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Message no. 1
From: Jod <chatin@*******.NL>
Subject: Little combat question here...
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 1997 16:47:17 +0200
Hya people!

I've just come up with another question here. I dunno if it's in the
Shadowrun Second edition book, so maybe I've read over it. Sorry if I have.

Anyway, what happens if two people start a fight. One grabs a knife, the
other a gun (Hold out, Heavy pistol, assualt cannon, whatever. ;)). What
should be rolled? Should the gun wileder roll both firearms _and_ melee
rolls? I guess if the gun is small enough, it can be used withouth penalties
or something...

Just a question....

Jod

PS I'm probably gonna get 'twapped' for this... but I'm relatively new to
this list, so I'm _really_ wondering what the business is with the
w--dch-cks. (See! I censored it!:))
Message no. 2
From: David Buehrer <dbuehrer@****.ORG>
Subject: Re: Little combat question here...
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 1997 08:59:35 -0600
Jod wrote:
|
| Hya people!
|
| I've just come up with another question here. I dunno if it's in the
| Shadowrun Second edition book, so maybe I've read over it. Sorry if I have.

That's okay, some of this stuff gets a little complex :)

| Anyway, what happens if two people start a fight. One grabs a knife, the
| other a gun (Hold out, Heavy pistol, assualt cannon, whatever. ;)). What
| should be rolled? Should the gun wileder roll both firearms _and_ melee
| rolls? I guess if the gun is small enough, it can be used withouth penalties
| or something...

Okay, the guy with the knife (A) attacks the guy with the gun (B). A rolls
melee to attack and B rolls unarmed combat to defend (I suppose he could
use the gun as a melee weapon though). Assuming they're both still standing
afterwards B tries to shoot A. B carries out his attack normally but with
a +2 modifier for using a gun in melee (I think that's the modifier :)

| PS I'm probably gonna get 'twapped' for this... but I'm relatively new to
| this list, so I'm _really_ wondering what the business is with the
| w--dch-cks. (See! I censored it!:))

Naw, people get thwapped for being really silly or for debating about
Grounding.

The whole w**dchuck thing started about 6-9 months ago when Bull
mentioned something about woodchucks and I asked, "How much wood
could a woodchuck chuk?" after which a very long thread about
woodchucks arose from the depths of depravity :) The thread was so
massive that it was a historical event (that many of us are trying to
forget but still tease eachother about).

-David
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1068/homepage.htm
--
"Creativity is allowing yourself to make mistakes. Art is knowing
which ones to keep."
Message no. 3
From: Barbie <barbie@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: Little combat question here...
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 1997 18:58:22 -0500
At 24-Sep-97 wrote Jod:


>Anyway, what happens if two people start a fight. One grabs a knife, the
>other a gun (Hold out, Heavy pistol, assualt cannon, whatever. ;)). What
>should be rolled? Should the gun wileder roll both firearms _and_ melee
>rolls? I guess if the gun is small enough, it can be used withouth penalties
>or something...

Simple, attacker rolls his combat skill, the the other counters.
If (A) attacker is the one with the firearm and the other (B) not,
then (A) fires at (B), (B) rolls damage resitance.
If (B) attacks first then rools (A) his un/armed combat against,
don`t forgett the +2 modifier for using a gun in melee.

--

Barbie
---------------------------------------------------------------
Evil Overlord advice #17:

When I employ people as advisors, I will occasionally listen to
their advice.

http://www.amigaworld.com/barbie
FAQ keeper of SR_D, the german Shadowrun mailing list.
---------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 4
From: Fade <runefo@***.UIO.NO>
Subject: Re: Little combat question here...
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 1997 19:23:35 +0000
Jod wrote:

> What happens if two people start a fight. One grabs a knife, the
> other a gun (Hold out, Heavy pistol, assualt cannon, whatever. ;)). What
> should be rolled? Should the gun wileder roll both firearms _and_ melee
> rolls? I guess if the gun is small enough, it can be used withouth penalties
> or something...

By the standard rules, they roll initiative. Both can use their
actions normally, but a firearm used in close quarters gets a +2 to
TN, no other difference. The knife wielder can attack normally, the
gunman may roll unarmed to counterattack, neither rolls is modified.

There is, though, a lot of house rules, including but not limited
to:

The firearms attack is considered a 'melee' attack and can be parried
and counterattacked. (But what reach would you assign a pistol?)

The + to hit TN in melee is increased with larger weapons and
accessories. (+1 extra for silencers or gas vents, +1 (or up) for
larger weapon sizes.)


--
Fade

And the Prince of Lies said:
"To reign is worth ambition, though in Hell:
Better to reign in hell than to serve in heaven."
-John Milton, Paradise Lost
Message no. 5
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Little combat question here...
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 1997 21:06:10 +0100
Jod said on 16:47/24 Sep 97...

> Anyway, what happens if two people start a fight. One grabs a knife, the
> other a gun (Hold out, Heavy pistol, assualt cannon, whatever. ;)). What
> should be rolled? Should the gun wileder roll both firearms _and_ melee
> rolls? I guess if the gun is small enough, it can be used withouth penalties
> or something...

This isn't all that well covered, but a +2 modifier to the shooter's TN
applies per opponent in the melee. Whenever someone attempts to do this
sort of thing, I tend to make them roll Armed Combat instead of Firearms,
and use net successes (if any) to stage up the damage just like the
firearm were a melee weapon.

I guess that BTB you have to roll a Firearms test, but that doesn't
really make all that much sense to me when you're attempting to shoot
someone from half a meter range, who's trying to get the gun away from
anywhere it can hurt...

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Zo buurman, ik hier?
-> NERPS Project Leader & Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-

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Message no. 6
From: Mike Bobroff <AirWisp@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Little combat question here...
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 1997 01:44:01 -0400
In a message dated 97-09-24 10:48:51 EDT, you write:

> Anyway, what happens if two people start a fight. One grabs a knife, the
> other a gun (Hold out, Heavy pistol, assualt cannon, whatever. ;)). What
> should be rolled? Should the gun wileder roll both firearms _and_ melee
> rolls? I guess if the gun is small enough, it can be used withouth
penalties
> or something...
>
> Just a question....
>
> Jod

Okay here are the two scenarios :

1. Fires the gun .. roll Firearms.
2. Swing with the gun to hit him with it ... Armed Combat

nuff said ...

oh, and as per your request ...


thwap !

Mike
Message no. 7
From: Knight Rook Brandon Bradley <shadowd@********.COM>
Subject: Re: Little combat question here...
Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 17:51:59 -0700
David Buehrer wrote:

> The whole w**dchuck thing started about 6-9 months ago when ... [snip]

I seem to remember a similar "thread" being brought up back in late 93'-early
94'... with about the same results... :) --
Knight Rook Brandon Bradley *** shadowd@********.com
A.K.A. The Shadow Dancer *** brabradl@****.edu
\______________)======================================================
WITH ORION'S SWORD THE HUNTER AROSE AND CONQUERED THE WORLD WITH FURY AND GRACE

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Thwap!