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Message no. 1
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Rand Ratinac)
Subject: Invisible laser sights?
Date: Tue Dec 25 05:30:01 2001
Guys, I'd presume it'd be possible to make an
invisible laser sight by using an infrared laser and
thermographic goggles or whatever, but you'd have to
have the thermo activated, which could make things
inconvenient under daylight. Right?

So the question is, would there be another way to make
an invisible sight that you yourself could track,
using goggles or (better yet) something built into a
set of shades, but which would perfectly well in both
no light and bright light? What kind of range would a
sight like this have - more or less than a visible
light laser? Would smoke block the sight in the same
way as a visible light laser? Oh, and same questions
for the infrared laser compared to a visible light
one.

Oh, and how much of this could you actually do today?

====Doc'
(aka Mr. Freaky Big, Super-Dynamic Troll of Tomorrow, aka Doc'booner, aka Doc' Vader)

.sig Sauer

If you SMELL what the DOC' is COOKING!!!

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Message no. 2
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Ross Nicoll)
Subject: Invisible laser sights?
Date: Tue Dec 25 06:30:01 2001
On Tue, 25 Dec 2001, Rand Ratinac wrote:

> Guys, I'd presume it'd be possible to make an
> invisible laser sight by using an infrared laser and
> thermographic goggles or whatever, but you'd have to
> have the thermo activated, which could make things
> inconvenient under daylight. Right?

> So the question is, would there be another way to make
> an invisible sight that you yourself could track,
> using goggles or (better yet) something built into a
> set of shades, but which would perfectly well in both
> no light and bright light? What kind of range would a
> sight like this have - more or less than a visible
> light laser? Would smoke block the sight in the same
> way as a visible light laser? Oh, and same questions
> for the infrared laser compared to a visible light
> one.

> Oh, and how much of this could you actually do today?
Thermographic goggles, AFAIK, don't have a problem with daylight. I
beleive you're thinking of low light goggles, which are a very different
technology. I beleive current tech allows you to use an IR sight, which
can be viewed fine with goggles designed for the task. AFAIK a UV sight is
also theoretically possible, but I've never heard of such a thing...
Message no. 3
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Gurth)
Subject: Invisible laser sights?
Date: Tue Dec 25 14:00:01 2001
According to Rand Ratinac, on Tue, 25 Dec 2001 the word on the street was...

> Guys, I'd presume it'd be possible to make an
> invisible laser sight by using an infrared laser and
> thermographic goggles or whatever, but you'd have to
> have the thermo activated, which could make things
> inconvenient under daylight. Right?

Not really; low-light goggles can be overloaded if used in daylight, but
IIRC modern western types tend to shut off automatically (I'd certainly
expect them to in SR) but infrared viewers have no problems with daylight.
So other than to actually wear a set of goggles, if necessary built into
sunglasses or your eyes, I don't think there would be much inconvenience.

FWIW, some modern laser sights use near-IR lasers, because low-light
goggles tend to operate in the near-IR as well, so the dot is invisible to
anyone not wearing low-light goggles.

> So the question is, would there be another way to make
> an invisible sight that you yourself could track,
> using goggles or (better yet) something built into a
> set of shades, but which would perfectly well in both
> no light and bright light?

One thing I can think of, is to use a tight radio beam. Not sure if it's
practical (probably not) but it would basically give you a miniature radar
system on your gun.

> Oh, and how much of this could you actually do today?

An invisible laser coupled to goggles is easily possible today, as it was
already used in the 1980s. I think this is the best way to go for the
question you're asking.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
"I know you're expecting me to take that as good news," Randy says.
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Message no. 4
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Downtym)
Subject: Invisible laser sights?
Date: Tue Dec 25 14:30:01 2001
On Tue, 25 Dec 2001, Ross Nicoll wrote:

> Thermographic goggles, AFAIK, don't have a problem with daylight. I
> beleive you're thinking of low light goggles, which are a very different
> technology. I beleive current tech allows you to use an IR sight, which
> can be viewed fine with goggles designed for the task. AFAIK a UV sight is
> also theoretically possible, but I've never heard of such a thing...

