Back to the main page

Mailing List Logs for ShadowRN

Message no. 1
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: House rules
Date: Sat, 8 Nov 1997 11:43:56 +0100
When trying to write up my own house rules for easy reference, I thought
a handy thing to have would be a kind of big book of Shadowrun house
rules, sorted by category (combat, magic, skills, etc.) and put it on a
web page, so that anyone who wants it can download it and see what rules
other people use for certain situations.

I'll be looking through my saved ShadowRN mails for other peoples' house
rules that were posted on the list in the past, and I'd also like to ask
anyone who wants to contribute to write up their house rules and send them
to me (via private email, preferably) so that I can include them.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Would it make you feel much better, if it was you against the world?
-> NERPS Project Leader & Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version 3.1:
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE
Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
Message no. 2
From: Mike Loseke <mike@******.VERINET.COM>
Subject: Re: House rules
Date: Sat, 8 Nov 1997 07:51:13 -0700
Quoth Gurth:
>
> When trying to write up my own house rules for easy reference, I thought
> a handy thing to have would be a kind of big book of Shadowrun house
> rules, sorted by category (combat, magic, skills, etc.) and put it on a
> web page, so that anyone who wants it can download it and see what rules
> other people use for certain situations.
>
> I'll be looking through my saved ShadowRN mails for other peoples' house
> rules that were posted on the list in the past, and I'd also like to ask
> anyone who wants to contribute to write up their house rules and send them
> to me (via private email, preferably) so that I can include them.

Doh! You beat me to it! That's cool, I'll let you do all the hard
stuff. :) I'll be sure to send you some. I'm actually working on one
for bioware and mages that kind of makes sense.

--
Mike Loseke | I'd rather be naked with plenty of food.
mike@*******.com | Yes, totally stuffed and totally nude.
www.verinet.com/~mike | And eating beside me, as bare as can be;
SWO: www.swo.com | None other than Pamela Anderson Lee.
NCLUG: www.nclug.org | -- Steve Madden, posted to a.h.b-o-u
Message no. 3
From: j.jacobsma@************.com j.jacobsma@************.com
Subject: House rules
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 13:59:34 -0400 (EDT)
From deckerl@******.com Fri, 29 Oct 1999 14:05:44 -0400
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 14:05:44 -0400
From: Lee Decker deckerl@******.com
Subject: House rules

> I recently got into a fairly heated discussion with my
> players on the subject of house rules. It turns out that all
> the little rules that I've accreted onto the system over the
> years in an attempt to improve/personalize it are, well,
> unwanted. My players have been putting up with them merely
> because they thought they had to, since I'm the game master.
> (Now how did they get that idea, I wonder?)
>
> Now, I know other groups have house rules. How did you get
> your players to like them, if they do? If they don't, how did
> you get them to put up with them? Or are you like me, living
> in a dream world, thinking your players are fine with your
> additions, when they are, in fact, just keeping quiet and
> avoiding confrontation. How does your group handle the whole
> concept of house rules?
>
> I'm seriously considering going to a "plain vanilla" approach
> to the rules --
Message no. 4
From: Lee Decker deckerl@******.com
Subject: House rules
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 14:05:44 -0400
I have a 1 page sheet (it has occasionally been 2 pages) of house rules I
give to new players. If they have arguments, great. If they can convince me
(and some have) that the rule doesn't add anything to the game, I remove it.
I haven't had too many complaints.
And if they don't like it, and can't convince me or a signifigant # of other
players to drop the rules, I ask them if they want to GM. My game, my world.
If they don't like me Gming, I'll gladly let somebody else take over, I
enjoy being a player as well. :)




From barbie@********.de Fri, 29 Oct 1999 20:16:44 +0100
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 20:16:44 +0100
From: Barbie LeVile barbie@********.de
Subject: House rules

On 29-Oct-99, j.jacobsma@************.com wrote:

snip house rule question

I use only house rules.

--
Barbie

"One World, One Web, One Program" - Microsoft Promotional Ad
"Ein Volk, Ein Reich, Ein Führer" - Adolf Hitler

barbie@********.de http://www.amigaworld.com/barbie/index.html

SRGC 0.22: SR1 SR2+++ SR3--- h++++ b++ b--- UB++ IE- RN+ SR_D+++ W++
dk sh++++ ri++++ sa+++ ad+++ m+++(x+++) gm++ m+++ P+++(P*)





From abortion_engine@*******.com Fri, 29 Oct 1999 14:19:56 -0400
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 14:19:56 -0400
From: abortion_engine abortion_engine@*******.com
Subject: House rules

> I recently got into a fairly heated discussion with my players on the
subject of house rules. It turns out that all the little rules that I've
accreted onto the system over the years in an attempt to improve/personalize
it are, well, unwanted. My players have been p
Message no. 5
From: Barbie LeVile barbie@********.de
Subject: House rules
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 20:16:44 +0100
ERROR: This message seems to be empty. It is located at Week-of-Mon-19991025.txt::521636,564.
Message no. 6
From: abortion_engine abortion_engine@*******.com
Subject: House rules
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 14:19:56 -0400
Well, I just got in this fight with my GM, so I'm a little biased. But
here's what I have to say:

Don't forget, as a gamemaster, that if your players don't like your game,
they'll stop playing with you. This will mean you're no longer a GM; you're
just a geek with a lot of books.

As a GM, I try to limit house rules, and write down all of the house rules
that I do have; it's not fair if people don't know what the rules are until
after they use them.

This is supposed to be fun, I'm told. [I wouldn't know; that's not why we
roleplay here.] So if your players aren't having fun, you've screwed up.
It's like going to the movies; the director's job is to entertain people,
not *just* create a film. If he doesn't entertain people, if they're not
having fun, he loses.




From barbie@********.de Fri, 29 Oct 1999 20:20:14 +0100
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 20:20:14 +0100
From: Barbie LeVile barbie@********.de
Subject: Initiative in SR3 [comments and rule conversion]

On 29-Oct-99, Ereskanti@***.com wrote:

> If the rules are *accurate* or *realistic*, then they cannot be
> "samurai-friendly" at the same time. You leave out to many gaps in
> "reality" when you do that.
>
This is simply not true.

--
Barbie

"One World, One Web, One Program" - Microsoft Promotional Ad
"Ein Volk, Ein Reich, Ein Führer" - Adolf Hitler

barbie@********.de http://www.amigaworld.com/barbie/index.html

SRGC 0.22: SR1 SR2+++ SR3--- h++++ b++ b--- UB++ IE- RN+ SR_D+++ W++
dk sh++++ ri++++ sa+++ ad+++ m+++(x+++) gm++ m+++ P+++(P*)





From rtomasso@*******.com Fri, 29 Oct 1999 14:24:57 -0400 (EDT)
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 14:24:57 -0400 (EDT)
From: Richard Tomasso rtomasso@*******.com
Subject: IT got me thinking

GRANITE wrote:
> How secure would an old tech storage device be in the world of SR??
> I mean
Message no. 7
From: dbuehrer@****.org dbuehrer@****.org
Subject: House rules
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 12:46:43 -0600
If they like what they see, we try it out. If it works and the majority
like it, we keep it. Sometimes it doesn't work and it gets scrapped.

I've never tried to force my players to like a house rule. That'd be like
forcing someone who doesn't like fish to eat fish. They'd resent the hell
out of it and wouldn't come over to dinner again.

As a general philosophy I try to keep house rules simple, and to a minimum.
If the current rules work, I try not to mess with them.

http://home.att.net/~graht/Shadowrun/SR_House_Rules_Game_Play.htm

As a player I'll put up with just about any number of house rules as long
as it doesn't compromize the actual roleplaying. But that's me :)

However, if there are a lot of house rules I let the GM worry about keeping
track of them. I don't enjoy having to read the rules, then read a lot of
house rules, and then keep everything seperate in my head. For example, in
a current GURPS game I'm in the combat rules have been almost entirely
replaced (the majority of the group wanted cinematic combat rules with
*lots* of options). In combat I tell the GM what my character wants to do
and he tells me which skill to use and which dice to roll. I tell him the
dice result and he tells me what happened. Everyone is happy.

\ I'm seriously considering going to a "plain vanilla" approach to the rules
\ -- I'll only add stuff that's missing, everything else is by the book.

I suggest sitting down with the players and ask them if they like any of
your house rules. If so, keep those. Try to work with the players to
reach a compromise. If you respect their wants and needs, they will
respect your wants and needs, and you will find someplace to meet in the
middle.

\ Or are you like me, living in a dream world, thinking your players are
\ fine with your additions, when they are, in fact, just keeping quiet and
\ avoiding confrontation.

Ask your players to speak up sooner the next time they don't like
something. By staying quiet they're contributing negatively to the game.
Everyone is responsible for the game.

-Graht
--
"Earn what you have been given."




