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Message no. 1
From: dghost@****.com dghost@****.com
Subject: Edges
Date: Fri, 8 Oct 1999 20:49:40 -0700
I'm making a character with a Masters in Thaumaturgy ... any suggestions
on how to accomplish this?

Also, I had the idea for an edge:
Knowledgable (or some other name for it)
for each BP (up to 6?) spent on this edge, the character gains 4 points
of knowledge skills.

or the flaw:
Dumb as a post (-2):
the character only receives Intelligence x3 points of knowledge skills.

A character can not me dumb as a knowledgable post (ie, you can't take
the edge and the flaw :)

--
D. Ghost
Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.
Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.
-Groucho Marx

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Message no. 2
From: Jeff axter@*****.com
Subject: Edges
Date: Fri, 8 Oct 1999 22:35:03 -0700 (PDT)
> or the flaw:
> Dumb as a post (-2):
> the character only receives Intelligence x3 points
> of knowledge skills.
>

There already is a Mental Flaw that does the same :
Uneducated (-2) (p. 25, SR3 Companion)


====Jeff
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Message no. 3
From: dghost@****.com dghost@****.com
Subject: Edges
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 1999 01:14:28 -0700
On Fri, 8 Oct 1999 22:35:03 -0700 (PDT) Jeff <axter@*****.com> writes:
<SNIP>
> There already is a Mental Flaw that does the same :
> Uneducated (-2) (p. 25, SR3 Companion)

Oh well ... That's what I get for not waiting until my friend returned my
copy of the SR3Co*. On the other hand, if it does the exact same thing
at the same cost, that's pretty cool ... Great minds think alike? :)

*we should formalize the the abreviations for the Shadowrun Companion
revised and updated for 3rd Edition and the original. I suggest SR3Co
vrs SR2Co (Or S3C vrs S2C)

--
D. Ghost
Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.
Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.
-Groucho Marx

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Message no. 4
From: Gurth gurth@******.nl
Subject: Edges
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 1999 11:39:14 +0200
According to dghost@****.com, at 20:49 on 8 Oct 99, the word on
the street was...

> I'm making a character with a Masters in Thaumaturgy ... any suggestions
> on how to accomplish this?

Just give this character the relevant magical skills at rating 4 or 5, I
would say. Especially Magic Background, whcih IMHO should be the highest-
rated magic-related skill (since a character like this would have plenty
of theoretical knowledge but not necessarily much hands-on experience).

> Also, I had the idea for an edge:
> Knowledgable (or some other name for it)
> for each BP (up to 6?) spent on this edge, the character gains 4 points
> of knowledge skills.

Sounds like a good enough edge to me, although I'd probably give 3
Knowledge skill points per point spent on the edge, not 4. Maybe also add
a limit that the edge can't have a higher rating that the character's
Intelligence.

Alternatively, add the rating of the edge to the Knowledge skill
multiplier -- for example, if you take it at 2 points, you get (7 x
Intelligence) Knowledge skill points.

> or the flaw:
> Dumb as a post (-2):
> the character only receives Intelligence x3 points of knowledge skills.

Dumb is not the same as ignorant. At any rate, this flaw already exists --
the Uneducated flaw gives Int x 3 points for Knowledge skills, plus some
other minor restrictions; see the Companion p. 25.

If you use my second suggestion for the Knowledgable edge, you might also
use it for the Uneducated flaw: rate it from -1 to -4, and modify the
number of Knowledge skill points in the same way.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
I would have it all if I'd only have this much
-> NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
->The Plastic Warriors Page: http://shadowrun.html.com/plasticwarriors/<-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ UL P L+ E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
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Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 5
From: Airwasp@***.com Airwasp@***.com
Subject: Edges
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 1999 09:28:19 EDT
In a message dated 10/8/99 8:44:53 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
dghost@****.com writes:

> I'm making a character with a Masters in Thaumaturgy ... any suggestions
> on how to accomplish this?

Get the edge of College Education ... and a skill of 6 in Magic Background ...

> Also, I had the idea for an edge:
> Knowledgable (or some other name for it)

I'm sorry chummer, if it were possible I'd say go for it, but somewhere in
the rules there is an edge already for gaining additional skill points
somewhere (Don't have SRC in front of me, sorry).

