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From:	Manolis Skoulikas greatworm@*****.com
Subject:	Invisibility in the Astral
Date:	Fri, 10 Mar 2000 08:55:55 +0200

Message no. 1 Some sessions ago I toyed with the idea that maybe through masking
or through some other sombo one could hide his aura in the astral.
Fact is you can hide the spell and foci auras with masking but you can
only disguise your own for that of a mundane.
So, I could come out with anything and opted for masking and camouflage
spells
to go about as ''wallpaper'' or the occasional passing
watcher(fetch-boy)spirit.

Still, it keeps nagging at me.

IS Invisibility in the astral (therefore read TOTAL invisibility)
another
unobtainable myth in SR (like teleportation) or am I missing something?

Gather ye all round of munchkin born and all not idle to the riddle!
A quest I put before you. Rob those evil corpers of their privacy,
and shadowruning spellworms will ever be of gratitude!!!

Start a string boyz & girls
You name it:
Spirit powers
Stealth
Masking
Alternate spells
Anything to keep us invisible in the astral!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

From:	Tamino tamino@*******.com.au
Subject:	Invisibility in the Astral
Date:	Fri, 10 Mar 2000 18:35:17 +1000

Message no. 2 At 08:55 AM 10/03/00 +0200, you wrote:
>Some sessions ago I toyed with the idea that maybe through masking
>or through some other sombo one could hide his aura in the astral.
> Fact is you can hide the spell and foci auras with masking but you can
>only disguise your own for that of a mundane.
>So, I could come out with anything and opted for masking and camouflage
>spells
>to go about as ''wallpaper'' or the occasional passing
>watcher(fetch-boy)spirit.
>
>Still, it keeps nagging at me.
>
>IS Invisibility in the astral (therefore read TOTAL invisibility)
>another
>unobtainable myth in SR (like teleportation) or am I missing something?

There is a faerie critter power in one of the paranormal animal books that
lets brownies and the little faerie creatures mask there aura completely in
astral, ie, complete astral invisibility...but then it's been a long time
since I read POAOE

-Tamino ...All too easy

"ISTI MIRANT STELLA" - Bayeux Tapestry
tamino@*******.com.au

From:	HHackerH@*.com HHackerH@*.com
Subject:	Invisibility in the Astral
Date:	Fri, 10 Mar 2000 05:06:43 EST

Message no. 3 In a message dated Fri, 10 Mar 2000 2:04:28 AM Eastern Standard Time, Manolis Skoulikas
<greatworm@*****.com> writes:

<snip reasons for the thread> Still, it keeps nagging at me.
> IS Invisibility in the astral (therefore read TOTAL invisibility)
> another
> unobtainable myth in SR (like teleportation) or am I missing something?
>
> Gather ye all round of munchkin born and all not idle to the riddle!
> A quest I put before you. Rob those evil corpers of their privacy,
> and shadowruning spellworms will ever be of gratitude!!!
>
> Start a string boyz & girls
> You name it:
> Spirit powers
> Stealth
> Masking
> Alternate spells
> Anything to keep us invisible in the astral!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Metaquest of Masking... Raise the entire aura to the Metaplanes. Of course, there might
be problems with this as well in other ways ...

-Keith

From:	HHackerH@*.com HHackerH@*.com
Subject:	Invisibility in the Astral
Date:	Fri, 10 Mar 2000 05:08:05 EST

Message no. 4 In a message dated Fri, 10 Mar 2000 3:37:54 AM Eastern Standard Time, Tamino
<tamino@*******.com.au> writes:

> There is a faerie critter power in one of the paranormal animal books that
> lets brownies and the little faerie creatures mask there aura completely in
> astral, ie, complete astral invisibility...but then it's been a long time
> since I read POAOE

The only power like that I can recall is "Glamour", and it's just a bit more
than "masking" ...