From phantom023@*******.com Fri, 29 Oct 1999 18:55:40 GMT
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 18:55:40 GMT
From: The Phantom phantom023@*******.com
Subject: IT got me thinking



>From: "GRANITE" <granite@**.net>
>Reply-To: shadowrn@*********.org
>To: shadowrn@*********.org
>Subject: IT got me thinking
>Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 04:06:25 -0700
>
>You'll never guess what I'm listening to..
>A record player...I picked up a very nice steroe at the local
>Salvation Army for $5..IT would have cost at least a hundred times
>that new..But I digress..
> Now you ask..What the heck is he on and why
>do I care.. My thought is this..
>How secure would an old tech storage device be in the world of SR??
>I mean if the formula for time travel is recorded on an edison tube
>today how likely would it be that anyone on this list would be able
>to decode it??
>[An edison tube is very much the same thing as an old stye record
>except about the same shape and size as a toilet paper center tube]
>So how do you think this sort of thing would apply in SR..say with
>the info recorded ont
Message no. 8
From: Marc Renouf renouf@********.com
Subject: House rules
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 15:07:17 -0400 (EDT)
Marc Renouf (ShadowRN GridSec - "Bad Cop" Division)

Other ShadowRN-related addresses and links:
Mark Imbriaco <mark@*********.html.com> List Owner
Adam Jury <adamj@*********.html.com> Assistant List Administrator
DVixen <dvixen@****.com> Keeper of the FAQs
Gurth <gurth@******.nl> GridSec Enforcer Division
David Buehrer <graht@********.att.net> GridSec "Nice Guy" Division
ShadowRN FAQ <http://shadowrun.html.com/hlair/faqindex.php3>;







From Sven.DeHerdt@***********.be Fri, 29 Oct 1999 21:45:27 +0200
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 21:45:27 +0200
From: Sven De Herdt Sven.DeHerdt@***********.be
Subject: House rules

j.jacobsma@************.com wrote:
>
<snip>
>
>Now, I know other groups have house rules. How did you get
>your players to like them, if they do? If they don't, how did
>you get them to put up with them? Or are you like me, living
>in a dream world, thinking your players are fine with your
>additions, when they are, in fact, just keeping quiet and
>avoiding confrontation. How does your group handle the whole
>concept of house rules?

I must admit that I don't use any "real" house rules yet, since I didn't
have time to fully document them yet.
What we do use are some slight changes, but I only introduced them after
discussing them with the players.

I plan to do the same with house rules. I'll create them, document them and
then ask the players if they could live with these rules.
If not, and if there are profound arguement, then I will consider changing
them before
Message no. 9
From: Sven De Herdt Sven.DeHerdt@***********.be
Subject: House rules
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 21:45:27 +0200
>I'm seriously considering going to a "plain vanilla" approach
>to the rules -- I'll only add stuff that's missing, everything
>else is by the book.
>

--
Sven :)




From Wildfire@*************.com Fri, 29 Oct 1999 15:49:01 -0400
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 15:49:01 -0400
From: Wildfire Wildfire@*************.com
Subject: IT got me thinking


The Phantom wrote:

>
> I can see it now Granite:
> "Runners, you're mission, if you choose to accept it, is to recoveran
> 8-track tape from the safe on the thirteenth floor of the Reraku Arcology."
> "Ummm, Mr Johnson?"
> "Yes, Widow? You have a question?"
> "Yeah. What's an 8-track?"
>

Even better:
"Yes, you have a question?"
"Don't ya mean 8 _rolls_ of tape? What kind is it? Scotch, Duct, Packing?"

WIldfire





From fanguad@****.rit.edu Fri, 29 Oct 1999 15:50:12 -0400
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 15:50:12 -0400
From: Fanguad fanguad@****.rit.edu
Subject: House rules

> <snip bit about house rules>

One of the things that I used as a house rule was a more
effective/meaner 'Rule of One'. Based off WW's botches, every two
1's that were rolled canceled one success.
The main problem I had with it was that sometimes it was 'too'
effective, especially with really high TN#s. So
Message no. 10
From: Fanguad fanguad@****.rit.edu
Subject: House rules
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 15:50:12 -0400
Liberal SR3 interpretation:
Stealth covers Disguise
Negotiation covers acting (hey, Fast Talking seems a lot like Acting)

Better (IMnsHO) SR3 interpretation:
Acting (Charisma linked) is its own Active skill.
Disguise is a knowledge skill.

--
D. Ghost
Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.
Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.
-Groucho Marx

___________________________________________________________________
Get the Internet just the way you want it.
Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month!
Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj.




From dghost@***
Message no. 11
From: abortion_engine abortion_engine@*******.com
Subject: House rules
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 16:17:21 -0400
Good luck :)

This subject comes up periodically, and I have yet to see anyone come up
with a good alternative (or if someone did, I missed it). The good
solutions tend to add to much complexity.

When you look at it realistically, the chance of a complete botch is really
pretty rare even for someone who is realatively unskilled, and even rarer
for a skilled person.

The only thing I don't allow is the use of Karma to foil a botch. Also,
Message no. 12
From: Cybertroll cybertroll@******.crosswinds.net
Subject: House rules
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 02:22:53 +0300
Cybertroll


--
E-Mail : cybertroll@********.gr / cybertroll@********.org
ICQ# : 7483400 but u have to beg to get my authorization!! :-)))
Homepage: http://www.crosswinds.net/~cybertroll - WOA Photo Album
-----------C--Y--B--E--R--T--R--O--L--L----------------------------
Do u really want to talk to me?? Come to #tavern in Othernet!
>=======<The official Blind Guardian IRC channel>===========<
U'll find the servers in http://www.othernet.org and in
http://tavern.home.pages.de/ (#tavern's homepage made by Soth)




From remo@***.net Fri, 29 Oct 1999 18:24:17 -0500
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 18:24:17 -0500
From: Patrick Goodman remo@***.net
Subject: House rules

> snip house rule question
>
> I use only house rules.

Okay, Barbie...then why do you claim to play Shadowrun? By your own
admission here, you don't.

--
(>) Texas 2-Step
El Paso: Never surrender. Never forget. Never forgive.






From remo@***.net Fri, 29 Oct 1999 18:24:21 -0500
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 18:24:21 -0500
From: Patrick Goodman remo@***.net
Subject: Why we play (was RE: House rules)

> This is supposed to be fun, I'm told. [I wouldn't know; that's not why
> we roleplay here.]

Then why the hell do you play?

--
(>) Texas 2-Step
El Paso: Never surrender. Never forget. Never forgive.






From remo@***.net Fri, 29 Oct 1999 18:24:25 -0500
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 18:24:25 -0500
From: Patrick Goodman remo@***.net
Subject: House rules

> One of the things that I used as a house rule was a more
> effective/meaner 'Rule of One'. Based off WW's botches, every
> two 1's that were r
Message no. 13
From: Patrick Goodman remo@***.net
Subject: House rules
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 18:24:17 -0500
--
(>) Texas 2-Step
El Paso: Never surrender. Never forget. Never forgive.






From mlfrankl@***.com Fri, 29 Oct 1999 19:40:21 -0400
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 19:40:21 -0400
From: Mike & Linda Frankl mlfrankl@***.com
Subje
Message no. 14
From: Patrick Goodman remo@***.net
Subject: House rules
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 18:24:25 -0500
Here, here <sound of clapping>

I run my game as vanilla as I can, that way we are all playing from the same
angle. I do have a limited list of house rules (12 items) and every player
is given one before they play for the first time. These have little or no
actual rule modifications, but are rather things that create a more player
friendly environment. My most important is "
Message no. 15
From: Mike & Linda Frankl mlfrankl@***.com
Subject: House rules
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 19:40:21 -0400
;)

Smilin' Jack






From arcaist@*****.de Sat, 30 Oct 1999 01:42:05 +0200
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 01:42:05 +0200
From: Arcaist arcaist@*****.de
Subject: "God" Characters (Was: Munch is alive and well)

> setting, but it IS in a cyberpunk atmosphere), a core element (IMO)
> is that no one is untouchable and everyone is replaceable. It may

No real problem with that...

> hell to knock off a given person; nearly impossible, but it is still
> possible. If it happens, there will be far reaching repercussions,
> the stiff will be replaced, and the machine will move on.

IMO, it should only be possible to eliminate such a "god-like"
person/creature through other means than rolling your 15 dice against
his 100. If a group or player devises a plan so powerful and cunning
that it *could* kill the "God-NPC", then the GM should just rule if it
works or not. I find even the idea of a group fighting with dice rolls
against an NPC with the above stats ridiculous...

> make no impact on the world at large. There is no hope. Thus is
> your life in a cyberpunk world.

In my world, hope
Message no. 16
From: Chris Maxfield cmaxfiel@****.org.au
Subject: House rules
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 14:23:56 +1000
Chris







From dghost@****.com Sat, 30 Oct 1999 00:21:47 -0700
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 00:21:47 -0700
From: dghost@****.com dghost@****.com
Subject: Magical Thesis

On Fri, 29 Oct 1999 23:49:16 -0400 "Angelkiller 404"
<angelkiller404@**********.com> writes:
On Fri, 29 Oct 1999 23:49:16 -0400 "Angelkiller 404"
<angelkiller404@**********.com> writes:
<SNIP>
> Here's what
> my various adepts have done as their thesei (what IS the plural of
> thesis anyway? AE, you're the writer: do you know this one?):
>
<SNIP>
> A movie (#2 in the non-sim box office smash entitled "Revenge of the
> Shaolin Trolls against Teenage Ninja Elves") The adept was director,
> writer, and choreographer.
> A one-shot comic book entitled "How to Kill" (Twisted Way Adept. ^_-)

MitS does not indicate that any special method is required for making
copies of a thesis. Therefore, every copy of this movie is a ritual link
back to your adept. The same goes for the comic book. :P~

--
D. Ghost
Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.
Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.
-Groucho Ma
Message no. 17
From: Lars Ericson lericson@****.edu
Subject: House rules
Date: Sun, 31 Oct 1999 08:24:37 -0600
I know that feeling all too well. 2 points of concealed armor and a small,
concealed, pop up turret. I figured that if my Van was going to be in a
fight, it would likely be against vehicles (my GM let me have a Vindicator
Minigun).
Lets just say that after a few runs, he may have regretted it (third run I
helped my fellow runners out by driving up behind the Lone Star barricade,
and let loose on the three cars and 10 guys. Much shrapnel and carnage
ensued).
But only one concealed _firmpoint_. Did you not have the CF for a
hardpoint, or you wanted something _really_ concealable?

