the ones I pulled ideas from everywhere ... (you noticed? three
dots, not two! and a blank before them ... that's style!)
In fact I have come to the conclusion that having too straight ideas
where the players should go makes RPing less interesting. I at least
tend to make thinks a lot too linear then. Of course GMing is more
difficult then, you should know the world and the rules rather good.
But of course we all started down in the basement one day (and these
days are not long gone)

--
Arno
*********************************************************************
Be careful when replying to this mail - check the address !!!
(And send me a note when you notice that
the reply-to-address points to the list!)
*********************************************************************
Message no. 6
From: L Canthros <lobo1@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Tue, 4 Feb 1997 21:45:18 EST
On Sun, 2 Feb 1997 15:20:24 -0700 GRANITE <granite@**.net> writes:
<snip>
>Hmmm..This is an easy one...If one of your PCs make this sort of
>comment..Wait a min..
>..If this is a problem with the players making
>this sort of comments and then wanting to get revenge with their
>PCs..TAKE CONTROL and put a stop to it as it is happening..With
>comments like "Grow up!" "Quit being and [youe fav explicative
>here]"or a simple "That sort of talk is not helping things let's play
>the game"
>..If it a PC problem..this is much simpler..Make the PCs comments
>come true..but in a way that will teach a lesson..For instance:
>[little human PC] "Hey fag boy..wher's your tutu?"
>[Fag Bob]turns and replies,"Hiya sweetheart...With my
>boytoy..."points to the biggest meanest looking troll the earth has
>ever seen, "But he's kinda jealous." Giganto-Troll sees and starts to
>react..[and it turns out they belong to a gang of like minded folks
>who don't mind forcing themselves on the PCs..Let them know]
>OR
>PC is constantly cruising for chicks when he should be paying
>attention to what is going on..Let him find a VERY drunk female..Who
>appears to approve of his attentions..And just when he is
>thinking..I'm gonna get lucky..have her BARF all over him...This
>should put an end to the cruising..Or you can choose that time to
>start shooting at him...Nothing like surprise to get in a few extra
>rounds..Afterall she has a boy friend that is very jealous..And if he
>gets killed..She will hate him forever...Women..who can figure
>them...

OR...

have the girl the PC has been hitting on all night turn out to be a
mantid>:) that should cure that, at least for a while...

Canthros-the-shapeshifter-mage-who-is-saving-this-advice-for-his-own-game
--
If any man wishes peace, canthros1@***.com
let him prepare for war. lobo1@****.com
--Roman proverb
http://members.aol.com/canthros1/
Message no. 7
From: L Canthros <lobo1@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Tue, 4 Feb 1997 21:45:19 EST
On Sun, 2 Feb 1997 13:49:26 EST Jarrod D Steeley <tinyskullhane@****.COM>
writes:
>I wrote and GMed an adventure last night. I thought it was pretty good
>but it turns out that it really sucked. I was the one who got
>everybody else interested in Shadowrun about 3 weeks ago. There was a
>friend of mine that never played before and decided to join up with
>the group in playing Shadowrun. He kind of brought down the mood
>because he is always negative. That set the stage for my adventure. I
>had so many things that just came out of no where, people said it
>sucked. Along with people making stupid sexual related comments which

I heard about the same thing after the first run I GMed. It was my fault,
but I didn't exactly appreciate the words "It sucked" every time I heard
my name and GM in the same sentence, in part because I could never find
out from anyone I asked why it sucked. Signing on to this list was good
right off, because we'll be here to help you solve a lot of the problems
you'll have as a new GM. If you've got web access, be sure to hunt up
several SR web pages. If you're also Java-capable (which I'm not at the
moment:(, try checking out Shadowland (http://www.shadowland.org). I
spent a large part of the summer on Shadowland, getting into the feel of
the game, the atmospere and playing catch-up with recent events in the SR
world. In short, find out what you did wrong, read up on everything you
can find (don't let the game interfere with more important things, tho'
Schoolwork will be very influential in getting you into college, where
you can play lots of SR:), and you'll probably wind up a better GM for
it. Get advice where you can, experience is even better, though.

