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Message no. 1
From: "Bill P. Flint" <claymore@******.DIGEX.NET>
Subject: Immortals in shadowrun world...
Date: Wed, 4 May 1994 23:56:40 -0400
I have been kicking around the idea of how imortals might exist in the shadowrun
world.

One idea is the immortals go on a cycle of some sort. It would be something
like a bunch of immortals are being born during the mana awaking period. These
immortals would be fighting for the prize and a winner would rise to the top
by at least a 100 years before the next awaking. This last immortal would dye
the day before the awaking. The cycle would then start all over again with
immortals being born during the next awaking.

What you all thing and any input, flames, critizism, etc. will be welcome.

--Claymore the Metaknight Champion
Message no. 2
From: Michael Garoni <Michael_Garoni@*********.COM>
Subject: Re: Immortals in shadowrun world...
Date: Thu, 5 May 1994 01:57:14 EST
:]I have been kicking around the idea of how imortals might exist in the
:]shadowrun world.
:]
:]Claymore the Metaknight Champion

But they do exist - Harlequin, Ehran the Scribe and a couple of others in the
Tir. The difference is that these guys DON'T die.

Obi Wan
Message no. 3
From: Dave S Johnson <john0286@****.TC.UMN.EDU>
Subject: Re: Immortals in shadowrun world...
Date: Thu, 5 May 1994 04:59:58 -0500
On Wed, 4 May 1994, Bill P. Flint wrote:

> I have been kicking around the idea of how imortals might exist in the shadowrun
> world.
>
> One idea is the immortals go on a cycle of some sort. It would be something
> like a bunch of immortals are being born during the mana awaking period. These
> immortals would be fighting for the prize and a winner would rise to the top
> by at least a 100 years before the next awaking. This last immortal would dye
> the day before the awaking. The cycle would then start all over again with
> immortals being born during the next awaking.
>
> What you all thing and any input, flames, critizism, etc. will be welcome.
>
> --Claymore the Metaknight Champion

Tjhese people would of course by NPC's in my world. Although I dought I
would uise them since this is an old and worn out scenerio, for myself and
those I know anyway. Maybe think of immortal wannabe's who have gone
extremist/psycho.

Dave S Johnson
Message no. 4
From: Gurth <jweste%smtp@******.HZEELAND.NL>
Subject: Immortals in shadowrun world... - Reply
Date: Thu, 5 May 1994 20:03:39 +0200
I think that the people who come closest to Highlander's immortals in
Shadowrun are the elves of the likes of Harlequin and Ehran. 5000 years
old seems pretty immortal to me...
Message no. 5
From: J Gavigan <csc086@*****.LANCS.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Immortals in shadowrun world...
Date: Thu, 5 May 1994 21:34:13 +0100
> I have been kicking around the idea of how imortals might exist in the
shadowrun
> world.

What if they wre just always there. *shrug*

To quote - "Noone knew we were among you... until now."


/// /// There can be only One...
\ // / /
\ //// _/ / ..Dodger!
\_ //// /
\___/ /
/ \_
/,)-_( \_ \
(/ \\ /\\\\ <\
// >\
-======================((============>:::(0)//////]O
' >/
</
Message no. 6
From: J Gavigan <csc086@*****.LANCS.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Immortals in shadowrun world...
Date: Thu, 5 May 1994 21:55:42 +0100
> Tjhese people would of course by NPC's in my world. Although I dought I

Why? I play an immortal in a Storyteller game, with a group of
Vampires, using the net.supplement. Ok, I'm immortal, I heal
very quickly, etc, but I'm still looking over my shoulder
the whole time in case the shadowy figure I've been chasing
for the last five gaming sessions, who's been going around
killing Vamps, Magi, and other supernatural creatures
indiscriminately, and taking their Quintessence/Quickening,
you name it, and who, apparently, seems to have shapechanging
abilities, and this particular aspect of the game kinda
outweighs the advantages playing an immie offers.

Jackin' out...

