Back to the main page

Mailing List Logs for ShadowRN

Message no. 1
From: "Jason Carter, Nightstalker" <CARTER@***.EDU>
Subject: Centering
Date: Tue, 22 Jun 1993 12:51:51 -0700
Centering is a free action that must be taken on the same action the
magician cast the spell.

See Ya in Shadows,
Jason J carter
The Nightstalker
Message no. 2
From: Andre' Selmer <031SEA@******.WITS.AC.ZA>
Subject: Centering
Date: Fri, 21 Jul 1995 11:17:11 +0200
When an individual centers, that is a free action, but what about the
event he uses to center, our mage sings opera (damnright embarresing
in battle), does that cost a simple action (the actual singing) hence
the mage can't cast in the same action as centering.

Yet another point, can you center in astral, you don't have vocal
cords, and your body is unresponsive

Andre'
Man is a teller of stories, he lives by and is surrounded by his
own stories and those of other people, he sees everythings that
happens to him in terms of these stories and thus has to live
enacting them
-Sarte

GARFIELD !
-Jon
Message no. 3
From: Mark Steedman <RSMS@******.EEE.RGU.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Centering
Date: Fri, 21 Jul 1995 11:52:14 GMT
> From: Andre' Selmer <031SEA@******.WITS.AC.ZA>

> When an individual centers, that is a free action, but what about the
> event he uses to center, our mage sings opera (damnright embarresing
> in battle), does that cost a simple action (the actual singing) hence
> the mage can't cast in the same action as centering.
>
the rules are far from clear, generally if you are singing, posturing
e.t.c. you get allowed to use it as a free action as the singing is
the centering

> Yet another point, can you center in astral, you don't have vocal
> cords, and your body is unresponsive
>
It specifically says you cannot, in the Grimoire but cannot remember
the page.

> Andre'
>

Mark
Message no. 4
From: Ian Smith <KildTheCat@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Centering
Date: Fri, 21 Jul 1995 15:15:04 -0400
>When an individual centers, that is a free action, but what >about the
event he uses to center, our mage sings opera (damnright >.embarresing
>in battle), does that cost a simple action (the actual singing) >hence
>the mage can't cast in the same action as centering.
.
The centering skill is performed simultaneously to the casting.
Message no. 5
From: PDL@****.dacom.co.kr
Subject: Centering
Date: Wed, 31 Jan 96 23:22:14 PST
Can you use the Centering Meta-magic skill with thrown or projectile weapons? I can not
remember and I do not have this book to reference. Thanks in advance.

Patrick
Message no. 6
From: "Mark Steedman" <M.J.Steedman@***.rgu.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Centering
Date: Thu, 1 Feb 1996 11:08:28 GMT
> From: PDL@****.dacom.co.kr

> Can you use the Centering Meta-magic skill with thrown or projectile weapons? I can
not remember and I do not have this book to reference. Thanks in advance.
>
> Patrick
>
If you are a physad initiate and buy the 'enhanced centering' power
with the specific skill for two points.

Note phsads get centring with athletics and stealth only unless they
buy the extra power, though centring off combat penalties such as
reach and enemies in meele is what really makes a physad combat loon.

Mark
Message no. 7
From: "Mark Steedman" <M.J.Steedman@***.rgu.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Centering
Date: Thu, 1 Feb 1996 11:08:28 GMT
> From: PDL@****.dacom.co.kr

> Can you use the Centering Meta-magic skill with thrown or projectile weapons? I can
not remember and I do not have this book to reference. Thanks in advance.
>
> Patrick
>
If you are a physad initiate and buy the 'enhanced centering' power
with the specific skill for two points.

Note phsads get centring with athletics and stealth only unless they
buy the extra power, though centring off combat penalties such as
reach and enemies in meele is what really makes a physad combat loon.

Mark
Message no. 8
From: "A Halliwell" <u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Centering
Date: Thu, 1 Feb 1996 15:10:28 +0000 (GMT)
|
|Can you use the Centering Meta-magic skill with thrown or projectile weapons? I can not
remember and I do not have this book to reference. Thanks in advance.