>at times it can make it funny, but in this instance it made all my
>characters try to kill each other thanks to the newcomer, because he
>just had to get his revenge on everybody which made the game an hour
>longer and twice as boring as it would have been if he'd not been
>there. Now nobody really wants to play anymore.
>How do I get everybody else interested in Shadowrun again and him to
>calm down.
>
First, be persuasive:) If you really want to play or GM with these guys
again, you may have to be persistent about it. Don't be too persistent
(you don't want to be a *total* pest), but be sure to let them know that
you'd like to give it a second try and that you think they'll enjoy it:)
I had to do some of this myself a while back, I currently have 5 regular
players, even if we don't play more than once a month <dejected sign>

Second, take some time to discuss with your players and find out what
they and their characters want to do. Discuss where you'd like to take
the game (big picture time: what is the underlying theme in your game?),
and talk about where they'd like to take the game (if the players aren't
happy, they won't play, after all:).

Third, implement this. Get as much background info on the PCs as you can
(the 20 questions is a good place to start). The more the better, because
it will provide a backdrop for your adventures and a backdrop for the
characters' interactions with each other and the NPCs. If necessary, sit
down with them and help them design new characters/redesign the old ones
to provide that kind of info and to better work with the other
characters. Find/write adventures that fit in with the theme of your game
and with the gameworld, if necessary, read a few books set in Shadowrun
(Dead Air is supposed to be real good, and writer is a list member, as a
plus:). Go over the info in the And So It Came to Pass... and the Plus Ca
Change chapters in the book, they'll help provide background info and
setting for your game. Make your background as rich as possible, use
props and drawings when/if you can.

Fourth, when you describe things, paint the picture with words. Don't get
too verbose or you'll wind up putting everyone to sleep, but make sure
they don't have to use their imagination too much trying to decide what
they're characters are seeing, they should be busy trying to decide how
their characters will be reacting to what they see. Keep it interesting,
if it starts to slow down or get boring, do something:)

If there is a lot of in-fighting going on, you may need to check to be
sure that it's the /characters/, not the players, whose personalities are
clashing. Either way, try not to allow to much of this to go on, unless
it ir demanded by the character(s) personality. If it is demanded, you
may need to go over the characters with the players. If it is the players
fighting among themselves (usually sparked because Player A made some
idiot remark which set off Player B), ask them to set it aside until
afterwards. If they cannot, maybe you need to hang it up for the night:)

Hope that wasn't too much, but I also hope it will be of some use to
you:)

Canthros-the-overly-verbose-shapeshifter-mage
--
If any man wishes peace, canthros1@***.com
let him prepare for war. lobo1@****.com
--Roman proverb
http://members.aol.com/canthros1/
Message no. 8
From: GRANITE <granite@**.NET>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Wed, 5 Feb 1997 07:36:53 -0700
> From: L Canthros <lobo1@****.COM>
> have the girl the PC has been hitting on all night turn out to be a
> mantid>:) that should cure that, at least for a while...

That should just about do it..Just ask Bull...
-------------------------------GRANITE
=================================================================
Lord, Grant Me The Serenity To Accept The Things I Cannot Change,
The Courage To Change The Things I Can,
And The Wisdom To Hide The Bodies Of Those People I Had To Kill
Because They Pissed Me Off.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ShadowRunner's Serenity Prayer
Message no. 9
From: GRANITE <granite@**.NET>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Wed, 5 Feb 1997 07:36:54 -0700
> From: L Canthros <lobo1@****.COM>
> Fourth, when you describe things, paint the picture with words. Don't get
> too verbose or you'll wind up putting everyone to sleep, but make sure
> they don't have to use their imagination too much trying to decide what
> they're characters are seeing, they should be busy trying to decide how
> their characters will be reacting to what they see. Keep it interesting,
> if it starts to slow down or get boring, do something:)

