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Message no. 1
From: Neal A Porter <nap@*****.PHYSICS.SWIN.OZ.AU>
Subject: Huge Personal Karma pool
Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1993 16:01:00 +1100
>Does anyone else play with a group karma pool for their party(s)? We have a
>sizable one now, around 30 karma. I find that it makes life a lot easier.
>Of coures we just go up against bigger things now...
>--
>
> Ben-ha-meen


No but I know of a char with about 16 personal Karma pool. Now that guy
is scary when he realy want's to do well in a test. { Still trying to burn his
Karma away, but he keeps getting away }

Adeus
Message no. 2
From: Deird'Re Brooks <deirdre@***.ORG>
Subject: Re: Huge Personal Karma pool
Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1993 23:48:43 -0800
> >Does anyone else play with a group karma pool for their party(s)? We have a
> >sizable one now, around 30 karma. I find that it makes life a lot easier.
> >Of coures we just go up against bigger things now...
> >--
> > Ben-ha-meen
>
> No but I know of a char with about 16 personal Karma pool. Now that guy
> is scary when he realy want's to do well in a test. { Still trying to burn his
> Karma away, but he keeps getting away }
> Adeus

It's actually really easy for 16 Karma to go flying away. Just
did that tonight, as a matter of fact. Amazing what you'll do
when spurred by the thought of 11mm bullets tearing through your,
er, armor.

In the games I've played and GM'd, Karma Pools have run from one
all the way up to 300+ (eek!). The high end characters have been
played for a *long* time, you see. Anyway, about four
streetgangers with a Threat Rating of three or a Group Karma of
20-30 should be sufficient to eat his Karma up real fast. Unless
he refuses to fight.

Just a few thoughts . . .

Deirdre, who brought Sister Sinister from a Group Total of 300
down to six in three encounters
Marzhavasati Kali |If mail bounces, check spelling. It's deirdre.
deirdre@***.org |If that doesn't work, send mail to
|deirdre%efn.org@*******.cs.uoregon.edu
"I prefer acid tripping over tripping while on acid."
-- Taffy S.
Message no. 3
From: The Reverend <mdb0213@******.TAMU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Huge Personal Karma pool
Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1993 02:44:07 -0600
]>>Does anyone else play with a group karma pool for their party(s)? We have a
]> >sizable one now, around 30 karma. I find that it makes life a lot easier.
]> >Of coures we just go up against bigger things now...

How did you get a GROUP karma pool of 30? That means that at the VERY least,
everyone has more than 290 karma (group karma pool starts out at 1), and has
donated ALL of their personal karma pool to it. Hmmm.... re-reading the page,
it doesn't say whether or not it's cumulative, so it might be that everyone
only needed to add 5 points or so (which is possible with a high-powered group
with each one having 20 karma pool [200 karma], and giving a quarter to the
group)

(another thought) and don't forget that it regens every encounter!!!

]> No but I know of a char with about 16 personal Karma pool. Now that guy

16 is possible. My rigger in the God Group (Brodie) has about a 20. We're
worried that THIS might be too large!

]It's actually really easy for 16 Karma to go flying away. Just
]did that tonight, as a matter of fact. Amazing what you'll do
]when spurred by the thought of 11mm bullets tearing through your,
]er, armor.

How many opponents? I can see burning that many during a HUGE firefight, but
only if there's a lot of them and not much armor.

]In the games I've played and GM'd, Karma Pools have run from one
]all the way up to 300+ (eek!). The high end characters have been
]played for a *long* time, you see. Anyway, about four

WHAT?!!?!!?!?!!?!?!!?
DID YOU SAY "HUNDRED"?!?!?!!!??!?!
*ahem*
Hate to say this, but... SICK! I'd like to see how an honest character in a
non-munchkin campaign got this much! That's Three THOUSAND Karma, chummers.
Shadowrun's been out for about 4 years, or roughly 1000 karma per year.
At ~50 weeks in a year, that's 20 karma per week! Is that just an extremely
high powered campaign, or a karma-easy one? Considering even the UB module
didn't give out that much! (p.199, SR2 Black) "A real horror show woulde be
worth 6 to 8 points or so, but that requires combat, danger, and powerful
opposition, where the objective is wrapped in twisting paths of mystery!"

