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Message no. 1
From: Richard M Conroy <Richard_M_Conroy@***.ir.intel.com>
Subject: Downtime (was Re: deckers)
Date: Wed, 07 Aug 96 13:52:00 PDT
:Any supplements or ideas relating to what players do between runs.
[snip]

:For example, what does the rest of the group do during game time
:when one is in hospital?

[example of player injured deleted]
Well, In my experience, where one player undergoes surgery, normally the
rest do too, either because most of them have been injured, or because
they all decided, under mutual consent to undergo, say, cyberware
upgrades at the same time to minimise game impact. This is an IC thing
too...not many groups would undergo a run without their best sam. This
probably doesn't help you too much, as you seem to imply that it is
generally only one player who is out.

If the character is sufficiently healed to be conscious, they can still
act to a certain degree. Deckers can still access the net (although
hacking is a seriously stupid idea when you're bedridden) and keep in
touch with the team. Mages can go Astral and accomplish the same thing.
In either case, runs are out, unless you are desperate or stupid, but
the character can still function to a certain degree, assisting in
plans, getting in touch with contacts etc. You can also roleplay it...
relatives/friends (NPC & PC) visit the character in hospital. Sometimes
the injured character might have to lie low, meaning that the others
have to move him, look after him, find blood donors, medicine etc. He
can become a function of the session (gain 1 karma point for keeping him
alive *grin*) almost a mini-run. It's best if he is conscious, at least
make it interesting for the player. Chances are your players will like
the fresh change. Time can pass quickly here, an hour or so of game time
might result in 2 weeks passing and the character being healed. But
don't rush it if everyone's enjoying it, particularly the bedridden one.
It's important that the poor sod regains consciousness for this
to happen. Alternatively, you can use the player in question to assist
you in roleplaying NPC's, this works well for everyone, but watch out
for some OOC spite (the player/NPC abusing his position to make trouble
for another player), and control it, a particular NPC might be the
characters girlfriend/spouse/kid whatever, who is very upset over the
PC's disappearance/injury (the PC's know but can't tell). If more than 1
player is incapacitated in this way, put them in the same ward and let
them RolePlay /play cards (IC), or let them roleplay out a past episode.
Or let each take turns RPing each others close relatives.
If you've never tried this before, be prepared for a surprise:
if it doesn't work, well you tried, but if it does, your players might
really take to it (watch them write up relatives etc. and spend the next
2 game sessions RPing~ no running or what) it happened to us.

:So then, as a GM, how do you fill up that time for the other
:players; other than saying " Three weeks pass uneventfully:)"; and
:what with?

Generally this is where all those character details come in: have them
write down what they do when they're not running. Some of this is
obvious~ Solos have to keep in shape, go to gun clubs etc. Deckers have
to keep their programs in top shape (acquiring drivers etc.). Fixers/
Detectives need to keep in touch with their contacts. Everyone needs to
keep their running gear & skills in nick, but they also need to do other
things~ they're running for a reason remember: money (so they can quit
when they're rich/finance their playboy lifestyle/bankroll something
important to them (extract a family member), rep, personal vendetta,
clear their name etc. Use these details between runs to advance the
story.

Downtime is the perfect time to implement each of the sub-plots ie all
that stuff that your PC's get into without the teams help: Gang
troubles, shakedowns, insults, chasing down loose ends, right-place-
right-time stuff.

Go with it man. Downtime can usually be more fun than the predictable
runs if they're done right. And remember, relatives do send their kids
to visit sometimes or have them show up on your doorstep as runaways.
Ham it up even, run it like a tacky soap opera (SR 90210 anybody ?
*duck*).

Richard.
O--------------------------------------------------------------------O
\Food for thought lies in the\Richard_M_Conroy@\Roadkill on the Info \
\depth of an inedible brick. \ccm.ir.intel.com \-rmation SuperHighway\
O-------------------------------------------------------------------O
Message no. 2
From: "Sascha Pabst" <Sascha.Pabst@**********.Uni-Oldenburg.DE>
Subject: Re: Downtime (was Re: deckers)
Date: Thu, 8 Aug 1996 23:33:28 +0000
On 7 Aug 96 at 13:52, Richard M Conroy wrote:
[snipped how to pass _character's_ downtime]
> Go with it man. Downtime can usually be more fun than the predictable
> runs if they're done right. And remember, relatives do send their kids
> to visit sometimes or have them show up on your doorstep as runaways.
> Ham it up even, run it like a tacky soap opera (SR 90210 anybody ?
> *duck*).
Although I agree I think the main problem was how to handle a player who's
character is down for some reason, be it voluntary or emergency surgery or
even the learning of spells. When the character is out of action, what to do
with the player? (Then, maybe _I_ got the question wrong... hm)