Grim Shear
"Dammit man, I thought I told you to throw the _Grenade_
not the pin." Spoken soon after telling a
Message no. 18
From: Barbie Levile barbie@********.de
Subject: House rules
Date: Sun, 31 Oct 1999 21:18:11 +0100
Patrick Goodman wrote:
>
> > snip house rule question
> >
> > I use only house rules.
>
> Okay, Barbie...then why do you claim to play Shadowrun? By your own
> admission here, you don't.
>
The world IS Shadowrun, not the rules.

Barbie
Message no. 19
From: Tamino tamino@**********.wow.aust.com
Subject: House rules
Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 23:54:21 +1000
At 09:18 PM 31/10/99 +0100, you wrote:
>Patrick Goodman wrote:
>>
>> > snip house rule question
>> >
>> > I use only house rules.
>>
>> Okay, Barbie...then why do you claim to play Shadowrun? By your own
>> admission here, you don't.
>>
>The world IS Shadowrun, not the rules.
>
>Barbie

That is the best answer I've heard in a long time...
Kudos to you Barb :)

*claps his appreciation*




-Tamino ...All too easy

"ISTI MIRANT STELLA" - Bayeux Tapestry
tamino@**********.wow.aust.com
Message no. 20
From: Patrick Goodman remo@***.net
Subject: House rules
Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 11:57:48 -0600
>>> > snip house rule question
>>> >
>>> > I use only house rules.
>>>
>>> Okay, Barbie...then why do you claim to play Shadowrun? By your
>>> own admission here, you don't.
>>
>>The world IS Shadowrun, not the rules.

Never saw the original of this; thanks for the quote, Tamino.

> That is the best answer I've heard in a long time...
> Kudos to you Barb :)
>
> *claps his appreciation*

Clap all you want; it just means that I'm going to disagree with you, too.
My contention is that the game rules/game mechanics and the game world are
part and parcel of each other. You could use a different rules system with
the same world, but then (IMnsHO) you aren't playing the same game. You're
just playing a different game with the same setting, which isn't the same
thing at all.

While I have no problem with house rules (I have a couple myself that get
regular use), the fact is that in order for us to be playing the same game,
we have to be using at least the same core rules. The Shadowrun setting
using GURPS rules isn't Shadowrun, anymore than the 7th Sea setting using
Shadwrun rules is 7th Sea. If all you're using is house rules, you're not
playing Shadowrun anymore. You're playing Barbie-RPG using the setting for
Shadowrun.

Patrick
Message no. 21
From: JonSzeto@***.com JonSzeto@***.com
Subject: House rules
Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 22:31:28 EST
<Barbie LeVile <barbie@********.de> wrote>

>>> > snip house rule question
>>> >
>>> > I use only house rules.
>>>
>>> Okay, Barbie...then why do you claim to play Shadowrun? By your
>>> own admission here, you don't.
>>
>>The world IS Shadowrun, not the rules.

<Tamino <tamino@**********.wow.aust.com> wrote>

> > That is the best answer I've heard in a long time...
> > Kudos to you Barb :)
> >
> > *claps his appreciation*

<Patrick Goodman <remo@***.net> wrote>

> Clap all you want; it just means that I'm going to disagree with you, too.

I have to side Patrick, but I also have to agree that what Barbie
originally said was true, to a degree: the rules have no real effect on the
uberplot of the game world and vice versa. It's still the Sixth World,
whether you use FASA's game rules, house rules, GURPS, Hero System, Fuzion,
FUDGE, or whatever.

However, the game rules themselves DO have an effect on the game STYLE that
you play. Each type of game lends itself to a certain style, and some rules
do a better job of highlighting one particular area (be it magic, martial
arts, gun play, vehicle combat, or whatever.)

The classical example that many verteran gamers point to is the contrast
between GURPS and Hero System. I won't go into particular detail, mostly
because I don't want to start the flame war on THIS mailing list. While
both are supposed to be universal game systems, GURPS has generally been
regarded as a far more detail-oriented system. This makes GURPS more
suitable for gritty, "realistic" types of games (and gamers), whereas Hero,
which plays a little more faster and looser with the details, is considered
more suitable for "cinematic" or "heroic" types of games.

On a similar note, too, some types of game systems lend themselves better
to certain nuances of a game than others. The biggest example of this is
magic. GURPS alone has several different magic and magic-related systems in
place. Steve Kenson has remarked on several occasions that Shadowrun's
magic system bears more resemblence to GURPS' Psionics system rather than
GURPS' Magic system.

I, for one, don't particularly care what game system you use to play
Shadowrun. (We FASA writers prefer that you use ours, but we'd rather
convince you than coerce you.) Nor do most of us mind whether you use house
rules or not; as far as I'm concerned, you're just "tweaking" the game
to fit your own style of play. But that won't change the fact that
changing the rule will change the game overall. Caveat emptor: may the GM
beware.

(That was probably Patrick's point, I just elaborated more.)

-- Jon
Message no. 22
From: Sebastian Wiers m0ng005e@*********.com
Subject: House rules
Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 19:55:09 -0600
-----Original Message-----
From: JonSzeto@***.com <JonSzeto@***.com>
To: shadowrn@*********.org <shadowrn@*********.org>
Date: Monday, November 01, 1999 9:33 PM

:I have to side Patrick, but I also have to agree that what Barbie
:originally said was true, to a degree: the rules have no real effect on the
:uberplot of the game world and vice versa. It's still the Sixth World,
:whether you use FASA's game rules, house rules, GURPS, Hero System, Fuzion,
:FUDGE, or whatever.
:
:However, the game rules themselves DO have an effect on the game STYLE that
:you play. Each type of game lends itself to a certain style, and some rules
:do a better job of highlighting one particular area (be it magic, martial
:arts, gun play, vehicle combat, or whatever.)


Jon's statement was an elegant one, and therefore, I spent a while
hoping to come up with something equal. I didn't, so I'll at least try to
make it short.
I think that the rules of a RPG are very important because, in many
ways, they ARE the fiction of that world. The setting and characters and
history are all very crucial- they make the game world what it is. You can
only change them so much, and still be playing the same game. However, the
rules help to make it what it will BECOME, for the players at least. As
such, when you change them, you change who the players characters are, to an
extent. This is a hard feeling to convey, but I think it is an important
factor in why players (GM's included) often feel strongly about certain
rules concepts.

Mongoose
Message no. 23
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Poe Saoer)
Subject: house rules?
Date: Sat Feb 17 10:45:02 2001
i am starting my first pbem campaign for shadowrun,a nd since i have been
out of the shadows for a while, i have no house rules. Can you all give me
some ideas as to what house rules you use to make the game a little more
personalized?
thank you
Drwe
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
Message no. 24
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Scott W)
Subject: house rules?
Date: Sat Feb 17 11:15:00 2001
> i am starting my first pbem campaign for shadowrun,a nd since i
have been out of the shadows for a while, i have no house rules.
Can you all give me some ideas as to what house rules you use to make
the game a little more personalized?

Well, some GMs like to start players out with a different starting
amount of Building Points (if you use that system). Or perhaps
restrictions on Attribute and skill values, or starting gear. That
way they can tailor the power level of the game. I'm in a Gang PBEM
and a Pirates PBEM right now where we started off with limitations on
what we could buy and how poerful the characters could be, and that
(although challenging to a heart 'n' soul min/maxer like myself :)
made the game feel a bit different from a standard game.
Aside from that, or my Lifestyle House Rules (shameless plug!), I
don't really use house rules... I'm pretty comfy with what FASA's
done.
The main thing about using house rules, if you decide to, is to A)
inform everyone of the rules you're changing, and B) make sure
everyone agrees that the rule will be changed. In the first case, if
you've decided Wired Reflexes are too poerful and taken away the
Reaction bonus, the girl who's made a character with Wired 3 is going
to be pretty ticked when she gets into combat. Better to know while
she's making the character. In the second case, if you hate the
called shot rules and want to change them, but ALL your players think
they're dandy, maybe you should give some ground and decide not to
change it. That'll keep everyone happy, and it might let you push
another rule by the jury.

====-Boondocker (who was born with 30 Building Points)

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35
a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/
Message no. 25
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Gurth)
Subject: house rules?
Date: Sat Feb 17 13:40:01 2001
According to Poe Saoer, on Sat, 17 Feb 2001 the word on the street was...

> i am starting my first pbem campaign for shadowrun,a nd since i have been
> out of the shadows for a while, i have no house rules. Can you all give me
> some ideas as to what house rules you use to make the game a little more
> personalized?

The important ones I can remember off the top of my head:

I use SR1 rules for Staging. Every weapon has an extra digit after the
Damage Code that indicates how many successes are needed to stage its
damage up or down by one level -- for example, a 6M4 weapon would need for
successes to go from M to S (or back). Using this house rule, though,
you'll want to stage damage up _before_ letting the target stage it down,
else you'll find that most weapons will do their base damage most of the
time. The Staging values have been taken direct from SR1 rulebooks,or
improvised where those weren't available.

