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Message no. 1
From: Mike Elkins <MikeE@*********.COM>
Subject: Libraries and getting maps
Date: Tue, 27 May 1997 11:22:58 -0500
Avenger wrote:
>Yes, the local library does have maps,
>geological, and geographical, city maps only of
>the UK cities, and only a few of them.

I'm astounded. In the US, public libraries would
always have at least a world atlas. Street maps
of foreign cities might be hard to get, but the
reference librarians tend to be masters of
info-scrounge (and delighted to be useful). I
think most of it dates back to the 19th century,
when endowing a library was a good way for a
robber baron to shed some of that Noveu Riche
label.

<snip: Try National Geographic>
>Tried that, the local newsagent is lucky to get a
>copy of this magazine once every six months,
>let alone on release. The library has never
>heard of the magazine, and as it's an
>American publication wouldn't get it anyway.

Thats very sad. Of course, over here you can
pick up about 120lbs of back issues at every
garage sale. Also, are our libraries and
newstands really that much more cosmopolitan
than the UKs? It's not hard to get Le Monde or
some other foreign publications here, and we
Americans have a reputation (well earned, I had
thought) of insularity.

Double-Domed Mike
Message no. 2
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Libraries and getting maps
Date: Tue, 27 May 1997 18:54:44 +0100
|Thats very sad. Of course, over here you can
|pick up about 120lbs of back issues at every
|garage sale. Also, are our libraries and
|newstands really that much more cosmopolitan
|than the UKs?

Not really. All *GOOD* libraries have a LOT of periodicals.
Some of the smaller ones have VERY limited budgets however....

It's not hard to get Le Monde or
|some other foreign publications here, and we
|Americans have a reputation (well earned, I had
|thought) of insularity.

You can say that again....
--
______________________________________________________________________________
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| "Are you pondering what I'm pondering Pinky?" |
|Andrew Halliwell | |
|Principal subjects in:- | "I think so brain, but this time, you control |
|Comp Sci & Electronics | the Encounter suit, and I'll do the voice..." |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 3
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Libraries and getting maps
Date: Wed, 28 May 1997 11:54:09 +0100
Mike Elkins said on 11:22/27 May 97...

> I'm astounded. In the US, public libraries would always have at least a
> world atlas. Street maps of foreign cities might be hard to get, but
> the reference librarians tend to be masters of info-scrounge (and
> delighted to be useful). I think most of it dates back to the 19th
> century, when endowing a library was a good way for a robber baron to
> shed some of that Noveu Riche label.

That would make them somewhat less useful for a campaign set in the 2050s,
IMHO. Still it should pay to look around a bit, and copy what you need.

> <snip: Try National Geographic>
> Thats very sad. Of course, over here you can pick up about 120lbs of
> back issues at every garage sale.

You can try second-hand book stores; one in my area has a table full of
National Geographics I believe, but I've never looked into them.

> Also, are our libraries and newstands really that much more cosmopolitan
> than the UKs? It's not hard to get Le Monde or some other foreign
> publications here, and we Americans have a reputation (well earned, I
> had thought) of insularity.

Doesn't that depend on where you are and what foreigners come there? Every
store that sells newspapers here in town has lots of German papers, for
example, but, say, Italian ones are impossible to come by.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
And everytime it rains...
-> NERPS Project Leader & Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-

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Message no. 4
From: Avenger <Avenger@*******.DEMON.CO.UK>
Subject: Re: Libraries and getting maps
Date: Tue, 27 May 1997 23:32:28 +0100
In article <s38ad700.073@********.dragonsys.com>, Mike Elkins
<MikeE@*********.COM> rambled on endlessly about Libraries and getting
maps

>I'm astounded. In the US, public libraries would
>always have at least a world atlas. Street maps
>of foreign cities might be hard to get, but the
>reference librarians tend to be masters of
>info-scrounge (and delighted to be useful).

The problems I have living on a rock in the deep south of England aren't
indicative of the rest of the UK. a friend has a library near him in
London that's well equipped. Unfortunately the few things he's found in
there that might be useful are reference only, and they won't photocopy
any of it. :(

The rest seems to be huge compilations of encyclopaedias dating back
into some godforsaken century and research materials, but not the sort
of thing we're looking for.

