Back to the main page

Mailing List Logs for ShadowRN

Message no. 1
From: LSDodge d7582@*****.com
Subject: jukebox and other questions
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 15:59:32 -0400
Note: I don't have access to source books at the moment, so bare with me.

Say you have a skillwires system, no headware memory, and a jukebox. How
long would it take to switch from one skill to another? I'm thinking simple
action, but it could be free, I don't know.

Are there rules for firing through PEOPLE? Or, to make it simple, how much
ballistic/impact armor would an unarmored average Joe corps or civilian
give? (i.e. how good is a human shield?)

When making a standing jump (open athletics or strength test, result is
amount of meters(feet?) jumped, 1/3 quickness is maximum height in meters),
if you jump three meters straight up, would the bottoms of your feet be
three meters off the ground, or your head, waist, or what?

Do you think cyberzombies would be harder to target with a manabolt or other
astral-form related spells, seeing as how they don't really have any essence
left, thus either a negligible or nonexistent astral form?

thank you,
--Tim
Message no. 2
From: Ereskanti@***.com Ereskanti@***.com
Subject: jukebox and other questions
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 19:10:30 EDT
In a message dated 4/28/1999 3:12:13 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
d7582@*****.com writes:

> Note: I don't have access to source books at the moment, so bare with me.

okay...

> Say you have a skillwires system, no headware memory, and a jukebox. How
> long would it take to switch from one skill to another? I'm thinking simple
> action, but it could be free, I don't know.

with none of my books near me (not sure where my BABY ran off to now...), I
keep thinking this is a Free Action if the jukebox is controlled via
cybernetic command.

> Are there rules for firing through PEOPLE? Or, to make it simple, how much
> ballistic/impact armor would an unarmored average Joe corps or civilian
> give? (i.e. how good is a human shield?)

In our games, if you want to do this, we usually say it counts as a "Full
Cover Modifier", and the power of the round (upon impacting the opposite
side) has it's power reduced by an amount equal to the individuals' Body
Attribute.

> When making a standing jump (open athletics or strength test, result is
> amount of meters(feet?) jumped, 1/3 quickness is maximum height in meters),
> if you jump three meters straight up, would the bottoms of your feet be
> three meters off the ground, or your head, waist, or what?

I have always LOVED this question personally. IMO, not sure if there is an
exact ruling to this to be honest, it would say your feet. We often have
characters' making athletics (5) tests to land on their feet, in addition to
the leaping test itself. We also say that "you can make the jump sure, but
you'll be catching the railing with your hands" just to make things more
"climactically fun".

> Do you think cyberzombies would be harder to target with a manabolt or
other
> astral-form related spells, seeing as how they don't really have any
essence
> left, thus either a negligible or nonexistent astral form?

In truth, yes, I do think so. In function/mechanic, I don't recall.

-K
Message no. 3
From: grahamdrew grahamdrew@*********.com
Subject: jukebox and other questions
Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 14:04:14 -0400
LSDodge wrote:
>
> Note: I don't have access to source books at the moment, so bare with me.
>
> Say you have a skillwires system, no headware memory, and a jukebox. How
> long would it take to switch from one skill to another? I'm thinking simple
> action, but it could be free, I don't know.

If it were a jukebox that were pushbuton or manually controled, it would
most likely be simple. If it were cybernetic it would most likely be
free.

>
> Are there rules for firing through PEOPLE? Or, to make it simple, how much
> ballistic/impact armor would an unarmored average Joe corps or civilian
> give? (i.e. how good is a human shield?)

Use them as a barrier, and assign them a barrier rating using the
factors of the situation (armor, body, etc.)

>
> When making a standing jump (open athletics or strength test, result is
> amount of meters(feet?) jumped, 1/3 quickness is maximum height in meters),
> if you jump three meters straight up, would the bottoms of your feet be
> three meters off the ground, or your head, waist, or what?