I got tired of the constant..My character is here or there..Er..no he
is over there..So I picked up a china board..I now have 3..1 large
white..1 small white..and 1 small black..And if you sort of sketch
out a room and put initials where the PCs are..Then no more bickering
and the players are satisfied...
-------------------------------GRANITE
=================================================================
Lord, Grant Me The Serenity To Accept The Things I Cannot Change,
The Courage To Change The Things I Can,
And The Wisdom To Hide The Bodies Of Those People I Had To Kill
Because They Pissed Me Off.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ShadowRunner's Serenity Prayer
Message no. 10
From: Fro <fro@***.AB.CA>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Wed, 5 Feb 1997 07:57:15 -0700
At 07:36 2/5/97 -0700, Granite wrote:

Whoops..forgot to check the address, sent this straight to Granite..sorry
man, you'll have to listen to my drivel twice :)

>I got tired of the constant..My character is here or there..Er..no he
>is over there..So I picked up a china board..I now have 3..1 large
>white..1 small white..and 1 small black..And if you sort of sketch
>out a room and put initials where the PCs are..Then no more bickering
>and the players are satisfied...

I've been doing that for awhile, using a chalk board for maps and suchlike.
It solves the 'But I wasn't over *there*' argument, and replaces it with
'But you didn't draw that wall right to the wall, I thought it was
broken!'. I guess I deserved that, but yeesh, talk about nit picking.

Fro-who-does-talk-on-topic-once-in-a-blue-moon
Message no. 11
From: "Kruse, Denny" <dkruse@***.AZ05.BULL.COM>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Wed, 5 Feb 1997 13:00:00 MST
>I got tired of the constant..My character is here or there..Er..no he
>is over there..So I picked up a china board..I now have 3..1 large
>white..1 small white..and 1 small black..And if you sort of sketch
>out a room and put initials where the PCs are..Then no more bickering
>and the players are satisfied...

A while back one of our group worked at a drafting company. So for free he
printed up some squares on some kind of thick white paper. The plotter
printed light blue lines on it 1 inch apart, then it was laminated somehow.
We use it as a battlemap, writing in walls and other furniture, cars, and
stuff. And figures to show where we are. It has been a long time since I
played a RPG without one, and can't imagine doing it now.

Now I'm looking on getting my baby brother started on AD&D, but I found out
that the map my friend made would cost me 80$! When I get the chance, I'm
going down to an art store and see what they can do for me.

Denzil Kruse
d.kruse@****.com
Message no. 12
From: Tim Cooper <tpcooper@***.CSUPOMONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Wed, 5 Feb 1997 12:25:13 -0800
On Wed, 5 Feb 1997, Kruse, Denny wrote:

> >I got tired of the constant..My character is here or there..Er..no he
> >is over there..So I picked up a china board..I now have 3..1 large
> >white..1 small white..and 1 small black..And if you sort of sketch
> >out a room and put initials where the PCs are..Then no more bickering
> >and the players are satisfied...
>
> A while back one of our group worked at a drafting company. So for free he
> printed up some squares on some kind of thick white paper. The plotter
> printed light blue lines on it 1 inch apart, then it was laminated somehow.
> We use it as a battlemap, writing in walls and other furniture, cars, and
> stuff. And figures to show where we are. It has been a long time since I
> played a RPG without one, and can't imagine doing it now.
>
> Now I'm looking on getting my baby brother started on AD&D, but I found out
> that the map my friend made would cost me 80$! When I get the chance, I'm
> going down to an art store and see what they can do for me.
>
> Denzil Kruse

I've had a 30"x60" piece of glass with a 1/2 inch grid underneath on my
gaming table for years now. It works great. You can write on it with
those "trasnparency"/over-head projector pens and it washes off very
easily (no annoying stains like on the vinyl game matts). Course I got
the glass free when a friend gave us this desk (glass-topped). I'm not
sure how much it would cost (I've gotten a larger table in my room and the
glass is a tad too small on one end) to replace, but estimates put it
around the same price (or more) as your "battlemap".