There is a special Physical Adept power called enhanced centering in the
Grimoire. This allows thrown and projectile (I think).
--
______________________________________________________________________________
| |What to do if you find yourself stuck in a crackin |
|u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk |the ground beneath a giant bolder, which you can't |
| |move, with no hope of rescue. |
|Andrew Halliwell |Consider how lucky you are that life has been good |
|Principal in:- |to you so far... |
|Comp Sci & Visual Arts | -The BOOK, Hitchhikers guide to the galaxy. |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 9
From: gilean@****.muscanet.com (Kurt Montgomery)
Subject: Re: Centering
Date: Thu, 1 Feb 1996 19:08:45 -0600
>> From: PDL@****.dacom.co.kr
>
>> Can you use the Centering Meta-magic skill with thrown or projectile
weapons? I can not remember and I do not have this book to reference.
Thanks in advance.
>>
>> Patrick
>>
>If you are a physad initiate and buy the 'enhanced centering' power
>with the specific skill for two points.
>
>Note phsads get centring with athletics and stealth only unless they
>buy the extra power, though centring off combat penalties such as
>reach and enemies in meele is what really makes a physad combat loon.
>
>Mark
>
Could someone explain to me what centring does for a phsad? (Yes, this is a
serious question.)
Message no. 10
From: "Gurth" <gurth@******.nl>
Subject: Re: Centering
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 1996 11:23:54 +0100
Kurt Montgomery said on 1 Feb 96...

> Could someone explain to me what centring does for a phsad? (Yes, this is a
> serious question.)

Centering can be used by full magicians to get more successes for
spellcasting, against drain, and to remove penalties to magical success
tests. Physads cannot use most of that, but they can use centering to
reduce penalties for *physical* skills (Athletics and Stealth). If the
physad also has the Enhanced Centering power, (s)he can also use centering
against penalties of other skills, but it must be purchased for each
category separately (at a cost of 2 Magic).

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Sometimes it feels like )@&*()@&%#68%3*(48@&%
-> NERPS Project Leader & Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Character Mortuary: http://huizen.dds.nl/~mortuary/mortuary.html <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version 3.1:
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE
Y PGP- t(+) 5+ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b+@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(----) y?
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
Message no. 11
From: "A Halliwell" <u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Centering
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 1996 10:39:45 +0000 (GMT)
|Could someone explain to me what centring does for a phsad? (Yes, this is a
|serious question.)

The same thing it does for mages, but for different skills.

It can add dice to a test for althletics or combat skills, reduce
wound/reach/visibility penalties.
(In first Ed, centering gave AUTO successes.....Now it just gives extra
dice.)

--
______________________________________________________________________________
| |What to do if you find yourself stuck in a crackin |
|u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk |the ground beneath a giant bolder, which you can't |
| |move, with no hope of rescue. |
|Andrew Halliwell |Consider how lucky you are that life has been good |
|Principal in:- |to you so far... |
|Comp Sci & Visual Arts | -The BOOK, Hitchhikers guide to the galaxy. |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 12
From: Gallas William <gallas@**.ec-lyon.fr>
Subject: Re: Centering
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 96 11:50:54 MET
Gurth said:
> Kurt Montgomery said on 1 Feb 96...
>
> > Could someone explain to me what centring does for a phsad? (Yes, this is a
> > serious question.)
>
> Centering can be used by full magicians to get more successes for
> spellcasting, against drain, and to remove penalties to magical success
> tests. Physads cannot use most of that, but they can use centering to
> reduce penalties for *physical* skills (Athletics and Stealth). If the
> physad also has the Enhanced Centering power, (s)he can also use centering
> against penalties of other skills, but it must be purchased for each
> category separately (at a cost of 2 Magic).
>

I thought magicians can also boost their spells with centering (with a 2 for 1
success ratio), so perhaps physad can use their centering skill the same way
i.e. for 2 success with the centering skill, they get a success on their test.

- Cobra.