-Mike B.
Message no. 6
From: Chris Maxfield cmaxfiel@****.org.au
Subject: Edges
Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 01:34:40 +1000
At 09:28 9/10/99 -0400, Airwasp@***.com wrote:
>In a message dated 10/8/99 8:44:53 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
>dghost@****.com writes:
>
> > I'm making a character with a Masters in Thaumaturgy ... any suggestions
> > on how to accomplish this?
>
>Get the edge of College Education ... and a skill of 6 in Magic Background ...
I
I'd also add the knowledge skills Spell Design and Talismongering at about
level 4 or 5.

Chris
Message no. 7
From: Ereskanti@***.com Ereskanti@***.com
Subject: Edges
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 1999 11:37:43 EDT
In a message dated 10/8/1999 8:44:53 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
dghost@****.com writes:

> I'm making a character with a Masters in Thaumaturgy ... any suggestions
> on how to accomplish this?
>
> Also, I had the idea for an edge:
> Knowledgable (or some other name for it)
> for each BP (up to 6?) spent on this edge, the character gains 4 points
> of knowledge skills.

I'm not sure how you get 4 points of Knowledge skills out of a single BP.
Way out of whack IMO.

> or the flaw:
> Dumb as a post (-2):
> the character only receives Intelligence x3 points of knowledge skills.

This makes me really curious. Almost seems like your reverse-engineering one
aspect of the Shapeshifter "non-civility" by comparison.

> A character can not me dumb as a knowledgable post (ie, you can't take
> the edge and the flaw :)

All of this just to try and make a guy with a Masters' in Thaumaturgy? No
offense here, but you're way over-detailing the concept. Masters is NOT
doctorate if you want to go by comparison of skills in the SR3 system
mechanics. Masters' would be perhaps a skill in Academic: Magic
Theory/Thaumaturgy of rating 7. Doctorate would be the "8" level and beyond
using the skill comparison table in the BBB3.

Going on the consideration that "a beginning character may not have a general
skill of rating in excess of 6" (paraphrased), then could simply get an edge
of "Exceptional Skill", similar to the edge of "Exceptional
Attribute", and
apply the mechanics at this time. Personally, it would be easier to make
some kind of arrangement with a GM IMO to allow for the Academic (Knowledge)
skill of a 7. Perhaps the person is a theoretical marvel, but an
applications dingbat (at least to begin with), and doesn't have the applied
(Active) skills in Sorcery, Conjuring or Enchanting at anything above a 3-4.
At least, for starting out.

All IMO of course.
-K
Message no. 8
From: Lars Ericson lericson@****.edu
Subject: Edges
Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 10:52:23 -0500
dghost@****.com wrote:
>
> I'm making a character with a Masters in Thaumaturgy ... any suggestions
> on how to accomplish this?
>
> Also, I had the idea for an edge:
> Knowledgable (or some other name for it)
> for each BP (up to 6?) spent on this edge, the character gains 4 points
> of knowledge skills.

That seems like a lot for a single BP. In the amin book's priority
system, characters can spend their active skill points on knowledge
skills on a 1 for 1 excahnge. I agree that knowledge skills are not as
useful as active skills, but 1:4 so too high of a ratio. I'd suggest
1:2, i.e. 1 BP gives 2 additional knowledge (or language) skill points.
Message no. 9
From: Ereskanti@***.com Ereskanti@***.com
Subject: Edges
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 1999 11:55:44 EDT
In a message dated 10/9/1999 4:42:05 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
gurth@******.nl writes:

> Alternatively, add the rating of the edge to the Knowledge skill
> multiplier -- for example, if you take it at 2 points, you get (7 x
> Intelligence) Knowledge skill points.
<snip>
> If you use my second suggestion for the Knowledgable edge, you might also
> use it for the Uneducated flaw: rate it from -1 to -4, and modify the
> number of Knowledge skill points in the same way.

Gurth, I do believe *this* might not be an entirely bad idea. Although,
given that it is always easier to create than it is to destroy, perhaps the
aquiring points should be 2 per level BP cost, and the losing of points would
be -1 per level. Certain maximums of course should apply just to keep things
under wraps. Perhaps as the negative can reach "4 points" by your
suggestion, then the positive as well?

-K
Message no. 10
From: dghost@****.com dghost@****.com
Subject: Edges
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 1999 11:45:06 -0700
On Sat, 9 Oct 1999 11:37:43 EDT Ereskanti@***.com writes:
> In a message dated 10/8/1999 8:44:53 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
> dghost@****.com writes:
<SNIP>
> > Also, I had the idea for an edge:
> > Knowledgable (or some other name for it)
> > for each BP (up to 6?) spent on this edge, the character gains 4
points
> > of knowledge skills.

