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Message no. 1
From: Wafflemeisters <evamarie@**********.NET>
Subject: Buzzed gangers
Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 14:44:48 -0500
>
> Truthfully, I find it odd, and always have, that steroids and the like
> aren't more popular in the gutters of SR. Muscle replacements and the like
> are somewhat expensive, especially compared to how 'roids and it's
> companion drugs would be so cheap. I don't know, but I'd think that there
> would be CP2020-style booster gangs, jacked up on cocaine, steroids, and
> the occassionaly combat drug that could open serious cans of whoop-ass on
> defenseless people. Factor in crap like angel dust...that's obviously a
> recipe for a very short life, but those booster gangers would be *Nasty*...
>
> Erik J.
>
>
> "Ladies & Gentleman, the newest member of the band, the one and only Spice
> Boy, GRUMPY SPICE!!!" <and the crowd goes wild!!!>

Check out "California- Free State"- the ansaszie "gypsies"
have some
way nasty booster "drugs" of a amgical nature. Not the uban mayhem you
seem to crave, but similar.
My opinion is that drugs don't have THAT big anneffect on performance.
Kamikazee does, obviously, and I could see certain street drugs or BTL's
granting pain tollerance of pretty high levels.

On the other hand, common phamacuiticals might be just the reason it is
so easy to boost attributes with Karma- who needs to study, when you can
buy "smart drugs" that WORK.

-Mongoose
Message no. 2
From: Lehlan Decker <decker@****.FSU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Buzzed gangers
Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 15:54:47 -0500
> Check out "California- Free State"- the ansaszie
"gypsies" have some
> way nasty booster "drugs" of a amgical nature. Not the uban mayhem you
> seem to crave, but similar.
> My opinion is that drugs don't have THAT big anneffect on performance.
> Kamikazee does, obviously, and I could see certain street drugs or BTL's
> granting pain tollerance of pretty high levels.
>
> On the other hand, common phamacuiticals might be just the reason it is
> so easy to boost attributes with Karma- who needs to study, when you can
> buy "smart drugs" that WORK.
>
I guess it depends on the world your GM creates. In mine, it goes
like this. The bottom rungs of the latter, use synthetic drugs,
chemical, derivates of cocaine etc etc. People with money, have
the implants and go for chip abuse (BTL, 2XS, Black Beetles etc).
Drugs that boost your performance are certainly possible. CFS lists
some "ideas", Lone Star lists some, and I believe Shadowtech did
as well. I can see some companies even encouraging their use
as an alternative to cyberware.
I don't see synthetic drugs, replacing hardwork or cyberware.
Your "natural" body is meant to only be pushed so hard or long, before
it collapses. Drugs can alter this threshold, but I don't
see them being able to remove it. (Cyberware is a different story).
Heh...I've seen one PC's who's character had an internal pump
with pain killers installed. (He was an addict). He would
take a hit before combat, and it made him stronger and faster,
and acted sorta like a trauma damper. Of course when it wore out
he was fubar for quite awhile. (Anyone remember Bane from the
batman comics?).
For other ideas, another interesting source if Rifts of all
things. Check out the Juicers archetype.
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Lehlan Decker 644-4534 Systems Development
decker@****.fsu.edu http://www.scri.fsu.edu/~decker
--------------------------------------------------------------------
"Uh-Oh Toto, it doesn't look like we're gods anymore."
Message no. 3
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Buzzed gangers
Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 19:34:22 -0400
At 02:44 PM 4/28/98 -0500, you wrote:

> Check out "California- Free State"- the ansaszie "gypsies"
have some
>way nasty booster "drugs" of a amgical nature. Not the uban mayhem you
>seem to crave, but similar.

Have it, was royally disappointed. And those Anasazi potions aren't what I
was looking for.

> My opinion is that drugs don't have THAT big anneffect on
performance.
>Kamikazee does, obviously, and I could see certain street drugs or BTL's
>granting pain tollerance of pretty high levels.

Pain tolerance is almost a given. But as a point of fact, you simply don't
get to be the size of Arnold Schwarzenegger without steroids and other
drugs. It's pretty well accepted that "Ahnohld" took steroids. He also
was blessed genetically.