Well, doing a little test I jumped up and down a few times, got dizzy,
and took a nap. When I cam back, however, I noticed that although the
distance would see from the bottoms of one's feet, you don't go straight
up. When you jump (or at least how I do) straight up, you tend to pull
your legs up towards your waist. I would think it would be from the
gottoms of the feet, but they are only about 6 inches from your waist
anyway.
>
> Do you think cyberzombies would be harder to target with a manabolt or other
> astral-form related spells, seeing as how they don't really have any essence
> left, thus either a negligible or nonexistent astral form?
>
They are, and that is reflectwed in thier partial magic resistance
described on p. 80, Cybertechnology.

> thank you,
> --Tim

--
If a device is designed to do one thing really well, it can be
redesigned to do many things badly.
-Paranoia
Message no. 4
From: Chris Maxfield cmaxfiel@****.org.au
Subject: jukebox and other questions
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:08:23 +1000
At 03:59 28/04/99 -0400, LSDodge wrote:
>Do you think cyberzombies would be harder to target with a manabolt or other
>astral-form related spells, seeing as how they don't really have any essence
>left, thus either a negligible or nonexistent astral form?

Well, cyberzombies do gain the bonus where all magic tests against them suffer
a target number penalty of twice their negative essence rating (modulus). This
applies to both astral and physical tests. I think this means they're pretty
hard to target with astral manabolts.






Chris Maxfield We are restless because of incessant
<cmaxfiel@****.org.au> change, but we would be frightened if
Canberra, Australia change were stopped.
Message no. 5
From: Mongoose m0ng005e@*********.com
Subject: jukebox and other questions
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 23:42:04 -0500
:Say you have a skillwires system, no headware memory, and a jukebox. How
:long would it take to switch from one skill to another? I'm thinking simple
:action, but it could be free, I don't know.

Making the switch would be a simple action if the Jukebox was manualy
controlled (most are, but you might allow a line form a datajack to count as
"use cyber control", or get DNI adaptation).
"Booting" the new soft would also likely be a free action.

:Are there rules for firing through PEOPLE?

Nope.

:Or, to make it simple, how much
:ballistic/impact armor would an unarmored average Joe corps or civilian
:give? (i.e. how good is a human shield?)


Hard to say, even in real life. If you make it like shooting through a
tree, they would have a barrier rating (maybe around 6).
The easiest solution is to treat the target as cover (i.e., add a TN
penalty), then use some rule for stray shots if the shot misses. Even if
you intend to shoot through the hostage, you won't have nearly as much
control over where you hit the Bad Guy, as traveling through bodies tend to
alter a bullets path a lot. Easiest just to assume you don't hurt him at
all if you hit the hostage.

:When making a standing jump (open athletics or strength test, result is
:amount of meters(feet?) jumped, 1/3 quickness is maximum height in meters),
:if you jump three meters straight up, would the bottoms of your feet be
:three meters off the ground, or your head, waist, or what?


You jump up 3 meters, meaning every part of your body is 3 meters higher
than before- including the bottoms of your feet. Its like being on a
platform that goes up 3 meters, right? So, if you were doing a "flop", you
might be able to clear something that was your jump hieght plus 1/2 your own
hieght.

:Do you think cyberzombies would be harder to target with a manabolt or
other
:astral-form related spells, seeing as how they don't really have any
essence
:left, thus either a negligible or nonexistent astral form?


Harder to affect with magic than they already are? I don't think so.
I'm not sure what "astral form" spells really are; are you implying that
"manbolt" manipulates the target's astral form? It doesn't - in fact,
acording to MiTS, NO spell can do that. In any case, a cyberzombie is more
alive than a rock, but the rock is easier to affect with (physical) magic-
so does the rock have "more" of an astral form?
I think the modifier for targeting cyberzombies already takes thier
astral nature into account, and fits best with the nature of magic as
defined in SR3 and MiTS.

Mongoose
Message no. 6
From: Bruce gyro@********.co.za
Subject: jukebox and other questions
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:14:28 +0200
-----Original Message-----
From: Mongoose <m0ng005e@*********.com>
To: shadowrn@*********.org <shadowrn@*********.org>
Date: 29 April 1999 06:24
Subject: Re: jukebox and other questions



<snippage>
>:When making a standing jump (open athletics or strength test, result
is
>:amount of meters(feet?) jumped, 1/3 quickness is maximum height in
meters),
>:if you jump three meters straight up, would the bottoms of your feet
be
>:three meters off the ground, or your head, waist, or what?
>
>
> You jump up 3 meters, meaning every part of your body is 3 meters
higher
>than before- including the bottoms of your feet. Its like being on
a
>platform that goes up 3 meters, right? So, if you were doing a
"flop", you
>might be able to clear something that was your jump hieght plus 1/2
your own
>hieght.
<heavy snippage>

Does this mean that basketball players can jump, feet first through
the hoop? Thats just over 3 meters up and I dont see them getting that
much air. These people can be considered to be the best "jumpers" in
the world and a benchmark to measure your PCs performance against.