_______
/ \
| _ )
\_/ \ /
/ ) /
/| / /
/ /
/ /
/ /
/ /
/ /
/ / __
/ /______/ )
(___________/\|
Message no. 13
From: "Mark Steedman" <M.J.Steedman@***.rgu.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Centering
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 1996 13:30:23 GMT
> From: gilean@****.muscanet.com (Kurt Montgomery)

> Could someone explain to me what centring does for a phsad? (Yes, this is a
> serious question.)
>
>
Yes and a chat around the subject.

They may use centering vs 'penalties to target numbers' on stealth
and athletics plus any active skills they have bought the 'enhanced
centering power' for.
You roll centering. Its a general skill [despite the tendancy to take
kai shouts, mages taking latin e.t.c., if it does centeraing you pay
general skill karma costs, a concentration in only penalties (as
opposed to assist with sorcery) 'might' be permitable]
Every two success you get translate to 1 centering success. (FASA
don't state round up or down, the kind way is round up and i find
that works ok [1 or 2 =1, 3 or 4=2 etc.]) Each of these centering
success can offset a +1 penalty to target numbers (mages etc can also
add them to spell sucess or drain success (1 thing at a time), but
like with autos from karma you need 1 sucess on the base roll before
centering ones count).

Target number is base target number of the following skill roll minus
initiation grade (this latter makes it very nice arround grade 3+ as
you roll 3's to knock penalties off that roll that just got modded
from 4 to 6).

Centering is required at 4 or 5 skill to get many successes in 2nded
which makes it rather expensive but it can make a really good adition
to a well rounded character. Just like grade it needs balancing with
skills and new spell, atts e.t.c. if you want the best results.

With physad centering can be quite supurb combined with resist pain
ability as you happilly look at base target numbers despite movement,
lighting and the moderate wound while your poor opponent is busy
needing 8's or more. Powerful yes, with enhanced centerinhg but then
so is anything else that costs that much karma to buy, this trick
needing say arround grade 2 couls set you back 60 karma to add to a
character [as the merc aquires, negotiate, gunnery or demolitions or
something from 0 to 6+]

Mark
Message no. 14
From: gilean@****.muscanet.com (Kurt Montgomery)
Subject: Re: Centering
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 1996 10:29:54 -0600
>Kurt Montgomery said on 1 Feb 96...
>
>> Could someone explain to me what centring does for a phsad? (Yes, this is a
>> serious question.)
>
>Centering can be used by full magicians to get more successes for
>spellcasting, against drain, and to remove penalties to magical success
>tests. Physads cannot use most of that, but they can use centering to
>reduce penalties for *physical* skills (Athletics and Stealth). If the
>physad also has the Enhanced Centering power, (s)he can also use centering
>against penalties of other skills, but it must be purchased for each
>category separately (at a cost of 2 Magic).
>
Thank you.
------------------------------------------------
"Where a rat can go, two Kender will be." -Human Proverb
(Rat, Two, Kender, Will, and Human are all regestered
trademarks of T$R incorperated)

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version: 3.1
GMU/CS d- s++:+ a--- C++++ W++ N++ K+ w--- M-- PS+ PE- Y+>++
t++ 5- X- R* tv+ b++ Dl+ D++ G+ e* h-- !r z-
-----END GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Message no. 15
From: "Gurth" <gurth@******.nl>
Subject: Re: Centering
Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 10:46:45 +0100
A Halliwell said on 2 Feb 96...

> (In first Ed, centering gave AUTO successes.....Now it just gives extra
> dice.)