We also use either metal figs, the DMZ card-board stand-ups, or little
glass markers (a la 'Pente') for the (N)PC's.

The other cool thing is that having a huge piece of glass on the table is
that it doubles as "scratch paper". I did things like initiative tables
and other misc. notes right on the table, then just wiped them off when
done. It also does wonders to increasing the bounce height of dice.

~Tim
Message no. 13
From: mike.paff@*****.COM
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Wed, 5 Feb 1997 12:43:56 -0800
> From: "Kruse, Denny" <dkruse@***.AZ05.BULL.COM>
>
> A while back one of our group worked at a drafting company. So for free he
> printed up some squares on some kind of thick white paper. The plotter
> printed light blue lines on it 1 inch apart, then it was laminated somehow.
> We use it as a battlemap, writing in walls and other furniture, cars, and
> stuff. And figures to show where we are. It has been a long time since I
> played a RPG without one, and can't imagine doing it now.
>
> Now I'm looking on getting my baby brother started on AD&D, but I found out
> that the map my friend made would cost me 80$! When I get the chance, I'm
> going down to an art store and see what they can do for me.
>
You might want to check out a fabric store. A friend of mine got a tablecloth
sized piece of vinyl-coated fabric. His wife used an ordinary red ballpoint
pen to draw the lines. It works quite well, and wasn't very expensive.

Mike
Message no. 14
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Wed, 5 Feb 1997 22:27:58 +0100
GRANITE said on 7:36/ 5 Feb 97...

> > have the girl the PC has been hitting on all night turn out to be a
> > mantid>:) that should cure that, at least for a while...
>
> That should just about do it..Just ask Bull...

I thought he married one... Or was he already married to her before she
became a mantis spirit?

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Some bald fanatics try to make me buy their books.
-> NERPS Project Leader & Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-

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Message no. 15
From: Bull <chaos@*****.COM>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Wed, 5 Feb 1997 17:41:06 -0500
At 07:57 AM 2/5/97 -0700, Fro babbled:
>At 07:36 2/5/97 -0700, Granite wrote:
>
>Whoops..forgot to check the address, sent this straight to Granite..sorry
>man, you'll have to listen to my drivel twice :)
>
>>I got tired of the constant..My character is here or there..Er..no he
>>is over there..So I picked up a china board..I now have 3..1 large
>>white..1 small white..and 1 small black..And if you sort of sketch
>>out a room and put initials where the PCs are..Then no more bickering
>>and the players are satisfied...
>
>I've been doing that for awhile, using a chalk board for maps and suchlike.
> It solves the 'But I wasn't over *there*' argument, and replaces it with
>'But you didn't draw that wall right to the wall, I thought it was
>broken!'. I guess I deserved that, but yeesh, talk about nit picking.
>
I found a couple real useful items at a local Hobby shop. One is something
called a Battlemat (Actually, Mine's the Megamat). These are either 2'x2'
or 4'x4' vinyl mats marked out with 1 inch squares that you can draw on and
wipe off with Overhead Projection Markers. Combine this with miniatures (I
don't use Shadowrun mini's, simply because I already have several hundred
Games Workshop mini's), and it's great for placements and scenarios...

Bull

>Fro-who-does-talk-on-topic-once-in-a-blue-moon
>
Bull-the-Ork-Decker-who=does-too
--
Now the Fearless Leader of the New Star Wars Mailing List!