/> Dod
/<
O[\\\\\\(O):::<======================================-
\<
\> Dodger - csc086 @ cent1.lancs.ac.uk

"Fighting to survive in a world with the darkest powers!"
- Queen, 'Princes of the Universe'
-----===*===-----
Message no. 7
From: J Gavigan <csc086@*****.LANCS.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Immortals in shadowrun world... - Reply
Date: Thu, 5 May 1994 23:45:39 +0100
> I think that the people who come closest to Highlander's immortals in
> Shadowrun are the elves of the likes of Harlequin and Ehran. 5000 years
> old seems pretty immortal to me...

I was under the impression that they used magic to prolong their
lifespan beyond the normal 500 years, or so that a elf lives...
In any case, we aren't talking about immortals as in people just
living a long time. We're talking about characters like these in
the film 'Highlander', with all the background that that film
contains, including the Gathering, Quickening, etc. Just being
an extremely long-lived person doesn't qualify you as the sort
of immortal we are talking about here.


There can be only One...

/> ..Dodger!
/<
O[\\\\\\(O):::<======================================-
\<
\> Dodger - csc086 @ cent1.lancs.ac.uk

-----===*===-----
Message no. 8
From: Bryan Prince <WALAB@******.HH.VANDERBILT.EDU>
Subject: Re: Immortals in shadowrun world... - Reply
Date: Fri, 6 May 1994 08:00:58 -0600
Dodger--(and all you other Highlanders out there)
Just a quick question--In the movie, when Chris wins the final battle and
becomes the HIGHLANDER, he then also picks up powers that enable him to
'hear' all mankind (the way I remember it) and he becomes a sort of
caretaker to lesser mankind. If this is the case for SR, then how many
immortals are the CEO's of Corps and such, and wouldn't the 'good'
immortals' Corps be beneficial to man? We haven't seen any evidence of
this in SR yet, so I guess there are no immortals? Maybe I'm just
confused....

Bryan Prince aka SHADOWMASTER
Message no. 9
From: "James M. Nichols" <JMNICH00@****.UKY.EDU>
Subject: Re: Immortals in shadowrun world... - Reply
Date: Fri, 6 May 1994 10:33:53 EDT
This is the last time I'll clutter the list with this but could someone here in
the states give me the number of a movie "club" type place that could order
said unedited version of Highlander.

By the way, someone mentioned a 'director's cut' released in '90 or so. If th
is was a U.S. release could they give me some in-depth info on it. Does it con
tain all (or most) of the unseen stuff and where to get it. If it WAS a U.S.
release then it might be easier (and CHEAPER) to get than a Euro version.

Any and all help would be GREATLY appreciated.


James M. Nichols
Message no. 10
From: jacob hawkins <HAWKINSJ@********.WA.COM>
Subject: Re: Immortals in shadowrun world... - Reply
Date: Fri, 6 May 1994 22:07:47 +0200
I'd say there are some corps out there lookin' out for the humie/meta-
humie race.

Look at Aztechnology, they terminate (and I don't mean fire) any
employees of theirs found to be members of the Universal Brotherhood
(those damn ROACHES!)


Snakebait
______________________________________________________________________
"Sealed with a curse as sharp as a knife | Doctor Emilio Lizardo
Doomed is your soul and damned is your life!"| a.k.a Lord John
| Whorphin
Message no. 11
From: Darth Vader <j07c@***.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: Immortals in shadowrun world... - Reply
Date: Sat, 7 May 1994 15:01:55 +0100
> Just a quick question--In the movie, when Chris wins the final battle and
> becomes the HIGHLANDER, he then also picks up powers that enable him to
> 'hear' all mankind (the way I remember it) and he becomes a sort of
> caretaker to lesser mankind. If this is the case for SR, then how many
> immortals are the CEO's of Corps and such, and wouldn't the 'good'
> immortals' Corps be beneficial to man? We haven't seen any evidence of
> this in SR yet, so I guess there are no immortals? Maybe I'm just
> confused....

Well the last immortal to survive gets all those kewl powers
that doesnt mean however that he has to use them for the good of
mankind. In the film the Highlander was 'the good guy' TM so he
became 'a caretaker to lesser mankind' but imagine what would
happen if Kurgan managed to win :)

--

Strong am I with the Force... but not that strong!
Twilight is upon me and soon night must fall.
That is the way of things ... the way of the Force.