> I'm not sure how you get 4 points of Knowledge skills out of a single
BP.
> Way out of whack IMO.

Raising your intelligence by one point costs two build points and yields
5 more knowledge skill points in addition to the benefits of having a
higher intellligence. If it's 3 per BP, then taking 2 points of this
edge instead of raising the intelligence stat by 1 yields 6 knowledge
skill points and no benefits from a high intelligence. As such, (IMO)
the edge has to exchange AT LEAST 4 knowledge skill points per BP spent.
Where it might get out of hand is where you Intelligence is maxed out ...

<SNIP>
> All of this just to try and make a guy with a Masters' in Thaumaturgy?
No
> offense here, but you're way over-detailing the concept. Masters is
NOT
> doctorate if you want to go by comparison of skills in the SR3 system
> mechanics. Masters' would be perhaps a skill in Academic: Magic
> Theory/Thaumaturgy of rating 7. Doctorate would be the "8" level and
beyond
> using the skill comparison table in the BBB3.
>
> Going on the consideration that "a beginning character may not have a
general
> skill of rating in excess of 6" (paraphrased), then could simply get an
edge
> of "Exceptional Skill", similar to the edge of "Exceptional
Attribute",
and
> apply the mechanics at this time.

Actually, I thought of something similar that I forgot to include. :)

(This is not it, btw :)
Master Degree = Aptitude in one skill)
Doctorate (Must have Masters first) [cost 4] = (as Aptitude but only
applies to one specialization and modifier is -2 -- not cumulative with
Aptitude [or Master's Degree] modifiers.)

> Personally, it would be easier to make
> some kind of arrangement with a GM IMO to allow for the Academic
(Knowledge)
> skill of a 7. Perhaps the person is a theoretical marvel, but an
> applications dingbat (at least to begin with), and doesn't have the
applied
> (Active) skills in Sorcery, Conjuring or Enchanting at anything above a
3-4.
> At least, for starting out.
>
> All IMO of course.

And I*M*O you'd have to apply the theoretical knowledge in order to do
research ... :)
"We have created over 50 new spells that work in theory."
"In theory? Haven't you tested them?"
"..."
"Well?"
"We don't know how ..."

--
D. Ghost
Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.
Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.
-Groucho Marx
___________________________________________________________________
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Message no. 11
From: Gurth gurth@******.nl
Subject: Edges
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 1999 20:05:39 +0200
According to Ereskanti@***.com, at 11:55 on 9 Oct 99, the word on
the street was...

> Gurth, I do believe *this* might not be an entirely bad idea.

As opposed to most of my other ideas, you mean? ;)

> Although, given that it is always easier to create than it is to
> destroy, perhaps the aquiring points should be 2 per level BP cost, and
> the losing of points would be -1 per level.

Good point. However, you can also reverse it: Knowledge skills are
actually a very useful thing, so maybe you should get more points back for
not having them, then you should pay for having more. It can also be
argued that these two factors cancel each other out, and thus simply put
the cost at 1 point per level either way... There's a lot to be said for
each of these three options, IMHO.

> Certain maximums of course should apply just to keep things under wraps.
> Perhaps as the negative can reach "4 points" by your suggestion, then
> the positive as well?

Well, the negative modifier really can't go under -4, because else you'd
have no Knowledge skills at all. Putting the limit on the positive points
at the same level should work fine, I think.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
I would have it all if I'd only have this much
-> NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
->The Plastic Warriors Page: http://shadowrun.html.com/plasticwarriors/<-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ UL P L+ E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 12
From: Steven A. Tinner bluewizard@*****.com
Subject: Edges
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 1999 16:45:20 -0400
Instead of buying new knowledge skill points with BP's, how about changing
the base multiplier instead?

Like this ...

Edge
Studied - 3, or 6 BP's
Adds +1 to the knowledge skill base multiplier for each level of this edge.
So the BM becomes a 6 at level 1, and a 7 at level 2.

Yes, I realize that knowledge skills ARE useful, but IMO even giving an INT
maxed character 2 levels of this edge is that bad of a game breaker IMO.
42 or so points for knowledge skills is very good though, and IMO does
reflect a certain degree of higher education.