For burst- and autofire, determine the TN as normal but don't factor in
recoil modifiers. Instead, roll an open test and see by how many points you
exceed the TN (halve this, rounding down, for weapons that double recoil
modifiers.) Then add your recoil compensation to this number, and you've
got the number of bullets that hit. The number of successes used for staging
is one-half the number of dice that ecxeeded the TN. (Note that, when firing
two bursts in an action, the second burst _does_ get the recoil from the
first one added to its TN.)

With the Regeneration power, at the end of every turn roll Essence against
a TN equal to the total number of boxes of damage you have. Every success
removes one box of damage. (If you have both Stun and physical damage,
the TN is based on the track that has the most boxes filled, and each
success removes one box from each.) You can also choose to take a Complex
Action to make this test; you still get the automatic test at the end of
the turn if you do. Overflow works as for all other characters, and is
simply added to the TN of 10 needed for regenerating a Deadly wound (e.g.
with a Deadly physical and 4 overflow you need to roll 14s). I do still
make the 1D6 roll to check for death when the character gets up to Deadly,
though -- a 1 (or 2 for massive damage) means Regeneration doesn't work for
this wound, so normal healing will have to be employed.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
afblinken
-> NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+@ UL P L++ E W-(++) N o? K w+(--) O V?
PS+ PE(-)(+) Y PGP- t@ 5++ X(+) R+++(-)>$ tv+ b++@ DI- D+ G+ e h! !r y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 26
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Damion Milliken)
Subject: House Rules
Date: Mon May 14 10:35:01 2001
Hi Folks!

I'm compiling up my house rules document, and I'd like to look around and
see what other people have done, and pinch a few good ideas. Don't worry,
you'll get acknowledged if I steal your rule ideas :-). Does anyone have
any of their favourite house rules to share? Pointers to web pages would do
me fine if you like.

Also, I'm especially interested in anyones house rules on metamagic.
Particularly alternative metamagical tecniques to expand the boundaries of
magic, and advanced metamagical techniques. By advanced I mean, what
happens if you want to get really good at Masking, and choose it twice? Can
you Mask any differently? Maybe you can Mask more things, or your Masking
is more difficult to pierce. Perhaps you can Mask things that other's
cannot (such as your Essence)?

Also, I have a vague rule idea that I'd like to throw out. I was thinking
that if a character resists a Physical attack (as in Physical, not Stun
damage) with the assistance of armour, then they should be subject to a Stun
attack. This rule idea is inspired by Graht's rule of a similar nature. I
was thinking that it would sound reasonable that a character be subjected to
a Stun attack with a Power equal to what their armour reduced the Physical
attack by, and a Damage Level that went up by one for every one they staged
the Physical attack down by. An example is in order here I feel:

Goggles gets shot by a heavy pistol for 9S damage. He's packing an armour
jacket (5/3). He needs to resist 4S damage. Say he stages this down twice
to a Light. Now he needs to resist a Stun attack with a Power equal to what
his armour reduced the Physical attack by, ie 5. The Damage Level is staged
up twice, as he staged the Physical attack down twice, so it's a Moderate.
5M Stun here he comes.

Does this sound like a reasonable rule to represent the bruising, winding,
etc. that accompanies being shot while wearing armour?

--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong
Unofficial Shadowrun Guru E-mail: dam01@***.edu.au
-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version: 3.12
GE d- s++:-- a24 C++ US++>+++ P+ L++>+++ E- W+>++ N++ o@ K- w+(--) O-@
M-- V- PS+ PE(-) Y+>++ PGP-@>++ t+ 5 X++>+++ R+(++) !tv(--) b+ DI+++@
D G+ e++>++++$ h(*) r++ y-(--)
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
Message no. 27
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Graht)
Subject: House Rules
Date: Mon May 14 11:15:01 2001
At 12:36 AM 5/15/2001 +1000, Damion Milliken wrote:
>Hi Folks!
>
>I'm compiling up my house rules document, and I'd like to look around and
>see what other people have done, and pinch a few good ideas. Don't worry,
>you'll get acknowledged if I steal your rule ideas :-). Does anyone have
>any of their favourite house rules to share? Pointers to web pages would do
>me fine if you like.

http://www.users.qwest.net/~abaker3/shadowrun/shadowrun_house_rules.htm

If you want the D8 rules, let me know.

To Life,
-Graht
ShadowRN Gridsec, Nice Guy Division
--
Message no. 28
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Rand Ratinac)
Subject: House Rules
Date: Mon May 14 22:15:01 2001
<snipt!(TM)>
> Does this sound like a reasonable rule to represent
the bruising, winding, etc. that accompanies being
shot while wearing armour?
> Damion Milliken

Possibly, Damion, although I don't really think it's a
good thing to implement unless you want to make combat
really lethal and a really bad idea. And also,
considering no one's ever NOT going to go into a big
fight without armour (well, if they have a brain),
you're going to increase the amount of rolling in
combat significantly.

A question - how would you handle magical armour, or
solid armour? Remember, a lot of this 'stun' damage
comes from being shot in 'soft' armour. Armour plates
(security grade, military grade, ANY impact armour)
aren't going to transfer much, if any 'bruising'
damage to the wearer, especially in melee combat.

How I handle Masking is to allow the mage to mask as
anything they 'possess' in their aura. So being
magical, initiated and (previously) a mundane, they
can mask as any of these things. If they have
cyberware, they can also mask to simulate additional
cyberware etc.

Oh, and I have one house rule that I'd like to
mention. You could call it the "More Power to Adepts"
rule. Basically, I never thought the power that gave
additional skill dice (the name of which I can't
recall for some reason) was worth taking - the cost
was significantly too high for the benefits received -
remember, the dice don't function as normal skill dice
- you can still only use pool dice up to your skill
rating, not to your skill plus improvements rating,
plus, as you get further and further initiated, the
costs of improving the power compared to improving the
skill itself become prohibitive. Also, I always saw
adept powers in general and this power in particular
as magical - they are, aren't they? This was never
reflected in the rules - I always thought they should
allow incredible feats and manoeuvres - hiding in
plain sight, the heroic jump kick off a building and
through the door of a helicopter - that kind of thing.
It shouldn't make the really tough ones EASY, but it
should make them feasible.

So what I did was the following - extra dice from this
power also decrease the target number for skill tests
in a non-linear progression. The first two dice reduce
target numbers by 1. Three further dice reduce target
numbers by 1 again, for a total of -2. Four more dice
reduce the target by another 1, and so on. That way,
you COULD get in the vicinity of being able to do
impossible things with ease, but only if you put your
entire LIFE into one particular skill, but any adept
could put a decent amount of power into skills and get
some 'magical' benefit.

I haven't used this one with SR3, where the power
costs for some improved skills has come down, but I
still think it'd be worth looking at.

====Doc'
(aka Mr. Freaky Big, Super-Dynamic Troll of Tomorrow, aka Doc'booner, aka Doc' Vader)

.sig Sauer

Can you SMELL what THE DOC' is COOKIN'!!!

____________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @*****.co.uk address at http://mail.yahoo.co.uk
or your free @*****.ie address at http://mail.yahoo.ie
Message no. 29
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Damion Milliken)
Subject: House Rules
Date: Tue May 15 05:20:02 2001
[Rand Ratinac] writes:

> Possibly, Damion, although I don't really think it's a good thing to
> implement unless you want to make combat really lethal and a really bad
> idea. And also, considering no one's ever NOT going to go into a big fight
> without armour (well, if they have a brain), you're going to increase the
> amount of rolling in combat significantly.

I don't know if it'd increase the rolling at all, actually. The combat
would be over sooner, as even though each hit took twice the rolling, each
hit dealt twice the damage, too. It'd probably work out about the same.
It'd be likely that armoured opponents would just wind up unconcious from
impact, rather than dead, though.

The reason I'm thinking about this rule is that I recall a story from Ivy K
about when she tested an armour jacket once. For real. Does anyone with
any knowledge about body armour care to chime in?

> A question - how would you handle magical armour, or solid armour?
> Remember, a lot of this 'stun' damage comes from being shot in 'soft'
> armour. Armour plates (security grade, military grade, ANY impact armour)
> aren't going to transfer much, if any 'bruising' damage to the wearer,
> especially in melee combat.

I'd probably ignore the rule for hard armour, like heavy armour. That'd
make heavy armour attractive over layered soft armour of the same Ballistic
and Impact Ratings (which at the moment it isn't).

> I haven't used this one with SR3, where the power costs for some improved
> skills has come down, but I still think it'd be worth looking at.

Wow, your adepts must go off! Players in my games regularly choose Improved
Ability for Stealth, Athletics, and melee combat skills. Once or twice
they've chosen it for ranged combat skills, but not so often. I guess
that's an indication that it's worth the price, at least in my game.

Something I've never seen chosen, however, is Improved Attribute Adept
Powers. They just cost too much.

--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong
Unofficial Shadowrun Guru E-mail: dam01@***.edu.au
-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version: 3.12
GE d- s++:-- a24 C++ US++>+++ P+ L++>+++ E- W+>++ N++ o@ K- w+(--) O-@
M-- V- PS+ PE(-) Y+>++ PGP-@>++ t+ 5 X++>+++ R+(++) !tv(--) b+ DI+++@
D G+ e++>++++$ h(*) r++ y-(--)
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
Message no. 30
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Rand Ratinac)
Subject: House Rules
Date: Tue May 15 08:35:01 2001
<snipt!(TM)>
> I don't know if it'd increase the rolling at all,
actually. The combat would be over sooner, as even
though each hit took twice the rolling, each hit dealt
twice the damage, too. It'd probably work out about
the same. It'd be likely that armoured opponents would
just wind up unconcious from impact, rather than dead,
though.

