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Message no. 1
From: John E Pederson <lobo1@****.COM>
Subject: Bugs and Guns (a long time ago was: the uac dilemma)
Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:34:12 EDT
On Fri, 25 Jul 1997 14:06:08 -0500 TopCat <topcat@***.NET> writes:

>But that is neither here nor there... I've missed a great deal of this
>thread and I was wondering what this had to do with unarmed combat?

At this point, not a whole lot:) It started out on unarmed combat, got
over to bugs and ItNW, from there to bugs, firearms and ItNW, and now
just bugs and guns (sorta:) I guess that would be the 'drift' thing they
keep talking about, huh:)


--
-Canthros
I had rather believe all the fables in the legends and the Talmud
and the Alcoran, than that this universal frame is without a mind.
--Francis Bacon
http://members.aol.com/canthros1
Message no. 2
From: John E Pederson <lobo1@****.COM>
Subject: Bugs and Guns (a long time ago was: the uac dilemma)
Date: Fri, 25 Jul 1997 22:34:12 EDT
On Fri, 25 Jul 1997 14:43:30 -0400 Jonathan Hurley
<jhurley1@************.EDU> writes:

>> Yes, and on an average roll, the sammie wouldn't have hit the broad
>side
>> of a very large barn with that full auto burst (the sammie's TN
>would
>> have been at least 13, 12 or 11 with a laser sight or smartlink,
>> respectively).
>
<<Oh, I dunno. Example: Snapshot (a PC) honks off a nine-round burst at a
target. He's using an Ares Alpha combat gun(Two points recoil comp) with
a shock pad (another point.) He's got a strength of 7 (another 2 points
(FoF p83) for a grand reduction of 5, bringing his target number (at
close range, with his smartgun link) to 6. Not bad at all, all things
considered. If he was using a weapon with IGV4, he'd be looking at 4's
for a target number. Because of the way the Ares Alpha description is
worded, he could *add* the IGV4 to the weapon and get his TN down to 2.
(The weapon offers 2 points of recoil comp, *and* can take barrel mounted
accessories. Now I see why this weapon is so hard to get.)>>


Shh! I've got a player on this list:)

You might remember, however, that I didn't use an Ares Alpha (which, btw,
seems to be no harder to get than a AK-98, unless the figures I've got
are a bit screwed up (don't have FoF)). The AK doesn't come with any
recoil comp, doesn't come with any sighting stuff. It's a vanilla assault
rifle (if such a thing exists:) And I didn't use the Strength=>Recoil
rules from FoF (they're optional, after all:) So, I'd say my example
still stands:):) The fact is, your example is valid, just not what I was
talking about. So, even assuming an IGV4, Smartgun I, and Shock Pads on
the AK-98, you've got a Target Number of at least 6. Let's say partial
light and light smoke or fog (for visual effect and all:) and you're back
up to a 12. Remove the smoke, you've got an 8. Let's say buggy-boy is
running (+2) and that our friendly neighborhood chrome monster is also
walking, over difficult ground (ant hive, tunnels, low ceilings, rough
floors, etc:) and you're back at that 12. With a strenght of eight
there's another 2 points of recoil comp and you've got a ten, but let's
say the bug also has partial cover...etc, etc. How complicated do you
want to make it?


--
-Canthros
I had rather believe all the fables in the legends and the Talmud
and the Alcoran, than that this universal frame is without a mind.
--Francis Bacon
http://members.aol.com/canthros1
Message no. 3
From: TopCat <topcat@***.NET>
Subject: Re: Bugs and Guns (a long time ago was: the uac dilemma)
Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 01:54:39 -0500
At 10:34 PM 7/25/97 EDT, you wrote:
>>But that is neither here nor there... I've missed a great deal of this
>>thread and I was wondering what this had to do with unarmed combat?

