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Message no. 1
From: "Bill P. Flint" <claymore@******.DIGEX.NET>
Subject: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Mon, 14 Mar 1994 19:57:25 -0500
Does anybody know how far a person can jump from a stand still or
running start in heightt/distance?
What about a person's rate of climbing?
And of course the speed a person swims?

One last note, what is the use of a hydralic leg jack 1 besides from
the fact it lowers the target number of lessening damage by one?

--Bill Flint
Message no. 2
From: William Field <wrfield@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Tue, 15 Mar 1994 00:27:54 EST
>
> Does anybody know how far a person can jump from a stand still or
> running start in heightt/distance?
> What about a person's rate of climbing?
> And of course the speed a person swims?
>
> One last note, what is the use of a hydralic leg jack 1 besides from
> the fact it lowers the target number of lessening damage by one?
>
> --Bill Flint
>

A couple of uses a friend of mine came up with for the hydralic leg
are as follows:

1) unlawful entry
2) assault
3) battery

Believe it or not, the item functions quite well in these contexts.

Bill
Message no. 3
From: Egil Geir Brautaset <egilbra@***.UNIT.NO>
Subject: Re: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Tue, 15 Mar 1994 12:39:42 +0100
On Mon, 14 Mar 1994, Bill P. Flint wrote:

> Does anybody know how far a person can jump from a stand still or
> running start in heightt/distance?

How about:
Running Start: Quickness meters (increased by Athletics)
Standing Start: Half Quickness meters (increased by Athletics)

> What about a person's rate of climbing?
How about:
1m / action

> And of course the speed a person swims?

> One last note, what is the use of a hydralic leg jack 1 besides from
> the fact it lowers the target number of lessening damage by one?

It increases jump length by zero :-)


> --Bill Flint


--Egil
Message no. 4
From: A cohort's CoHort <cohort@******.CONNECTED.COM>
Subject: Re: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Tue, 15 Mar 1994 05:37:47 -0800
On Mon, 14 Mar 1994, Bill P. Flint wrote:

> Does anybody know how far a person can jump from a stand still or
> running start in heightt/distance?
> What about a person's rate of climbing?
> And of course the speed a person swims?
>
Probably the best way to deal with this is to dig through GURPS and
convert. Figuring that the average person can run at 5 yards (3 feet)
per second, jump about 6 feet from a standing start, etc., tho I don't
remember all of the stats right off my head. They are all in the
Equipment section for some strange reason (the one in front of the
Basic Combat section).

CoHort@*********.com
-----=====-----
"Sorry - Is my Freudian slip showing?"
"You don't have to shout - I've got 20/20 hearing!"
Message no. 5
From: "C. Paul Douglas" <granite@*****.NET>
Subject: Re: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Tue, 15 Mar 1994 09:54:34 -0500
On Mon, 14 Mar 1994, Bill P. Flint wrote:

>
> One last note, what is the use of a hydralic leg jack 1 besides from
> the fact it lowers the target number of lessening damage by one?

Does anyone remember Speed Racer and his Mark 5 [or Mach 5 I don't rember
which it was] had a hydrolic jack that was used to pogo stick jump over
obsticals - the leg jack can be used in the same manner.
----------------GRANITE
Message no. 6
From: Brian McCallister <mccllstr@*****.BUCKNELL.EDU>
Subject: Re: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Tue, 15 Mar 1994 11:59:51 -0500
> On Mon, 14 Mar 1994, Bill P. Flint wrote:
> How about:
> Running Start: Quickness meters (increased by Athletics)
> Standing Start: Half Quickness meters (increased by Athletics)

Running Start is basically long jump.IMHO as a long jumper for four years.
Your average person by this method
is gonna do a jump of about 12 feet. Maybe, Unlikely for someone of
average strength though. A six would
allow 12 meters or 40 feet. Impossible. Also, jumping is much more a
a factor of strength then quickness. Being a really good sprinter helps
you get going, but that is as much strength as well. Standing distnaces
seem too long as well, but I cannot give first hand distances so won't
really say.