I don't know about first edition because I don't have h original Grimoire,
but in SR2 centering does not give extra dice. What it does is, it allows
you to roll an extra test, and every two successes from that test either
functions as one success for the spellcasting or against drain, or lower
the TN penalties by 1. That's no extra dice in the normal sense of the
word, IMO.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Sometimes it feels like )@&*()@&%#68%3*(48@&%
-> NERPS Project Leader & Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Character Mortuary: http://huizen.dds.nl/~mortuary/mortuary.html <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version 3.1:
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE
Y PGP- t(+) 5+ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b+@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(----) y?
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
Message no. 16
From: "A Halliwell" <u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Centering
Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 15:43:20 +0000 (GMT)
|
|A Halliwell said on 2 Feb 96...
|
|> (In first Ed, centering gave AUTO successes.....Now it just gives extra
|> dice.)
|
|I don't know about first edition because I don't have h original Grimoire,
|but in SR2 centering does not give extra dice. What it does is, it allows
|you to roll an extra test, and every two successes from that test either
|functions as one success for the spellcasting or against drain, or lower
|the TN penalties by 1. That's no extra dice in the normal sense of the
|word, IMO.
|
I stand corrected. It does give extra successes then....
--
______________________________________________________________________________
| |What to do if you find yourself stuck in a crackin |
|u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk |the ground beneath a giant bolder, which you can't |
| |move, with no hope of rescue. |
|Andrew Halliwell |Consider how lucky you are that life has been good |
|Principal in:- |to you so far... |
|Comp Sci & Visual Arts | -The BOOK, Hitchhikers guide to the galaxy. |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 17
From: The Digital Mage <mn3rge@****.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Centering
Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:16:13 +0000 (GMT)
On Fri, 2 Feb 1996, Mark Steedman wrote:

> You roll centering. Its a general skill [despite the tendancy to take
> kai shouts, mages taking latin e.t.c., if it does centeraing you pay
> general skill karma costs, a concentration in only penalties (as
> opposed to assist with sorcery) 'might' be permitable]
Does it specifically state that a centring skill is considered a general
skill -I've been treating then as Special Skills and thus treated them as
Specialisations; it seems appropriate when they say that teh centring
skill must be pretty near useless for everything else.



The Digital Mage : mn3rge@****.ac.uk
"Life is a choice, Death....an obligation."-Me
Shadowrun WWW site at http://www.bath.ac.uk/~mn3rge/Shadowrun
Message no. 18
From: "A Halliwell" <u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Centering
Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:59:10 +0000 (GMT)
|
|On Fri, 2 Feb 1996, Mark Steedman wrote:
|
|> You roll centering. Its a general skill [despite the tendancy to take
|> kai shouts, mages taking latin e.t.c., if it does centeraing you pay
|> general skill karma costs, a concentration in only penalties (as
|> opposed to assist with sorcery) 'might' be permitable]
|Does it specifically state that a centring skill is considered a general
|skill -I've been treating then as Special Skills and thus treated them as
|Specialisations; it seems appropriate when they say that teh centring
|skill must be pretty near useless for everything else.

I'd say they can be any type of skill not involved in general shadowrunning.
I'd ban things like firearms (although build/repair might be allowable),
combat, computers, etc.

More common are such things as dancing/singing/foreign languages/arts.
There's no real reason that centering skill shouldn't be something like
Rubics cube or something like that.

Anything that allows the mage to concentrate for the sole purpose of
concentration.
--
______________________________________________________________________________
| |What to do if you find yourself stuck in a crackin |
|u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk |the ground beneath a giant bolder, which you can't |
| |move, with no hope of rescue. |
|Andrew Halliwell |Consider how lucky you are that life has been good |
|Principal in:- |to you so far... |
|Comp Sci & Visual Arts | -The BOOK, Hitchhikers guide to the galaxy. |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 19
From: Hannu Hurme etz@**********.fi
Subject: Centering
Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 23:50:21 +0300
Hello.

Some time ago sombody made a post about a "center" or "centering"
skill for
SR, mainly if somebody would make a fantasy conversion. Could someone send
me info about that "skill" because I don't have those old posts anymore.

And reply to me directly because I'm not on this list either. Thank you.

The www address at the end of this post is where my conversion is located,
all interested come take a look (note: there won't be anything until FASA
replies to my email, which as you know may take some time).


Hannu Hurme aka Etz
--------------------------
Mail Me: etz@**********.fi
--------------------------
www.saunalahti.fi/~etz/era
--------------------------
Message no. 20
From: Phil Smith phil_urbanhell@*******.com
Subject: Centering
Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 20:54:11 GMT
I have a question; how do you center for stealth, or rather, how do you
apply centering to open tests?