GCS -d+@ -p+(---) c+++ l+ u+++ e+ m++(-) s+/ !n(---) h*(+) f+ !g w+ t+ r++ y?
Message no. 12
From: Nightfox <DJWA@******.UCC.NAU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Immortals in shadowrun world... - Reply
Date: Sat, 7 May 1994 15:26:25 -0700
>I'd say there are some corps out there lookin' out for the humie/meta-
>humie race.
>
>Look at Aztechnology, they terminate (and I don't mean fire) any
>employees of theirs found to be members of the Universal Brotherhood
>(those damn ROACHES!)

Yes, they may do that, but who is to say it is for the benign benifit of man
kind. they most probably have an alterrior motive and would not be pleased with
the idea of an outside force starting to infiltrate them. That would explain
the purge.


Nightfox


BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!
Daniel Waisley + SCA - March of Ered Sul - Flagstaff AZ
DJWA@******.UCC.NAU.EDU + Nau fencing club.
"Nightfox" + Brotherhood of the Cryptic Demesne -household
BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!
GE - d+(-) -p+@ c++(++++) !L u(--) e+(*) m+ s+/ !n+(-) h* f+ g+ w+++ t+ r+ y+
"infinity = zero" - Daniel Waisley "Nightfox"
BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!
Message no. 13
From: J Gavigan <csc086@*****.LANCS.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Immortals in shadowrun world... - Reply
Date: Fri, 6 May 1994 18:17:46 +0100
ShadowMaster wrote:

> Dodger--(and all you other Highlanders out there)
> Just a quick question--In the movie, when Chris wins the final battle and
> becomes the HIGHLANDER, he then also picks up powers that enable him to
> 'hear' all mankind (the way I remember it) and he becomes a sort of
> caretaker to lesser mankind. If this is the case for SR, then how many
> immortals are the CEO's of Corps and such, and wouldn't the 'good'
> immortals' Corps be beneficial to man? We haven't seen any evidence of
> this in SR yet, so I guess there are no immortals? Maybe I'm just
> confused....

Right, well, first of all, we're not saying that immortals are
part of Shadowrun's official universe, as detailed by FASA, in
the sourcebooks, etc. We're just consodering the ways in which
we, ourselves would incorporate immortals into our Shadowrun
games, if we wanted to let one of our players play the character
of an immortal...

Going on to the question of immortals being CEOs, etc. The first
thing to remember is that, in the film, Connor Mac Leod won the
Prize, which is something that should be practically unattainable
a player character to do... The Prize means that the immortal who
wins it is, in essence a god. He holds _all_ the knowledge ever
possessed by any immortal who was beheaded in the course of the
Gathering. All the power of the quickening is at his disposal...
The Prize, in reality is not something that can, or, indeed,
should be defined, as, in the film, until it was won, noone knew
what it meant, or was...
In the film, and in the series, as well, to a certain extent, all
the immortals we see are loners, travellers, etc. They don't stay
in one place forany real lentgh of time, although there are except-
ions, like Mac Leod, who has worked out a way of staying in the
same place the whole time... Normally, though, one would expect an
immortal to be a traveller, wandering around the world, looking for
other immortals, striving for the Prize. Immortals do not seek the
limelight, ever. It is almost as if they have their own Masquerade
(a la 'Vampire') to maintain. As Connery said - "Noone has known we
were among you... Until now."
Where is the advantage in having an immortal as the CEO of a corp?
Alright, he is very knowledgable, etc., but it takes more than skills
and knowledge to run a multinational corporation. Perhaps an immortal
might find a space in one of the corp armies, but, if he were to be
found out, he would probably be captured and dissected, in an attempt
to discover the source of his immortality. So, it would make a hell
of a lot more sense to maintain the secret of the immortal's presence
in the world, and quietly go about the business of winning the Prize.
Another reason why I doubt an immortal would be interested in
something like the CEOship of a corp - the only ambition any
normal immortal could have is that of winning the Prize. Nothing
else really matters... Especially as the Gathering is in full swing
at this stage...

