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Message no. 1
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Number Ten)
Subject: Help needed w/new campaign, rules questions.
Date: Sat Dec 8 13:30:01 2001
Hiya, folks.

After about a year's hiatus I have decided to again take up the gauntlet of
Shadowrun GMing. The last campaign I ran was a Ye Olde Standard
Seattle-based shadowrunner team. This time, I am trying something a trifle
different.

The basic idea is a "We Are the Law" campaign from the Companion. The
players are all a part of a small team of Lone Star rookies, being assigned
to various departments as a "pilot program" to give them maximum exposure
before permanent assignment. The game takes place in New Orleans, with it
being posited that Lone Star won the law-enforcement contract away from
NOPS sometime in '57-'58, unlike what "Smuggler Havens" states.

So, the first question is -- has anyone ever done anything of the sort,
either a law-enforcement campaign or a New Orleans campaign or both? How
did it work out? If it didn't, why? What valuable experience can you share
with me?

I also have several less-generic rules questions.

1) The Lone Star book says that street patrolmen make from 20,000 to 48,000
nuyen a year. This rather neatly explains why a lot of cops are on the
take, since even the highest quoted salary is not enough for a middle-class
lifestyle. The Companion, however, directly contradicts that by suggesting
that cops are paid enough to maintain a middle-class lifestyle. So, what I
was figuring was to start my players at a salary of Y5,000 a month plus a
little bit. Keeping in mind that this "little bit" will have to serve them
for -everything-: repair costs, new equipment, medical bills, etc., I can't
quite make up my mind how much it should be. I want my players to feel the
strain of tight finances, but I don't want to make it so tight that their
characters -have- to go on the take right away, or so tight that the
players lose interest in the game. (I have specifically barred decker and
rigger characters, for that reason among others, so the financial strain is
not -quite- as big of a deal, but it is still a concern.)

Would anyone care to make suggestions?

(In my last campaign, I did not pay quite this much attention to the
monetary value of the rewards, and got my come-uppance when the group's NPC
rigger got her helicopter blown out from under her... and the group came up
with the cash to replace it without feeling the strain. Was a rude
awakening, to say the least.)

2) One of the archetypes in the 2nd-edition Lone Star book is a DPI astral
backup mage. Given the changes between 2nd and 3rd edition magic, am I
correct in assuming that staying behind and astrally attacking incoming
spells is no longer an option? In fact, the closest modus operandi I've
been able to come up with for a "backup mage" is to stay out of sight and
allocate spell defense dice. Does anyone have a better idea, or am I
basically right?

Thanks in advance,
--Number 10.

====number_10_ox@**********.com IM Nick: number10ox

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Message no. 2
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Iridios)
Subject: Help needed w/new campaign, rules questions.
Date: Sat Dec 8 17:55:01 2001
Number Ten wrote:

> I also have several less-generic rules questions.
>
> 1) The Lone Star book says that street patrolmen make from 20,000 to 48,000
> nuyen a year. This rather neatly explains why a lot of cops are on the
> take, since even the highest quoted salary is not enough for a middle-class
> lifestyle. The Companion, however, directly contradicts that by suggesting
> that cops are paid enough to maintain a middle-class lifestyle. So, what I
> was figuring was to start my players at a salary of Y5,000 a month plus a
> little bit. Keeping in mind that this "little bit" will have to serve them
> for -everything-: repair costs, new equipment, medical bills, etc., I can't
> quite make up my mind how much it should be. I want my players to feel the
> strain of tight finances, but I don't want to make it so tight that their
> characters -have- to go on the take right away, or so tight that the
> players lose interest in the game. (I have specifically barred decker and
> rigger characters, for that reason among others, so the financial strain is
> not -quite- as big of a deal, but it is still a concern.)