I weas thinking having the adept add half their centering skill to stealth
or rolling centering against a TN of 4 and giving them an extra stealth for
every (two) success(es).

MITS does not actually elaborate on this; it tells you what to do with
success tests but open tests are not mentioned.

Phil
________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
Message no. 21
From: kawaii trunks@********.org
Subject: Centering
Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 17:04:06 -0400
From: "Phil Smith" <phil_urbanhell@*******.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2000 4:54 PM


> I have a question; how do you center for stealth, or rather, how do you
> apply centering to open tests?
>
> I weas thinking having the adept add half their centering skill to stealth
> or rolling centering against a TN of 4 and giving them an extra stealth
for
> every (two) success(es).
>
> MITS does not actually elaborate on this; it tells you what to do with
> success tests but open tests are not mentioned.
>
> Phil

I was under the impression that Centering is used to reduce drain, not to
increase effectiveness? Or can it be used for both?

Ever lovable and always scrappy,
kawaii
Message no. 22
From: Ithlamor@***.com Ithlamor@***.com
Subject: Centering
Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 23:07:56 EDT
Centering can be used for much more than just reducing drain. It can be used to lower
penalties (though not the base target number), it can be used to increase the successes of
a magical skill test, the list goes on and on. For physical adepts, centering can be used
to increase some of their physical skills. However, adepts only can apply it to Stealth
and Athletics at first. For each initiate grade they get beyond 0, they can learn to
center for an additional skill. They then can use centering for successes or reducing the
penalties. For you, Phil, I would suggest handling the Stealth issue the way you
mentioned. That is how I always did it...just use the same TN for the centering test as
you do for the stealth skill test itself.
Message no. 23
From: Gurth gurth@******.nl
Subject: Centering
Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 12:47:04 +0200
According to kawaii, at 17:04 on 23 May 00, the word on the street was...

> > I have a question; how do you center for stealth, or rather, how do you
> > apply centering to open tests?
> >
> > I weas thinking having the adept add half their centering skill to stealth
> > or rolling centering against a TN of 4 and giving them an extra stealth for
> > every (two) success(es).

This has been discussed a few times before, and various house rules have
been suggested. Unfortunately, I can't remember any right now :(

Your suggestion would work, or you could, for example, let the adept roll
a centering test (TN 4) and give an extra die on the open test for every
two successes rolled.

> I was under the impression that Centering is used to reduce drain, not to
> increase effectiveness? Or can it be used for both?

Centering has lots of uses -- it can reduce Drain, get extra successes, or
remove penalties. Adepts don't have much use for the first one, but the
other two can come in handy.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Here come the golden oldies. Here come the Hezbollah.
-> NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
->The Plastic Warriors Page: http://shadowrun.html.com/plasticwarriors/<-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ UL P L+ E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 24
From: Phil Smith phil_urbanhell@*******.com
Subject: Centering
Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 17:07:28 GMT
>From: "kawaii" <trunks@********.org>
>I was under the impression that Centering is used to reduce drain, not to
>increase effectiveness? Or can it be used for both?

Depends who you are, adepts - who hardly ever resist drain - can apply it to
athletics and stealth to begin with and other skills at each grade.

Any other initiate can use centering to get more successes in magical
skills, resisting drain or reducing penaltys on magical skills.

Phil
________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
Message no. 25
From: Mathena, Timothy A. Tim.Mathena@************.com
Subject: Centering
Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 10:23:33 -0700
> Depends who you are, adepts - who hardly ever resist drain -
> can apply it to
> athletics and stealth to begin with and other skills at each grade.
>
> Any other initiate can use centering to get more successes in magical
> skills, resisting drain or reducing penaltys on magical skills.
>
> Phil

As an adept though you would need the enhanced centering ability to do this.

