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From:	maxnoel_fr@*****.fr (Max Noel)
Subject:	Desktop-sized cyberdecks
Date:	Mon, 29 Sep 2003 13:30:52 +0200

Message no. 1 (I apologize if this is the second time you get this message -- I
mistakenly sent it from another account which is not subscribed to the
list, so I assumed it didn't get through)

Hello again!

I suppose this has already been debated to death, but anyway. Do
desktop-sized cyberdecks exist? (I suppose the answer is yes, but)
Where can I find official stats for them? If the answer is "nowhere"...
Well I'd say something like lower price (perhaps 50%) increased weight,
lower concealability if any and no batteries. Does that sound right?

Thanks in advance,

-- Wild_Cat
maxnoel_fr@*****.fr -- ICQ #85274019
"Look at you hacker... A pathetic creature of meat and bone, panting
and sweating as you run through my corridors... How can you challenge a
perfect, immortal machine?"

From:	toreador@***.bc.ca (Andrew Murdoch)
Subject:	Desktop-sized cyberdecks
Date:	Mon, 29 Sep 2003 07:43:22 -0700 (PDT)

Message no. 2 On Mon, 29 Sep 2003, Max Noel wrote:

> I suppose this has already been debated to death, but anyway. Do
> desktop-sized cyberdecks exist? (I suppose the answer is yes, but)
> Where can I find official stats for them? If the answer is "nowhere"...
> Well I'd say something like lower price (perhaps 50%) increased weight,
> lower concealability if any and no batteries. Does that sound right?

There used to be rules for breadboarding cyberdecks in VR 2.0 (Basically,
non-portable, desktop cyberdeck with all the functions, but cheaper cost)
but that seems to have been eliminated in Matrix.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hail, Centurion! "...He that hath no sword, let him
Andrew C. Murdoch sell his garment and buy one."
toreador@***.bc.ca Luke 22:36
http://www.fandom.ca

From:	me@******.net (Hexren)
Subject:	Desktop-sized cyberdecks
Date:	Mon, 29 Sep 2003 17:40:52 +0200

Message no. 3 AM> On Mon, 29 Sep 2003, Max Noel wrote:

AM> There used to be rules for breadboarding cyberdecks in VR 2.0 (Basically,
AM> non-portable, desktop cyberdeck with all the functions, but cheaper cost)
AM> but that seems to have been eliminated in Matrix.

---------------------------------------------

I dunno 'bout Matrix but the VR 2 reference would be to site 90 lower
left corner. Basicly the size of a 20 century desktop PC, with the
cost reduced by 50% and all target number in regard to cooking and
installation tasks reduced by 2.

Greetz
Hexren

but hey I would not want to carry a desktop around if the cost safing
is only 50%. It's just uncool ;)

From:	maxnoel_fr@*****.fr (Max Noel)
Subject:	Desktop-sized cyberdecks
Date:	Mon, 29 Sep 2003 18:30:06 +0200

Message no. 4 Hexren wrote:

> but hey I would not want to carry a desktop around if the cost safing
> is only 50%. It's just uncool ;)

It depends... I'm aiming for the "hacking room" look, i.e. some kind
of windowless basement, lit only by the glowing of a dozen computer
monitors over a couple of IBM keyboards -- and this looks cooler with
desktop computers IMO. It's for a character who's not a 'real' decker
(just a programmer/AI researcher) and whose starting resources are low,
to say the least.

Besides, not carrying it around is exactly the point of a desktop,
isn't it? ;)

-- Wild_Cat
maxnoel_fr@*****.fr -- ICQ #85274019
"Look at you hacker... A pathetic creature of meat and bone, panting
and sweating as you run through my corridors... How can you challenge a
perfect, immortal machine?"