Steven A. Tinner
bluewizard@*****.com
http://listen.to/tinner
"Half of All Gamers Never Read the Rules, Half of All Gamers Argue About the
Rules, Unfortunately, Its the Same Half."
Message no. 13
From: dghost@****.com dghost@****.com
Subject: Edges
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 1999 18:34:54 -0700
On Sat, 9 Oct 1999 20:05:39 +0200 "Gurth" <gurth@******.nl> writes:
> According to Ereskanti@***.com, at 11:55 on 9 Oct 99, the word on
> the street was...
>
> > Gurth, I do believe *this* might not be an entirely bad idea.
>
> As opposed to most of my other ideas, you mean? ;)
>
> > Although, given that it is always easier to create than it is to
> > destroy, perhaps the aquiring points should be 2 per level BP cost,
and
> > the losing of points would be -1 per level.

> Good point. However, you can also reverse it: Knowledge skills are
> actually a very useful thing, so maybe you should get more points back
for
> not having them, then you should pay for having more. It can also be
> argued that these two factors cancel each other out, and thus simply
put
> the cost at 1 point per level either way... There's a lot to be said
for
> each of these three options, IMHO.
<SNIP>

The problem (IMO) with flaws that reduce starting knowledge skills is
that the min-max possibilities. That's why I only gave 2 points for my
flaw ... IMO, the flaw should also give some other unpleasant modifiers
(at least if you want more than 2 points back) ... ie, +1 T#s when
defaulting, or something like that. Also, certain skills (Magical &
Technical perhaps) should have a lower starting limit ... like 4 or 5.)

--
D. Ghost
Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.
Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.
-Groucho Marx

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Message no. 14
From: Gurth gurth@******.nl
Subject: Edges
Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 11:37:51 +0200
According to dghost@****.com, at 18:34 on 9 Oct 99, the word on
the street was...

> The problem (IMO) with flaws that reduce starting knowledge skills is
> that the min-max possibilities. That's why I only gave 2 points for my
> flaw ... IMO, the flaw should also give some other unpleasant modifiers
> (at least if you want more than 2 points back) ... ie, +1 T#s when
> defaulting, or something like that. Also, certain skills (Magical &
> Technical perhaps) should have a lower starting limit ... like 4 or 5.)

The Uneducated edge from the Companion has a few of those additional
modifiers, but nothing that will really make things unpleasant, IMHO.
(Speaking only one language is not a big deal -- most Americans, Germans,
French, and lots of others are living proof ;)

Okay. Taking Tinner's comment into consideration as well, it seems to me
now that getting more knowledge skills should be cost more points than
what you get for not having Knowledge skills, if for no other reason than
preventing players from having 60 points worth of Knowledge skills too
easily. So, how about this:

Uneducated (revised)
Value: -1 per level (maximum 4)
See text on page 25 of SRC3 for general rules, except that the character's
Knowledge skill points are equal to his or her Intelligence multiplied by
(5 - level). Characters who take this flaw at level 1 may have two
languages (but not more), while those with the Uneducated flaw at level 2
or higher may only know one language.

Educated
Value: 3 per level (maximum 5)
Every level taken in this edge adds 1 to the multiplier for Knowledge
skills; for example, a character with level 2 Educated gets Intelligence x
7 points in Knowledge skills.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
I would have it all if I'd only have this much
-> NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
->The Plastic Warriors Page: http://shadowrun.html.com/plasticwarriors/<-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ UL P L+ E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 15
From: Raije murk@****.org.au
Subject: Edges
Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 16:11:21 +1000
>
> There already is a Mental Flaw that does the same :
> Uneducated (-2) (p. 25, SR3 Companion)
>

Dumb as a post sounds better. In fact, it would suit a lot more characters
better too ;-)

I got a Q: We have a character who thinks he's satan. Except that he is.
Now the GM (and I) want him to take the delusion flaw, and tone it down so
that he thinks he is the devil, but hwe wants to take a flaw so that other
people think that he thinks is satan, but he actually is satan and....have I
lost you? What do you think?

In any case, he's an odd char to play with...a very helpful satan that's for
sure...oi.


