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Message no. 1
From: Zebulin Magby zebulingod@*****.com
Subject: Flame weapons in Shadowrun?
Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 18:30:36 -0700 (PDT)
I was wondering if anyone had come up with flamethrower weapons for shadowrun, and
if so, where I could find such weapons of destruction?

Thanks in advance,

Zebulin

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Message no. 2
From: Gurth gurth@******.nl
Subject: Flame weapons in Shadowrun?
Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 11:56:13 +0200
According to Zebulin Magby, at 18:30 on 20 Oct 99, the word on the street
was...

> I was wondering if anyone had come up with flamethrower weapons for
> shadowrun, and if so, where I could find such weapons of destruction?

There have been a number of write-ups, but I don't know where to find them
ATM. You might locate some stats by looking through the archives for this
list, though.

As for more helpful thoughts, a flamethrower uses two types of
"ammunition": the fuel (usually up to about 25 liters) and the ignition
cartridges (about 5 of them). It can fire hot and cold shots: hot means an
ignition cartridge is used, and thus the fuel burns when it comes out of
the weapon; cold shots are without using a cartridge, so you're spraying
unignited fuel. The number of hot shots is obviously limited by the number
of ignition cartridges, but any shot can be of any length -- as long as
you keep the trigger pressed, the weapon will keep spraying fuel.

In SR game terms, a typical flamethrower will have 5 ignition cartridges
and 10 Simple Actions worth of fuel. It fires Single Shot, but once it's
fired, the user can decide to simply keep the stream going on any Simple
Action after it's been fired, getting a new skill test to hit the target.
It's probably best to make it cost a Free Action to stop shooting.

Range is limited, especially if using unthickened fuel. I tend to put a
flamer's range at Light Pistol equivalent with thickened fuel, and half
that with unthickened fuel. Don't forget that shots can be bounced off
obstructions so they can be sprayed around cover to hit people who think
they're safe -- though I'd put something like a +4 TN on this.

Damage is caused mainly by the fire, which will keep burning for a while,
and the strong stream of fuel (base knockdown TNs on the full Power
Level). Damage I'd say is in the order of 6S for anyone hit by the stream
of fuel, and 6M for a number of turns equal to the number of Simple
Actions the character was subject to the flamethrower's attack. Thus, if a
character was fired on for four Simple Actions, he or she would continue
taking 6M damage every turn for four turns.

If used indoors, flamethrowers will quickly deplete the available oxygen,
especially in poorly-ventilated areas like bunkers. This makes them very
useful in fighting entrenched enemies (historical note: they were first
used in WWI for exactly that purpose, and the US troops in the Pacific
also used them a lot against Japanese bunkers). Game effects of this would
be up to the GM, though.

Then there is the chance of the fuel tanks blowing up when they get hit by
small arms fire. You're carrying big tanks of pressurized fuel on your
back -- you'd better not get shot :) I'd say it's a called shot to
specifically hit the fuel tanks, though any hit on the user has a 1 on 1D6
chance of hitting the tank (or 1-4 on 1D6 if from behind), which will
rupture it. Then roll five dice against a TN equal to the unmodified Power
Level of the round (twice that if the round is explosive or tracer); if no
successes are rolled, the fuel ignites and the user is subject to 6M
damage for a number of turns equal to the number of Simple Actions worth
of fuel left in the flamer. Still want to use one? :)

A very good source for flamethrowers is the Phoenix Command Special Weapon
Data Supplement, BTW.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
"Remember that all the items in the equipment lists are obviously
not available anywhere." --Gemini RPG, p. 100
-> NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
->The Plastic Warriors Page: http://shadowrun.html.com/plasticwarriors/<-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ UL P L+ E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 3
From: Airwasp@***.com Airwasp@***.com
Subject: Flame weapons in Shadowrun?
Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 10:13:37 EDT
In a message dated 10/20/99 8:29:27 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
zebulingod@*****.com writes:

> I was wondering if anyone had come up with flamethrower weapons for
shadowrun,
> and
> if so, where I could find such weapons of destruction?
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Zebulin

For a simple flamethrower, use the rules for the squirt pistols and rifles,
but use White Phosphorous as the material being shot ... hence the damage
would be 14M, less in water ...

-Mike
Message no. 4
From: Lee Decker deckerl@******.com
Subject: Flame weapons in Shadowrun?
Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 10:15:39 -0400
>
> > I was wondering if anyone had come up with flamethrower weapons for
> shadowrun,
> > and
> > if so, where I could find such weapons of destruction?
> >
> > Thanks in advance,
> >
> > Zebulin
>
> For a simple flamethrower, use the rules for the squirt
> pistols and rifles,
> but use White Phosphorous as the material being shot ...
> hence the damage
> would be 14M, less in water ...
>
YOuch...that is truly truly evil. My thought however would be that white
phosphrous wouldn't work that well in this application, although its been a
long time since I played with the stuff, and I've never tried to add it to a
squirt gun. I do know I would shoot any player who asked me if they could
create this. Nah..I'd let them create it, and have it melt when they used it
:)
Message no. 5
From: Gurth gurth@******.nl
Subject: Flame weapons in Shadowrun?
Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 20:57:01 +0200
According to Airwasp@***.com, at 10:13 on 21 Oct 99, the word on
the street was...

