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Message no. 1
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Melina & Pete)
Subject: Greek Mythology - Initiation (a little long)
Date: Tue Nov 20 11:15:01 2001
>Hmmmm. Actually -- or, perhaps, unfortunately -- I am having a hard time
>linking metamagics to deity-figures for a hermetic. Hermetics, while
artists,
>are also scientists; unless the player wanted the character to (somehow)
turn
>to a shamanic (or better yet, idolist) spellcaster, the use of gods or
other
>mythological symbolism tends to clash with the hermetic concept.


Not necessarily. While it may seem otherwise, we today do not know a hell of
a lot about the ancient world. The quest for more knowledge in these areas
is what gives rise to the discipline of Archaeology. Just one hundred years
ago, the city of Troy was thought to be a myth till Heinrich Schliemann
found it (or rather, dug straight through the middle of it and destroyed
over three thousand years of artifacts). In any case, it *is* possible for a
hermetic to have a very scientific view of the classical world, the
professionals have since Schliemann's mistake. If he is actively trying to
uncover new aspects of the classical world, separating myth from reality (or
attempting to figure out how myth was born from interpretations of reality),
all for the purpose of advancing an understanding of magic, then that sounds
pretty hermetic to me.

As to how one would actually incorporate the Greek gods into a hermetic
tradition, that's not too hard either. Using coins for this purpose actually
makes some sense since they would both date to the period in question, and
be mythologically tied to some of the city-states and gods (each city state
was tied to a particular god: Athens = Athena, for example). If the mage
ties each coin to a particular aspect of magic (combat, detection, health,
illusion, and manipulation) to the appropriate Greek god, then he can have
one coin for each aspect come from a city devoted to that god. The coin can
then act as a spell category focus.

So, a few examples:
-an Athenian coin could be used for detection or combat as Athena was the
goddess of wisdom, and, to an almost equal degree, war.
-a coin from Epidouros would be for healing, it was the center of the cult
of Asclepius (the god of healing).
-a Spartan coin ... well that's just obvious.

This could go on ad infinitum. The Greeks colonized most of the ancient
Mediterranean, with every city and isolated temple devoted to a new god. I
don't know how much you know about ancient Greece, or even if you want to
use this suggestion, but if you want to know more feel free to email me
privately.

So the post was more than a little long, here ends my bout with verbal
diarrhea.

Pete
player, GM, and general SR addict;
who just happened to minor in Classical Studies (archaeology)
Message no. 2
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Bira)
Subject: Greek Mythology - Initiation (a little long)
Date: Tue Nov 20 19:40:01 2001
On Tue, 20 Nov 2001 11:16:59 -0500
"Melina & Pete" <myork2@******.ca> wrote:

>If he is actively trying to
> uncover new aspects of the classical world, separating myth from reality (or
> attempting to figure out how myth was born from interpretations of reality),
> all for the purpose of advancing an understanding of magic, then that sounds
> pretty hermetic to me.

It seems to me some brands of hermetics were always calling upon
some god or other to cast their spells, so it wouldn't be "wrong" to
have this character do that. The difference from hermetic magicians to
more shamanic "priests" is that what the mage does isn't really worship,
more like a series of small-time bargains or coercion of minor spirits.

Another approach to a mage following a Greek tradition is have
the character focus more on the phylosophy than on the religion. There's
a series of Ars Magica articles on Pyramid that detail mages following
Pythagoras, Plato and Aristotle, three of the greatest Greek
phylosophers. Most of their content (the only real exception is the
rules paragraph at the end of each article :) ) can be directly applied
to a SR mage.

--
Bira -- SysOp da Shadowland.BR
http://www.shadowland.com.br
Redator de Shadowrun da RPG em Revista
http://www.rpgemrevista.f2s.com
Message no. 3
From: shadowrn@*********.com (shadowrn@*********.com)
Subject: Greek Mythology - Initiation (a little long)
Date: Wed Nov 21 00:45:00 2001
ra002585@**.unicamp.br writes:
> Another approach to a mage following a Greek tradition is have
> the character focus more on the phylosophy than on the religion. There's
> a series of Ars Magica articles on Pyramid that detail mages following
> Pythagoras, Plato and Aristotle, three of the greatest Greek
> phylosophers. Most of their content (the only real exception is the
> rules paragraph at the end of each article :) ) can be directly applied
> to a SR mage.

