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Message no. 1
From: Ashlocke <woneal@*******.NET>
Subject: Re: Damaging manipulations AOE vs. Single Target and casting thr
Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 05:08:47 -0005
On 21 Feb 98 at 3:17, Fade wrote:

> Started writing up a few guidelines on the whole mirror/LOS thing
> with spells.
>
> This situation arose, and I want confirmation here.
> A damaging manipulation single target spell (flamethrower) starts the
> physical energy at the mage and directs it outward. Thus it cannot be
> cast around corners by a mirror, right? (Except, possibly, for a low-
> force 'light' phsyical component DM.).

Right, mirrors cannot be used when casting physical damaging manipulation
spells to cast around corners. The Force is irrelevant. The relevant
rules explanations are in SRII, p 150, specifically the 3rd paragraph in
the left column and the 2nd paragraph on in the right column on that page.

>
> But a damaging manipulation Area of Effect spell 'detonates' its
> physical component at the target point, not at the mage, and thus it
> should be possible to cast it around a corner by using a mirror, rather
> than what I've assumed, which is, it can't be. Is this correct?

No... apparently from the explanation the energy physically travels to
the target, and once there then expands to the AOE.
--
@>->,-`---
Ashelock
o=<======-

GM's Theme: "I am the eye in the sky, looking at you, I can see your lies.
I am the maker of rules, dealing in fools, I can cheat you blind."
Message no. 2
From: Fade <runefo@***.UIO.NO>
Subject: Re: Damaging manipulations AOE vs. Single Target and casting thr
Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 15:23:30 +0000
Ashlocke wrote:
*snip*
> > But a damaging manipulation Area of Effect spell 'detonates' its
> > physical component at the target point, not at the mage, and thus it
> > should be possible to cast it around a corner by using a mirror, rather
> > than what I've assumed, which is, it can't be. Is this correct?
>
> No... apparently from the explanation the energy physically travels to
> the target, and once there then expands to the AOE.

That's exactly the bit I was curious about, yes. Beause it does not
make sense for a spell to behave that way - either it acts as a
normal spell until it goes to the target area and there expands to
AOE - and thus can be cast through mirrors, *or* the spell creates a
'missile' which then travels physically to the target area and
'explodes' at the target point. According to SR rules it is the
latter option, but I think that doesn't quite make sense - which is
why I asked if anyone else thought so. I'm able to read the rules but
it doesn't mean I agree with them.
--
Fade

And the Prince of Lies said:
"To reign is worth ambition, though in Hell:
Better to reign in hell than to serve in heaven."
-John Milton, Paradise Lost
Message no. 3
From: Mon goose <landsquid@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Damaging manipulations AOE vs. Single Target and casting thr
Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 00:50:14 PST
> Right, mirrors cannot be used when casting physical damaging
manipulation spells to cast around corners. The Force is irrelevant.
>

Not entirely- the spell travels in a straight line to the target, but if
high enough in force, could puch though interveneing walls, like any
powerful weapon. The victem gets 1/2 barrier protection, makingtis a
not-useless tactic.

>> But a damaging manipulation Area of Effect spell 'detonates' its
physical component at the target point, not at the mage, and thus it
should be possible to cast it around a corner by using a mirror, rather
than what I've assumed, which is, it can't be. Is this correct?
>
> No... apparently from the explanation the energy physically
travels to the target, and once there then expands to the AOE.
>

Absolutely right, AFAIK. In fact, if you cast, say, acid bomb,
through a glass window, the targets still get half the barrier rating of
the window as protection (if the spell can "punch though" the window),
even though the spell wasn't "active" going through the glass. Thats
becuase the spell channles and guides PHYSICAL matter and power, which
(in this case) then expands to an AOE.
If the window is tough enough to stop the spell, it does no damage,
except maybe to the window. It does NOT "detonate" at the window- it
does so only at the target.

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Message no. 4
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Damaging manipulations AOE vs. Single Target and casting thr
Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 23:31:05 +0000
And verily, did Fade hastily scribble thusly...
|That's exactly the bit I was curious about, yes. Beause it does not
|make sense for a spell to behave that way - either it acts as a
|normal spell until it goes to the target area and there expands to
|AOE - and thus can be cast through mirrors, *or* the spell creates a
|'missile' which then travels physically to the target area and
|'explodes' at the target point. According to SR rules it is the
|latter option, but I think that doesn't quite make sense - which is
|why I asked if anyone else thought so. I'm able to read the rules but
|it doesn't mean I agree with them.

It *is* a MANIPULATION spell, rather than a combat spell remember.
Manipulation implies using a spell to change something that is already
present, such as control emotions altering someones emotional state, or
transform changing someones shape.

Damaging manipulations manipulate the matter or energy in the area, creating
the damaging effect at the mages location, and then controlling that effect
and forcing it to physically move to the target.

The way I see flamebomb, for example, is simple.
The spell transforms matter around the mage into a highly pressurised flame
contained in a force-bubble, launches it at the target and then releases the
force-bubble.

Electrical damage causes the creation of a massive electrical field that
grounds out through the target. (This is ELECTRICAL grounding, not magical
grounding.)

etc....

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
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| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
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Message no. 5
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Damaging manipulations AOE vs. Single Target and casting thr
Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 08:38:27 +1000
Ashlocke writes:
>> A damaging manipulation single target spell (flamethrower) starts the
>> physical energy at the mage and directs it outward. Thus it cannot be
>> cast around corners by a mirror, right? (Except, possibly, for a low-
>> force 'light' phsyical component DM.).

> Right, mirrors cannot be used when casting physical damaging
manipulation
>spells to cast around corners. The Force is irrelevant. The relevant
>rules explanations are in SRII, p 150, specifically the 3rd paragraph in
>the left column and the 2nd paragraph on in the right column on that page.


Except for, as mentioned, DMs that use light, eg the laser beam spell in
Awakenings.

>> But a damaging manipulation Area of Effect spell 'detonates' its
>> physical component at the target point, not at the mage, and thus it
>> should be possible to cast it around a corner by using a mirror, rather
>> than what I've assumed, which is, it can't be. Is this correct?

> No... apparently from the explanation the energy physically travels
to
>the target, and once there then expands to the AOE.


Think of it as a grenade, or a missile... it travels physically (and
visible) to the target, and then blows up. Hence the image of the mage
throwing a ball of fire that then explodes.

--
.sig deleted to conserve electrons. robert.watkins@******.com

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