Point - but it'd also mean whoever got in the first
shot would be the winner in most cases, because you're
virtually doubling up on damage. Now while that may be
realistic, it's not always going to be much fun in a
game, especially if you're the kind of GM who likes to
ambush his players. Remember, if you play the game
realistically, a lot of the time getting knocked out
is just as bad (potentially worse!) as getting dead.

One more thing - would you have to use up another lot
of combat pool to resist the stun damage?

In any event, I won't be using this rule - I like a
more 'heroic' style of game.

> I'd probably ignore the rule for hard armour, like
heavy armour. That'd make heavy armour attractive
over layered soft armour of the same Ballistic and
Impact Ratings (which at the moment it isn't).

What's heavy armour - security grade and higher? What
about magic? What about the plates in a 'vest with
plates', a longcoat and an armour jacket - those DO
have solid plates in them according to the
descriptions - at least, I think a jacket is supposed
to - the others DEFINITELY do. What about impact
armour versus melee combat, or projectile weapons?

> Wow, your adepts must go off! Players in my games
regularly choose Improved Ability for Stealth,
Athletics, and melee combat skills. Once or twice
they've chosen it for ranged combat skills, but not so
often. I guess that's an indication that it's worth
the price, at least in my game.

Well, then don't use it. I think I've only ever had
one player who's taken more than two points in any
particular skill and while a -1 is good, it's hardly
incredible.

Anyway, your players must be weird. I simply can't see
where 1 bonus die (and that's it!) is worth half a
power point.

> Something I've never seen chosen, however, is
Improved Attribute Adept Powers. They just cost too
much.
> Damion Milliken

Really? You think? I dunno - if you're a melee combat
adept and you're not a troll, Improved Strength is
almost essential, and Improved Quickness is great for
EVERYONE (makes you move faster, lets you use heavier
combinations of armour, not to mention increasing
reaction and combat pool, and, of course, it lets you
buy higher levels of skills cheaper). It also only
costs up to 0.5 points per increase up to the racial
maximums (that is, at least the way I read it, the
HIGH values (1.5 times the racial modified limit)).

====Doc'
(aka Mr. Freaky Big, Super-Dynamic Troll of Tomorrow, aka Doc'booner, aka Doc' Vader)

.sig Sauer

Can you SMELL what THE DOC' is COOKIN'!!!

____________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @*****.co.uk address at http://mail.yahoo.co.uk
or your free @*****.ie address at http://mail.yahoo.ie
Message no. 31
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Damion Milliken)
Subject: House Rules
Date: Tue May 15 11:10:01 2001
[Rand Ratinac] writes:

> Remember, if you play the game realistically, a lot of the time getting
> knocked out is just as bad (potentially worse!) as getting dead.

Yeah, I can definitely see that point, which is why I'm only tossing the
idea around, not rushing out to impliment it right away :-).

> One more thing - would you have to use up another lot of combat pool to
> resist the stun damage?

Er, not having thought about it, I think the answer would be yes. If you
used Combat Pool dice on your first Damage Resistance Test, then you'd be
decreasing the Physical damage that you took. So then you'd be increasing
the Stun damage you'd have to resist. It'd be two separate tests.

> In any event, I won't be using this rule - I like a more 'heroic' style of
> game.

So you're happy with the "blast and miss every time" autofire rules that SR
currently has, then? <grin>

> What's heavy armour - security grade and higher? What about magic? What
> about the plates in a 'vest with plates', a longcoat and an armour jacket -
> those DO have solid plates in them according to the descriptions - at
> least, I think a jacket is supposed to - the others DEFINITELY do.

Er, I was thinking Security and higher grades. The full body encasing
external type jobs.

Hmm, I noticed an interesting point in SR3 just then. In the section on
Layering Armour (p. 285) it says that while helmets and shields do not count
towards Combat Pool losses, they do count towards the Quickness penalty. Is
this supposed to mean that somebody wearing Security grade armour with a
helmet has to follow the Quickness penalty rules, or that someone wearing
(say) an armour jacket and vest with plates (and thus is already following
the Quickness penalty rules) and helmet has to include the helmet's armour
Ratings in the Quickness penalty calculations?

> What about impact armour versus melee combat, or projectile weapons?

Um, I'd probably treat them the same.

> Anyway, your players must be weird. I simply can't see where 1 bonus die
> (and that's it!) is worth half a power point.

It's very common for them to get 2 bonus dice or 4 bonus dice (ie a full
Magic Point worth, depending on the skill it's for), or both (ie 2 Magic
Points worth).

What do all your Adepts spend their points on?

> Really? You think? I dunno - if you're a melee combat adept and you're not
> a troll, Improved Strength is almost essential, and Improved Quickness is
> great for EVERYONE (makes you move faster, lets you use heavier
> combinations of armour, not to mention increasing reaction and combat pool,
> and, of course, it lets you buy higher levels of skills cheaper). It also
> only costs up to 0.5 points per increase up to the racial maximums (that
> is, at least the way I read it, the HIGH values (1.5 times the racial
> modified limit)).

I find that most characters in my games tend to have good Attributes
already, and so if they need a bonus, they always go for the Attribute Boost
(great for getting your Strength from 5 or 6 or 7 to around 9 or 10 or 11,
which usually means that armoured opponents need around 6's to resist your
punches), and it's way way cheaper.

In fact, the sole time I think Improved Physical Attribute points have been
purchased in my game was for role playing and character reasons. One of my
players wanted a character who wasn't a big beefy meat head looking guy, but
also wanted a high Body Attribute. He had a Body of 3 or 4, and a few
points of Improved Physical Attribute to get him up to 6 or 8. If he'd have
just been trying to munch it, he'd certainly not have gone that route.

--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong
Unofficial Shadowrun Guru E-mail: dam01@***.edu.au
-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version: 3.12
GE d- s++:-- a24 C++ US++>+++ P+ L++>+++ E- W+>++ N++ o@ K- w+(--) O-@
M-- V- PS+ PE(-) Y+>++ PGP-@>++ t+ 5 X++>+++ R+(++) !tv(--) b+ DI+++@
D G+ e++>++++$ h(*) r++ y-(--)
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
Message no. 32
From: shadowrn@*********.com (shadowrn@*********.com)
Subject: House Rules
Date: Tue May 15 17:00:11 2001
On Wed, 16 May 2001 01:11:25 +1000 (EST) Damion Milliken
<dam01@***.edu.au> writes:
> [Rand Ratinac] writes:
<SNIP>
> > One more thing - would you have to use up another lot of combat
> > pool to
> > resist the stun damage?

> Er, not having thought about it, I think the answer would be yes.
> If you
> used Combat Pool dice on your first Damage Resistance Test, then
> you'd be
> decreasing the Physical damage that you took. So then you'd be
> increasing
> the Stun damage you'd have to resist. It'd be two separate tests.
<SNIP>

So I dodge only to knock my noggin on something? Seems to me, that Combat
Pool should apply twice ...

--
D. Ghost
Profanity is the one language all programmers know best
- Troutman's 6th programming postulate.
________________________________________________________________
GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!
Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!
Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit:
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
Message no. 33
From: shadowrn@*********.com (shadowrn@*********.com)
Subject: House Rules
Date: Tue May 15 17:00:19 2001
On Tue, 15 May 2001 19:22:27 +1000 (EST) Damion Milliken
<dam01@***.edu.au> writes:
<SNIP>
> Wow, your adepts must go off! Players in my games regularly choose
> Improved
> Ability for Stealth, Athletics, and melee combat skills. Once or
> twice
> they've chosen it for ranged combat skills, but not so often. I
> guess
> that's an indication that it's worth the price, at least in my
> game.
>
> Something I've never seen chosen, however, is Improved Attribute
> Adept
> Powers. They just cost too much.

I've had at least one character with it. I think the draw back, isn't the
power point cost, it's the karma impact. IIRC, once you buy Improved
Attribute, it's treated as a natural increase and thus karma costs for
increasing that attribute are increased. I don't treat adept powers or
bioware as natural improvements in this sense in my games. :)

--
D. Ghost
Profanity is the one language all programmers know best
- Troutman's 6th programming postulate.
________________________________________________________________
GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!
Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!
Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit:
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
Message no. 34
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Rand Ratinac)
Subject: House Rules
Date: Tue May 15 21:10:00 2001
> Er, not having thought about it, I think the answer
would be yes. If you used Combat Pool dice on your
first Damage Resistance Test, then you'd be decreasing
the Physical damage that you took. So then you'd be
increasing the Stun damage you'd have to resist. It'd
be two separate tests.

Ouch.

> So you're happy with the "blast and miss every time"
autofire rules that SR currently has, then? <grin>

No, that I'm not very happy with. :)

> Er, I was thinking Security and higher grades. The
full body encasing external type jobs.
>
> Hmm, I noticed an interesting point in SR3 just
then. In the section on Layering Armour (p. 285) it
says that while helmets and shields do not count
towards Combat Pool losses, they do count towards the
Quickness penalty. Is this supposed to mean that
somebody wearing Security grade armour with a helmet
has to follow the Quickness penalty rules, or that
someone wearing (say) an armour jacket and vest with
plates (and thus is already following the Quickness
penalty rules) and helmet has to include the helmet's
armour Ratings in the Quickness penalty calculations?