Moving on 15-20 years, the top bodybuilders are wacking themselves so full
of steroids, growth hormone, insulin, thyroid drugs, and other things that
it's amazing more of them don't die. But that's about the only way the
human body can be pushed to over 300 pounds at about 1 to 2 percent body
fat; you can only maintain body fat that low for a day or two or your
joints begin to hurt (there isn't enough lubrication). NOW try to tell me
drugs don't have a big effect of performance; most of these guys don't work
any harder in the gym than I do.

Certain drugs, like Angel Dust, have a side-effect of increasing strength
to insane levels. I'm not sure how, but I think it has something to do
with flooding the body with various adrenals hormones. In any case, talk
to anyone who's seen Angel Dust in the ER, or a cop. That shit is nasty;
not only will it fry the user's brain, they become so strong it takes a
supreme effort to restrain them.

Other drugs, like cocaine and other stimulants, increase speed if not at
least perception. Ever had a seriously wicked caffiene high? Multiply
that a few dozen times and you've got a snort or two of coke. That's a
significant performance boost (speaking of which, when coke-heads could
"get it up" they were literally able to go not only all night, but
sometimes all weekend...).

Factor in 205X chemistry and you've lost a side-affect or two and made the
"positive" side of the drugs (as in what you are taking them for) several
times more potent.

From what I've read, BTLs are supposed to be easily hundreds of nuyen for a
single burn-out chip dose. That's one high. For the same amount, you
could buy 205X crack and get high all month. That *has* to be extremely
attractive for gangers.

> On the other hand, common phamacuiticals might be just the reason
it is
>so easy to boost attributes with Karma- who needs to study, when you can
>buy "smart drugs" that WORK.

Now I've never thought of this. It's been proven that light/mild steroid
use (i.e. low doses, done for one, maybe two, one month cycles) has no real
long term negative health affects. And having tried various "smart drugs"
I know they do have some sort of positive affects.

So maybe in 205X, with modern chemistry and sensible usage, this is how
someone, like a shadowrunner or a corporate exec, increases their Strength
or Intelligence or something. In addition to hard work of course.
Interesting thought.

Erik J.


"Ladies & Gentleman, the newest member of the band, the one and only Spice
Boy, GRUMPY SPICE!!!" <and the crowd goes wild!!!>
Message no. 4
From: Wafflemeisters <evamarie@**********.NET>
Subject: Buzzed gangers
Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 19:04:13 -0500
> Certain drugs, like Angel Dust, have a side-effect of increasing strength
> to insane levels. I'm not sure how, but I think it has something to do
> with flooding the body with various adrenals hormones. In any case, talk
> to anyone who's seen Angel Dust in the ER, or a cop. That shit is nasty;
> not only will it fry the user's brain, they become so strong it takes a
> supreme effort to restrain them.

I've seen "Angel Dust" in recreational use, andit was not my
impression the user was berzerk, or strong. Theywere rather, um
uninibited, in away that might lead to disregard forlegal codesand
genral social convention, be that theft, viloence,sex. I think the
"crazed pipehead" this is a myth used to justify police brutality. In
fact, any panic situation will flood our body with adrenaline and
produce similar behavior. And armed cops provoke panic in some people.
Often more so in people on drugs, given this countries laws. The LAST
person I'd ask for an accurate description of a drugs effect on behavior
is an ER doctor of cop- they by definition see abnomal cases and people
with problem behavior.

On the other hand,anybody who is not sensitive to pain, and
unihibited about doing or suffering damage, can be a SERIOUS threat.
Drugs don't make you stronger- they might let you USE all your strenght
without caring about hurting youself or others. This holds true for
mothers who's children have been hurt, people in shock, and persons
"caught up" in a riot. Its not just a drug effect- its a survival
instinct. Some people are into danger FOR that buzz. They can be as
nasty as any "PCP crazed maniac" .

I'd say most "freakout" drugs just increase "professional
rating",
letting folks fight until almost dead instead of surrendering, and maybe
encourge agressive behavior- add one or two to threat for attacks and
counters, but subtract a similar amountfor damge reistance IE, redirect
"pool" to offense.