I would pay about 10% above the ¥5,000 middle lifestyle amount. Each
trooper would have an issued armor (vest or jacket), an issued sidearm
(Predator or the like), and Health Insurance (no self respecting person
would take a job as a cop without decent health insurance offering).
The health insurance would take care of any duty related injuries at
probably 100% and non duty injuries (non criminal as well) at probably
75% coverage. Also cops may have other less tangible benefits, such as
being preferred tenants in apartments, discounts and freebies at some
shops, and etc. Lifestyle payments would cover any necessary living
expenses within the lifestyle. If a cop want's to go out to Chez
Expensive Resturante he's going to be paying extra. ¥500 savings a
month will give them just enough to start saving and maybe spend a
little bit. If a character wants any non-issue equipment they have to
pay out of pocket, especially if they're buying illegal equipment or
throwaway guns.


--
Iridios
--
From:The Top 100 Things I'd Do
If I Ever Became An Evil Overlord
(http://www.eviloverlord.com/lists/overlord.html)

If the hero runs up to my roof, I will not run up after him and
struggle with him in an attempt to push him over the edge. I
will also not engage him at the edge of a cliff. (In the middle
of a rope-bridge over a river of molten lava is not even worth
considering.)

Used Without Permission
Message no. 3
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Damion Milliken)
Subject: Help needed w/new campaign, rules questions.
Date: Mon Dec 10 06:45:01 2001
Number Ten writes:

> 2) One of the archetypes in the 2nd-edition Lone Star book is a DPI astral
> backup mage. Given the changes between 2nd and 3rd edition magic, am I
> correct in assuming that staying behind and astrally attacking incoming
> spells is no longer an option? In fact, the closest modus operandi I've
> been able to come up with for a "backup mage" is to stay out of sight and
> allocate spell defense dice. Does anyone have a better idea, or am I
> basically right?

You're right, attacking incoming spells is not possible in SR3 :-(. I recall
that in order to provide Spell Defence, the provider needs to be on the same
plane (ie astral or physical) as the targets receiving the Spell Defence.
Thus a DPI astral magician is pretty useless at providing Spell Defence for
the average mundane beat cop. A physically present magician could still
provide Spell Defence though. A potential use for an astral response
magician could be to take a couple of spirits (elementals would be best)
along to manifest and help out the mundanes.

--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong
Unofficial Shadowrun Guru E-mail: dam01@***.edu.au
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Message no. 4
From: shadowrn@*********.com (BD)
Subject: Help needed w/new campaign, rules questions.
Date: Mon Dec 17 01:00:01 2001
Hope it's not too late to reply to this... I had some mailer issues. I
forget who wrote it, but here's my two bits.

> 1) The Lone Star book says that street patrolmen make from 20,000 to
48,000 nuyen a year. This rather neatly explains why a lot of cops are on
the take, since even the highest quoted salary is not enough for a
middle-class lifestyle. The Companion, however, directly contradicts that
by suggesting that cops are paid enough to maintain a middle-class
lifestyle. So, what I was figuring was to start my players at a salary of
Y5,000 a month plus a little bit.
>

60,000Y/yr seems to me to be a lot for a cop, especially for a bunch of
rookies. You might want to look into Gurth's Lifestyle House Rules (they
were mine, but Gurth made them much better). That allows a character to
tailor what they want to spend money on in terms of the different things
that Lifestyles cover. Doing that would help you reevaluate what a Middle
Lifestyle would be: maybe a by-the-book Middle is too extravagant for these
guys.

Also, are they married? Living with anyone? That would mean they have
two incomes... 2,750Y per month for each person would mean a total of
5,500Y, or a Middle Lifestyle plus one person. That's only 33,000Y per
person. It's still high for rookies, but whatever.

> Keeping in mind that this "little bit" will have to serve them for
-everything-: repair costs, new equipment, medical bills, etc., I can't
quite make up my mind how much it should be. I want my players to feel the
strain of tight finances, but I don't want to make it so tight that their
characters -have- to go on the take right away, or so tight that the
players lose interest in the game. (I have specifically barred decker and
rigger characters, for that reason among others, so the financial strain is
not -quite- as big of a deal, but it is still a concern.)
>

Deckers and riggers would be specialized anyway and therefore in
different squads... I gather you'd want to keep these guys all together
most of the time.