In our group the player either doesn't show up when the charater is down (why
should [s]he sit around if no play can be done?), or, most often, another
character is used. Most of us have "permanent" secondary characters, some use
new characters whenever neccessary, normaly to play out an idea for character
generation.

Sascha
--
+---___---------+----------------------------------------+--------------------+
| / / _______ | Jhary-a-Conel aka Sascha Pabst |The one who does not|
| / /_/ ____/ |Sascha.Pabst@**********.Uni-Oldenburg.de| learn from history |
| \___ __/ | | is bound to live |
|==== \_/ ======| *Wearing hats is just a way of life* | through it again. |
|LOGOUT FASCISM!| - Me | |
+------------- http://www.informatik.uni-oldenburg.de/~jhary -----------------+
Message no. 3
From: Richard M Conroy <Richard_M_Conroy@***.ir.intel.com>
Subject: Re: Downtime (was Re: Deckers)
Date: Fri, 09 Aug 96 09:28:00 PDT
Sascha wrote:
:Although I agree I think the main problem was how to handle a player
:who's character is down for some reason, be it voluntary or emergency
:surgery or even the learning of spells. When the character is out of
:action, what to do with the player? (Then, maybe _I_ got the question
:wrong... hm)

No, I understood you perfectly. Read the rest of my post, I was fairly
thorough in my reply.

:In our group the player either doesn't show up when the charater is
:down (why should [s]he sit around if no play can be done?),

My main suggestion was to have the PLAYER of the character roleplay some
of the GM's NPC's instead. Depending on the situation, most characters
shouldn't be completely out of touch anyway, unless comatose, and should
be able to keep in touch with the other characters.

:or, most often, another character is used. Most of us have "permanent"
:secondary characters, some use new characters whenever neccessary,
:normaly to play out an idea for character generation.

Secondary characters work pretty well, but the main flaw with them is
that it slows down your plot development (character knowledge doesn't
transfer, etc.).

I take it that your PC's are actually going on runs when some of your
characters are out of commission? Most teams would not take on a run
unless they were at full strength, although if it was mid-run I could
understand continuing without a character.

One thing you could try doing is introducing advanced medical
technologies, something that could speed up healing *A LOT*, or have
institutions with awakened paramedics. In both cases expensive as hell,
but it could be something that players aim for...

Richard
O--------------------------------------------------------------------O
\Food for thought lies in the\Richard_M_Conroy@\Roadkill on the Info \
\depth of an inedible brick. \ccm.ir.intel.com \-rmation SuperHighway\
O-------------------------------------------------------------------O
Message no. 4
From: "Sascha Pabst" <Sascha.Pabst@**********.Uni-Oldenburg.DE>
Subject: Re: Downtime (was Re: Deckers)
Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 17:02:50 +0000
On 9 Aug 96 at 9:28, Richard M Conroy wrote:
[wrong question answered (my assumption)]
> No, I understood you perfectly. Read the rest of my post, I was fairly
> thorough in my reply.
Um, maybe I've mis- or not read something, in this case, I am sorry.

> :In our group the player either doesn't show up when the charater is
> :down (why should [s]he sit around if no play can be done?),
>
> My main suggestion was to have the PLAYER of the character roleplay some
> of the GM's NPC's instead.
Uh, no, I'd never let a player take over a NPC that is plot-relevant if I'm
GMing, and not-plot-relevant NPCs used to be either civilians (who are not too
interesting to play) or "mercenaries" - NPCs brought along for more
{fire|magic|decking}power, and our group doesn't hire this kind of help
anymore (made _BAD_ experiences once).

> Depending on the situation, most characters
> shouldn't be completely out of touch anyway, unless comatose, and should
> be able to keep in touch with the other characters.
...but it tends to be quite boring when a firefight is running and you are the
player who's NPC is down (and as a GM I wount let the player handle one or
more of the enemie combatants - might bring bad feelings in the (players)
group, or is possibly suddenly quite easy to overcome the NPCs. No, is just
too tempting for my taste).