Basically, I'm saying that, were I to incorporate the idea of
immortals from the film Highlander into a Shadowrun campaign, I would
run them the same as they are portrayed in the film. One thing,
though... I doubt whether I'd consider allowing them to use cyberware,
du to the way in which the Quickening ties their body and mind
together... I reckon that an immortal would reject cyberware. In any
case, by 2055, the Gathering would be in full swing, so immortlas in
2055 would be pretty powerful... They could probably match any
cyberpunk, in my opinion...

Anyway, that's my two cents worth...


Jackin' out...

/> Dodger
/<
O[\\\\\\(O):::<======================================-
\<
\> Dodger - csc086 @ cent1.lancs.ac.uk

Jack Gavigan, "If you did it and lived, then
Lancaster University, you probably did it right..."
England. --JKW, Freelancer

-----===*===-----
Message no. 14
From: "Bill P. Flint" <claymore@******.DIGEX.NET>
Subject: Re: Immortals in shadowrun world... - Reply
Date: Mon, 9 May 1994 17:39:51 -0400
I started this thread and noone has truely tried to give an give concept of
putting immortals in the shadowrun world or even reponded to my suggestion.

I have already seen the movies and about 75%-90% of all the shows on TV.

I now would just like some ideas.

Not that wea already have immortals and they are elves, CEO are the immortals,
or what the prize they get and how it effects them.

--Claymore
Message no. 15
From: Ivy Ryan <ivyryan@***.ORG>
Subject: Re: Immortals in shadowrun world... - Reply
Date: Mon, 9 May 1994 17:24:08 -0700
Bill,
The only "immortals" that I use are vampires, elves, and some
humans who have the right magic. But I don't think they'd hurt any. If
you keep control of them.
Enjoy,
Ivy K
Message no. 16
From: Gurth <jweste%smtp@******.HZEELAND.NL>
Subject: Re: Immortals in shadowrun world... - Reply - Reply
Date: Wed, 11 May 1994 09:52:37 +0200
>I have already seen the movies and about 75%-90% of all the shows on TV.

The first movie was good, the second was a lot less, and the shows are
OK, all IMHO.

>I now would just like some ideas.

>Not that wea already have immortals and they are elves, CEO are the
>immortals,
>or what the prize they get and how it effects them.

I have thought about this a bit since this thread started, and this is
more or less what I came up with:

1) Immortals can be of any (meta)human race. You can explain this by
either saying that the orks, elves, and whatever, were born after the
Awakening (that is if you disregard the rather weak "alien from Zeist"
story from Highlander 2), or that they changed into the metahuman after
the Awakening.

2) They have Regeneration power (see below), and can only be killed if
their head gets chopped off. When an immortal gets a Deadly wound from an
edged weapon, roll 1D6: 5 or 6 = head is gone. Deadly wound from other
source (gunshot, car crash, etc.) roll 2D6: 11+ = head gone.

3) No fighting between immortals on holy ground (or was it that they
could only fight on holy ground? I always get it mixed up...) If they do,
no bonus from killing their opponent (see point 4). You could define holy
ground as terrain with a background count of 2 or higher.

4) When an immortal kills another immortal (i.e. chops off the head), he
receives all knowledge from the other immortal. Accompanied by lightning
effects and all (which takes 1D6+1 Combat Turns), he thus gets a number
of points of Karma equal to, let's say, one-tenth the total amount of
Karma that the other immortal collected in his/her lifetime.

5) The Prize is mortality. Once all other immortals have been killed, the
survivor has all their knowledge and karma, and becomes mortal. He also
gets a few powers: Empathy, Magic Sense (Mana Detection in Paranormal
Animals of North America), and maybe some others.

About regeneration: I never liked FASA's description of that power. At
the end of the turn _all_ damage heals immediately? Why not say that the
creature gets a number of points equal to its body, or maybe roll a Body
test against a Target Number = number of boxes filled in, and the number
of boxes retrieved is equal to the successes.

Anyway, hope this answers some questions (all is my opinion, before
anyone flames, thwaps, whatevers me :+)



+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+ Gurth + "Ik kom u vrede en geluk brengen." +
+ (jweste%smtp@******.hzeeland.nl) + "MOOI! ZET MAAR IN DE GANG NEER!" +
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Message no. 17
From: "Bill P. Flint" <claymore@******.DIGEX.NET>
Subject: Re: Immortals in shadowrun world... - Reply - Reply
Date: Wed, 11 May 1994 08:37:57 -0400
Now this is what I been looking for. I especially like the idea of getting
1/10 of the karma earned from the defeated immortal. It a view I haven't
thought of.