=Keith

From:	Manolis Skoulikas greatworm@*****.com
Subject:	Invisibility in the Astral
Date:	Sat, 11 Mar 2000 01:15:44 +0200

Message no. 5 HHackerH@***.com wrote:
>
> In a message dated Fri, 10 Mar 2000 2:04:28 AM Eastern Standard Time, Manolis
Skoulikas <greatworm@*****.com> writes:
>
> <snip reasons for the thread> Still, it keeps nagging at me.
> > IS Invisibility in the astral (therefore read TOTAL invisibility)
> > another
> > unobtainable myth in SR (like teleportation) or am I missing something?
> >

>
> Metaquest of Masking... Raise the entire aura to the Metaplanes. Of course, there
might be problems with this as well in other ways ...
>
> -Keith

Unfortunately the astral concealment metaquest only covers the tracks of
your astral signature, not your aura itself , which remains all too
visible and can be assensed without any metaplanar impediment.

It remains a good idea in the context of the critter power ''fading''
A similar stunt can work for desperate getaway to the metaplanes
if your astral body is being chased by many other mages or a not so
determined to follow higher level initiate (both cases making astral
evasion a lousy option). go on rating 2 quest and you lose the ''pasee''
over that astral ''Rio Grande''.

From:	Manolis Skoulikas greatworm@*****.com
Subject:	Invisibility in the Astral
Date:	Sat, 11 Mar 2000 01:34:16 +0200

Message no. 6 HHackerH@***.com wrote:
>
> In a message dated Fri, 10 Mar 2000 3:37:54 AM Eastern Standard Time, Tamino
<tamino@*******.com.au> writes:
>
> > There is a faerie critter power in one of the paranormal animal books that
> > lets brownies and the little faerie creatures mask there aura completely in
> > astral, ie, complete astral invisibility...but then it's been a long time
> > since I read POAOE
>
> The only power like that I can recall is "Glamour", and it's just a bit
more than "masking" ...
>
> =Keith

Can somebody tell me where can I get somebody to perform that
''glamour'' for me?

Thanks for the idea anyway. I plan on meeting ''Grandma'' from the
boston underground (ref. Technobabel novel), a shadorun fixer Baba Yaga
Spirit (she keeps a pet Djoo Noo Qua bodyguard whose horn clippings I
need for a focus formula). Some serious gamemaster bootlicking and
NPC hoop kissing is coming my way, possibly an Essence point or two
for the ''closing'' of the deal. I may try to convince her to teach me
the ''glamour'' power as limited metamagical technique for self
invisibilty in the astral.
She might say no...Inwhich case:
Here comes the foolhardy part (emphasis on FOOL):
She's a spirit.
Spirits have true names.
A rating 13 metaquest on the Metaplane of Forest (Baba Yagas are Russian
Taiga Forest malevolent spirits-I SINCERELY hope this one is) will give
me her true name and then...

Now is this the perfect quote for wishful thinking or what???

Manolis

Manolis

From:	HHackerH@*.com HHackerH@*.com
Subject:	Invisibility in the Astral
Date:	Fri, 10 Mar 2000 20:43:19 EST

Message no. 7 In a message dated 3/10/00 6:23:39 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
greatworm@*****.com writes:

>
> Unfortunately the astral concealment metaquest only covers the tracks of
> your astral signature, not your aura itself , which remains all too
> visible and can be assensed without any metaplanar impediment.

Actually, you may want to reread the stuff that was once around on the issue.
It is raising the "AURA", not just the signature to the metaplanes.

> It remains a good idea in the context of the critter power ''fading''
> A similar stunt can work for desperate getaway to the metaplanes
> if your astral body is being chased by many other mages or a not so
> determined to follow higher level initiate (both cases making astral
> evasion a lousy option). go on rating 2 quest and you lose the ''pasee''
> over that astral ''Rio Grande''.

FADING is a power that moves the entire being, which is "spirit like" to
begin with into some other "place". And as for "entering a metaplanar
quest
while projecting", that doesn't seem to be working either, as you begin a
quest from your body, not from your astral location.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
-K
-"Just a Bastard"
-Hoosier Hacker House
"Children of the Kernel"
[http://members.aol.com/hhackerh/index.html]

From:	Manolis Skoulikas greatworm@*****.com
Subject:	Invisibility in the Astral
Date:	Sun, 12 Mar 2000 02:05:34 +0200

Message no. 8 HHackerH@***.com wrote:
>
> Actually, you may want to reread the .
> It is raising the "AURA", not just the signature to the metaplanes.
>

Well, you seem to be very informed on the subject (no pun intented)
Since I can only seem to find this on the matter: MItS p.94
''Various things can be traced can be traced to a character astrally:
foci, material links for ritual sorcery, a thesis and so on. Whenever a
character is carrying one of these traceable ITEMS, they can conceal its
LINK by making an astral quest to a metaplane of their choice.'', I
would really apreciate your help in solving this. Wher does it say
anything for raising a person's aura and making it invisible on the
astral?
Please send any of the other stuff that you mentioned as I haven't been
around too long and probably missed them.If you don't have them , I
would really appreciate a quick summary with the jist of it and a couple
of reasons for support.