>At this point, not a whole lot:) It started out on unarmed combat, got
>over to bugs and ItNW, from there to bugs, firearms and ItNW, and now
>just bugs and guns (sorta:) I guess that would be the 'drift' thing they
>keep talking about, huh:)

And you all know that *I* would never do anything like drift in a topic... heh

Thanks for the clarification. I wish I wouldn't have thrown away all of the
uac stuff, I might've found something good to yammer on about in there... ah
well, there'll be other topics :)
--
Bob Ooton
topcat@***.net
Message no. 4
From: Jonathan Hurley <jhurley1@************.EDU>
Subject: Re: Bugs and Guns (a long time ago was: the uac dilemma)
Date: Sun, 3 Aug 1997 23:52:23 -0400
On Friday, July 25, 1997 22:34, John E Pederson[SMTP:lobo1@****.COM] wrote:
> On Fri, 25 Jul 1997 14:43:30 -0400 Jonathan Hurley
> <jhurley1@************.EDU> writes:
> You might remember, however, that I didn't use an Ares Alpha (which, btw,
> seems to be no harder to get than a AK-98, unless the figures I've got
> are a bit screwed up (don't have FoF)). The AK doesn't come with any
> recoil comp, doesn't come with any sighting stuff. It's a vanilla assault
> rifle (if such a thing exists:) And I didn't use the Strength=>Recoil
> rules from FoF (they're optional, after all:) So, I'd say my example
> still stands:):) The fact is, your example is valid, just not what I was
> talking about. So, even assuming an IGV4, Smartgun I, and Shock Pads on
> the AK-98, you've got a Target Number of at least 6. Let's say partial
> light and light smoke or fog (for visual effect and all:) and you're back
> up to a 12. Remove the smoke, you've got an 8. Let's say buggy-boy is
> running (+2) and that our friendly neighborhood chrome monster is also
> walking, over difficult ground (ant hive, tunnels, low ceilings, rough
> floors, etc:) and you're back at that 12. With a strenght of eight
> there's another 2 points of recoil comp and you've got a ten, but let's
> say the bug also has partial cover...etc, etc. How complicated do you
> want to make it?

Oh, I don't care. The only reason I picked an Ares Alpha was that is the
(preferred) assault rifle of the PC who downed three Force 5 true forms
before they swarmed him. I agree that firing a nine-round aimed burst from
an AK-97 would be dumb. But a 6-round burst (yielding a 14D damage code,
and with our hypothetically modified AK-97, manageable(+1 recoil penalty,
after the aforementioned mods)) might not be. Actually, any more than 6
aimed rounds from an AR is wasteful, anyway. (The damage code doesn't go
above D, after all, and if it can bounce a 14 power level, I'm quite
frightened)

As for all that other penalties, those apply no matter what fire mode is
chosen.

I'm just arguing that FA is not as useless as it is painted.

--
Quicksilver rides again
--------------
Those who would give up a little freedom for security
deserve neither freedom nor security
-Benjamin Franklin
Yeah, I have Attention Deficit Dis - Hey, look at that butterfly!
Jonathan Hurley (mailto:jhurley1@************.edu)
Message no. 5
From: Tobias Berghoff <Zixx@*****.TEUTO.DE>
Subject: Re: Bugs and Guns (a long time ago was: the uac dilemma)
Date: Mon, 4 Aug 1997 18:01:00 GMT
on 03.08.97 jhurley1@************.EDU wrote:

j> after the aforementioned mods)) might not be. Actually, any more than 6
j> aimed rounds from an AR is wasteful, anyway. (The damage code doesn't go
j> above D, after all, and if it can bounce a 14 power level, I'm quite
j> frightened)

Have a guess how scared I was when my buddy-NPC didn't even take notice,
when I send a 6-shot burst of explosive APDS from my Ares Alpha (borrowed
from MET2000) right through his neck (with 10 succsesses). He just went on
takeing down that AH with the laser that once was his right arm.
(I survived it. Just needed a new set of lungs...)

bye

Tobias
## CrossPoint v3.1 ##

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