><snip: Try National Geographic>
>>heard of the magazine, and as it's an
>>American publication wouldn't get it anyway.
>
>Thats very sad. Of course, over here you can
>pick up about 120lbs of back issues at every
>garage sale. Also, are our libraries and
>newstands really that much more cosmopolitan
>than the UKs?

In some ways, probably, in others no. The UK seems to be very limited
in it's view of the world. After all the Brits once had a world
spanning empire, and many don't quite believe it's gone. So, the UK is
more important than anywhere else. After all, why stock stuff about
another country - they couldn't possibly be as interesting.

> It's not hard to get Le Monde or
>some other foreign publications here, and we
>Americans have a reputation (well earned, I had
>thought) of insularity.

I dare say that somewhere in England there's a gret library, but I don't
have enough freedom to be able to search for it :( I guess I'll just
have to go on the way I am, and "guess" most of it. Occassionally I'm
lucky enough to be able to dig up something but it's damned hard work.

--
__ \ | \ __
| | _` | __| | / _ \ \ / _ \ __ \ _` | _ \ __|
| | ( | | < ___ \ \ / __/ | | ( | __/ |
____/ \__,_|_| _|\_\ _/ _\ \_/ \___|_| _|\__, |\___|_|
A Dark Shadow in a Dark World |___/
Web page at: http://www.shalako.demon.co.uk
Message no. 5
From: Tuvyah@***.COM
Subject: Re: Libraries and getting maps
Date: Thu, 29 May 1997 03:42:49 -0400
Avenger@*******.DEMON.CO.UK (Avenger) wrote:

>>I dare say that somewhere in England there's a gret library, but I don't
have enough freedom to be able to search for it :(

What about the British Library at the British Museum and the Bodleian
Collection at Oxford?

Smilin' Ted
Message no. 6
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Libraries and getting maps
Date: Thu, 29 May 1997 11:14:41 +0100
|The problems I have living on a rock in the deep south of England aren't
|indicative of the rest of the UK. a friend has a library near him in
|London that's well equipped. Unfortunately the few things he's found in
|there that might be useful are reference only, and they won't photocopy
|any of it. :(

Every library I've ever been in has a public pay-photocopier.
I'm surprised that them londoners are so primative....

Then again.... They are londoners....
Hmmmmm....


|In some ways, probably, in others no. The UK seems to be very limited
|in it's view of the world. After all the Brits once had a world
|spanning empire, and many don't quite believe it's gone. So, the UK is
|more important than anywhere else. After all, why stock stuff about
|another country - they couldn't possibly be as interesting.

That sounds like a stereotypical example of America......

--
______________________________________________________________________________
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| "Are you pondering what I'm pondering Pinky?" |
|Andrew Halliwell | |
|Principal subjects in:- | "I think so brain, but this time, you control |
|Comp Sci & Electronics | the Encounter suit, and I'll do the voice..." |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 7
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Libraries and getting maps
Date: Thu, 29 May 1997 11:28:55 +0100
|
|Avenger@*******.DEMON.CO.UK (Avenger) wrote:
|
|>>I dare say that somewhere in England there's a gret library, but I don't
|have enough freedom to be able to search for it :(
|
|What about the British Library at the British Museum and the Bodleian
|Collection at Oxford?

As he said, he's living on an island off the south coast of england, and
DOESN'T have the time to go to the mainland very often!

Please pay attention.
--
______________________________________________________________________________
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| "Are you pondering what I'm pondering Pinky?" |
|Andrew Halliwell | |
|Principal subjects in:- | "I think so brain, but this time, you control |
|Comp Sci & Electronics | the Encounter suit, and I'll do the voice..." |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 8
From: Mark Steedman <M.J.Steedman@***.RGU.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Libraries and getting maps
Date: Thu, 29 May 1997 12:47:22 GMT
Spike writes

> |The problems I have living on a rock in the deep south of England aren't
> |indicative of the rest of the UK. a friend has a library near him in
> |London that's well equipped. Unfortunately the few things he's found in
> |there that might be useful are reference only, and they won't photocopy
> |any of it. :(
>
> Every library I've ever been in has a public pay-photocopier.
> I'm surprised that them londoners are so primative....
>
The problem is most likely the book in question is an exception to
the usual rule of 5% photocopying or they are not prepared to do it
for free.