> > It remains a good idea in the context of the critter power ''fading''
> > A similar stunt can work for desperate getaway to the metaplanes
> > if your astral body is being chased by many other mages or a not so
> > determined to follow higher level initiate (both cases making astral
> > evasion a lousy option). go on rating 2 quest and you lose the ''pasee''
> > over that astral ''Rio Grande''.
>
> FADING is a power that moves the entire being, which is "spirit like" to
> begin with into some other "place". And as for "entering a metaplanar
quest
> while projecting", that doesn't seem to be working either, as you begin a
> quest from your body, not from your astral location.
>
K, my man, I would have to disagree with you on that. Projecting
directly to the metaplanes does not have to be directly from your body
since
you are actually astrally projecting. Consider that the ''True aura''
quest
can be accomplised when astrally assensing (and that can be while also
astrally projecting). Also, from a metaphysical point of view the
astral
is supposed to be the passageway to the metaplanes so you would
actually
have to pass through it to reach the metaplanes IMO.

Thanks for all the input, you really helped!
I look forward to the ''stuff that was once around on the issue''

The Wiz

From:	HHackerH@*.com HHackerH@*.com
Subject:	Invisibility in the Astral
Date:	Sat, 11 Mar 2000 20:53:47 EST

Message no. 9 In a message dated 3/11/00 7:13:23 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
greatworm@*****.com writes:

> Well, you seem to be very informed on the subject (no pun intented)
> Since I can only seem to find this on the matter: MItS p.94
> ''Various things can be traced can be traced to a character astrally:
> foci, material links for ritual sorcery, a thesis and so on. Whenever a
> character is carrying one of these traceable ITEMS, they can conceal its
> LINK by making an astral quest to a metaplane of their choice.'', I
> would really apreciate your help in solving this. Wher does it say
> anything for raising a person's aura and making it invisible on the
> astral?
> Please send any of the other stuff that you mentioned as I haven't been
> around too long and probably missed them.If you don't have them , I
> would really appreciate a quick summary with the jist of it and a couple
> of reasons for support.

Look under Free spirits.

> > FADING is a power that moves the entire being, which is "spirit like"
to
> > begin with into some other "place". And as for "entering a
metaplanar
> quest
> > while projecting", that doesn't seem to be working either, as you begin a
> > quest from your body, not from your astral location.
> >
> K, my man, I would have to disagree with you on that. Projecting
> directly to the metaplanes does not have to be directly from your body
> since
> you are actually astrally projecting. Consider that the ''True aura''
> quest
> can be accomplised when astrally assensing (and that can be while also
> astrally projecting). Also, from a metaphysical point of view the
> astral
> is supposed to be the passageway to the metaplanes so you would
> actually
> have to pass through it to reach the metaplanes IMO.

I think you need to quit turning run-on's into things. The sections on
'Dweller on the Threshold' give the boundaries of Astral Quest's and Astral
Projection. Read slowly through the section about it on pg. 92.

"To begin an astral , quest, a character must astrally project to a
metaplane. Initiates able to use astral projection can do so on their own.
Others must gain access to the metaplanes through the astral gateway power of
a free spirit (see Powers of Free Spirits, pg. 116). Either way, the
character must project directly to the metaplane."

There are no random wanderings there, there is no "I'm projecting along, and
while I am doing so, I am assensing this guy's aura, and well there's
something wrong, so I'm going to go off on a quest to do so" stunts. This is
one of those things that has been around since SR1 IIRC (Spike, you're the
SR1 pro here, care to verify for me please?) and has been carried at least
through SR2 to SR3.