-Rookie
Message no. 26
From: Phil Smith phil_urbanhell@*******.com
Subject: Centering
Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 20:00:50 GMT
>From: "Mathena, Timothy A." <Tim.Mathena@************.com>
> > Depends who you are, adepts - who hardly ever resist drain -
> > can apply it to
> > athletics and stealth to begin with and other skills at each grade.
> >
> > Any other initiate can use centering to get more successes in magical
> > skills, resisting drain or reducing penaltys on magical skills.
> >
> > Phil
>
>As an adept though you would need the enhanced centering ability to do
>this.
>
>-Rookie

Not in SR3 you don't :)>

Phil
________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
Message no. 27
From: Manolis Skoulikas great_worm@*****.com
Subject: Centering
Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 01:07:09 +0300
Phil Smith wrote:
>
> I have a question; how do you center for stealth, or rather, how do you
> apply centering to open tests?
>
> I weas thinking having the adept add half their centering skill to stealth
> or rolling centering against a TN of 4 and giving them an extra stealth for
> every (two) success(es).
>
> MITS does not actually elaborate on this; it tells you what to do with
> success tests but open tests are not mentioned.
>
Since there is no drain and there is no set TN for the open test you
cannot use it for drain nor for reducing penalties.
But since you get half one succes for every two centering successes, I
would go for using half of the centering dice (round down) in the open
test

Say: Stealth 5, Centering 7 (7/2=3,5=3)
so that's 5+3=8 dice for the open test.

the wiz
Message no. 28
From: Rand Ratinac docwagon101@*****.com
Subject: Centering
Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 20:09:05 -0700 (PDT)
<Snippola(TM)>
> Since there is no drain and there is no set TN for
the open test you cannot use it for drain nor for
reducing penalties. But since you get half one succes
for every two centering successes, I would go for
using half of the centering dice (round down) in the
open test
>
> Say: Stealth 5, Centering 7 (7/2=3,5=3) so that's
5+3=8 dice for the open test.
> the wiz

Personally, I hate the open test rule as it's MUCH too
random for my liking.

If you use it, though, to partially compensate for the
random nature, I'd suggest adding the result of the
centering test (or half the result) to the result of
the open test instead of adding more dice.

====Doc'
(aka Mr. Freaky Big, Super-Dynamic Troll of Tomorrow, aka Doc'booner, aka Doc' Vader)

S.S. f. P.S.C. & D.J.

.sig Sauer

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites.
http://invites.yahoo.com/
Message no. 29
From: Sebastian Wiers m0ng005e@*********.com
Subject: Centering
Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 12:12:12 -0500
> > I have a question; how do you center for stealth, or rather, how do you
> > apply centering to open tests?

The way I've decided to do this (which is also sometimes a problem with
complimentary dice) when I GM is to use the average of the two highest
centering or complimentary dice, if that happens to be higher than the
regular roll.

>>>Centering has lots of uses -- it can reduce Drain, get extra successes,
or
remove penalties. Adepts don't have much use for the first one, but the
other two can come in handy.<<<

Centering against TN penalties on an open test is tricky, because of the
mechanic used. I think its not needed in those cases anyhow, since
centering "for success" (using some houe rule mechanic that allows extra
dice or a potential better result) has basically the same effect on open
tests.


Mongoose

_____________________________________________
NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
Click here for FREE Internet Access and Email
http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html
Message no. 30
From: Sebastian Wiers m0ng005e@*********.com
Subject: Centering
Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 23:52:19 -0500
Doc' said-
:Personally, I hate the open test rule as it's MUCH too
:random for my liking.

As used, its actually not all that random. If 2 characters have equal
numbers of dice, the chance of one open test result being higher than the
other is (barring ties) 50/50. As you change that nuber of dice, the
respective chances chage in the exact same ratio- unlike in, say, an opposed
test. The reult (who wins the test) is very similar to using a "rule of 4".

:If you use it, though, to partially compensate for the
:random nature, I'd suggest adding the result of the
:centering test (or half the result) to the result of
:the open test instead of adding more dice.

Adding two dice results together to get an open test result upsets the
mechanics vastly in the adepts favor. I think that is a bit much-
centering is nice, but I don't think it is supposed to be a superhuman
boost.


