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Message no. 1
From: Callahan <callahan@********.COM>
Subject: Re: Karma and the Pedestrian
Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 15:24:09 -0400
When dinosaurs roamed the earth, Jerry Hill wrote:
> How does anyone else deal with Karma for people who just happen to be
> around. I don't mean the karma pool on an individual basis (that's
handled
> with threat/professional ratings) but specifically good karma with regard
to
> bonding costs, the ability to quicken and/or anchor spells, etc.


Basically, your average schlep won't earn much if any karma. Karma, which
exists mostly for game-purposes IMHO, is primarily the accumulated
experience of the daring, the exceptional, the shadowrunners. Think about
what you average joe does in a day . . . goes to work, eats dinner, flakes
out in front of the trid for a while . . . Karma isn't being racked up by
this guy. I wouldn't think that successfully going to work and back even
qualifies for a "survived the encounter" karma point (unless you live in
the darker parts of the Barrens, that is).

Now magicians, representing a tiny fraction of the world's population,
almost BY DEFINITION are more into the action scene than your average joe.
They're playing with mana, summoning spirits and so on.

The idea of using Karma to spend on skills loses its meaning when applied
to solely mundane pursuits. If I'm a corp researcher and I study really
hard, I might be able to increase my Physical Sciences (Engineering)
concentration from 3 to 4, representing (roughly) the advance from an
undergrad to a masters-level engineering skill. But I'm spending all my
time working and studying, so I'm not out adventuring. Even if I was,
shooting a troll in the head won't help me to be a better researcher.

Having said all that, I think that none of it really matters.

I respectfully submit to you that this is probably an issue of trying to
read too much into the game system. Karma exists so players can advance in
some sort of game-balanced fashion (reality has little to do with karma . .
. I could teach you enough firearms skill to be effectively Level 3 in a
matter of weeks, but to get a Level 3 in Physical Sciences should
realistically take YEARS).

For NPCs, advancement and quickening and all that crap should happen
however the GM sees fit, as needed to achieve the goals of the game. If,
for the purposes of the game, the evil mage Dr. Evil (he's evil, but
lacking in originality) needs to bond a focus or quicken a spell, then have
him do so. Leave the accrual of good karma to those poor players and just
make sure NPCs fulfill their roles in the scope of the game.


Callahan
Message no. 2
From: James Lindsay <jlindsay@******.CA>
Subject: Re: Karma and the Pedestrian
Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 20:53:28 GMT
On Mon, 27 Apr 1998 15:24:09 -0400, Callahan wrote:

> Basically, your average schlep won't earn much if any karma. Karma, which
> exists mostly for game-purposes IMHO, is primarily the accumulated
> experience of the daring, the exceptional, the shadowrunners. Think about
> what you average joe does in a day . . . goes to work, eats dinner, flakes
> out in front of the trid for a while . . . Karma isn't being racked up by
> this guy. I wouldn't think that successfully going to work and back even
> qualifies for a "survived the encounter" karma point (unless you live in
> the darker parts of the Barrens, that is).

Unfortunately, this means that only people that do daring or exceptional
feats will improve themselves. The average "Joe" *must* gain something
equivalent to Karma Points so that he can increase his job-related skills.
And allowing characters that acquire karma to improve themselves faster
than those that don't is very bizarre indeed.

Change the term from "Good Karma" to "Experience Points" and things
take on
a whole new meaning (besides getting around that "only do-gooders triumph
in the long run in SR because evil antagonists can't possibly earn Good
Karma-- by definition").



James W. Lindsay Vancouver, British Columbia
"http://www.prosperoimaging.com/ground_zero";
ICQ: 7521644 (Sharkey)

Mano au mano, the "Professor"
would kick MacGyver's ass.
Message no. 3
From: Max Rible <slothman@*********.ORG>
Subject: Re: Karma and the Pedestrian
Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 13:32:28 -0800
At 20:53 4/29/98 GMT, James Lindsay insinuated:
>On Mon, 27 Apr 1998 15:24:09 -0400, Callahan wrote:
>> Basically, your average schlep won't earn much if any karma.

>Unfortunately, this means that only people that do daring or exceptional
>feats will improve themselves. The average "Joe" *must* gain something
>equivalent to Karma Points so that he can increase his job-related skills.
>And allowing characters that acquire karma to improve themselves faster
>than those that don't is very bizarre indeed.

>Change the term from "Good Karma" to "Experience Points" and
things take on
>a whole new meaning (besides getting around that "only do-gooders triumph
>in the long run in SR because evil antagonists can't possibly earn Good
>Karma-- by definition").

I've attempted to address this matter on a page at my web site:
http://www.amurgsval.org/shadowrun/learning.html

My campaign has both experience points and karma. Karma comes from
making a difference in the world, good or bad, and generates karma pool;
experience points come from training, and do not.

--
%% Max Rible %% slothman@*****.com %% http://www.amurgsval.org/~slothman/ %%
%% "Ham is good... Glowing *tattooed* ham is *bad*!" - the Tick %%

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