> For a simple flamethrower, use the rules for the squirt pistols and rifles,
> but use White Phosphorous as the material being shot ... hence the damage
> would be 14M, less in water ...

White phosphorus and flamethrower fuel are two totally different
substances... I don't think the WP rules from FoF would apply to
flamethrowers, unless you're talking about incendiary grenade launchers
that are sometimes called flamethrowers.

On a RL note for anyone wanting to try using WP in a flamethrower in SR,
WP has a melting point that's above the temperature at which it combusts
when in contact with oxygen. Better design a really good way of squirting
molten WP at your target :)

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
"Remember that all the items in the equipment lists are obviously
not available anywhere." --Gemini RPG, p. 100
-> NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
->The Plastic Warriors Page: http://shadowrun.html.com/plasticwarriors/<-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ UL P L+ E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 6
From: lomion lomion@*********.or
Subject: Flame weapons in Shadowrun?
Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 12:54:24 -0700
>
>On a RL note for anyone wanting to try using WP in a flamethrower in SR,
>WP has a melting point that's above the temperature at which it combusts
>when in contact with oxygen. Better design a really good way of squirting
>molten WP at your target :)

how about a narcojet pistol hehehe

--Larry
Message no. 7
From: Gurth gurth@******.nl
Subject: Flame weapons in Shadowrun?
Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 11:25:19 +0200
According to lomion, at 12:54 on 21 Oct 99, the word on the street was...

> >On a RL note for anyone wanting to try using WP in a flamethrower in SR,
> >WP has a melting point that's above the temperature at which it combusts
> >when in contact with oxygen. Better design a really good way of squirting
> >molten WP at your target :)
>
> how about a narcojet pistol hehehe

Nice try... You put solid WP into the narcoject dart, then heat it in the
weapon to melt it, right? All the while hoping that you didn't
accidentally get oxygen into the dart as well (though that could be
realitively easily avoided) After that you hope that the WP in the needle
hasn't solidified by the time it reaches the target, and also that there
is oxygen inside the target which will cause the WP to combust...

Wouldn't it be easier to just use standard narcoject and knock the target
out? :)

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
"Remember that all the items in the equipment lists are obviously
not available anywhere." --Gemini RPG, p. 100
-> NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
->The Plastic Warriors Page: http://shadowrun.html.com/plasticwarriors/<-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ UL P L+ E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 8
From: lomion lomion@*********.or
Subject: Flame weapons in Shadowrun?
Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 08:17:39 -0700
>
> >
> > how about a narcojet pistol hehehe
>
>Nice try... You put solid WP into the narcoject dart, then heat it in the
>weapon to melt it, right? All the while hoping that you didn't
>accidentally get oxygen into the dart as well (though that could be
>realitively easily avoided) After that you hope that the WP in the needle
>hasn't solidified by the time it reaches the target, and also that there
>is oxygen inside the target which will cause the WP to combust...

ok more seriously how about a 2 stage device, one that melts the WP and
exposes it right at detonation. Here is a side note..they used to use WP
for smoke grenades at first. This would be more of a bomb or rocket though
imho. It would also be very obvious and messy in it's effects. Also
where would you get the stuff?

>Wouldn't it be easier to just use standard narcoject and knock the target
>out? :)

sure..shoot down a guys dreams.... heh

--lomion
Message no. 9
From: Airwasp@***.com Airwasp@***.com
Subject: Flame weapons in Shadowrun?
Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 13:29:39 EDT
In a message dated 10/21/99 9:19:56 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
deckerl@******.com writes:

> > For a simple flamethrower, use the rules for the squirt
> > pistols and rifles,
> > but use White Phosphorous as the material being shot ...
> > hence the damage
> > would be 14M, less in water ...
> >
> YOuch...that is truly truly evil. My thought however would be that white
> phosphrous wouldn't work that well in this application, although its been a
> long time since I played with the stuff, and I've never tried to add it to
a
> squirt gun. I do know I would shoot any player who asked me if they could
> create this. Nah..I'd let them create it, and have it melt when they used
it
> :)

Instead of treating the squirt as a flamethrower, consider it more or a
flame-spitter ... sending a burning hocker at your opponent. :}

-Mike
Message no. 10
From: Gurth gurth@******.nl
Subject: Flame weapons in Shadowrun?
Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 19:40:02 +0200
According to lomion, at 8:17 on 22 Oct 99, the word on the street was...

> ok more seriously how about a 2 stage device, one that melts the WP and
> exposes it right at detonation.