Skrub.
Message no. 7
From: "Bill P. Flint" <claymore@******.DIGEX.NET>
Subject: Re: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Tue, 15 Mar 1994 15:21:54 -0500
I started this thread, so I going to give my opinion.

standing high jump = (strength + athletics push) x 0.1 meter
running high jump = (quickness + strength + athletics push) x 0.1 meter

standing long jump = (strength + athletics push) x .5 meters
running long jump = (quickness + strength + athletics push) x 0.5 meters

swimming = (quickness + athletics push) x 1.0
climbing = (quickness + athletics push) x running modifier x 0.5

The athletics push above are rolling your athletics, if you got it and no
webbing, to increase your rate with a base target number of 4. So if you roll
three successes you add 3 to what ever approiate attribute.

--Bill Flint
Message no. 8
From: "Seth A. Buntain" <enthar@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Tue, 15 Mar 1994 17:30:17 -0600
>
> > On Mon, 14 Mar 1994, Bill P. Flint wrote:
> > How about:
> > Running Start: Quickness meters (increased by Athletics)
> > Standing Start: Half Quickness meters (increased by Athletics)
>
Being a long jumper myself...

> is gonna do a jump of about 12 feet. Maybe, Unlikely for someone of
> average strength though. A six would
Not so unlikely. Running jump (long jump) freshman year was 12 feet for me.

> allow 12 meters or 40 feet. Impossible. Also, jumping is much more a
actually, if you use his formula, an _untrained_ human, with _average_
quickness, is going to get 2 meters, or ~6 feet. not overly impressive. But
then thats a couch potatoe.
The other end of the spectrum is the olympic class jumper, with a quickness of
6 and atheletics of 6 or more. He could get, on a good day, 12 meters, which
as you said is ~40 feet, which is a good approximation of the world record.

> a factor of strength then quickness. Being a really good sprinter helps
> you get going, but that is as much strength as well.

Hmm, I dont know if I exactly agree with that, but... I dont know if I
disagree either, so Ill just leave it. Stan
> Skrub.
>

--
Seth Buntain | "You will find that a great many of the truths
Enthar the Eternal | that we cling to depend greatly on our own point
email: enthar@***.edu | of view" --Obi Wan Kenobi
(V 1.01) GE d -p+ c++ l u e+(*) m(++) s/- !n h- f+ g- w+ t+(++) r+(++) !y
"It's a damn poor man who can't spell a wyrd in more than one way!"
-Thomas Jefferson
My opinions, comments and even facts are all mine.
Message no. 9
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Tue, 15 Mar 1994 19:25:26 -0500
>>>>> "BPF" == Bill P Flint <claymore@******.digex.net>
writes:

Let's put these through some number crunching. A ``normal'' person is one
with a 3 in the appropriate attributes and no extra skill. A ``jock'' is a
person with a 4 in the appropriate attributes and a 3 in the appropriate
skill. An ``olympian'' is a person with an 8 in the appropriate primary
attribute and a 6 in the appropriate secondary attribute, and an 8 in the
appropriate skill. Skill rolls assume an ``average'' number of successes.

BPF> standing high jump = (strength + athletics push) x 0.1 meter
normal: 0.3m jock: 0.55m olympian: 1.2m
BPF> running high jump = (quickness + strength + athletics push) x 0.1 meter
normal: 0.6m jock: 0.95m olympian: 1.8m

BPF> standing long jump = (strength + athletics push) x .5 meters
normal: 1.5m jock: 2.75m olympian: 6.0m
BPF> running long jump = (quickness + strength + athletics push) x 0.5 meters
normal: 3.0m jock: 4.75m olympian: 9.0m

So far looks pretty good.

BPF> swimming = (quickness + athletics push) x 1.0
normal: 3m/s jock: 6m/s olympian: 12m/s

Assuming you're looking at meters per second as your time scale, this
breaks down really fast here. If this were running it'd work, but swimming
at 12 meters per second? No way.