Here my response about the movie(s): Higherlander 2: There should have only be
one.

I hope to see more responses like this.

--Claymore
Message no. 18
From: Gurth <jweste%smtp@******.HZEELAND.NL>
Subject: Re: Immortals in shadowrun world... - Reply - Reply - Reply
Date: Wed, 11 May 1994 19:39:27 +0200
>Now this is what I been looking for. I especially like the idea of
>getting
>1/10 of the karma earned from the defeated immortal. It a view I
>haven't thought of.

Glad you liked it (I thought most of the stuff up while typing the
message, BTW).

>I hope to see more responses like this.

Then maybe someone can give one for the following: Replicants. (yep, I
saw Bladerunner today :+)



+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+ Gurth + In this bright future +
+ (jweste%smtp@******.hzeeland.nl) + You can't forget your past +
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Message no. 19
From: sabrina <sabrina@******.MED.NYU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Immortals in shadowrun world... - Reply - Reply
Date: Wed, 11 May 1994 15:36:39 -0400
> Here my response about the movie(s): Higherlander 2: There should have only be
> one.
>
> I hope to see more responses like this.

Like this?

Hilander Poo: The Sickening
Message no. 20
From: Ivy Ryan <ivyryan@***.ORG>
Subject: Re: Immortals in shadowrun world... - Reply - Reply
Date: Wed, 11 May 1994 12:52:49 -0700
Please Gurth,
The Regeneration rules are fine just as they are.
Micro-controlling SRII just makes it a bad game, instead of the best.
Ivy K
Message no. 21
From: Christopher Tong <tongster@*****.NET>
Subject: Re: Immortals in shadowrun world... - Reply - Reply - Reply
Date: Wed, 11 May 1994 13:21:36 -0700
Here's what we did . . .

PhysAd power, cost 5

After each turn, roll Body dice against the number of Wound boxes the
character has received. The number of successes equals the number of boxes
healed.

Sword concealability is raised to 12.

Can Sense another Immie within WIL X 5 meters.

Cannot drop under Magic Rating 5.

Can ONLY be human.

Cannot kill in any place with magical Background Rating of 3.

Quickening increases magical Background Rating of the area by one, and
shorts out all electrical systems within WIL meters. Gains +1 Karma,
Specail Skill of choice at Rating 5, really neat sword. Quickening takes
d6 Turns.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Tongster |tong@****.berkeley.edu|"We're gonna need another Timmy!"|
| Elric of the NTB| tongster@*****.net | -Mr. Lizard |
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
| "I have no trouble finding dates. Dates have trouble finding me!" |
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 22
From: Nightfox <DJWA@******.UCC.NAU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Immortals in shadowrun world... - Reply - Reply
Date: Wed, 11 May 1994 19:18:01 -0700
>About regeneration: I never liked FASA's description of that power. At
>the end of the turn _all_ damage heals immediately? Why not say that the
>creature gets a number of points equal to its body, or maybe roll a Body
>test against a Target Number = number of boxes filled in, and the number
>of boxes retrieved is equal to the successes.

I like this idea, it lends more "Its heeling before my eyes" type of thing to
regeneration. I also like the 3 boxs per turn that somebody posted as a lesser
form, though I would do just 1 box per turn.

Nightfox
Message no. 23
From: Thorben Woehler <tew@****.INFORMATIK.RWTH-AACHEN.DE>
Subject: Re: Immortals in shadowrun world... - Reply
Date: Fri, 13 May 1994 14:54:11 +0200
> I like this idea, it lends more "Its heeling before my eyes" type of thing
to
> regeneration. I also like the 3 boxs per turn that somebody posted as a lesser
> form, though I would do just 1 box per turn.

It was me, Nightfox...


But the 1 box per turn would not do anything in a combat situation, because
everything goes so damn fast!

Therefore we changed it to 3 boxes per turn (actually it was 1 box before that).

SHADE

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Thwap!