OK, good idea, but I don't see the point. The WP will burn anyway, and if
you use an explosive charge it will get scattered, too.

> Here is a side note..they used to use WP for smoke grenades at first.
> This would be more of a bomb or rocket though imho. It would also be
> very obvious and messy in it's effects.

WP bombs and grenades use an explosive charge to scatter the phosphorus,
so it then burns on exposure to the outside air. (That's one reason why WP
grenades have to be checked for rust -- do your shadowrunners do that
regularly? *EGMG*) I just don't see the feasibility of melting WP before
use when it's very effective in solid form already. So effective, even,
that "civilized" countries have banned its use IRL.

> Also where would you get the stuff?

Places where it's been used in a past war? ;) (Seriously, people still
sometimes find WP on the beaches where I live, and it's almost exactly 55
years since there was any fighting here.)

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
"Remember that all the items in the equipment lists are obviously
not available anywhere." --Gemini RPG, p. 100
-> NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
->The Plastic Warriors Page: http://shadowrun.html.com/plasticwarriors/<-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ UL P L+ E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 11
From: lomion lomion@*********.or
Subject: Flame weapons in Shadowrun?
Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 11:24:59 -0700
>
>Instead of treating the squirt as a flamethrower, consider it more or a
>flame-spitter ... sending a burning hocker at your opponent. :}

this gives me visions of a can of hairspray and a lighter for some reason.

Here's an idea: how about a mist sprayer? It shoots out the mist and a
small ignition thing on the end makes it ignite.

--lomion
Message no. 12
From: Paul J. Adam Paul@********.demon.co.uk
Subject: Flame weapons in Shadowrun?
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 20:20:50 +0100
In article <19991021013036.26010.rocketmail@******.yahoomail.com>,
Zebulin Magby <zebulingod@*****.com> writes
>I was wondering if anyone had come up with flamethrower weapons for
>shadowrun, and
>if so, where I could find such weapons of destruction?

My own creation...


Ares Arms "Pyromaniac" flamethrower
Because you demanded it, the Pyromaniac flamethrower is here! A one-
piece weapon with no bulky backpack, using revolutionary thickened fuel
technology to maximise range and damage while minimising risk to the
carrier! Come on, baby, light my fire!

Conceal: NA Capacity: 30 (special) Modes: SA/"FA"
Damage: 10M/8L Weight 6 Cost: Y1,250
Street Index: 3 Avail: 8/14 days

Use Heavy Pistol ranges. The first damage rolls refer to the round in which
the target is hit: the second to the damage taken per round thereafter.
Ballistic armour has half effect, impact armour as normal. Hardened
armour offers no special protection. The sticky fuel burns for 1d6 turns
plus one for every success generated on a Firearms (Flamethrower) roll. It
does not scrape off easily, but can be extinguished by conventional means.

The weapon has no recoil penalty and may fire up to three shots in one
Complex Action. Multiple hits do multiple initial damage but do not
increase burning damage: they do increase duration by 1d6 turns per
additional hit.

>>>>>[Lacks stopping power and you can completely forget about stealth.
I mean, some of us are putting down controlled bursts from suppressed
SMGs and then WHOOSH! Not to mention whiting out everyone's low-light
and thermal. And for people who say their flare comps will handle it,
you're still blind: you just get your vision back sooner. Oh, and don't forget
you're carring a lit pilot light around even before you fire. Very
inconspicuous.]<<<<<
-Rip Roarer
>>>>>[I do see the utility in some applications: it's a great way to
destroy
hardware and eliminate evidence. But it certainly wouldn't be a generally
useful weapon. And its antipersonnel effect is dubious, while anyone you
use it on is going to be very, very upset if they catch you.]<<<<<
-Demon Paul
>>>>>[Very useful for mob control, though. Spray an arc on the ground
and a wall of fire tends to herd people back: and if you do get rushed you
can take the front ranks with you.]<<<<<
-Bender
>>>>>[Flamers for riot control? Who is this guy?]<<<<<
-Sasha


--
Paul J. Adam
Message no. 13
From: Gurth gurth@******.nl
Subject: Flame weapons in Shadowrun?
Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 11:10:53 +0200
According to lomion, at 11:24 on 22 Oct 99, the word on the street was...

> this gives me visions of a can of hairspray and a lighter for some reason.
>
> Here's an idea: how about a mist sprayer? It shoots out the mist and a
> small ignition thing on the end makes it ignite.

It looks to me like the result of that will be a highly spectacular, but
fairly useless weapon due to its extremely short range. Clouds of a liquid
won't spray very far, because you can't really put much pressure behind
them; a stream of the same liquid can be shot much further.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
"Remember that all the items in the equipment lists are obviously
not available anywhere." --Gemini RPG, p. 100
-> NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
->The Plastic Warriors Page: http://shadowrun.html.com/plasticwarriors/<-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ UL P L+ E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998

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