BPF> climbing = (quickness + athletics push) x running modifier x 0.5
normal: 1.5m/s jock 2.75m/s olympian: 6.0m/s

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| GAT d--@ -p+ c++ !l u+ e+(*) m-(+) s n---(+) h-- f !g(+) w+ t- r+ y+ |
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Message no. 10
From: Neal A Porter <nap@*****.PHYSICS.SWIN.OZ.AU>
Subject: Re: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 1994 15:04:04 +1000
>
> Does anybody know how far a person can jump from a stand still or
>running start in heightt/distance?
> What about a person's rate of climbing?
> And of course the speed a person swims?
>
> One last note, what is the use of a hydralic leg jack 1 besides from
>the fact it lowers the target number of lessening damage by one?
>
>--Bill Flint
>

The 'jumping jacks', as my team calls them increase your jumping hieght.
For each level multiple your standard hieght by the rating (yes for level one
this means no increase), so with a level 6 jack, you can jump 6 times your
normal hieght. (assuming 1.5 meter standing vertical jump, them you could
jump up to 9 meters in vertical hieght, and about 24 meters long. Of course
all this changes if you are running, or have athletics) So up to the top of
two storie buildings in a single bound, or low three storie ones. Of course
the one thing they dont help well with is aiming your jump, so watch those
cliffs.

A'Deus.
Message no. 11
From: Quid Non <jdfalk@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 1994 01:58:28 -0500
On Tue, 15 Mar 1994, C. Paul Douglas wrote:

> Does anyone remember Speed Racer and his Mark 5 [or Mach 5 I don't rember
> which it was] had a hydrolic jack that was used to pogo stick jump over
> obsticals - the leg jack can be used in the same manner.

Mach 5.
For those who don't know, "Speed Racer" was an early to
mid-sixties cartoon which looks like Japanamation but the plots and
stereotypes seem to be more late-fifties American (in other words, pretty
much _all_ stereotypes).
The basic storyline is that the hero, "Speed" Racer, would go all
around the world to less and less plausible auto races, and usually end up
having to do some detective work as well. And, of course, there was
always some girl who fell for him.
It was shown on MTV for a while, might still be.
Message no. 12
From: Luke Kendall <luke@********.CANON.OZ.AU>
Subject: Re: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 1994 11:01:58 +1000
Rat:
> An ``olympian'' is a person with an 8 in the appropriate primary
> attribute and a 6 in the appropriate secondary attribute, and an 8 in the
> appropriate skill.

By Olympian, you mean a (present day) world record holder type? In which
case, since human racial maximum is 6, you can't have 8 for the primary
attribute - they'd fail the drug tests! :-)

So you lose 0.5 (if you are requiring an attribute test), or 1.0 (if not),
at the appropriate place in the formulae.

Otherwise, I agree with Rat's analysis.

I'd also suggest the swimming is much too fast all the way through.
Try: swimming = (quickness + athletics push) / 4 (in m/s); someone
should see how this compares with olympic times; it's ok elsewhere.

luke
Message no. 13
From: Micah Levy <M.Levy@**.UCL.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 1994 12:57:10 +0000
>
> Rat:
> > An ``olympian'' is a person with an 8 in the appropriate primary
> > attribute and a 6 in the appropriate secondary attribute, and an 8 in the
> > appropriate skill.
>
> By Olympian, you mean a (present day) world record holder type? In which
> case, since human racial maximum is 6, you can't have 8 for the primary
> attribute - they'd fail the drug tests! :-)
>

The racial maximums given are maximums for 'normal' people.
It is possible that some charaters could have attributes which exceed this,
for example, in the Sprawl Sites book, if I'm not mistaken there is a
corporate scientist with an Intelligence of 8 (and no cerebral booster). Also
physical adepts can increase attributes above the racial maximum if they have
the kara for it and (I think- I don't have the book here at the mo) that if
PCs want to spend the Karma then they can also increase their attributes over
the racial maximums.
That last bit could be wrong but otherwise, it seems perfectly likely that
Olympians could have physical attributes of 8.

I would add that IMHO maybe there ought to be some kind of penalty for trying
to swim with:
bone lacing
cyberlimbs
heavy dermal implants
hydraulic jacks

simply because of the extra weight being carried.
What do you guys think?