The solution to all your library problems would be the British
Libraries interlibrary loan service. However i suspect this could
prove quite costly to use for private purposes. I have used this
extensively for getting research papers and books. Books come to your
local library and you can borrow them for some time, limit dependent
on the book, some are limited (in very rare cases) to being read in
your local library but at least the book comes to the nearest
library. In the case of research journal papers you get a photocopy
posted to you. My experience is through the University however using
the university library to do the ordering who do this sort of thing
all the time and with the Uni footing the bill. I don't know but i
have a feeling this service is quite expensive, though its probably a
LOT cheaper than trying to get from the IOW to London!

Usually, at least in Britian you are allowed to photocopy up to 5% or
1 chapter of a book for research purposes. Some reference texts are
however excluded, as are ordance survey mays (i believe).

Mark
Message no. 9
From: david lowe <dlowe@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Libraries and getting maps
Date: Thu, 29 May 1997 13:40:46 -0800
At 3:42 AM 5/29/97, Tuvyah@***.COM wrote:
>Avenger@*******.DEMON.CO.UK (Avenger) wrote:
>
>>>I dare say that somewhere in England there's a gret library, but I don't
>have enough freedom to be able to search for it :(
>
>What about the British Library at the British Museum and the Bodleian
>Collection at Oxford?
>
>Smilin' Ted

This may be only of use to those who have acess to US mail order catalogs,
and who only want maps of the US, but I know that there is a CD-ROM with
the Thomas' Guide maps to the US. Very handy, especially if you know how to
hack resources and use Illustrator to "update" the maps for 2050.

D.
Message no. 10
From: Tuvyah@***.COM
Subject: Re: Libraries and getting maps
Date: Thu, 29 May 1997 16:39:33 -0400
Spike (aka Mr. Grumpy without cause) wrote:

>>As he said, he's living on an island off the south coast of england, and
DOESN'T have the time to go to the mainland very often!

>>Please pay attention.

He also said that " a friend has a library near him in London that's well
equipped. Unfortunately the few things he's found in there that might be
useful are reference only, and they won't photocopy any of it. " If the
friend is in London, both the British Museum and the Bodleian are not out of
his reach.

Please pay attention.

Smilin' Ted
"...who knows why he's smilin'."
Message no. 11
From: Ray & Tamara <macey@*******.COM.AU>
Subject: Re: Libraries and getting maps
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 09:36:09 +1000
> >>>I dare say that somewhere in England there's a gret library, but I
don't
> >have enough freedom to be able to search for it :(
> >
> >What about the British Library at the British Museum and the Bodleian
> >Collection at Oxford?
> >
> >Smilin' Ted
>
> This may be only of use to those who have acess to US mail order
catalogs,
> and who only want maps of the US, but I know that there is a CD-ROM with
> the Thomas' Guide maps to the US. Very handy, especially if you know how
to
> hack resources and use Illustrator to "update" the maps for 2050.

What's it cost to buy?

Ray.

-----------------------------------------------------
| The universe is a big place, and whatever happens,|
| You will not be missed |
-----------------------------------------------------

EMAIL: macey@*******.com.au
Message no. 12
From: david lowe <dlowe@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Libraries and getting maps
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 22:24:07 -0800
At 9:36 AM 5/30/97, Ray & Tamara wrote:

>> This may be only of use to those who have acess to US mail order
>catalogs,
>> and who only want maps of the US, but I know that there is a CD-ROM with
>> the Thomas' Guide maps to the US. Very handy, especially if you know how
>to
>> hack resources and use Illustrator to "update" the maps for 2050.
>
>What's it cost to buy?
>
>Ray.
>


You know, between work and home I get two or three of them damn catalogs a
day, and now that I actually need one I can't find one. I'll send the cost
along as soon as I find it. I seem to recall it being around $50 US, but I
bought it at work so I didn't actually pay for it. Sorry.

D.

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