From:	davidb@****.imcprint.com (Graht)
Subject:	Desktop-sized cyberdecks
Date:	Mon, 29 Sep 2003 11:18:13 -0600

Message no. 5 At 10:30 AM 9/29/2003, Max Noel wrote:

>Hexren wrote:
>
>>but hey I would not want to carry a desktop around if the cost safing
>>is only 50%. It's just uncool ;)
>
> It depends... I'm aiming for the "hacking room" look, i.e. some
> kind of windowless basement, lit only by the glowing of a dozen computer
> monitors over a couple of IBM keyboards -- and this looks cooler with
> desktop computers IMO. It's for a character who's not a 'real' decker
> (just a programmer/AI researcher) and whose starting resources are low,
> to say the least.
>
> Besides, not carrying it around is exactly the point of a
> desktop, isn't it? ;)

Unless you're a troll ;)

--
To Life,
-Graht
ShadowRN Assistant Fearless Leader II
http://www.graht.com

From:	gurth@******.nl (Gurth)
Subject:	Desktop-sized cyberdecks
Date:	Mon, 29 Sep 2003 19:19:28 +0200

Message no. 6 According to Max Noel, on Monday 29 September 2003 18:30 the word on the
street was...

> Besides, not carrying it around is exactly the point of a desktop,
> isn't it? ;)

You could strap it to a pack frame, put the keyboard on a bungee around
your neck, and would then only need to find a way to carry the monitor
(let's assume it's a TFT type of thing, not a CRT) so that you can
actually see it without having to set everything up.

:)

--
Gurth@******.nl - Stone Age: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Don't you know you know what's right?
-> Probably NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d- s:- !a>? C++(---) UL+ P(+) L++ E W--(++) N o? K w(--)
O V? PS+ PE@ Y PGP- t- 5++ X(+) R+++$ tv+(++) b++@ DI- D+ G+ e h! !r y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998

From:	justin@***********.net (Justin)
Subject:	Desktop-sized cyberdecks
Date:	Mon, 29 Sep 2003 12:25:26 -0500

Message no. 7 Gurth wrote:

> According to Max Noel, on Monday 29 September 2003 18:30 the word on the
> street was...
>
>
>> Besides, not carrying it around is exactly the point of a desktop,
>>isn't it? ;)
>
>
> You could strap it to a pack frame, put the keyboard on a bungee around
> your neck, and would then only need to find a way to carry the monitor
> (let's assume it's a TFT type of thing, not a CRT) so that you can
> actually see it without having to set everything up.

Actually, there are a couple of routes you could take here. One would be
to use the goggle approach, have a display shown in a pair of glasses or
goggles. Or have some of that new cool 70fps paper wrapped around your
forearm.

I'm sure there are yet more options than the monitor you and I are
familiar with, be it CRT of LCD

From:	me@******.net (Hexren)
Subject:	Desktop-sized cyberdecks
Date:	Mon, 29 Sep 2003 19:30:06 +0200

Message no. 8 G> At 10:30 AM 9/29/2003, Max Noel wrote:

>>Hexren wrote:
>>
>>>but hey I would not want to carry a desktop around if the cost safing
>>>is only 50%. It's just uncool ;)
>>
>> It depends... I'm aiming for the "hacking room" look, i.e. some

>> kind of windowless basement, lit only by the glowing of a dozen computer
>> monitors over a couple of IBM keyboards -- and this looks cooler with
>> desktop computers IMO. It's for a character who's not a 'real' decker
>> (just a programmer/AI researcher) and whose starting resources are low,
>> to say the least.
>>
>> Besides, not carrying it around is exactly the point of a
>> desktop, isn't it? ;)

G> Unless you're a troll ;)

---------------------------------------------

Well a desktop is nearly as universaly usefull as a towel... so you
should really think about carrying it around ;)

From:	maxnoel_fr@*****.fr (Max Noel)
Subject:	Desktop-sized cyberdecks
Date:	Mon, 29 Sep 2003 19:28:34 +0200

Message no. 9 Gurth wrote:

> You could strap it to a pack frame, put the keyboard on a bungee around
> your neck, and would then only need to find a way to carry the monitor
> (let's assume it's a TFT type of thing, not a CRT) so that you can
> actually see it without having to set everything up.
>
> :)

A 'civilian' version of smartgoggles (i.e. sunglasses that can display
video) will do the job perfectly. Or a retinal image link routed
through a datajack.
The real problem is finding a place to put the generator. Desktops
don't have batteries...