Ummm, I think there's something about how that only
applies if you're already layering armour - so using
security armour, a helmet and a shield wouldn't have
any effect.

Could be wrong, though - the situation hasn't come up
before - I don't have a lot of characters going around
in full body armour, y'know? :)

> > What about impact armour versus melee combat, or
projectile weapons?
>
> Um, I'd probably treat them the same.

As being shot vs. soft ballistic armour? You're
kidding, right?

> It's very common for them to get 2 bonus dice or 4
bonus dice (ie a full Magic Point worth, depending on
the skill it's for), or both (ie 2 Magic Points
worth).

Still, I'd rather learn the skills naturally (except
stealth and athletics) and be able to use combat pool
dice up to their full rating if necessary.

> What do all your Adepts spend their points on?

Mine personally, or my players? For my players it
varies. For me, it's whatever is appropriate to the
character. I always get some amount on increased
reflexes - I mean, really. :) Apart from that, it's
generally powers that let you do SPECIAL things - why
increase stuff you can already do when your powers
allow you to do COOL stuff? :) My 'point man' adept
got stuff like improved strength, vision
modifications, hearing modifications, extra stealth
and traceless walk etc. His 'signature', I guess, is
the spatial recognition power. My sniper/close
combatant has vision mag, killing hands and a few
other improved senses.

I recently put together a close combat guy for a
high-powered, HK action movie-type game. These are the
powers I got him - btw, could those of you who are
playing in the game not look at this, please?

















Distance Strike
Improved Reflexes (2)
Improved Senses
Flare Compensation
Hearing Amplification
Thermographic
Vision Magnification (3)
Stunning Hands (8S)
Traceless Walk

The vision mag is because his ace-in-the-hole for when
guys are too far away, or things get a little out of
hand are twin SMGs - he's got Ambidexterity 8, so...:)

He's also a sneaky bastard, which is why he's got the
traceless walk. I told you why I get the improved
senses above, the stunning hands (like killing hands,
but does improved stun damage is because he does focus
on close combat, the distance strike is a Shaolin Monk
thing. :) Oh, and he's got stealth 8, SMG 8 and
Shaolin Kung Fu 10 - told you with was an action movke
game. :)

> I find that most characters in my games tend to have
good Attributes already,

Well, yes.

> and so if they need a bonus, they always go for the
Attribute Boost (great for getting your Strength from
5 or 6 or 7 to around 9 or 10 or 11, which usually
means that armoured opponents need around 6's to
resist your punches), and it's way way cheaper.

Never liked that, personally - I prefer natural
increases to attributes, especially because the boost
makes you resist drain and the higher the numbers
involved, the harder it is to get it to work in the
first place.

> In fact, the sole time I think Improved Physical
Attribute points have been purchased in my game was
for role playing and character reasons. One of my
players wanted a character who wasn't a big beefy meat
head looking guy, but also wanted a high Body
Attribute. He had a Body of 3 or 4, and a few points
of Improved Physical Attribute to get him up to 6 or
8. If he'd have just been trying to munch it, he'd
certainly not have gone that route.
> Damion Milliken

Well, that's another reason I like it. I prefer subtle
characters - no full body 'borg conversions for me -
and that counts here, too. The 'action movie'
character I mentioned above has a natural strength of
8 and body of 6, but he's a big, beefy guy. Generally,
my characters are a lot less threatening in appearance
and improved attributes help to add a nasty surprise
to my adepts.

====Doc'
(aka Mr. Freaky Big, Super-Dynamic Troll of Tomorrow, aka Doc'booner, aka Doc' Vader)

.sig Sauer

Can you SMELL what THE DOC' is COOKIN'!!!

____________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @*****.co.uk address at http://mail.yahoo.co.uk
or your free @*****.ie address at http://mail.yahoo.ie
Message no. 35
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Damion Milliken)
Subject: House Rules
Date: Wed May 16 11:05:01 2001
dghost@****.com writes:

> > Er, not having thought about it, I think the answer would be yes. If you
> > used Combat Pool dice on your first Damage Resistance Test, then you'd be
> > decreasing the Physical damage that you took. So then you'd be
> > increasing the Stun damage you'd have to resist. It'd be two separate
> > tests.
>
> So I dodge only to knock my noggin on something? Seems to me, that Combat
> Pool should apply twice ...

Well, when I read Combat Pool, I assumed that he meant Combat Pool dice
added to the Damage Resistance Test (ie added to the Body test). Dodging
occurs prior to this, and reduces the damage that you take initially (say
from 8M with 4 successes to 8M with 0 successes). So in answer to the
question, Dodging would help both the Physical and Stun damage resistance
tests, yes. It would do so because it reduces the Physical damage that you
have to resist, and thus, by extension, the potential Stun damage that you
may have to resist.

--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong
Unofficial Shadowrun Guru E-mail: dam01@***.edu.au
-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version: 3.12
GE d- s++:-- a24 C++ US++>+++ P+ L++>+++ E- W+>++ N++ o@ K- w+(--) O-@
M-- V- PS+ PE(-) Y+>++ PGP-@>++ t+ 5 X++>+++ R+(++) !tv(--) b+ DI+++@
D G+ e++>++++$ h(*) r++ y-(--)
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
Message no. 36
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Damion Milliken)
Subject: House Rules
Date: Wed May 16 11:45:01 2001
[Rand Ratinac] writes:

> Ummm, I think there's something about how that only applies if you're
> already layering armour - so using security armour, a helmet and a shield
> wouldn't have any effect.

I sat down, got the appropriate errata, and logic'd it all out. You're
right, it only matters if you're layering armour already. I'm going to
spring this nice surprise on my players real soon now. You see, they have a
habit of wearing armour clothing and a vest, and then popping on a rapid
transit helmet if they're expecting trouble. Well, half of them do. The
other half of them spend the whole time paying out on the geeks with the
bike hats on.

> Could be wrong, though - the situation hasn't come up before - I don't
> have a lot of characters going around in full body armour, y'know? :)

I know, but I have a lot of NPCs running around in it, and it would matter a
lot to them. Joe security guard gets issued security armour and a helment,
but usually only has a Quickness of around 3. He'd be way way useless if he
had to suffer the Quickness penalties for layering.

> As being shot vs. soft ballistic armour? You're kidding, right?

Well, I never said that I'd fully thought it through :-). It's probably
more sensible to go the other way, yeah.

> Still, I'd rather learn the skills naturally (except stealth and
> athletics) and be able to use combat pool dice up to their full rating if
> necessary.

I tend to find that only in rather peculiar circumstances do my players use
their Combat Pool offensively. They're usually too concerned about getting
into cover, dodging, and generally saving their own arses if a fight breaks
out.

> Never liked that, personally - I prefer natural increases to attributes,
> especially because the boost makes you resist drain and the higher the
> numbers involved, the harder it is to get it to work in the first place.

It seems to work well, every now and then it won't fire, or they'll take
Light Stun from it (once one of them took Serious Stun, even), but most of
the time it seems to go OK. And it's cheap, don't forget that bit ;-).

--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong
Unofficial Shadowrun Guru E-mail: dam01@***.edu.au
-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version: 3.12
GE d- s++:-- a24 C++ US++>+++ P+ L++>+++ E- W+>++ N++ o@ K- w+(--) O-@
M-- V- PS+ PE(-) Y+>++ PGP-@>++ t+ 5 X++>+++ R+(++) !tv(--) b+ DI+++@
D G+ e++>++++$ h(*) r++ y-(--)
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
Message no. 37
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Rand Ratinac)
Subject: House Rules
Date: Wed May 16 22:05:01 2001
> I sat down, got the appropriate errata, and logic'd
it all out. You're right, it only matters if you're
layering armour already. I'm going to spring this
nice surprise on my players real soon now. You see,
they have a habit of wearing armour clothing and a
vest, and then popping on a rapid transit helmet if
they're expecting trouble. Well, half of them do.
The other half of them spend the whole time paying out
on the geeks with the bike hats on.

Heh heh heh. :)

> I know, but I have a lot of NPCs running around in
it, and it would matter a lot to them. Joe security
guard gets issued security armour and a helment, but
usually only has a Quickness of around 3. He'd be way
way useless if he had to suffer the Quickness
penalties for layering.

True.

> Well, I never said that I'd fully thought it through
:-). It's probably more sensible to go the other way,
yeah.

Yeah, really. I mean, modern ballistic armour is
designed to stop a bullet from killing you. If that
puts you flat on your back, so be it. Older armour
(and thus modern impact armour) is designed to stop
low kinetic energy weapons from hurting you AND keep
you fighting.

> I tend to find that only in rather peculiar
circumstances do my players use their Combat Pool
offensively. They're usually too concerned about
getting into cover, dodging, and generally saving
their own arses if a fight breaks out.

Well, sure, but if you're the ambushers...;)

I prefer to have a choice in the matter, you know?
Even though I generally end up with a bunch of combat
pool dice in hand at the end of each round, because I
usually save them in case I have to dodge or resist
damage.

> It seems to work well, every now and then it won't
fire, or they'll take Light Stun from it (once one of
them took Serious Stun, even), but most of the time it
seems to go OK. And it's cheap, don't forget that bit
;-).
> Damion Milliken

Sure, but it's what, 0.25 per point? For only twice
that, if your natural attributes aren't too high, you
get a PERMANENT increase to those attributes.