The groups around here...
---
The Reverend "They called me the Reverend when I entered the church unstained"
Fear the Information Revolution...for it has reached the hands of the strange.
PGP 2.2 Public Key Block available upon request
Message no. 4
From: Deird'Re Brooks <deirdre@***.ORG>
Subject: Re: Huge Personal Karma pool
Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1993 09:37:30 -0800
> ]> No but I know of a char with about 16 personal Karma pool. Now that guy
>
> 16 is possible. My rigger in the God Group (Brodie) has about a 20. We're
> worried that THIS might be too large!

Not really. It's certainly impressive, but the only rational
thing to do is scale up the opposition a bit when the GM wants a
serious challenge. If the GM is unwilling to do so, then hey,
your character is too powerful.

> ]It's actually really easy for 16 Karma to go flying away. Just
> ]did that tonight, as a matter of fact. Amazing what you'll do
> ]when spurred by the thought of 11mm bullets tearing through your,
> ]er, armor.
>
> How many opponents? I can see burning that many during a HUGE firefight, but
> only if there's a lot of them and not much armor.

Well, only if there are a lot of low-threat gun-dummies on the
other side, or a few *high* threat runners, which it was in this
case. The actual Karma was spent on breaking the guy's arm so he
_couldn't_ shoot me, you see.

> ]In the games I've played and GM'd, Karma Pools have run from one
> ]all the way up to 300+ (eek!). The high end characters have been
> ]played for a *long* time, you see. Anyway, about four
>
> WHAT?!!?!!?!?!!?!?!!?
> DID YOU SAY "HUNDRED"?!?!?!!!??!?!

Actually, I typed it, but it amounts to the same thing.

> *ahem*
> Hate to say this, but... SICK! I'd like to see how an honest character in a
> non-munchkin campaign got this much! That's Three THOUSAND Karma, chummers.
> Shadowrun's been out for about 4 years, or roughly 1000 karma per year.
> At ~50 weeks in a year, that's 20 karma per week! Is that just an extremely
> high powered campaign, or a karma-easy one? Considering even the UB module
> didn't give out that much! (p.199, SR2 Black) "A real horror show woulde be
> worth 6 to 8 points or so, but that requires combat, danger, and powerful
> opposition, where the objective is wrapped in twisting paths of mystery!"

Most of the modules award more than that,such as Imago and
Harlequin, as well as the Findley-specials int he back of the NAN
books. As for the rest, we play an average of 3-4 times a week
when we *do* play Shadowrun. Munchkin? Sometimes I think that
munchkin doesn't mean what most people *think* it means. It
becomes a convenient word to bandy about when someone is playing
a higher level game than you'd ever *think* of. To the point,
the PCs were all at roughly the same level of power and were
roughly equally challenged. And it _is_ possible to challenge
them. Yes, I've been able to burn out a Decker's 124 pt. Karma
pool in a reasonably secure matrix system. Anyway, none of the
PCs had a significant advantage over other PCs played at the
same time, nor were the players really trying to attain it. The
words you may be searching for is "Monty Haul" but then Monty
Haul doesn't have car bombs and snipers.

But, you play your way, and I'll play mine, and I won't put you
down for playing at whatever power level you desire, why should
I?

> The groups around here...

Marzhavasati Kali |If mail bounces, check spelling. It's deirdre.
deirdre@***.org |If that doesn't work, send mail to
|deirdre%efn.org@*******.cs.uoregon.edu
"You can have my gun when you pry it out of my hand with _your_
cold, dead fingers."
-- DB
Message no. 5
From: Neal A Porter <nap@*****.PHYSICS.SWIN.OZ.AU>
Subject: Re: Huge Personal Karma pool
Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1993 14:21:15 +1100
Deird'Re Brooks :
>In the games I've played and GM'd, Karma Pools have run from one
>all the way up to 300+ (eek!). The high end characters have been
>played for a *long* time, you see. Anyway, about four
>streetgangers with a Threat Rating of three or a Group Karma of
>20-30 should be sufficient to eat his Karma up real fast. Unless
>he refuses to fight.
>
>Just a few thoughts . . .
>
>Deirdre, who brought Sister Sinister from a Group Total of 300
>down to six in three encounters

Is this 300 the group or personal Karma. And also are you talking about
permenant loss of Karma pool, or just use until it refreshes.
If it permenant how did the charecters feel about four years worth of work
going down the drain?