-- Wild_Cat
maxnoel_fr@*****.fr -- ICQ #85274019
"Look at you hacker... A pathetic creature of meat and bone, panting
and sweating as you run through my corridors... How can you challenge a
perfect, immortal machine?"

From:	justin@***********.net (Justin)
Subject:	Desktop-sized cyberdecks
Date:	Mon, 29 Sep 2003 12:31:14 -0500

Message no. 10 Max Noel wrote:

> A 'civilian' version of smartgoggles (i.e. sunglasses that can
> display video) will do the job perfectly. Or a retinal image link
> routed through a datajack.
> The real problem is finding a place to put the generator. Desktops
> don't have batteries...

I dunno about you, but I can run my desktop for 30 minutes in a
blackout. And that's just your basic UPS. If you actually put thought
and effort into designing a portable desktop, which is essentially what
today's notebooks are, you could get a couple of hours at least, with
just garage technology.

From:	anders@**********.com (Anders Swenson)
Subject:	Desktop-sized cyberdecks
Date:	Mon, 29 Sep 2003 10:33:31 -0700

Message no. 11 On Mon, 29 Sep 2003 11:18:13 -0600
Graht <davidb@****.imcprint.com> wrote:
> At 10:30 AM 9/29/2003, Max Noel wrote:
>

> >
> > Besides, not carrying it around is exactly the point of a
> >desktop, isn't it? ;)
>
> Unless you're a troll ;)
>
Besides, you still need to plug it in!
--Anders

From:	grimjack@******.com (Martin Little)
Subject:	Desktop-sized cyberdecks
Date:	Mon, 29 Sep 2003 13:42:03 -0400 (EDT)

Message no. 12 > > Unless you're a troll ;)
> >
> Besides, you still need to plug it in!
> --Anders
>
Well duh, obviously the troll will just carry an outlet as well.

;)

From:	maxnoel_fr@*****.fr (Max Noel)
Subject:	Desktop-sized cyberdecks
Date:	Mon, 29 Sep 2003 19:41:00 +0200

Message no. 13 Justin wrote:

>> A 'civilian' version of smartgoggles (i.e. sunglasses that can
>> display video) will do the job perfectly. Or a retinal image link
>> routed through a datajack.
>> The real problem is finding a place to put the generator.
>> Desktops don't have batteries...
>
> I dunno about you, but I can run my desktop for 30 minutes in a
> blackout. And that's just your basic UPS. If you actually put thought
> and effort into designing a portable desktop, which is essentially
> what today's notebooks are, you could get a couple of hours at least,
> with just garage technology.

Of course, by then you're probably better off using a laptop/portable
cyberdeck. My Powerbook can run for more than 3 hours on battery, and I
consider cyberdecks have at least twice that battery time (no screen to
power, advanced battery tech...).
By the way, are there any rules for this?

-- Wild_Cat
maxnoel_fr@*****.fr -- ICQ #85274019
"Look at you hacker... A pathetic creature of meat and bone, panting
and sweating as you run through my corridors... How can you challenge a
perfect, immortal machine?"

From:	gurth@******.nl (Gurth)
Subject:	Desktop-sized cyberdecks
Date:	Tue, 30 Sep 2003 13:39:03 +0200

Message no. 14 According to Max Noel, on Monday 29 September 2003 19:28 the word on the
street was...

> The real problem is finding a place to put the generator. Desktops
> don't have batteries...