> :or, most often, another character is used. Most of us have "permanent"
> :secondary characters, some use new characters whenever neccessary,
> :normaly to play out an idea for character generation.
> Secondary characters work pretty well, but the main flaw with them is
> that it slows down your plot development (character knowledge doesn't
> transfer, etc.).
But here you assume the whole group is replaced, otherwise there's just a
short "we introduce him to what happened, but tell him the payment is just..."
Oooops, no, of course, I meant... *blush*

> I take it that your PC's are actually going on runs when some of your
> characters are out of commission? Most teams would not take on a run
> unless they were at full strength, although if it was mid-run I could
> understand continuing without a character.
Our players come from 3 different towns, about 1/2 hour apart, most of us are
working for their living, and so it happens quite often someone can't show up
for a session (orange clouds of smoke happen to be quite often near our
runners, where people disappear or re-appear suddenly :-), and most of us
enjoy having at least two characters, so our group of 'runners is in fact more
a loose network of people working together as needed (strange - some of them
never seem to meet :-)
>From this derives we _have_ to enter runs in different constellations, and
sometimes not in full stength.

> One thing you could try doing is introducing advanced medical
> technologies, something that could speed up healing *A LOT*, or have
> institutions with awakened paramedics. In both cases expensive as hell,
> but it could be something that players aim for...
I tried that once, just to introduce a new way of healing, but it was
"prototype", and the player not too happy, since it cost Essence. But he was
up and kicking butts within days.

Sascha
--
+---___---------+----------------------------------------+--------------------+
| / / _______ | Jhary-a-Conel aka Sascha Pabst |The one who does not|
| / /_/ ____/ |Sascha.Pabst@**********.Uni-Oldenburg.de| learn from history |
| \___ __/ | | is bound to live |
|==== \_/ ======| *Wearing hats is just a way of life* | through it again. |
|LOGOUT FASCISM!| - Me | |
+------------- http://www.informatik.uni-oldenburg.de/~jhary -----------------+
Message no. 5
From: Pete Sims <petesims@********.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Downtime (was Re: deckers)
Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 22:18:40 +0100
In article <m0uociV-0004wbC@*******.Informatik.Uni-Oldenburg.DE>, Sascha
Pabst <Sascha.Pabst@**********.Uni-Oldenburg.DE> writes
>On 7 Aug 96 at 13:52, Richard M Conroy wrote:
>[snipped how to pass _character's_ downtime]
>> Go with it man. Downtime can usually be more fun than the predictable
>> runs if they're done right. And remember, relatives do send their kids
>> to visit sometimes or have them show up on your doorstep as runaways.
>> Ham it up even, run it like a tacky soap opera (SR 90210 anybody ?
>> *duck*).
>Although I agree I think the main problem was how to handle a player who's
>character is down for some reason, be it voluntary or emergency surgery or
>even the learning of spells. When the character is out of action, what to do
>with the player? (Then, maybe _I_ got the question wrong... hm)
>
>In our group the player either doesn't show up when the charater is down (why
>should [s]he sit around if no play can be done?), or, most often, another
>character is used. Most of us have "permanent" secondary characters, some
use
>new characters whenever neccessary, normaly to play out an idea for character
>generation.
>
> Sascha
Downtime, an interesting problem at the best of times. Figured that out
when an important party member was seriously injured on a run and left
the rest of the team with little to do. We all sat around for a long
time after the game and talked about solutions.

The team now consists of an ex Dox Wagon medic, who works part time at a
street docs, a Bounty Hunter, who still chases bail jumpers
occassionally, and a - sorry, can't tell you his role, as other players
may be here, who has several boat related skills, holds down a small
store where he repairs boats etc, and occassionally races them, and is
at present in a rather meaningful relationship with a female reporter.
A Decker who works (unsurprisingly) in an electronics store (backroom
techie), a Shaman, who works in a talismongers store, a mage who spends
a lot of his downtime chasing down sales of artefacts and magical
paraphernalia (he has quite a collection now)and another anonymous
player of "unknown" origin, who has a number of "between run"
activities.

A lot of hard work on building character backgrounds (families etc.) has
allowed for some other downtime events, including the dreaded family get
together barbecue (god that was hilarious), and a decent attempt at
believable character interaction with the world as they see it.