_____________________sabrepunk@**********.net_
Raije
sabrepunk@**********.net
UIN-2799894
~Simple Guide to Cyberpunk~
http://gateway.to/cyberpunk/
"Shit Happens, So Carry Toilet Paper"
Message no. 16
From: dghost@****.com dghost@****.com
Subject: Edges
Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 13:20:10 -0700
On Sun, 10 Oct 1999 11:37:51 +0200 "Gurth" <gurth@******.nl> writes:
<SNIP>
> Educated
> Value: 3 per level (maximum 5)
<SNIP>

There is a standard of Edges not costing more than 6 points ... This one
would get up to 15. So if the limit is 6 BP, that's an increase of 2 (1
Intelligence) to 12 (6 Intelligence) knowledge skill points for 6 BPs.
Seems out of whack (on the `spensive side) to me.
*shrugs*

--
D. Ghost
Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.
Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.
-Groucho Marx

___________________________________________________________________
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Message no. 17
From: Ereskanti@***.com Ereskanti@***.com
Subject: Edges
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 00:09:42 EDT
I just dropped everything to let a couple of people here know how something
went tonight.

Last week, the concept of "Education" levels was discussed as the point of
"Uneducated" (Int x 3 in knowledge skill points) vs. the standard rating.
Tonight I opened the doors as we make a new group of characters in
preparation for some other material we're tinkering with (tons of ideas,
nothing official).

In it, we played with "Uneducated" all the way to "Common" (what ever
character is, except for Shapeshifters) and up to "Smart Ass" levels. As
Uneducated was Int x 3, Poorly Educated was Int x 4, "Average" is standard,
Advanced Education became Int x 6 and Highly Educated became Int x 7. The
first two are -2 and -1 point flaws respectively, and the last two are +1 and
+2 point edges respectively.

I have to admit, it went over well, and only two of the 6-7 players even
really gave it a thought. We've even dubbed the "Highly Educated" Edge as
"Trivia Master" and "Smart Ass" for the time being.

I'm just letting people know how well it went, and would like to know if
anyone else has actually bounced this one off of their player groups yet.

-K
[Hoosier Hacker House]
[http://members.aol.com/hhackerh/intro.htm]
ICQ#-51511837
Message no. 18
From: Ahrain Drigar ahrain_drigar@*******.com
Subject: Edges
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 02:54:30 EDT
>From: dghost@****.com
>Date: Fri, 8 Oct 1999 20:49:40 -0700
>
>I'm making a character with a Masters in Thaumaturgy ... any suggestions
>on how to accomplish this?
>

IMHO I believe one of the best ways of dealing with "Masters" and
"PhD's"
etc, has been "Origins" in Shadowrun Supplemental #8,
http://shadowrun.html.com/tss/tss.html. Although, you will have to update
for 3rd ed. (I haven't had a game started since 3rd or I would post a few
ideas).

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Message no. 19
From: dghost@****.com dghost@****.com
Subject: Edges
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 02:57:56 -0700
On Mon, 11 Oct 1999 02:54:30 EDT "Ahrain Drigar"
<ahrain_drigar@*******.com> writes:
> >From: dghost@****.com
> >Date: Fri, 8 Oct 1999 20:49:40 -0700
> >I'm making a character with a Masters in Thaumaturgy ... any
suggestions
> >on how to accomplish this?

> IMHO I believe one of the best ways of dealing with "Masters" and
"PhD's"
> etc, has been "Origins" in Shadowrun Supplemental #8,
> http://shadowrun.html.com/tss/tss.html. Although, you will have to
update
> for 3rd ed. (I haven't had a game started since 3rd or I would post a
few
> ideas).

IMnsHO ;), it is a nice system and worked well in 2nd Edition but,
speaking as someone who tried to update it to 3rd Edition, does not work
as well now that skills have been divided into Active and Knowledge as
well as the fracturing of skills such as Firearms, Ground Vehicles, etc.
Perhaps someone else can come up with a 3rd Edition version that works
better than mine did (mine was lost in my HD crash so it is not available
for reference.). Good luck. :)

--
D. Ghost
Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.
Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.
-Groucho Marx

___________________________________________________________________
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Message no. 20
From: Gurth gurth@******.nl
Subject: Edges
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 11:41:34 +0200
According to dghost@****.com, at 13:20 on 10 Oct 99, the word on
the street was...

> There is a standard of Edges not costing more than 6 points ... This one
> would get up to 15.

True, but it's a guideline for home-designed edges, not a hard and fast
rule. The way I see it, some things can easily go over 6 points, which
means they're so expensive that hardly anyone will take them -- so there's
no real problem anyway :)

> So if the limit is 6 BP, that's an increase of 2 (1 Intelligence) to 12
> (6 Intelligence) knowledge skill points for 6 BPs.