=======================================================
= Bull, aka Chaos, aka Rak, aka Steven Ratkovich =
= chaos@*****.com =
= "Order is Illusion! Chaos is Bliss! Got any fours?" =
=======================================================

"I finally find a guy I like, and you got to go and kill him!"
-Kom, "Outlanders"
Message no. 16
From: Bull <chaos@*****.COM>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Wed, 5 Feb 1997 17:47:19 -0500
At 10:27 PM 2/5/97 +0100, Gurth babbled:
>GRANITE said on 7:36/ 5 Feb 97...
>
>> > have the girl the PC has been hitting on all night turn out to be a
>> > mantid>:) that should cure that, at least for a while...
>>
>> That should just about do it..Just ask Bull...
>
>I thought he married one... Or was he already married to her before she
>became a mantis spirit?
>
Bull is married to a nice, respectable Italian girl...

His partner, Johnny 99, the Coyote Shaman, was married to a Rat Shaman who
bacame a Mantis, after inviting another girl (Who was a Mantis in the first
place) to live with them, along with his OTHER wife... (Johnny gets in a
little over his head... He's married to 2 women, who are married to each
other too, plus he branches out occasionally)

Bull
--
Now the Fearless Leader of the New Star Wars Mailing List!

=======================================================
= Bull, aka Chaos, aka Rak, aka Steven Ratkovich =
= chaos@*****.com =
= "Order is Illusion! Chaos is Bliss! Got any fours?" =
=======================================================

"I finally find a guy I like, and you got to go and kill him!"
-Kom, "Outlanders"
Message no. 17
From: Brett Borger <bxb121@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Wed, 5 Feb 1997 21:32:12 -0500
L Canthros enlightened us with these words of wisdom:
>moment:(, try checking out Shadowland (http://www.shadowland.org). I
>spent a large part of the summer on Shadowland, getting into the feel of

Yeah, Shadowland is great, but watch out for the munchkins....I've never
seen so many characters with 10+ skills....

-=SwiftOne=-
Message no. 18
From: Brett Borger <bxb121@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Wed, 5 Feb 1997 22:21:01 -0500
>Bull is married to a nice, respectable Italian girl...

Italians, that's the way to go!

-=SwiftOne=-
(engaged to a Santoro!)
Message no. 19
From: Gothic <Gothic@****.ENTERPRISE.NET>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Wed, 5 Feb 1997 19:20:32 +0000
Automatic digest processor, on 3 Feb 97 you wrote:

> 1] You should sit down with Mr. I'mNewToSR and explain the best you
> can the SR universe..The have him read the intro stuff in the rule
> book..This should get him heading in the right direction..

If you (or anyone else) is interested, I've just finished setting up
the "It Came To Pass...." chapter from the SR2ed in Word 7 for just
the same reason.

I'm new to SR and want to GM a run with a group that have had NO
exposure to the world. I didn't want to pass the rule book among the
whole group (3 or 4) so I scanned it, OCR, into Word.

If you want the file, let me know.

Later,


\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/
Gothic
It's more than just a name,
It's an attitude.

kevin@**********.net
\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/
Message no. 20
From: "Arno R. Lehmann" <arlehma@***.NET>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Thu, 6 Feb 1997 01:12:37 +0100
On Tue, 4 Feb 1997 21:45:19 EST, L Canthros wrote:

>Hope that wasn't too much, but I also hope it will be of some use to
>you:)

That's it. When remembering all this, you will do fine. But I must say
that it's not really simple to do. But anyome will finally learn. This
I write with seeing I'm just learning it ...

--
Arno
*********************************************************************
Be careful when replying to this mail - check the address !!!
(And send me a note when you notice that
the reply-to-address points to the list!)
*********************************************************************
Message no. 21
From: L Canthros <lobo1@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Wed, 5 Feb 1997 22:33:45 EST
On Wed, 5 Feb 1997 21:32:12 -0500 Brett Borger <bxb121@***.EDU> writes:
>L Canthros enlightened us with these words of wisdom:
>>moment:(, try checking out Shadowland (http://www.shadowland.org). I
>>spent a large part of the summer on Shadowland, getting into the feel
>of
>
>Yeah, Shadowland is great, but watch out for the munchkins....I've
>never
>seen so many characters with 10+ skills....
>
>-=SwiftOne=-
>
:) I kinda liked it there, but I didn't really hang out much in the
Shadowtalk section...the one character I ever used I was/am still getting
a handle on RPing wise...Shapeshifter mage notwithstanding, I was labeled
the munchkin. I think my biggest sin was not having a decent handle on my
character...