It works rather well, and gives everyone something to do during
downtime, when they are not in a position to hold down a run. Having
said that, I have been known to steal ideas and modules from other game
systems, so if I find a short run, I may throw that at the players, when
they have nothing better to do. The other alternative we've tried, and
that seems to work OK, is to have a "spare" character.

Most of my players now have two characters available to them, that they
are building up, and use them alternately depending on circumstances.
If one or two characters are injured, or undergoing surgery, then the
other characters come in for a while. They all have a favourite, of
course, but that's to be expected. It also means, that if a team member
meets with a "terminal accident" it doesn't destroy game play and
continuity too much, because they already have a new character ready and
raring to go, someone who has a bit of street rep, and isn't considered
a newbie, or cannon fodder.

Just my pennethworth.
TTFN
--
Pete Sims
Message no. 6
From: Richard M Conroy <Richard_M_Conroy@***.ir.intel.com>
Subject: Re: Downtime (was Re: Deckers)
Date: Mon, 12 Aug 96 12:08:00 PDT
Sascha wrote:
:> No, I understood you perfectly. Read the rest of my post, I was
:> fairly thorough in my reply.
:Um, maybe I've mis- or not read something, in this case, I am sorry.

You want to somehow involve the PLAYER when his CHARACTER is essentially
unplayable. I gave 2 main areas of suggestion. One involved having or
contriving that the CHARACTER wasn't completely out of Commission,
rendering him playable. The other involved allowing the PLAYER to play
some temporary non-important roles, allowing him to RolePlay and still
involve him in the session. I know what you meant, even if I wasn't
clear enough in my reply.

:Uh, no, I'd never let a player take over a NPC that is plot-relevant if
:I'm GMing, and not-plot-relevant NPCs used to be either civilians (who
:are not too interesting to play) or "mercenaries" - NPCs brought along
:for more {fire|magic|decking}power, and our group doesn't hire this
:kind of help anymore (made _BAD_ experiences once).

I'd never suggest allowing them to be your main NPC's, or any NPC's for
that matter who have an ability to change your plot development. The
roles I suggested were of the form of worried relatives, or one-shot
NPC's whose main purpose was humour (say a sidekick or something) where
you as the GM would roleplay the main NPC, while the PLAYER would be the
minor one, the point being to add flavour to the encounter.

And who says civilians aren't interesting to play ? They are most
certainly a refreshing break from the usual grizzled runner types. I'm
not suggesting you make a campaign of it (such a campaign would be
primarily player-driven, best done as a LARP), but spicing up your
campaign with alternative roleplay never does harm, and can put a whole
new perspective on your players view of the game.
One of the best examples that I can recall was where my GM got
me and 2 other team members who hadn't done much in a while to RP some
Juve~Gangers (Calvin, Beavis & Butthead) at a meet between the decker
(who'd been hogging play) and his contact. We had spectators so we
hammed it up a bit (read: lots), with our NPC's addressing the lack of
fashion in his deck, and offering to rectify it (spraycan). Soon there
were these kind of NPC's (most better behaved) RPed by players at most
meets.

:and as a GM I wount let the player handle one or more of the enemie
:combatants
[snip]

No shit !!!!

:> Secondary characters work pretty well, but the main flaw with them is
:> that it slows down your plot development (character knowledge doesn't
:> transfer, etc.).
:But here you assume the whole group is replaced,

No I don't. I run a very plot intensive game, where there are many
shadowy players in the backgound, all with specific objectives. This
happens independantly of the players, but their actions may affect these
players goals.
Basically, key information is usually spread differently through
my players. Some of them know some of the pieces, others different ones.
It's not IC for them to share this knowledge with everyone, after all
information is valuable and disemmination devalues it. Much of my plot
revolves around my players sharing pieces of information, trying not to
compromise their sources etc. trying to get a bigger picture.
Having a second character would mean that certain keys may not
be present when the first character isn't around. It doesn't work for
me, but obviously you have no problem with it.

:Our players come from 3 different towns, about 1/2 hour apart, most of
:us are working for their living, and so it happens quite often someone
:can't show up for a session (orange clouds of smoke happen to be quite
:often near our runners, where people disappear or re-appear suddenly

:From this derives we _have_ to enter runs in different constellations,
:and sometimes not in full stength.