I'd also doubt cocaine reduces reaction time enough to matter in
combat. It might make you alert, and keep you slightly hyped on
adrenaline, giving a slight edge, but no more than basic training in
cobat awareness should.

-Mongoose
Message no. 5
From: Wafflemeisters <evamarie@**********.NET>
Subject: Re: Buzzed gangers
Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 19:05:13 -0500
> I've seen one PC's who's character had an internal pump
> with pain killers installed. (He was an addict). He would
> take a hit before combat, and it made him stronger and faster,
> and acted sorta like a trauma damper. Of course when it wore out
> he was fubar for quite awhile. (Anyone remember Bane from the
> batman comics?).
> For other ideas, another interesting source if Rifts of all
> things. Check out the Juicers archetype.

One of my characters had a "stim dispenser" that was mounted in
armor. It was controlled by a jack cable, and held DMSO dissolved stim
in various doses. Being able to stim as a free action is a good edge.
Combine that with a trauma damper, and you can keep it up for a while,
since the "extra stun box" is negated by the damper (which I did NOT
have). It does get pricey, especially if you get to the point that you
are "floating" enough stun to go into overflow and turn those serious
wounds into deadly plus if the stim wears off.... talk about
addictions.... It also held one shot of kamikazee, which got refilled
twice...
The device mounts IN the armor to help avoid any "accidents"- it might
be better if the storage was issolated (say ouside a boot), with ducts
to your skin. Or integrate it at the end of a cyberlimb, and duct it
back for delivery. (good in a cyberfoot, better if you have the whole
leg).

-Mongoose
Message no. 6
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Buzzed gangers
Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 22:58:03 -0400
At 07:04 PM 4/29/98 -0500, you wrote:

> I've seen "Angel Dust" in recreational use, andit was not my

I don't really want to know. I've been to raves (back before most people
in the States had heard of them) and I've seen a number of drugs in use,
but never PCP or 'dust...

>impression the user was berzerk, or strong. Theywere rather, um
>uninibited, in away that might lead to disregard forlegal codesand
>genral social convention, be that theft, viloence,sex. I think the

That's true most of the time. PCP and the like don't automatically turn
the user into a crazed berzerker.

>"crazed pipehead" this is a myth used to justify police brutality. In

Gotta disagree here. Any sort of drug that has a hallucinatory affect has
the capacity for a "bad trip." In other words, something just clicks wrong
and the user, for lack of a better phrase, freaks out. This happens with
everything from pot to nasties like PCP. And the more powerful the drug,
the nastier that "bad trip" will be.

And my best friend is a cop. Yeah, he's beat the crap out of people, and
they may not have deserved it. But right or wrong, a modern urban cop is a
soldier in a middle of a warzone. They tend to be extremely defensive and
protective about their lives. That sometimes translates into overreacting
and shooting or beating someone. It's best to simply do exactly as the cop
says and you'll be okay.

>fact, any panic situation will flood our body with adrenaline and
>produce similar behavior. And armed cops provoke panic in some people.
>Often more so in people on drugs, given this countries laws. The LAST

I'll go with you here.

>person I'd ask for an accurate description of a drugs effect on behavior
>is an ER doctor of cop- they by definition see abnomal cases and people
>with problem behavior.

They do see abnormal behaviours. But an ER doctor is still a doctor, which
is still a scientist of sorts. Cops do tend, like many people, to tell
tall tales, but I'd trust 99% of ER doctors. I've worked with them
occassionally, so I've no reason not to.

Erik J.


"Forgive me FASA for I have sinned. It has been 6 days since I last played
Shadowrun and 15 days since I last bought a SRTCG booster pack."
Message no. 7
From: David Hinkley <dhinkley@***.ORG>
Subject: Re: Buzzed gangers
Date: Sat, 2 May 1998 16:17:33 +0000
On 29 Apr 98 at 22:58, Erik Jameson wrote:

> At 07:04 PM 4/29/98 -0500, you wrote:
>
> > I've seen "Angel Dust" in recreational use, andit was not my
>
> I don't really want to know. I've been to raves (back before most
> people in the States had heard of them) and I've seen a number of
> drugs in use, but never PCP or 'dust...
>
> >impression the user was berzerk, or strong. Theywere rather, um
> >uninibited, in away that might lead to disregard forlegal codesand
> >genral social convention, be that theft, viloence,sex. I think the
>
> That's true most of the time. PCP and the like don't automatically
> turn the user into a crazed berzerker.
>
> >"crazed pipehead" this is a myth used to justify police brutality. In
>
> Gotta disagree here. Any sort of drug that has a hallucinatory
> affect has the capacity for a "bad trip." In other words, something
> just clicks wrong and the user, for lack of a better phrase, freaks
> out. This happens with everything from pot to nasties like PCP.
> And the more powerful the drug, the nastier that "bad trip" will be.

And the less "pure" it is the more likely a bad trip. PCP has another
negitive side. Heavy users (and former usesrs) can have flashbacks
and from what I understand the flashbacks are useally bad trips.

My second hand story came frone a friend who was a ER tech. A PCP
user wentoff in a hall near the ER. The security guard (county
sheriff's reserve) confronted him. The PCP guy attacked him . My
friend who was behind the guy, saw the guard was losing hit the guy
with a steel IV pole. The guy turned to attack. The guard hit him
with a night stick. The guy turned on the guard. My friend hit him
again. Thr guy turned on my friend. This hit and turn hit and turn
was repeated until enough reinforcements arrived to take the guy
down. In that area the typical responce was five officers (one
each for the head, both arms and both legs) who tackle him take him
down and cuff him with at least two sets of cuffs. Seems that
they had had single sets of cuffs broken along with the subjects
wrists. All in all it is bad stuff.




David Hinkley
dhinkley@***.org

====================================================
Those who are too intelligent to engage in politics
are punished by being governed by those who are not
--Plato
Message no. 8
From: Wafflemeisters <evamarie@**********.NET>
Subject: Re: Buzzed gangers
Date: Sun, 3 May 1998 05:15:22 -0500
> Re: Buzzed gangers (David Hinkley , Sat 11:17)
>
> On 29 Apr 98 at 22:58, Erik Jameson wrote:
>
> > At 07:04 PM 4/29/98 -0500, you wrote:
> >
> > > I've seen "Angel Dust" in recreational use, andit was not my
> >
> > I don't really want to know. I've been to raves (back before most
> > people in the States had heard of them) and I've seen a number of
> > drugs in use, but never PCP or 'dust...
> >

I went to "raves" in '89-'90 in LosAngeles, and happened to know for a
fact that some "X" being sold was actually PCP. I personally consummed
six packs of malt liquor, and folks tried to BUY "x" from me. Very
amuzing.

> > Gotta disagree here. Any sort of drug that has a hallucinatory
> > affect has the capacity for a "bad trip." In other words, something
> > just clicks wrong and the user, for lack of a better phrase, freaks
> > out. This happens with everything from pot to nasties like PCP.
> > And the more powerful the drug, the nastier that "bad trip" will be.
>

EH. "Bad trips" always seem to happen to unstable people, but I'm not
fond enough of drug culture and users to have any knowledge there one
way or another.

> <snip ER story> Seems that
> they had had single sets of cuffs broken along with the subjects
> wrists. All in all it is bad stuff.
>

Which bears out my point- the drug did not make the guy stronger, or
actully effective in "combat"- they just made him more willing to fight
and less concerned about getting hurt.
Your run of the mill NON DRUGGED psycotic can exhibit identical
behavior.

-Mongoose
Message no. 9
From: THADEUSv20 <THADEUSv20@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Buzzed gangers
Date: Sun, 3 May 1998 22:35:15 EDT
In a message dated 98-05-03 05:56:58 EDT, you write:

<< Which bears out my point- the drug did not make the guy stronger, or
actully effective in "combat"- they just made him more willing to fight
and less concerned about getting hurt.
Your run of the mill NON DRUGGED psycotic can exhibit identical
behavior.
>>


Actually PCP does kill pain cause it is a horse tranquilizer. You know as it
knocks a horse on it's ass. It was designed for use on horses so the
chemistry has a hallucinitory effect on the human body. It does cause one to
lose their ability to feel pain cause it's some heavy duty stuff.

Further Reading

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