If you use IR, wouldn't the "dot" be blurred out if you put it on a
hot target? For example, if you line up the sight onto a person's
chest and then look through your goggles, wouldn't the sight be
obscured by the heat being emitted by the person?

Downtym |
Email: gte138j@*****.gatech.edu | Post no bills
Message no. 5
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Rand Ratinac)
Subject: Invisible laser sights?
Date: Tue Dec 25 17:50:01 2001
> > Thermographic goggles, AFAIK, don't have a problem
with daylight. I beleive you're thinking of low light
goggles, which are a very different technology. I
beleive current tech allows you to use an IR sight,
which can be viewed fine with goggles designed for the
task. AFAIK a UV sight is also theoretically possible,
but I've never heard of such a thing...
>
> If you use IR, wouldn't the "dot" be blurred out if
you put it on a hot target? For example, if you line
up the sight onto a person's chest and then look
through your goggles, wouldn't the sight be obscured
by the heat being emitted by the person?
> Downtym |

There's that possibility - what I meant about thermo
having problems with daylight, though, is that it'd be
less 'effective' than normal vision under lighted
conditions. I mean, wouldn't thermo, like, obscure
details and such stuff? That's why I was wondering if
you could use something else.

====Doc'
(aka Mr. Freaky Big, Super-Dynamic Troll of Tomorrow, aka Doc'booner, aka Doc' Vader)

.sig Sauer

If you SMELL what the DOC' is COOKING!!!

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
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from News and Sport to Email and Music Charts
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Message no. 6
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Vincent Pellerin)
Subject: Invisible laser sights?
Date: Wed Dec 26 04:05:02 2001
On Tue, 25 Dec 2001, Rand Ratinac wrote:

> So the question is, would there be another way to make
> an invisible sight that you yourself could track,
> using goggles or (better yet) something built into a
> set of shades, but which would perfectly well in both
> no light and bright light? What kind of range would a
> sight like this have - more or less than a visible
> light laser? Would smoke block the sight in the same
> way as a visible light laser? Oh, and same questions
> for the infrared laser compared to a visible light
> one.

OK, go read the War against the chtorr serie from David Gerrold or the GURPS
supplement of the same name.

EV Laser sights
This is a very specialized laser sight, which requires a weapon mount a
special helmet. It swithes its locaion in the spectrum a hundreds of times
per second. Only the user, wearing the helmet visor that swithes frequency
in the same random pattern, can see the beam. Nobody else, not even
somebody with a similar helmet, will see more than a flash once in a while
<<snip the rest of text>>

This could easely be feasable by 2060 standard using a variable frequency
laser sight linked to a set of goggles, jumping from UV to IR... With no
need to have the actual viewer scan through the spectrum, just a computer
generated visual dot added on wathever mode you are using IR, lowlight...

Is that what you where looking for? Would be great for an assassin without
a smartgun..

Range? similar to any other. I don't think it would be better at getting
trought smoke, for that microwaves or ladar (way different frequencies), or
ultrasounds would be better ( see ultrasound sight ). As a GM I would not
accept a laser sight that could go from X-rays to microwaves, IR and UV
unless it is really bulky.







---------------------------------------
- Vincent Pellerin, Geneviève Dufour -
- et Mandy (Tracy Flash of Lightning) -
- vpelleri@************.qc.ca -
---------------------------------------
Message no. 7
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Paul J. Adam)
Subject: Invisible laser sights?
Date: Wed Dec 26 15:10:01 2001
In article <Pine.SOL.4.21.0112251418410.14756-100000@*****.gatech.edu>,
Downtym <gte138j@*****.gatech.edu> writes
>If you use IR, wouldn't the "dot" be blurred out if you put it on a
>hot target? For example, if you line up the sight onto a person's
>chest and then look through your goggles, wouldn't the sight be
>obscured by the heat being emitted by the person?

Nope - you'd want to use 14-micron wavelength, and while people radiate
and reflect fairly well in that wavelength it's similar to the way they
put out red light in real life; a laser gives you a bright monochromatic
spot that's easily seen against ambient.


--
Paul J. Adam

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