This I would agree with, even encourage. *grins* Please remember, however,
that this isn't a spell-category focus we're talking about; he's using the
coins for his Initiation.

Hmmmm. Anchoring, Centering, and Shielding all have related foci; he could
turn the coins into that (or they could already be that, weak ones, for him
to bond.) Otherwise ... well, to be honest, you could make foci for a number
of the other metamagics. Cleansing? Divining? Invoking, most certainly.
Probably not Possessing, but Reflecting is a candidate as well.

Or perhaps use the coins as objects that can -guide- your PC into learning
the metamagics. Initiates can learn metamagics by Questing to 'a random
hermetic metaplane'. Perhaps each coin is etched with a complex (and
ancient) geometric/trigometric design, with the flip side of the coin
suggesting what metaplane the PC should Quest to in order to learn it.

YMMV.


The Wyrm Ouroboros
'Half Russian mathemetician,
half Silicon Valley code freak.'
Message no. 4
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Gak The Great)
Subject: Greek Mythology - Initiation (a little long)
Date: Fri Nov 23 13:55:00 2001
Sometime, somwhere down the timeline, Bira whispered:
> It seems to me some brands of hermetics were always calling upon
> some god or other to cast their spells, so it wouldn't be "wrong" to
> have this character do that. The difference from hermetic magicians to
> more shamanic "priests" is that what the mage does isn't really worship,
> more like a series of small-time bargains or coercion of minor spirits.

I always viewed it this way: Shamen have definite ties to their
Idol/God(dess), while Hermetics see magic as a science to explore, which can
also be given by a God, i.e. "<Insert Random Goddess>, give me the Power to
destroy my enemy with this fireball"(Shaman) or "Aha, if I do this and this,
I will be able, through the magical rules set up by <Isert Random God>, to
cast a fireball.

There are also some hermetic mages mentioned in Chrom&Dioxin, called
"Theurgen", who work for the Westphalia (Ruled by a Cardinal), so I see no
problem with connecting a hermetic to some god.

-- GAK THE GREAT

"Ein Ring, sie zu knechten, sie alle zu finden,
Ins Dunkel zu treiben und ewig zu binden,
Im Lande Mordor, wo die Schatten drohn."
Sauron aus "Herr der Ringe von J.R.R. Tolkien
Message no. 5
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Anders Swenson)
Subject: Greek Mythology - Initiation (a little long)
Date: Fri Nov 23 22:35:01 2001
> There are also some hermetic mages mentioned in Chrom&Dioxin, called
> "Theurgen", who work for the Westphalia (Ruled by a Cardinal), so I see no
> problem with connecting a hermetic to some god.
>
> -- GAK THE GREAT
>
Chrome and Dioxin?
--Anders
Message no. 6
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Burning Avatar)
Subject: Greek Mythology - Initiation (a little long)
Date: Sat Nov 24 05:05:01 2001
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On 24-Nov-01 Anders Swenson wrote:

> Chrome and Dioxin?

It's a german source book, which is probably only published in Germany

> --Anders

- - Burning Avatar

- ----------------------------------
Ona galad a naur i lumbulo

BA's data haven
http://home.t-online.de/home/tobias.d/srmain.htm

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Message no. 7
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Gurth)
Subject: Greek Mythology - Initiation (a little long)
Date: Sat Nov 24 07:40:04 2001
According to Anders Swenson, on Sat, 24 Nov 2001 the word on the street was...

> Chrome and Dioxin?

"Chrom & Dioxin" is the title of "Ein Shadowrun-Quellenbuch," as
it says on
the book's spine. IOW, it's one of the sourcebooks published by FanPro in
Germany. It describes northern Germany, Freestate Westphalia, the Greater
Frankfurt megaplex, Karlsruhe, Switzerland, and some new equipment.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Come down here and I'll show you the wrong way.
-> NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+@ UL P L++ E W-(++) N o? K w+(--) O V?
PS+ PE(-)(+) Y PGP- t@ 5++ X(+) R+++(-)>$ tv+ b++@ DI- D+ G+ e h! !r y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998

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