You seem to play a very high powered game either way, do your players
enjoy that sort of game? If they do then the best of luck to you, I just hope
none of your charecters ever take a dislike to mine.

Adeus
Message no. 6
From: Ben Jordan <jordanbd@***.BELOIT.EDU>
Subject: Re: Huge Personal Karma pool
Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1993 16:39:15 +22310502
Seems I may have made a mistake. If someone would be so kind as to correct
my understanding of group karma pools, I would be most happy. I thought
that 10% of the karma that each cha. earns at the end of an adventure can,
infact must, go into the karma pool. If each player earns 4 karma (low for
the type of encounters we have--we are just very lucky and inventive. :))
then each players donation is .4x4 (average number of players). Each cha.
also has to put in one point to start with just to be a part of the pool. I
thought that this point counted in the pool. This is just what our GM told
us.
--

Ben-ha-meen
--i feel evil. like, that i am evil, not that
i feel an evil presence or something--

james mcculloch
Message no. 7
From: Ben Jordan <jordanbd@***.BELOIT.EDU>
Subject: Re: Huge Personal Karma pool
Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1993 17:13:28 +22310502
Well, I have always been of the opinion that you cna take out any other cha.
if you do it right. If one of those 300+ karma point cha. deceided to kill
me I might just step over into their world for a moment and do something
really silly like expend enough C4 on their appartment to blow up a few city
blocks. Our previous party did it, we could do it again. Of course I
recomend retiring those cha. right away. People tend to get a bit upset
when you demolish 3 or 4 city blocks. Still, I do not think even 300+ karma
can defend against 90+ kilos of C4. Who needs a nuke? All that nasty
radiation.
--

Ben-ha-meen
--i feel evil. like, that i am evil, not that
i feel an evil presence or something--

james mcculloch
Message no. 8
From: Deird'Re Brooks <deirdre@***.ORG>
Subject: Re: Huge Personal Karma pool
Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1993 21:46:02 -0800
> Seems I may have made a mistake. If someone would be so kind as to correct
> my understanding of group karma pools, I would be most happy. I thought
> that 10% of the karma that each cha. earns at the end of an adventure can,
> infact must, go into the karma pool. If each player earns 4 karma (low for
> the type of encounters we have--we are just very lucky and inventive. :))
> then each players donation is .4x4 (average number of players). Each cha.
> also has to put in one point to start with just to be a part of the pool. I
> thought that this point counted in the pool. This is just what our GM told
> us.

Actually, 10% of all earned Karma goes into your _personal_ Karma
pool, but you can donate as much as you like to the group Karma
Pool, but must donate at least one to make use of it.
Oh yeah, that's 10% rounded _up_.

Marzhavasati Kali |If mail bounces, check spelling. It's deirdre.
deirdre@***.org |If that doesn't work, send mail to
|deirdre%efn.org@*******.cs.uoregon.edu
"Absolute power doesn't corrupt. It's _boring_!"
-- Candy Sweetwater
Message no. 9
From: Deird'Re Brooks <deirdre@***.ORG>
Subject: Re: Huge Personal Karma pool
Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1993 21:50:38 -0800
> Well, I have always been of the opinion that you cna take out any other cha.
> if you do it right. If one of those 300+ karma point cha. deceided to kill
> me I might just step over into their world for a moment and do something
> really silly like expend enough C4 on their appartment to blow up a few city
> blocks. Our previous party did it, we could do it again. Of course I
> recomend retiring those cha. right away. People tend to get a bit upset
> when you demolish 3 or 4 city blocks. Still, I do not think even 300+ karma
> can defend against 90+ kilos of C4. Who needs a nuke? All that nasty
> radiation.

Nah, nukes can be pretty clean if you're careful about it. I
mean, really, we're talking 61 years into the future. A small
suitcase nuke would do the job admirably, _and_ leave very little
fallout.

Or you could attempt to use a fuel-air explosive. That would
give you thermonuclear level explosion without the nuclear. Just
heat, light and kinetic energy.

Marzhavasati Kali |If mail bounces, check spelling. It's deirdre.
deirdre@***.org |If that doesn't work, send mail to
|deirdre%efn.org@*******.cs.uoregon.edu
"There's no such thing as overkill, just undertargeting."
-- Strega
(That one seems appropriate in this case. ;-) )

Further Reading

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