--
-Canthros-the-shapeshifter-mage
If any man wishes peace, canthros1@***.com
let him prepare for war. lobo1@****.com
--Roman proverb
http://members.aol.com/canthros1/
Message no. 22
From: "Steven A. Tinner" <bluewizard@*****.COM>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Thu, 6 Feb 1997 01:46:41 -0500
> Bull is married to a nice, respectable Italian girl...

Isn't that an oxymoron? :-)

Steven A. Tinner
bluewizard@*****.com
http://www.ncweb.com./users/bluewizard
"Thoughtlash, Soldevei Digger, Timewalk! AAAAHHHH!!!!!"
Message no. 23
From: Brett Borger <bxb121@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Thu, 6 Feb 1997 11:33:05 -0500
>> Bull is married to a nice, respectable Italian girl...
>
>Isn't that an oxymoron? :-)

Careful....

-=SwiftOne=-
(engaged to a Santoro! [who is the sweetest, kindest, and most perfect
woman in the world.]
Message no. 24
From: GRANITE <granite@**.NET>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Thu, 6 Feb 1997 13:06:06 -0700
> From: "Steven A. Tinner" <bluewizard@*****.COM>
> > Bull is married to a nice, respectable Italian girl...
>
> Isn't that an oxymoron? :-)

No..He's a Bull..Not an Ox..and he is anything but a moron...

Oh and by the way..I got multi copies of this message from the
list...
-------------------------------GRANITE
=================================================================
Lord, Grant Me The Serenity To Accept The Things I Cannot Change,
The Courage To Change The Things I Can,
And The Wisdom To Hide The Bodies Of Those People I Had To Kill
Because They Pissed Me Off.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ShadowRunner's Serenity Prayer
Message no. 25
From: Tim Cooper <tpcooper@***.CSUPOMONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Thu, 6 Feb 1997 16:51:15 -0800
On Wed, 5 Feb 1997, Gothic wrote:

> Automatic digest processor, on 3 Feb 97 you wrote:
>
> > 1] You should sit down with Mr. I'mNewToSR and explain the best you
> > can the SR universe..The have him read the intro stuff in the rule
> > book..This should get him heading in the right direction..
>
> If you (or anyone else) is interested, I've just finished setting up
> the "It Came To Pass...." chapter from the SR2ed in Word 7 for just
> the same reason.
>
> I'm new to SR and want to GM a run with a group that have had NO
> exposure to the world. I didn't want to pass the rule book among the
> whole group (3 or 4) so I scanned it, OCR, into Word.
>
> If you want the file, let me know.
>
> Later,
>
>
> \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/
> Gothic
>

I'll bet Mike (and all the rest of the FASA people) just love to hear
this kind of stuff...

First things first. Nevermind the legal aspect of that, but above all
else, show some respect to the creators and developers.