> Thanks for all the input, you really helped!
> I look forward to the ''stuff that was once around on the issue''

And I look forward to people making statements such as this, especially in
regards to abilities and paranormal powers that are NOT related. "Fading" is
just such an occurence. I, just to satisfy this curiosity, went and read
Fading in both the Critters Handbook (SR3) and the PAOE (SR2). Both power
descriptions have to do with beings vanishing completely from the physical
and astral planes and leaving no trace of their existence behind them. This
isn't the same as "Aura Masking" or "Quest of Astral Concealment" in
any way.

Now, if you want to interpret the writing in the books to mean something
else, that is all well and good and you are welcome to do so. I'm just
fairly certain this wasn't the intent put into them.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
-K
-"Just a Bastard"
-Hoosier Hacker House
"Children of the Kernel"
[http://members.aol.com/hhackerh/index.html]

From:	Manolis Skoulikas greatworm@*****.com
Subject:	Invisibility in the Astral
Date:	Sun, 12 Mar 2000 10:30:53 +0200

Message no. 10 Ok, I think it was pretty obvious that Fading vanishes the WHOLE thing
and not just astral bodies. The similarity would be the vanishing if you
went on a quest, not the essence of the vanishing. 'Nough said.

I stand corrected on the projection - metaquest. In Grimoire, it states
''either way, the character must project directly onto the metaplane.
He can make no side trips to the etheric plane first.''
See! that was n't too difficult. Thanks for reminding me of the older
Editions. I wander why they ommited the last sentence though on MItS?

And for the life of me I can not seem to find anything on ''raising
AURAS'' in the free spirit Section. Besides a person can never be a
free spirit (unless free spirited) even if a free spirit can be a
person(according to UCAS law I think).

Find me my quote for raising auras and I will be forever grateful.

By the way you seem well informed on powers and magical techniques.
What character do you play?

The Wiz

From:	HHackerH@*.com HHackerH@*.com
Subject:	Invisibility in the Astral
Date:	Sun, 12 Mar 2000 04:36:40 EST

Message no. 11 In a message dated 3/12/00 3:38:46 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
greatworm@*****.com writes:

> And for the life of me I can not seem to find anything on ''raising
> AURAS'' in the free spirit Section. Besides a person can never be a
> free spirit (unless free spirited) even if a free spirit can be a
> person(according to UCAS law I think).

Somewhere, there is a twisted sense of logic to that sentence.

> Find me my quote for raising auras and I will be forever grateful.

Read the "Aura Masking" section on Free Spirits (pg 117 in MitS for the most
recent version). Third, to the last paragraph of that section begins the
information .... oops, fourth to the last paragraph.

It's also part of a conversation of "likelihoods" that Steve K. and some of
us on the list had once last year (not that it was really all that long ago
actually).

> By the way you seem well informed on powers and magical techniques.
> What character do you play?

I'm the GM, I play 'em all. ;-P
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
-K
-"Just a Bastard"
-Hoosier Hacker House
"Children of the Kernel"
[http://members.aol.com/hhackerh/index.html]

From:	tb33537 tb33537@***.edu
Subject:	Invisibility in the Astral
Date:	Mon, 20 Mar 2000 17:51:44 -0600

Message no. 12 and in fact this point was raised in a fiction: the dragon heart saga,
in which both a beyond the pale samurai with a spirit fused with his
soul, gets transported along with Ryan Mercury physically to the
metaplanes. I don't know about you but I think that would cause a
person's aura to seem to vanish, though the astral trail could still be
tracked.

From:	Manolis Skoulikas greatworm@*****.com
Subject:	Invisibility in the Astral
Date:	Tue, 21 Mar 2000 02:12:05 +0200

Message no. 13 tb33537 wrote:
>
> and in fact this point was raised in a fiction: the dragon heart saga,
> in which both a beyond the pale samurai with a spirit fused with his
> soul, gets transported along with Ryan Mercury physically to the
> metaplanes. I don't know about you but I think that would cause a
> person's aura to seem to vanish, though the astral trail could still be
> tracked.

I would say that the body of Burnout became the physical form of the
spirit
and eventually become one with the spirit itself. Like a possessed
character
becoming one with possessing spirit over time.

But I would n't explain fiction in game terms too strictly.
Actually if you rememeber, Lethe uses his concealement power on Burnout
and he becomes invisible on the astral also, even thought his does n't
work on the game since Concealement is type : P ,and only works
on the physical plane.
Thanks for the idea though, it helps on something I am working on.

The Wiz.

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