So NO, I dont think your feet are going 3 metres into the air. Maybe
your waist or shoulders , but not the feet.

All IMH-NBA watching-O

-- BRUCE <gyro@********.co.za>

<hard@****>

Theres nothing like a netfight
Everything is True
Nothing is Forbidden
Message no. 7
From: Gurth gurth@******.nl
Subject: jukebox and other questions
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:54:25 +0200
According to LSDodge, at 15:59 on 28 Apr 99, the word on the street was...

> Say you have a skillwires system, no headware memory, and a jukebox. How
> long would it take to switch from one skill to another? I'm thinking simple
> action, but it could be free, I don't know.

If you don't use system load delay (from Shadowtech) I'd say a "Use Simple
Object" Simple Action as well. When controlled through a datajack or some
other cyber-interface, a Free Action should do it.

> Are there rules for firing through PEOPLE? Or, to make it simple, how much
> ballistic/impact armor would an unarmored average Joe corps or civilian
> give? (i.e. how good is a human shield?)

We've had this discussion before, and the best solution we came up with,
IIRC, is to base it on the target's Body rating. Something in the order of
one-half Body being the armor rating of a person should work well enough
(using full Body is too much, IMHO).

> When making a standing jump (open athletics or strength test, result is
> amount of meters(feet?)

Please keep Imperial measurements out of Shadowrun :)

> jumped, 1/3 quickness is maximum height in meters), if you jump three
> meters straight up, would the bottoms of your feet be three meters off
> the ground, or your head, waist, or what?

Three meters straight up? Do you know the world record high jump, by any
chance? (OK, neither do I, but it's 2 meters something, I believe.)

I would imagine the height jumped is the maximum height of obstacle you
can jump over. So, if the formula from FoF or the new Companion says a
character can jump 2 m into the air, he or she can jump over a 2 m tall
wall.

> Do you think cyberzombies would be harder to target with a manabolt or other
> astral-form related spells, seeing as how they don't really have any essence
> left, thus either a negligible or nonexistent astral form?

Cyberzombies get magic resistance, which adds twice the absolute value of
the cyberzombie's Essence to _any_ TN for magic to affect the character.
This can make Heal and Treat spells sheer hell to cast on them; under
second edition rules, the best TN possible for Treating the cyberzombie we
had in the group back then was about 17...

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
It's just the dust and diesel of passing time.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
->The Plastic Warriors Page: http://shadowrun.html.com/plasticwarriors/<-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 8
From: Airwasp@***.com Airwasp@***.com
Subject: jukebox and other questions
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 10:24:19 EDT
In a message dated 4/28/1999 3:12:13 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
d7582@*****.com writes:

> Note: I don't have access to source books at the moment, so bare with me.

I know the feeling, I have to walk farther know to get to K's and my library
at the moment.

> Say you have a skillwires system, no headware memory, and a jukebox. How
> long would it take to switch from one skill to another? I'm thinking simple
> action, but it could be free, I don't know.

From what I remember from Shadowtech, switching between skillsofts is
normally a free action (it could be a simple action though, help!!!).

> Are there rules for firing through PEOPLE? Or, to make it simple, how much
> ballistic/impact armor would an unarmored average Joe corps or civilian
> give? (i.e. how good is a human shield?)

As of this moment and time, no, however, I would reduce the power of the
bullet by the person being shot through's Body attribute, and once the power
is dropped to 0, then the bullet stops, oh, and in the case of APDS
ammunition, the APDS would halve only the Body attribute of the first person
being shot through, as the APDS covering has been sufficiently stripped away,
removing it's properties after thant.