~Tim
(and what the hell am I gonna do with some monstrous word file - and we
all know how huge they are. I'd rather have something hardbound [he he
he] that I can flip through rather than spend the _other_ half of my life
staring at a monitor...oh I guess I COULD just print it, but let's see:
laser printer, 200+ pages... that's about half the price of the actual
book for a mess of one-sided pages...)
Message no. 26
From: L Canthros <lobo1@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH)
Date: Thu, 6 Feb 1997 21:44:50 EST
On Thu, 6 Feb 1997 21:13:17 +0100 Gurth <gurth@******.NL> writes:
>Lady Jestyr said on 23:31/ 6 Feb 97...
>
>> "So, all the red dice are lone star guys, these sets of two white
>dice
>> together are patrol cars, the green dice are the yak enforcers, this
>> white one is your mark, the blue dice are mall security guards...
>>
>> "Hang on - Why is there half a patrol car at the Slushee-Slurpee
>stand?"
>>
>> "I said that was your mark! Oh, never mind..."
>
>Just a suggestion, but how about taking a piece of grid paper and a
>pencil, and doing it like this:
>
>"The A is Arnie, the T is Tracy, G is Geoff, and 1, 2, 3, 4, and 5 are
>the
>five gangers. The rectangle is the dump truck, and"...
>
But, but, but...that would be <gasp!> sensible:) Besides, you'd have to
erase a bunch and you have to get a new sheet of paper every time:)

--
-Canthros
If any man wishes peace, canthros1@***.com
let him prepare for war. lobo1@****.com
--Roman proverb
http://members.aol.com/canthros1/
Message no. 27
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 12:27:13 +0100
Tim Cooper said on 16:51/ 6 Feb 97...

> laser printer, 200+ pages... that's about half the price of the actual
> book for a mess of one-sided pages...)

Print double-sided... First the odd pages, then stick them back into the
printer and print the even pages on the other side. Do a test first to see
exactly how they should go into the printer, so you don't print twice on
the same side, or in reverse order :)

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Plastic donut, can of Spam.
-> NERPS Project Leader & Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-

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Message no. 28
From: Tim P Cooper <z-i-m@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 15:24:03 EST
On Fri, 7 Feb 1997 12:27:13 +0100 Gurth <gurth@******.NL> writes:
>Tim Cooper said on 16:51/ 6 Feb 97...
>
>> laser printer, 200+ pages... that's about half the price of the actual
>> book for a mess of one-sided pages...)
>
>Print double-sided... First the odd pages, then stick them back into the
>printer and print the even pages on the other side. Do a test first to
see
>exactly how they should go into the printer, so you don't print twice on
>the same side, or in reverse order :)

Yeah, been there done that - wasted about 4 character sheets trying to
get it right :)

But recently I just printed out a 20 page document that I got off the
web, and after re-formatting it to my taste I had to print it about twice
due to a combination of printing errors, editing mistakes and
etc..(printed the odd pages, saw an error on screen fixed it - which then
changed the pagination, thus making it impossible to correctly print the
evens..twice.) :)

~Tim

>
>--
>Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
> Plastic donut, can of Spam.
> -> NERPS Project Leader & Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
>-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html
><-
>
>-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
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>
Message no. 29
From: Tim P Cooper <z-i-m@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Bad Adventure!?! TSH)
Date: Sun, 9 Feb 1997 03:23:09 EST
On Sat, 8 Feb 1997 13:01:12 +0100 Gurth <gurth@******.NL> writes:
>Tim P Cooper said on 15:24/ 7 Feb 97...
>
>> Yeah, been there done that - wasted about 4 character sheets trying to
>> get it right :)
>
>You should be able to find out by making a small mark on one side of a
>sheet of paper (near one of the short sides), and hitting Form Feed on
>the printer...

Yup, that's what I did every once in a while until I learned (read: took
the time to actually _remember_) how it fed/printed.

>> But recently I just printed out a 20 page document that I got off the
>> web, and after re-formatting it to my taste I had to print it about
twice
>> due to a combination of printing errors, editing mistakes and
>> etc..(printed the odd pages, saw an error on screen fixed it - which
then
>> changed the pagination, thus making it impossible to correctly print
the
>> evens..twice.) :)
>
>That's always a problem... Though you could have solved that by printing
>the evens up to the page where you corrected the error, and then
printing
>both the odd and even pages starting at that page...

Yeah, I guess you're right. But it would have been too easy, not to
mention logical..:)

[snip]

>--
>Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html

~Tim

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