> 2) One of the archetypes in the 2nd-edition Lone Star book is a DPI
astral backup mage. Given the changes between 2nd and 3rd edition magic, am
I correct in assuming that staying behind and astrally attacking incoming
spells is no longer an option? In fact, the closest modus operandi I've
been able to come up with for a "backup mage" is to stay out of sight and
allocate spell defense dice. Does anyone have a better idea, or am I
basically right?
>

Sounds all right to me. Something you could do to be a bastard is (if
you have a PC mage) give them a higher salary... obviously LS would want to
provide incentives to get and keep magicians and they'd want to keep them
honest... so it's reasonable. And just wait until the other PCs find out. >:)

====-Boondocker

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Message no. 5
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Gurth)
Subject: Help needed w/new campaign, rules questions.
Date: Mon Dec 17 06:20:00 2001
According to BD, on Mon, 17 Dec 2001 the word on the street was...

> 60,000Y/yr seems to me to be a lot for a cop, especially for a bunch of
> rookies. You might want to look into Gurth's Lifestyle House Rules (they
> were mine, but Gurth made them much better).

I thought you were going to give me feedback on that...?

Anyway, another source you may want to check for PC police stuff is NERPS:
Underworld, which has a handy table with suggested police salaries (based
on those of the LAPD of about five years ago).

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
"I know you're expecting me to take that as good news," Randy says.
-> NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+@ UL P L++ E W-(++) N o? K w+(--) O V?
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Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 6
From: shadowrn@*********.com (BD)
Subject: Help needed w/new campaign, rules questions.
Date: Sat Dec 22 01:00:01 2001
>> 60,000Y/yr seems to me to be a lot for a cop, especially for a bunch of
rookies. You might want to look into Gurth's Lifestyle House Rules (they
were mine, but Gurth made them much better).
>>

> I thought you were going to give me feedback on that...?

D'oh! I'm sorry about that, Gurth. Totally forgot. Actually, the game
I was running aborted due to me being a lousy GM, so we didn't get to test
it...

I've only heard feedback from two other players, Rand (Doc) and an
off-list guy, Jim. Both of them seemed to like it, and I certainly like
the cost options better than the point thing I made up.

I'm not really sure you need so many categories, but I think it works
just fine with the current number.

All in all, I really like it. It's not the sort of thing that's going to
Change The Way We Game ;), but it's a definite good house rule.

(I just want some credit for giving you the basis for the idea if you end
up making millions, okay? :) )

====-Boondocker

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Message no. 7
From: shadowrn@*********.com (BD)
Subject: Help needed w/new campaign, rules questions.
Date: Sat Dec 22 11:55:01 2001
Dude, this was SO supposed to be a private post... I always remember to
copy the address, but pasting seems to escape me.

Oh well, at least I didn't mention my Satan-worshipping ways. Wouldn't
want that sort of thing to get out, eh?


> D'oh! I'm sorry about that, Gurth. Totally forgot. Actually, the game
I was running aborted due to me being a lousy GM, so we didn't get to test
it...
>
> I've only heard feedback from two other players, Rand (Doc) and an
off-list guy, Jim. Both of them seemed to like it, and I certainly like
the cost options better than the point thing I made up.
>

> I'm not really sure you need so many categories, but I think it works
just fine with the current number.
>
> All in all, I really like it. It's not the sort of thing that's going to
Change The Way We Game ;), but it's a definite good house rule.
>
> (I just want some credit for giving you the basis for the idea if you end
up making millions, okay? :) )
>



====-Boondocker

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Message no. 8
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Gurth)
Subject: Help needed w/new campaign, rules questions.
Date: Sat Dec 22 12:40:06 2001
According to BD, on Sat, 22 Dec 2001 the word on the street was...

> Dude, this was SO supposed to be a private post... I always remember to
> copy the address, but pasting seems to escape me.

First hit Reply, _then_ copy & paste the address :) Anyway, my reply did go
only to you.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
"I know you're expecting me to take that as good news," Randy says.
-> NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+@ UL P L++ E W-(++) N o? K w+(--) O V?
PS+ PE(-)(+) Y PGP- t@ 5++ X(+) R+++(-)>$ tv+ b++@ DI- D+ G+ e h! !r y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998

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