Mongoose

_____________________________________________
NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
Click here for FREE Internet Access and Email
http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html
Message no. 31
From: Rand Ratinac docwagon101@*****.com
Subject: Centering
Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 22:27:58 -0700 (PDT)
> :Personally, I hate the open test rule as it's MUCH
too random for my liking.
>
> As used, its actually not all that random. If 2
characters have equal numbers of dice, the chance of
one open test result being higher than the other is
(barring ties) 50/50. As you change that nuber of
dice, the respective chances chage in the exact same
ratio- unlike in, say, an opposed test. The reult
(who wins the test) is very similar to using a "rule
of 4".

Perhaps - but the potential for unbalanced results is
much worse that with other systems.

> Adding two dice results together to get an open
test result upsets the mechanics vastly in the adepts
favor. I think that is a bit much- centering is nice,
but I don't think it is supposed to be a superhuman
boost.
> Mongoose

I disagree.




















That's all.

















No, seriously, it seems I expressed myself poorly. I
didn't mean the RESULT of the centering test is added
to the result of the open test. I meant that the
number of successes - or half, depending on how good
you think centering should be - should be added. So
that adept in Manolis' example, with seven successes,
would add either +7, or +3 to the highest result on
his open test.

====Doc'
(aka Mr. Freaky Big, Super-Dynamic Troll of Tomorrow, aka Doc'booner, aka Doc' Vader)

S.S. f. P.S.C. & D.J.

.sig Sauer

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites.
http://invites.yahoo.com/
Message no. 32
From: Gurth gurth@******.nl
Subject: Centering
Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 10:12:50 +0200
According to Sebastian Wiers, at 12:12 on 24 May 00, the word on the
street was...

> > Centering has lots of uses -- it can reduce Drain, get extra successes, or
> > remove penalties. Adepts don't have much use for the first one, but the
> > other two can come in handy.
>
> Centering against TN penalties on an open test is tricky because of the
> mechanic used.

Yes, though adepts can also use Centering for skills that don't use open
tests (most of the time), like Athletics, or later on for other skills as
well.

> I think its not needed in those cases anyhow, since centering "for
> success" (using some houe rule mechanic that allows extra dice or a
> potential better result) has basically the same effect on open
> tests.

I can't really see a way to allow centering vs. penalties for an open test
anyway, even if the GM wants to modify the open test result. That is to
say, I can think of some methods, but they make it either too easy or too
difficult. Centering for "success" would, like you say, have much the same
effect anyway.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Here come the golden oldies. Here come the Hezbollah.
-> NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
->The Plastic Warriors Page: http://shadowrun.html.com/plasticwarriors/<-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ UL P L+ E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 33
From: Sebastian Wiers m0ng005e@*********.com
Subject: Centering
Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 12:33:57 -0500
:No, seriously, it seems I expressed myself poorly. I
:didn't mean the RESULT of the centering test is added
:to the result of the open test. I meant that the
:number of successes - or half, depending on how good
:you think centering should be - should be added. So
:that adept in Manolis' example, with seven successes,
:would add either +7, or +3 to the highest result on
:his open test.
:Doc'

Ah, that's a very different thing. That could work, and seeing that
even 3-5 successes on a centering test is often doing pretty well, I think
adding the full number of successes to the result of the open test would
give resonable results.
The only problem is, what is the TN that the centering test is rolled
against? If you are making an open test, the test (by definition) does not
have a TN. In fact, this is exactly why the issue came up in the first
place.


Mongoose

_____________________________________________
NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
Click here for FREE Internet Access and Email
http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html

Further Reading

If you enjoyed reading about Centering, you may also be interested in:

Disclaimer

These messages were posted a long time ago on a mailing list far, far away. The copyright to their contents probably lies with the original authors of the individual messages, but since they were published in an electronic forum that anyone could subscribe to, and the logs were available to subscribers and most likely non-subscribers as well, it's felt that re-publishing them here is a kind of public service.

Thwap!