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Message no. 1
From: Mon goose <landsquid@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Insane Armor values / R2 damage idea
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 21:36:32 PST
<snip on perforating a car body with some autofire>
>what damage has it actually suffered? It's still drivable, its handling
>and acceleration aren't affected. There aren't many places to hit a car
>that will significantly affect its performance.

Yeah, that occurred to me when my character wasted a limo easily
with a shotgun with apds slugs. He's got good firearms, but no vehicle
B/R, so how did he know where the battery, fueltank, or oilpan was?
Just blowing out the radiator, or even more vital parts, WON't cause a
crash (at least not instantly). A diasabled vehicle shouldn't be an
instant crash, and the shooter needs a vulnerable point to aim for to do
much harm- that, or a weapon that explodes or othewise damages a large
portion of the vehicle.
Unless you can hit a crucial spot, the most you'll likely cause is a
light wound or cosmetic damage. Although, didn't I hear something about
rebes shooting down older Russian choppers in Afganastan with assault
rifles? Took two 10 round bursts of apds for our back-up samurai to
pull the same trick on a police chopper (i think one of the upgraded

Hows this:

A vehicle with a body of 2 is man-sized, right? So, multiply the
effective power (after armor) of the weapon by (2/body) when resisting
damage, to simulate a relatively smaller or larger "wound chanel". Yes,
power is INFINITE for body zero- any hit destroys them. A riggers
control pool still goes against the same target (its a different number
than power in our campaign).
To solve the problem that incresing the damage level is too easy for
the skilled attacker, staging should be brought back, just for the
attacker, at least with Non-av/ap weapons. Make the attacker get as
many succeses as vehicle body to stage up the damage. Big vehicles
would require a much larger or more crucial wound to be facing the same
peformance loss. Of course, as usual, the vehicle would only need 2
succesess to reduce damage 1 level. All damage is staged automatically
deadly for 0 body drones as a consequence. Non av/ap weapons still do
one level less base damage.

So, a HP with APDS shooting an armoured van (4/6) would do a base of
3l {[9-(6/2)]*(2/4)]}, and need 4 succeses to stage up! A salvalette
gurdian with APDS in burst does 4m {[12-(6/2)*(2/4)]}, and would do the
same with improved explosive ammo; [(14-6)*(2/4)]= 4m. An Ares alpha
firing a 10 round burst (regular ammo) would do 6d [(18-6)*(2/4)], with
the same chance to stage up. Since it is already doing deadly damage,
every 4 of the attackers succeses would only require the vehicle to get
two. An assult cannon would do the same base damage (6d), and as it
would need only 2 succeses to increase the damage level, all successes
would have to be equalled by the vehicle before damage could be staged
Note that APDS ammo becomes less signifigant against large vehicles-
sure, it penetrates, but what does it hit? Explosive actually becomes
some what better, as in reality. Shooting at the crew becomes the best
option for any small arm.
For ease of use, a "body size vs effective power" chart could be
drawn up, with the vehicles body resistance TN as the table result.

Pretty sweet, neh? Under this system, it would be OK to have a
vehicle with increased "body" statistic, as long as the original (size
based) body was used to compute power and required succeses. I'd still
restrict it (Say 1 for civilian, 2 for security, 3 or 4 for military,
and at high cost, as with these adjustments, body dice can do some good.
Maybe the same design / custimization stats as armor.)

This is reminiscent of the early SR using differnt damage codes for
persons and vehicle (it was half power and staging, right, then just
half power and one less level, then just half power?)
In that time, armor has gotten slightly cheaper but no more common,
and body has actually dropped. Also, personel body armorhas gotten
generally better (layering, gell packs, military). Meaning the average
power a vehicle resists has gone up, and more succeses are needed to
resist damage. Its now as easy to kill a tank as an orc in military

In fact, this system basically makes humans a special target type
with a "body size" of 2, a variable body statistic, and taking an extra
damage level for having more vulnerable points. Animals and some
characters (trolls) could be given "body size" ratings based on mass, as
P23 of R2. Increased "body size" could be a merit (and flaw) for Orcs
and Trolls - a 1200 Kg troll is not unreasonable, but who'd play one?
A dragons realistic mass is HOW many tons? :)

A similar system could be used for colisions- adjust the crashes
power up by multipling by (body/2), then apply damage to the other
vehicle or pedestrian as above. "Hit by a bus"- OUCH.

Well, thats my massive missive for the day. I think I'll write it
up with a table for Paolo's archive page, so give me some feedback
before I send it if you see any bugs or have other suggestions.

Mongoose / Technological progress is like an ax in the hands
of a psycotic - Einstien

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