====Doc'
(aka Mr. Freaky Big, Super-Dynamic Troll of Tomorrow, aka Doc'booner, aka Doc' Vader)

.sig Sauer

Can you SMELL what THE DOC' is COOKIN'!!!

____________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @*****.co.uk address at http://mail.yahoo.co.uk
or your free @*****.ie address at http://mail.yahoo.ie
Message no. 38
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Lars Wagner Hansen)
Subject: House Rules
Date: Thu May 17 16:40:06 2001
From: "Damion Milliken" <dam01@***.edu.au>
> I'm compiling up my house rules document, and I'd like to look
around and
> see what other people have done, and pinch a few good ideas. Don't
worry,
> you'll get acknowledged if I steal your rule ideas :-). Does anyone
have
> any of their favourite house rules to share? Pointers to web pages
would do
> me fine if you like.

Here is a link with enough to get you going for a while:

http://plastic.dumpshock.com/shadowrun/guidetohouserules.html

Lars
--
Lars Wagner Hansen, Jagtvej 11, 4180 Sorø
l-hansen@*****.tele.dk http://home4.inte.tele.dk/l-hansen
Message no. 39
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Bryan Pow)
Subject: House rules
Date: Fri Feb 1 21:55:01 2002
Someone posted an address for some house rules recently and I forgot to copy
the link, could they repost them? They had something to do with H2H and
called shots etc.
Also, who else has house rules they use alot? Got an address where we can
look them up? What house rules do most poeple use?

_________________________________________________________________
Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com
Message no. 40
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Keith Duthie)
Subject: House rules
Date: Fri Feb 1 22:35:02 2002
On Sat, 2 Feb 2002, Bryan Pow wrote:

> Someone posted an address for some house rules recently and I forgot to copy
> the link, could they repost them? They had something to do with H2H and
> called shots etc.

You mean Marc Renouf's one?
http://www-personal.umich.edu/~jormung/shadowrun/rules3.html

> Also, who else has house rules they use alot? Got an address where we can
> look them up? What house rules do most poeple use?

http://users.albatross.co.nz/~psycho/sr/houserules.html are the rules I'm
going to be using when I GM.

--
Madness takes its toll. Please have exact change ready.
http://users.albatross.co.nz/~psycho/ O- -><-
Message no. 41
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Lars Wagner Hansen)
Subject: House rules
Date: Sat Feb 2 04:00:01 2002
From: "Keith Duthie" <psycho@*********.co.nz>
> On Sat, 2 Feb 2002, Bryan Pow wrote:
>
> > Someone posted an address for some house rules recently and I forgot to copy
> > the link, could they repost them? They had something to do with H2H and
> > called shots etc.
>
> You mean Marc Renouf's one?
> http://www-personal.umich.edu/~jormung/shadowrun/rules3.html
>
> > Also, who else has house rules they use alot? Got an address where we can
> > look them up? What house rules do most poeple use?
>
> http://users.albatross.co.nz/~psycho/sr/houserules.html are the rules I'm
> going to be using when I GM.

And there is also The Players Guide to Shadowrun House Rules at the Plastic
Warriors site, although they are for SR2 IIRC:

http://plastic.dumpshock.com/shadowrun/supplements.html

Lars
--
Lars Wagner Hansen, Jagtvej 11, 4180 Sorø
l-hansen@*****.tele.dk http://home4.inet.tele.dk/l-hansen
--
SRGC v0.22 SR1 SR2++ SR3+++ h+ b+++ B--- UB++ IE+ RN LST W++ dk sa++ ma+
sh++ ad++++ ri mc rk-- m- (e-- o t-- d-) gm+ M- P-
--
Main Rule of Usenet: Never argue with idiots. They drag you down to
their level, then beat you with experience.
Message no. 42
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Gurth)
Subject: House rules
Date: Sat Feb 2 07:15:17 2002
According to Lars Wagner Hansen, on Sat, 02 Feb 2002 the word on the street was...

> And there is also The Players Guide to Shadowrun House Rules at the
> Plastic Warriors site, although they are for SR2 IIRC:

Yes, they are, though many of those rules should work in SR3 as well, though you
may need to change some things slightly.

> http://plastic.dumpshock.com/shadowrun/supplements.html

Thanks for the advertising :)

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
That's the way that I can't win.
-> NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d- s:- !a>? C++@ UL+ P(+) L++ E W--(++) N o? K w(--) O
V? PS+ PE@ Y PGP- t@ 5++ X(+) R+++$ tv+(++) b++@ DI- D+ G+ e h! !r y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 43
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Anders)
Subject: House rules
Date: Sun Feb 3 14:35:01 2002
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bryan Pow" <bryan_pow@*******.com>
To: <shadowrn@*********.com>
Sent: Friday, February 01, 2002 6:59 PM
Subject: House rules


: Someone posted an address for some house rules recently and I forgot to
copy
: the link, could they repost them? They had something to do with H2H and
: called shots etc.
: Also, who else has house rules they use alot? Got an address where we can
: look them up? What house rules do most poeple use?
: Get Damon Millikin's house rules. They are very good. You have to ask him
for the addy.
BTW, with Threats II coming out, the 2-book shipping threshold will be
reached. Do you want to order Threats II (when it hits the coast) and After
the Comet?
--Anders
Message no. 44
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Damion Milliken)
Subject: House rules
Date: Mon Feb 4 03:10:01 2002
Bryan Pow writes:

> Also, who else has house rules they use alot? Got an address where we can
> look them up? What house rules do most poeple use?

I've a whole bunch of house rules, some we use so much that many of my
players think they are core SR3 rules. They are available at
http://nosferatu.dhs.org/Rules.zip One day I will learn how to code HTML
properly and perhaps make a web site for them.

--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong
Unofficial Shadowrun Guru E-mail: dam01@***.edu.au
-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version: 3.12
GE d- s++:-- a25 C++ US++>+++ P+ L+>++ E- W+ N++ o@ K- w+(--) O-@ M--
V- PS+ PE- Y+ PGP-@>++ t+ 5 X+>+++ R++ !tv(--) b+ DI+++@ D G+
e++>++++$ h- r++>+++ y->+++
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
Message no. 45
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Marc Renouf)
Subject: House rules
Date: Mon Feb 4 16:50:01 2002
On Sat, 2 Feb 2002, Bryan Pow wrote:

> Someone posted an address for some house rules recently and I forgot to copy
> the link, could they repost them? They had something to do with H2H and
> called shots etc.

They have to do with lots of things, called shots and HTH being
but two among several. :) They can be found at:

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~jormung/shadowrun/rules3.html

Marc
Message no. 46
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Anders)
Subject: HOUSE RULES
Date: Wed Aug 21 00:05:01 2002
Mr. Milliken, sir, can you publish your house rules address, again?
--Anders
Message no. 47
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Damion Milliken)
Subject: HOUSE RULES
Date: Wed Aug 21 02:25:01 2002
Anders writes:

> Mr. Milliken, sir, can you publish your house rules address, again?

They should be at http://nosferatu.dhs.org/sr

Although I have yet to update them to reflect the "Official SR FAQ", so some
things might be a little whacked at the moment.

--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong
Unofficial Shadowrun Guru E-mail: dam01@***.edu.au
-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version: 3.12
GE d- s++:-- a26 C++ US++>+++ P+ L+>++ E- W++ N+ o@ K- w+(--) O-@ M--
V- PS+ PE- Y+ PGP-@>++ t+@ 5@ X+>+++ R++ tv(-) b+ DI+++@ D-@ G+
e++>++++ h--- r+++ y+++
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
Message no. 48
From: d_hyde@***.com (Derek Hyde)
Subject: House Rules?
Date: Wed, 19 May 2004 15:28:18 -0500
I'm currently trying to build a new house rules booklet for my group
that's just being put together, I was wondering if it would be possible
for any/all of you to send me a copy of yours so that I might see if
there's any that other people have thought of that I haven't run into
yet (save the trouble of having to fix things later, ya know?)

Derek M. Hyde
Message no. 49
From: nightgyr@*********.com.au (GreyWolf)
Subject: House Rules?
Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 08:45:52 +1000
> I'm currently trying to build a new house rules booklet for my group
> that's just being put together, I was wondering if it would be possible
> for any/all of you to send me a copy of yours so that I might see if
> there's any that other people have thought of that I haven't run into
> yet (save the trouble of having to fix things later, ya know?)
>
> Derek M. Hyde
>

Check out my site "Shadowrun-resources":

http://members.optushome.com.au/shadowrun-resources

It has a bunch of stuff you might find useful...

..and on a side note, if you complete your booklet, can I have a copy?

GreyWolf
Message no. 50
From: d_hyde@***.com (Derek Hyde)
Subject: House Rules?
Date: Wed, 19 May 2004 18:13:50 -0500
On May 19, 2004, at 5:45 PM, GreyWolf wrote:
> ..and on a side note, if you complete your booklet, can I have a copy?
>
> GreyWolf
>
>

not a problem, once I get it completed I'll put it up on my server in
quark 5.0 format
Message no. 51
From: DamionMilliken@*****.com.au (Damion Milliken)
Subject: House Rules?
Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 09:14:28 +1000
Derek writes:

> I'm currently trying to build a new house rules booklet for my group
> that's just being put together, I was wondering if it would be possible
> for any/all of you to send me a copy of yours so that I might see if
> there's any that other people have thought of that I haven't run into
> yet (save the trouble of having to fix things later, ya know?)