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|| Micah Levy ||
|| Department of Computer Science ||
|| University College London ||
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|| GCS d--@ -p+ c++ l(!) u++ e+ m- s n+ h* f g+(-) w t+ r++ y? ||
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Message no. 14
From: Jason Glenn Hall <S975164@*******.BITNET>
Subject: Re: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 1994 08:22:10 CST
Speed Racer was originally released in Japan as 'Mach Go-Go-Go!.'

That's why there was that huge 'G' on everything Speed owned.

Just an tidbit of non-SR info....

JGH...
<s975164@*******.umsl.edu>

---++= The Buffalo Soldier of the '90s =++---
--- Hoo-ah!!! ---
Message no. 15
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 1994 10:42:25 -0500
>>>>> "LK" == Luke Kendall <luke@********.canon.oz.au>
writes:

>> An ``olympian'' is a person with an 8 in the appropriate primary
>> attribute and a 6 in the appropriate secondary attribute, and an 8 in
>> the appropriate skill.
LK> By Olympian, you mean a (present day) world record holder type?

Yes.

LK> In which case, since human racial maximum is 6, you can't have 8 for
LK> the primary attribute - they'd fail the drug tests! :-)

Really. My rulebook says that certain NPCs can exceed the racial maximums.
I'd definitely categorize an Olympic athelete as ``certain NPCs'' :).

|||| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | ||||
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Message no. 16
From: "Seth A. Buntain" <enthar@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 1994 11:15:23 -0600
[Stuff is of course deleted.]

>
> BPF> standing high jump = (strength + athletics push) x 0.1 meter
> normal: 0.3m jock: 0.55m olympian: 1.2m
> BPF> running high jump = (quickness + strength + athletics push) x 0.1 meter
> normal: 0.6m jock: 0.95m olympian: 1.8m

Anyone have the guiness book of world records handy? i think olympic high
jump is a little better than 6 feet. In fact, a good high school athlete can
do 12 to 17 feet regularly. just so you know...


>
> BPF> standing long jump = (strength + athletics push) x .5 meters
> normal: 1.5m jock: 2.75m olympian: 6.0m

ok, ok, eek! (20 foot standing jump! *shudder*)

> BPF> running long jump = (quickness + strength + athletics push) x 0.5 meters
> normal: 3.0m jock: 4.75m olympian: 9.0m

all sound resonable.

>
> So far looks pretty good.
er..

> BPF> climbing = (quickness + athletics push) x running modifier x 0.5
> normal: 1.5m/s jock 2.75m/s olympian: 6.0m/s

lets see, is this free climbing, or rappelling? 6 meters a second is a pretty
good clip. Hell, 1.5 meters per second is fast for free climbing.

Unfortunately, climbing, especially free climbing, has so many variables in it
that it is very diffulcult to just lay down a formula on how fast people go...

This reality check has been brought to you by...
(: smilieys for the humor impaired :)

--
Seth Buntain | "You will find that a great many of the truths
Enthar the Eternal | that we cling to depend greatly on our own point
email: enthar@***.edu | of view" --Obi Wan Kenobi
(V 1.01) GE d -p+ c++ l u e+(*) m(++) s/- !n h- f+ g- w+ t+(++) r+(++) !y
"It's a damn poor man who can't spell a wyrd in more than one way!"
-Thomas Jefferson
My opinions, comments and even facts are all mine.
Message no. 17
From: The Powerhouse <P.C.Steele@*********.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 1994 17:24:02 +0000
In reply to Seth A. Buntain .....

> Anyone have the guiness book of world records handy? i think olympic high
> jump is a little better than 6 feet. In fact, a good high school athlete can
> do 12 to 17 feet regularly. just so you know...

Bloody hell I guess they feed the kids on jumping beans in the states. I think
olympic athletes manage just over 6ft possibly almost as high as 7ft, but don't
quote me.

But think about it, how high can YOU jump ? I'd be suprised if you could jump
and clear without touching a height greater than your own, seeing as most
<western> people average about 5'8 5'10 ....

As to 17ft, do they have wings ?
--
Phillip Steele - Email address P.C.Steele@***.ac.uk | Fighting against
Department Of Electrical & Electronic Engineering | Political Correctness !
University Of Newcastle Upon Tyne, England |
Land of the mad Geordies | The Powerhouse
Message no. 18
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 1994 12:56:51 -0500
>>>>> "SAB" == Seth A Buntain <enthar@***.edu> writes:

SAB> Anyone have the guiness book of world records handy? i think olympic
SAB> high jump is a little better than 6 feet. In fact, a good high school
SAB> athlete can do 12 to 17 feet regularly. just so you know...