Could you run that by me again, but in a form that makes sense? I have
_no_ idea what you're talking about here...

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
I would have it all if I'd only have this much
-> NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
->The Plastic Warriors Page: http://shadowrun.html.com/plasticwarriors/<-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ UL P L+ E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 21
From: dghost@****.com dghost@****.com
Subject: Edges
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 07:05:37 -0700
On Mon, 11 Oct 1999 11:41:34 +0200 "Gurth" <gurth@******.nl> writes:
> According to dghost@****.com, at 13:20 on 10 Oct 99, the word on
> the street was...
<SNIP>
> > So if the limit is 6 BP, that's an increase of 2 (1 Intelligence) to
12
> > (6 Intelligence) knowledge skill points for 6 BPs.

> Could you run that by me again, but in a form that makes sense? I have
> _no_ idea what you're talking about here...

Your proposal was that each 3 BPs increase the multiplier by 1. That
means that if you have a 1 Intelligence, and spend 6 BPs on this edge an
you get 2 (2 * 1 intel) extra knowledge skill points. If, instead, you
have an intelligence of 6, you would get 12 (2 * 6 Intel) extra knowledge
skill points. I think this might be a bit expensive, particularly for
low intelligences.

--
D. Ghost
Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.
Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.
-Groucho Marx

___________________________________________________________________
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Message no. 22
From: Airwasp@***.com Airwasp@***.com
Subject: Edges
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 09:45:38 EDT
In a message dated 10/10/99 11:10:23 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
Ereskanti@***.com writes:

> I just dropped everything to let a couple of people here know how something
> went tonight.
>
> Last week, the concept of "Education" levels was discussed as the point of

> "Uneducated" (Int x 3 in knowledge skill points) vs. the standard rating.

> Tonight I opened the doors as we make a new group of characters in
> preparation for some other material we're tinkering with (tons of ideas,
> nothing official).
>
> In it, we played with "Uneducated" all the way to "Common" (what
ever
> character is, except for Shapeshifters) and up to "Smart Ass" levels. As
> Uneducated was Int x 3, Poorly Educated was Int x 4, "Average" is
standard,
> Advanced Education became Int x 6 and Highly Educated became Int x 7. The
> first two are -2 and -1 point flaws respectively, and the last two are +1
> and +2 point edges respectively.
>
> I have to admit, it went over well, and only two of the 6-7 players even
> really gave it a thought. We've even dubbed the "Highly Educated" Edge as

> "Trivia Master" and "Smart Ass" for the time being.

Personally, I see the edge costs for Trivia Master (Int x 6) and Smart-Ass
(Int x 7) as being too low. I could see them being 3 and 6 points
respectively. As for the reverse, I can see them have a flaw cost of 3 and 6
points also.

My names as I see it for the edge in question ...

Paid attention in class / Farted around in class
Cost : 3 / level, -3 / level
Maximum Level: 2
Description:
This edge/flaw means that either the character actually learned a lot
more during the school years or they spent more time chasing after the
opposite sex and acting as entertainment for the shool years.
For each level as a edge, the Intelligence multiplier for Knowledge
Skills is increased by one per level, for the flaw, the same multiplier is
reduced by one per level.
If taken as an egde, the following name(s) can be ascribed to the
character: Brainiac, Smart-Ass, Trivia Master, Mr. Know-It-All, Mr.
Brittanica, Brown-Noser (probably from all the apples you brought to the
teacher).

If taken as a flaw, the following names can be ascribed to the character:
Womanizer, Class-Clown, Dumb-Ass, Mr. In-One-Ear-And-Out-The-Other, Huh?!?,
Droopy from Guadaloopy, Brown-Noser (simply because you graduated).

I never really gave it a thought as I did not want to be one of the people
trying it out to begin with. I was more interested in seeing who actually
did take it.