My house rules can be found at:

http://www.users.on.net/milliken/Damions_House_Rules.doc

They are slightly out of date, however, as I haven't had the time to change them since the
SR3 FAQ came out. There are a few house rules that are now covered by the SR3 FAQ.

--
Damion Milliken E-Mail: DamionMilliken@*****.com.au
---------------+----------------------------------+-----------------------
ICQ: 177734389 | MSN: DamionMilliken@*****.com.au | AIM/Y!: DamionMilliken
---------------+----------------------------------+-----------------------
Message no. 52
From: nightgyr@*********.com.au (GreyWolf)
Subject: House Rules?
Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 09:19:34 +1000
>
> On May 19, 2004, at 5:45 PM, GreyWolf wrote:
> > ..and on a side note, if you complete your booklet, can I have a copy?
> >
> > GreyWolf
> >
> >
>
> not a problem, once I get it completed I'll put it up on my server in
> quark 5.0 format
>

I dont think I can view that...

I really need to update my SR sites...

GreyWolf
Message no. 53
From: adamj@*********.com (Adam Jury)
Subject: House Rules?
Date: Wed, 19 May 2004 19:42:00 -0400
On 19-May-04, at 7:13 PM, Derek Hyde wrote:

> not a problem, once I get it completed I'll put it up on my server in
> quark 5.0 format

Might make more sense to export that to PDF for general consumption. ;-)

Best,
Adam

--
Adam Jury
Editor, The Shadowrun Supplemental :: http://tss.dumpshock.com
Message no. 54
From: nightgyr@*********.com.au (GreyWolf)
Subject: House Rules?
Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 09:52:09 +1000
> On 19-May-04, at 7:13 PM, Derek Hyde wrote:
>
> > not a problem, once I get it completed I'll put it up on my server in
> > quark 5.0 format
>
> Might make more sense to export that to PDF for general consumption. ;-)
>
> Best,
> Adam
>

With the author's ok, thats what I was going to be doing to it for my
website...

Damien, can I put your house rules up?

Authors get due recognition btw.

GreyWolf
Message no. 55
From: crusader-x@*******.net (E.L.King)
Subject: House Rules?
Date: Wed, 19 May 2004 18:57:28 -0500
>> not a problem, once I get it completed I'll put it up on my server in
>> quark 5.0 format
>
> Might make more sense to export that to PDF for general consumption.
> ;-)

No doubt. Quark is expensive.... Everyone can read PDFs....
Message no. 56
From: d_hyde@***.com (Derek Hyde)
Subject: House Rules?
Date: Wed, 19 May 2004 19:31:22 -0500
On May 19, 2004, at 6:14 PM, Damion Milliken wrote:

> Derek writes:
>
>> I'm currently trying to build a new house rules booklet for my group
>> that's just being put together, I was wondering if it would be
>> possible
>> for any/all of you to send me a copy of yours so that I might see if
>> there's any that other people have thought of that I haven't run into
>> yet (save the trouble of having to fix things later, ya know?)
>
> My house rules can be found at:
>
> http://www.users.on.net/milliken/Damions_House_Rules.doc
>
can't open it at all....3 different computers with 3 different OS's and
3 different versions of word all failed and said it was a corrupt file
Message no. 57
From: d_hyde@***.com (Derek Hyde)
Subject: House Rules?
Date: Wed, 19 May 2004 19:33:28 -0500
>> not a problem, once I get it completed I'll put it up on my server in
>> quark 5.0 format
>>
>
> I dont think I can view that...
>
> I really need to update my SR sites...
>
was planning on putting it up in that format so that if whomever wanted
to edit out my house rules or anything like that they could without any
trouble....however, I can put it in PDF format if you need....
Message no. 58
From: d_hyde@***.com (Derek Hyde)
Subject: House Rules?
Date: Wed, 19 May 2004 19:39:23 -0500
On May 19, 2004, at 6:57 PM, E.L.King wrote:

>>> not a problem, once I get it completed I'll put it up on my server
>>> in quark 5.0 format
>>
>> Might make more sense to export that to PDF for general consumption.
>> ;-)
>
> No doubt. Quark is expensive.... Everyone can read PDFs....
>
>
yes, yes quark is expensive, however, few people can edit pdf's and
stuff like that...then again, I suppose I could just do the tweaking
and such for whomever needed it
Message no. 59
From: gurth@******.nl (Gurth)
Subject: House Rules?
Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 09:23:02 +0200
According to Derek Hyde, on Thursday 20 May 2004 01:13 the word on the
street was...

> not a problem, once I get it completed I'll put it up on my server in
> quark 5.0 format

Uhh... won't that be a file that will be both very big for what's actually
in it, and in a format few people can use...?

--
Gurth@******.nl - Stone Age: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
... in real life, which was styled after the film.
-> Probably NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d- s:- !a>? C++(---) UL+ P(+) L++ E W--(++) N o? K w(--)
O V? PS+ PE@ Y PGP- t- 5++ X(+) R+++$ tv+(++) b++@ DI- D+ G+ e h! !r y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 60
From: DamionMilliken@*****.com.au (Damion Milliken)
Subject: House Rules?
Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 17:48:07 +1000
OK, I dug up my old SR "website" (if you can call it that ;-)) and put it back
online:
http://www.users.on.net/milliken/SR

GreyWolf writes:

> Damien, can I put your house rules up?

Feel free to put a copy of my house rules on your site, it would be great.

Derek writes:

> can't open it at all....3 different computers with 3 different OS's and
> 3 different versions of word all failed and said it was a corrupt file

Derek, my SR "site" has another (slightly different) .doc version, as well as a
.rtf and a .pdf version of the house rules. Hopefully one of them will work for you ;-).
As an aside, the original version that I posted downloaded and opened fine for me...
<shrug>

--
Damion Milliken E-Mail: DamionMilliken@*****.com.au
---------------+----------------------------------+-----------------------
ICQ: 177734389 | MSN: DamionMilliken@*****.com.au | AIM/Y!: DamionMilliken
---------------+----------------------------------+-----------------------
Message no. 61
From: sinabian@*******.com (James Mick)
Subject: House Rules?
Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 07:50:51 -0400
This is a slight variation I came up with on the game a few years back. I've
found out recently that there's a gaming group in PA that's been using it so
there must be some appeal to it at least. Any feedback would be appreciated.


http://members.aol.com/kiltedjamesman/armageddon.html


Plus there's a little bit on the main page of that site, but aside from the
Klingon weapons and the stuff adapted from the N64 Goldeneye game it's
mainly stuff I scrounged from other sites. Though a lot of love and work
went into crafting the SCK Drakefires that you'll also find on the main
page, and they're completely by the rules.


Just my .02¥
The Mad Kilted Cyberzombie GM

_________________________________________________________________
Best Restaurant Giveaway Ever! Vote for your favorites for a chance to win
$1 million! http://local.msn.com/special/giveaway.asp
Message no. 62
From: SteveG@***********.co.za (Steve Garrard)
Subject: House Rules?
Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 11:16:14 +0200
Damion Milliken wrote:
> [snip]
>
> aside, the original version that I posted downloaded and
> opened fine for me... <shrug>

Likewise


Slayer

"Beware my wrath, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup."
- Unknown Dragon



**********************************************************************
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and
intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they
are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify
the system manager.

This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by
MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses.

www.mimesweeper.com
**********************************************************************
Message no. 63
From: d_hyde@***.com (Derek Hyde)
Subject: House Rules?
Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 09:34:16 -0500
On May 21, 2004, at 4:16 AM, Steve Garrard wrote:

> Damion Milliken wrote:
>> [snip]
>>
>> aside, the original version that I posted downloaded and
>> opened fine for me... <shrug>
>
> Likewise
>
>

ok, can one of you that's having no problem with the file e-mail it
directly to me?
Message no. 64
From: nightgyr@*********.com.au (GreyWolf)
Subject: House Rules?
Date: Mon, 24 May 2004 10:38:41 +1000
> not a problem, once I get it completed I'll put it up on my server in
> quark 5.0 format

What is your website address again?

nb: Ive got Damions house rules up on my general resources site now.

Shadowrun Resources:
http://members.optushome.com.au/shadowrun-resources/

Nerps:
http://members.optushome.com.au/nerps/
Message no. 65
From: d_hyde@***.com (Derek Hyde)
Subject: House Rules?
Date: Sun, 23 May 2004 19:43:47 -0500
> What is your website address again?
>
website isn't up yet....will be as soon as I get the file done
Message no. 66
From: marc.renouf@******.com (Renouf, Marc A)
Subject: House Rules?
Date: Mon, 24 May 2004 09:35:32 -0400
This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand
this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.

---------------------- multipart/alternative attachment
> -----Original Message-----
> From: d_hyde@***.com [mailto:d_hyde@***.com]
> Sent: Sunday, May 23, 2004 8:44 PM

Well, I sent it as a reply to the autofire thread, but for sake of
completeness, here it is again:

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~jormung/shadowrun/rules3.html

Marc

---------------------- multipart/alternative attachment
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://warthog.dumpshock.com/pipermail/shadowrn/attachments/d37fefe8/attachment.htm

---------------------- multipart/alternative attachment--

Further Reading

If you enjoyed reading about House rules, you may also be interested in:

Disclaimer

These messages were posted a long time ago on a mailing list far, far away. The copyright to their contents probably lies with the original authors of the individual messages, but since they were published in an electronic forum that anyone could subscribe to, and the logs were available to subscribers and most likely non-subscribers as well, it's felt that re-publishing them here is a kind of public service.

Thwap!