I might add that a shooter could get a skill in (Meta)Human Anatomy, which
they could roll as a Complimentary skill, but not from the pov of additional
successes for the shooting through, but as a modifier to the number of Body
points the bullet will ignore before it's power and damage level begin to
drop.

> When making a standing jump (open athletics or strength test, result is
> amount of meters(feet?) jumped, 1/3 quickness is maximum height in meters),
> if you jump three meters straight up, would the bottoms of your feet be
> three meters off the ground, or your head, waist, or what?

Your feet.

> Do you think cyberzombies would be harder to target with a manabolt or
other
> astral-form related spells, seeing as how they don't really have any
essence
> left, thus either a negligible or nonexistent astral form?

Cyberzombies have twice the absolute of their essence as 'immunity to
directed magic,' which means that either they get additional dice to defend
themselves with, or the target number for the spellslinger increases also.

Here's a thought on this topic, if a mage spots a cyberzombie in the astral
and attacks using astral combat, and does not 'kill' the zombie on the first
strike, does this mean that the zombie's magical nature holding him together
lashes back out at the opponent at full throttle? Would it do Ward or normal
astral combat damage?

-Frankenstein
------------Hrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
Message no. 9
From: Mongoose m0ng005e@*********.com
Subject: jukebox and other questions
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 14:45:48 -0500
:>:When making a standing jump (open athletics or strength test, result
:is
:>:amount of meters(feet?) jumped, 1/3 quickness is maximum height in
:meters),
:>:if you jump three meters straight up, would the bottoms of your feet
:be
:>:three meters off the ground, or your head, waist, or what?
:>
:>
:> You jump up 3 meters, meaning every part of your body is 3 meters
:higher
:>than before- including the bottoms of your feet. Its like being on
:a
:>platform that goes up 3 meters, right? So, if you were doing a
:"flop", you
:>might be able to clear something that was your jump hieght plus 1/2
:your own
:>hieght.
:<heavy snippage>
:
:Does this mean that basketball players can jump, feet first through
:the hoop? Thats just over 3 meters up and I dont see them getting that
:much air. These people can be considered to be the best "jumpers" in
:the world and a benchmark to measure your PCs performance against.
:
:So NO, I dont think your feet are going 3 metres into the air. Maybe
:your waist or shoulders , but not the feet.

Your the one who said he could jump 3 meters- I was just referring to
how such a jump is normally measured. A persons "vertical leap" is the
distance that their center of gravity moves, vertically. So, if you
maintain the same basic position, its how far the bottom of your feet go up.
Michael "Air" Jordan's vertical leap is, I believe, quoted at being 42
inches, or about 1.2 meters. Combined with his height, this allowed his
head to get higher than a basketball rim- he generally reached that point
several feat from the net, and made dunks from a horizontal distance of
5-10 feet, I think.
I don't know what rules you used to figure out a likely vertical leap of
3 meters; I assume the rules in the SRC 2, and SR3 type stats. I don't
think the SRC2 jumping rules are very realistic. [They are not even
internally consistent, since you basically can jump twice as far if you
aren't trying to jump "as far as you can."] However, if those rules were
designed to reflect how far up your shoulders or whatever reached during the
jump, they would have to factor in the jumpers height; some characters are
more than 3 meters tall!

Mongoose
Message no. 10
From: Rand Ratinac docwagon101@*****.com
Subject: jukebox and other questions
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 20:18:40 -0700 (PDT)
> d7582@*****.com writes:
>
> > Note: I don't have access to source books at the
> moment, so bare with me.

Look, buddy, I don't see why the fact that you don't have your
sourcebooks with you means we have to get naked together!!!

*Doc' really is trying to behave, but he just couldn't let that one pass...sorry...*
==Doc'
(aka Mr. Freaky Big, Super-Dynamic Troll of Tomorrow)

.sig Sauer
_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @*****.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

Further Reading

If you enjoyed reading about jukebox and other questions, you may also be interested in:

Disclaimer

These messages were posted a long time ago on a mailing list far, far away. The copyright to their contents probably lies with the original authors of the individual messages, but since they were published in an electronic forum that anyone could subscribe to, and the logs were available to subscribers and most likely non-subscribers as well, it's felt that re-publishing them here is a kind of public service.

Thwap!