> I'm just letting people know how well it went, and would like to know if
> anyone else has actually bounced this one off of their player groups yet.
>
> -K
> [Hoosier Hacker House]
> [http://members.aol.com/hhackerh/intro.htm]
> ICQ#-51511837


-Mike B.
"Your belief in Absolute Power of Magic is nothing compared to a good Chick
Flick."
Hoosier Hacker House
http://members.aol.com/hhackerh/intro.htm
Message no. 23
From: Ereskanti@***.com Ereskanti@***.com
Subject: Edges
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 11:40:05 EDT
In a message dated 10/11/1999 6:47:08 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
murk@****.org.au writes:

> I got a Q: We have a character who thinks he's satan. Except that he is.
> Now the GM (and I) want him to take the delusion flaw, and tone it down so
> that he thinks he is the devil, but hwe wants to take a flaw so that other
> people think that he thinks is satan, but he actually is satan and....have
I
> lost you? What do you think?
>
> In any case, he's an odd char to play with...a very helpful satan that's
for
> sure...oi.

Okay Murk, I'll *bite*. What on earth are you referring to here? Is the
character merely a pain-in-the-ass type or he actually some kind of
"possessed/transient spirit in a mortal shell?" This is a very important
thing to clarify before *I* could go any farther on helping you out.

-K
Message no. 24
From: Gurth gurth@******.nl
Subject: Edges
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 19:57:42 +0200
According to dghost@****.com, at 7:05 on 11 Oct 99, the word on
the street was...

> > > So if the limit is 6 BP, that's an increase of 2 (1 Intelligence) to
> 12
> > > (6 Intelligence) knowledge skill points for 6 BPs.
>
> > Could you run that by me again, but in a form that makes sense? I have
> > _no_ idea what you're talking about here...
>
> Your proposal was that each 3 BPs increase the multiplier by 1. That
> means that if you have a 1 Intelligence, and spend 6 BPs on this edge an
> you get 2 (2 * 1 intel) extra knowledge skill points. If, instead, you
> have an intelligence of 6, you would get 12 (2 * 6 Intel) extra knowledge
> skill points.

Ah yes, with that explanation I suddenly see what the original sentence
meant, thanks :)

> I think this might be a bit expensive, particularly for low
> intelligences.

You're probably right, yes. I tried to make extra Knowledge skill points
expensive to make them a bit rare -- it's IMHO easier to be ignorant than
it is to be learned. Two points per level would work as well, I think, and
strike a balance between expense and return.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
I would have it all if I'd only have this much
-> NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
->The Plastic Warriors Page: http://shadowrun.html.com/plasticwarriors/<-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ UL P L+ E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 25
From: Raije murk@****.org.au
Subject: Edges
Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 13:52:04 +1000
>
> Okay Murk, I'll *bite*. What on earth are you referring to here? Is the
> character merely a pain-in-the-ass type or he actually some kind of
> "possessed/transient spirit in a mortal shell?" This is a very important
> thing to clarify before *I* could go any farther on helping you out.

hahaha

no, the player wants to actually *be* satan, but be onm holidays kind of
thing. The char himself is actually an Adversary Idol worshipper...its kind
of in between the two you mentioned there...actually...he's starting to make
a new character so it might not matter much...considering he's a newbie I
guess his this char was just to get used to things...

_____________________sabrepunk@**********.net_
Raije
sabrepunk@**********.net
UIN-2799894
~Simple Guide to Cyberpunk~
http://gateway.to/cyberpunk/
"Shit Happens, So Carry Toilet Paper"
Message no. 26
From: Scott W iscottw@*****.nb.ca
Subject: Edges
Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 01:49:24 -0300
"And now, a Channel 6 editorial reply to Raije."
] > Okay Murk, I'll *bite*. What on earth are you referring to here? Is the
] > character merely a pain-in-the-ass type or he actually some kind of
] > "possessed/transient spirit in a mortal shell?" This is a very important
] > thing to clarify before *I* could go any farther on helping you out.
]
] hahaha
]
] no, the player wants to actually *be* satan, but be onm holidays kind of
] thing.

LOL! Where exactly would the Dark Lord go to get away from it all?
Maybe somewhere cold...a Siberian gulag? "Well, the misery and
suffering's exquisite, but can't something be done about these
bedpreads? Tasteless...I wonder what's in the dresser
draw--AAAUUGGHH!!! Damn those Gideons!"

-Boondocker
Message no. 27
From: Ereskanti@***.com Ereskanti@***.com
Subject: Edges
Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 02:40:28 EDT
In a message dated 10/11/1999 11:52:16 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
iscottw@*****.nb.ca writes:

> LOL! Where exactly would the Dark Lord go to get away from it all?
> Maybe somewhere cold...a Siberian gulag? "Well, the misery and
> suffering's exquisite, but can't something be done about these
> bedpreads? Tasteless...I wonder what's in the dresser
> draw--AAAUUGGHH!!! Damn those Gideons!"