What's wrong with an extension cord? ;)

--
Gurth@******.nl - Stone Age: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Don't you know you know what's right?
-> Probably NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d- s:- !a>? C++(---) UL+ P(+) L++ E W--(++) N o? K w(--)
O V? PS+ PE@ Y PGP- t- 5++ X(+) R+++$ tv+(++) b++@ DI- D+ G+ e h! !r y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998

From:	tjlanza@************.com (Timothy J. Lanza)
Subject:	Desktop-sized cyberdecks
Date:	Tue, 30 Sep 2003 08:07:09 -0400

Message no. 15 At 07:39 AM 9/30/2003, Gurth wrote:
>According to Max Noel, on Monday 29 September 2003 19:28 the word on the
>street was...
>
> > The real problem is finding a place to put the generator. Desktops
> > don't have batteries...
>
>What's wrong with an extension cord? ;)

Heck, just put the troll on a bicycle. I think he can pump out enough juice. :)

--
Timothy J. Lanza
"When we can't dream any longer, we die." - Emma Goldman

From:	valeuj@*****.navy.mil (Valeu, John W. EM3 (AS40 R-3))
Subject:	Desktop-sized cyberdecks
Date:	Tue, 30 Sep 2003 21:48:02 +1000

Message no. 16 >> I dunno about you, but I can run my desktop for 30 minutes in a
>> blackout. And that's just your basic UPS. If you actually put thought
>> and effort into designing a portable desktop, which is essentially
>> what today's notebooks are, you could get a couple of hours at least,
>> with just garage technology.

> Of course, by then you're probably better off using a
laptop/portable
>cyberdeck. My Powerbook can run for more than 3 hours on battery, and I
>consider cyberdecks have at least twice that battery time (no screen to
>power, advanced battery tech...).
> By the way, are there any rules for this?

The rules for Impact and balistic casing maybe? Or were those removed in
Matrix as well?

From:	anders@**********.com (Anders Swenson)
Subject:	Desktop-sized cyberdecks
Date:	Tue, 30 Sep 2003 08:17:23 -0700

Message no. 17 On Tue, 30 Sep 2003 21:48:02 +1000
"Valeu, John W. EM3 (AS40 R-3)" <valeuj@*****.navy.mil> wrote:
> >> I dunno about you, but I can run my desktop for 30 minutes in a
> >> blackout. And that's just your basic UPS. If you actually put thought
> >> and effort into designing a portable desktop, which is essentially
> >> what today's notebooks are, you could get a couple of hours at least,
> >> with just garage technology.
>
> > Of course, by then you're probably better off using a
> laptop/portable
> >cyberdeck. My Powerbook can run for more than 3 hours on battery, and I
> >consider cyberdecks have at least twice that battery time (no screen to
> >power, advanced battery tech...).
> > By the way, are there any rules for this?
>
> The rules for Impact and balistic casing maybe? Or were those removed in
> Matrix as well?

Well the whole point of this is that we are talking about a non-portable.
Once you start making it portable, you lose the whole point of its being a
desktop machine. And any justification for a price break. There is no
justicification either in game balance or in 'hard science' for fudging
things without charging an appropriate price. I have no problem with bringing
foreward rules that seem to have forgotten by editors of 'the latest thing'.
--Anders

From:	loneeagle@********.co.uk (Lone Eagle)
Subject:	Desktop-sized cyberdecks
Date:	Wed, 01 Oct 2003 19:10:21 +0100

Message no. 18 At 12:48 PM 30/9/2003, John wrote:
> >cyberdeck. My Powerbook can run for more than 3 hours on battery, and I
> >consider cyberdecks have at least twice that battery time (no screen to
> >power, advanced battery tech...).
> > By the way, are there any rules for this?
>
>The rules for Impact and balistic casing maybe? Or were those removed in
>Matrix as well?

The Battery rules still exist, although the armoured casing IIRC now has a
Barrier Rating (after all no matter how much armour you have you still need
to stage the damage down.)

--
Lone Eagle
"Hold up lads, I got an idea."

www.wyrmtalk.co.uk - Please be patient, this site is under construction

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