Ummm... are you thinking of pole vault?

|||| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | ||||
| Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> WWW Page: http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox |
| GAT d--@ -p+ c++ !l u+ e+(*) m-(+) s n---(+) h-- f !g(+) w+ t- r+ y+ |
|...kcab nrut ,kcab nrut ,kcab nruT .ton si emit tub elbisrever si cisum ehT|
| ``hgiH nO eriF'' ,OLE-- |
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Message no. 19
From: "C. Paul Douglas" <granite@*****.NET>
Subject: Re: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 1994 15:15:02 -0500
> SAB> Anyone have the guiness book of world records handy? i think olympic
> SAB> high jump is a little better than 6 feet. In fact, a good high school
> SAB> athlete can do 12 to 17 feet regularly. just so you know...
>
Accordind to the 1990 GBWR
Standing long jump - 12 ft 2 1/4 in [male]
9 ft 7 in [female]

Fastest swim 25 meter pool - 5.50 mph [male]
4.48 mph [female]

farthest swim - 1826 miles [male]

fastest run - 26.95 mph [male]
22.5 mph [female]

and the only man in the world to be struck 7 times by lightening is
former Shenandoah park ranger Roy C. Sullivan [US]
------------------------GRANITE
Message no. 20
From: "C. Paul Douglas" <granite@*****.NET>
Subject: Re: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 1994 15:21:55 -0500
> SAB> Anyone have the guiness book of world records handy? i think olympic
> SAB> high jump is a little better than 6 feet. In fact, a good high school
> SAB> athlete can do 12 to 17 feet regularly. just so you know...

Oh yea, I forgot ...
high jump - 7 ft 11 1/2 in [male]
6 ft 9 1/4 in [female]

pole vault - 19 ft 9 1/2 in [male]

shot put - 74 ft 4 1/4 in [male]
73 ft 10 in [female]
-------------------GRANITE
Message no. 21
From: Luke Kendall <luke@********.CANON.OZ.AU>
Subject: Re: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Thu, 17 Mar 1994 09:02:12 +1000
LK> By Olympian, you mean a (present day) world record holder type?

Rat> Yes.

LK> In which case, since human racial maximum is 6, you can't have 8 for
LK> the primary attribute - they'd fail the drug tests! :-)

Rat> Really. My rulebook says that certain NPCs can exceed the racial maximums.
Rat> I'd definitely categorize an Olympic athelete as ``certain NPCs'' :).

But since we only have data on present-day Olympians, and assuming the
face-value intrepretation of `racial maximum', together with the guess
that certain NPC's in the future only exceed that through various weird
means (drugs/cyber/magic), then you have to work from a 6. Unless you insist
on working from a really interesting definition of `maximum' ... :-)

luke
Message no. 22
From: Michael Garoni <Michael_Garoni@****.INTERSOLV.COM>
Subject: Re[2]: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Thu, 17 Mar 1994 08:49:00 LCL
:]Rat:
:]> An ``olympian'' is a person with an 8 in the appropriate primary
:]> attribute and a 6 in the appropriate secondary attribute, and an 8 in
:]> the
:]> appropriate skill.
:]
:]By Olympian, you mean a (present day) world record holder type? In which
:]case, since human racial maximum is 6, you can't have 8 for the primary
:]attribute - they'd fail the drug tests! :-)
Yes you can. I am fairly sure that the SR2 rules state that you can increase
your attribs above the racial maximum, though this is left up to the GM.

Obi Wan
Message no. 23
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Jumping, Climbing, & Swimming
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 1994 21:34:05 -0500
When any rulebook says ``characteristic maximum'' I automatically
substitute ``normal characteristic maximum.'' Top-ranked Olympians are, by
definition, above ``normal.'' You can have attributes higer than ``normal''
without resorting to drugs/cyber/magic, it just takes a /lot/ of very hard
work, like years and years of training.

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