I see. I had a bit of a problem with that, players not turning up more
because they slept it out (game started 7:30, and I know they weren't
lying :O ), were busy getting drunk or whatever. Although there was a
core group of diehards who were there every time, and got the lions
share of enjoyment. I got tired of explaining everything to all the
transients who'd missed the last two sessions and asked them to leave,
got in some good friends to take their places, and finally the game
picked up.
You and I suffer from different problems (player dispersion is a
toughie), but from what I can read from your posts, your group isn't
that upset by multiple character use, which is one of the best ways to
deal with downed characters. I don't use it is because I think it
prevents players from getting fully attached to their characters (I know
my players), and besides my character creation is an exhaustive process,
it would take too long to ask players to create a second character, and
I don't think that they'd be able for it either.

Richard.
O--------------------------------------------------------------------O
\Food for thought lies in the\Richard_M_Conroy@\Roadkill on the Info \
\depth of an inedible brick. \ccm.ir.intel.com \-rmation SuperHighway\
O-------------------------------------------------------------------O
Message no. 7
From: "Sascha Pabst" <Sascha.Pabst@**********.Uni-Oldenburg.DE>
Subject: Re: Downtime (was Re: Deckers)
Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 18:26:36 +0000
On 12 Aug 96 at 12:08, Richard M Conroy wrote:
> You want to somehow involve the PLAYER when his CHARACTER is essentially
> unplayable.
OK, so (finally) we are sure we talk about the same thing :-)

> I gave 2 main areas of suggestion. One involved having or
> contriving that the CHARACTER wasn't completely out of Commission,
> rendering him playable.
>From what you described later on I see your point, but within our campaign it
wouldn't work that well, and from experience I can tell a combat- or
combatlike situation will arise just when the character is out. Murphy's Law
of ill characters, perhaps.

[snip player taking over "add-on" NPCs. Point taken, will consider it. Sounds
good.]

> :and as a GM I wount let the player handle one or more of the enemie
> :combatants
> [snip]
> No shit !!!!
:-)

> :> Secondary characters work pretty well, but the main flaw with them is
> :> that it slows down your plot development (character knowledge doesn't
> :> transfer, etc.).
> :But here you assume the whole group is replaced,
> No I don't. I run a very plot intensive game, where there are many
> shadowy players in the backgound, all with specific objectives. This
> happens independantly of the players, but their actions may affect these
> players goals.
[snip]
> Having a second character would mean that certain keys may not
> be present when the first character isn't around. It doesn't work for
> me, but obviously you have no problem with it.
We have a different style of gaming. Although I admit your way is more
"realistic", with the PCs watching their own back more then anything else, we
follow the "group trusts"-approach, where the group shares all
(plot-relevant) info (hm - most of the time, I have to admit). So it is
possible to bring in a new character with the comment "I tell him what
happened before".

[problems getting players together]
> I see. I had a bit of a problem with that, players not turning up more
> because they slept it out (game started 7:30, and I know they weren't
> lying :O ), were busy getting drunk or whatever. Although there was a
> core group of diehards who were there every time, and got the lions
> share of enjoyment.
Hm, sounds like some scene I know... :-/

> I got tired of explaining everything to all the
> transients who'd missed the last two sessions and asked them to leave,
> got in some good friends to take their places, and finally the game
> picked up.
Uh, no, never do that - let the players expplain. So you can't mistakenly
offer information, and the players will recall the events much better (at
least the ones that were present). Offer a Karma award if the summary is good.
And help out or correct errors you think the characters wouldn't have done
(mixing up dates or places, etc).
Plus you'll learn what did impress your players most last session :-)

> [Multiple Characters]I don't use it is because I think it
> prevents players from getting fully attached to their characters (I know
> my players), [snip]
Yup, may lead to shizophrenic (sp?) situations sometimes *slighly mad grin*

Sascha
--
+---___---------+----------------------------------------+--------------------+
| / / _______ | Jhary-a-Conel aka Sascha Pabst |The one who does not|
| / /_/ ____/ |Sascha.Pabst@**********.Uni-Oldenburg.de| learn from history |
| \___ __/ | | is bound to live |
|==== \_/ ======| *Wearing hats is just a way of life* | through it again. |
|LOGOUT FASCISM!| - Me | |
+------------- http://www.informatik.uni-oldenburg.de/~jhary -----------------+

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