*YOU* ... need significant help ... ;-P

-K
Message no. 28
From: Scott W iscottw@*****.nb.ca
Subject: Edges
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 01:07:40 -0300
"And now, a Channel 6 editorial reply to Ereskanti@***.com."
] > LOL! Where exactly would the Dark Lord go to get away from it all?
] > Maybe somewhere cold...a Siberian gulag? "Well, the misery and
] > suffering's exquisite, but can't something be done about these
] > bedpreads? Tasteless...I wonder what's in the dresser
] > draw--AAAUUGGHH!!! Damn those Gideons!"
]
] *YOU* ... need significant help ... ;-P

Hey, I'm not the fellow who wants to play Beelzebub in a
Thursday-night roleplaying session. That'd definitely creep me out.

GM: "You're pinned down, guards on one side, and raging fire on the
other. Mark, it's your action."
Mark: "I fire once at the guards, and look around for an exit."
GM: "Okay. You hit a guard, she goes down. Tony, your turn."
Tony: "Is using my Dark Powers of Damnation a Simple or Complex Action?"
GM: <sigh> "Whatever."
Mark: "I'm rolling up a new character. What Priority do I take to be
an Archangel?"
GM stands up, gathers his books, and leaves.
Mark: "Geez."
Tony: "I'd say Priority B. Gotta keep it balanced."

-Boondocker
Message no. 29
From: Ereskanti@***.com Ereskanti@***.com
Subject: Edges
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 13:51:44 EDT
In a message dated 10/12/1999 11:10:48 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
iscottw@*****.nb.ca writes:

> GM: "You're pinned down, guards on one side, and raging fire on the
> other. Mark, it's your action."
> Mark: "I fire once at the guards, and look around for an exit."
> GM: "Okay. You hit a guard, she goes down. Tony, your turn."
> Tony: "Is using my Dark Powers of Damnation a Simple or Complex Action?"
> GM: <sigh> "Whatever."
> Mark: "I'm rolling up a new character. What Priority do I take to be
> an Archangel?"
> GM stands up, gathers his books, and leaves.
> Mark: "Geez."
> Tony: "I'd say Priority B. Gotta keep it balanced."

Yeah, I think that would just about be the end of things for me as well,
especially after that Xena episode I saw recently...

-K (confused???)
Message no. 30
From: Scott W iscottw@*****.nb.ca
Subject: Edges
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 21:21:41 -0300
"And now, a Channel 6 editorial reply to Ereskanti@***.com."
] > GM: "You're pinned down, guards on one side, and raging fire on the
] > other. Mark, it's your action."
] > Mark: "I fire once at the guards, and look around for an exit."
] > GM: "Okay. You hit a guard, she goes down. Tony, your turn."
] > Tony: "Is using my Dark Powers of Damnation a Simple or Complex Action?"
] > GM: <sigh> "Whatever."
] > Mark: "I'm rolling up a new character. What Priority do I take to be
] > an Archangel?"
] > GM stands up, gathers his books, and leaves.
] > Mark: "Geez."
] > Tony: "I'd say Priority B. Gotta keep it balanced."
]
] Yeah, I think that would just about be the end of things for me as well,
] especially after that Xena episode I saw recently...
]
] -K (confused???)

Why are you confused? Xena's not an especially complex show...

-Boondocker
Message no. 31
From: Raije murk@****.org.au
Subject: Edges
Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 19:04:06 +1000
> In a message dated 10/11/1999 11:52:16 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
> iscottw@*****.nb.ca writes:
>
> > LOL! Where exactly would the Dark Lord go to get away from it all?
> > Maybe somewhere cold...a Siberian gulag? "Well, the misery and
> > suffering's exquisite, but can't something be done about these
> > bedpreads? Tasteless...I wonder what's in the dresser
> > draw--AAAUUGGHH!!! Damn those Gideons!"
>
> *YOU* ... need significant help ... ;-P
>
> -K
>
>

No he doesn't. I noticed it too. They stalk people. Everytime I go to a
hotel they leave their stuff behind...

_____________________sabrepunk@**********.net_
Raije
sabrepunk@**********.net
UIN-2799894
~Simple Guide to Cyberpunk~
http://gateway.to/cyberpunk/
"Shit Happens, So Carry Toilet Paper"

Further Reading

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