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Mailing List Logs for ShadowRN

Message no. 1
From: Chris Lubrecht <lubrecht@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: mage-heavy games
Date: Fri, 18 Nov 1994 11:51:09 -0500
>
> Well,
> I'm probably wasting bandwidth here, but Sinanju? Guess Rat here has seen
> Remo Williams: The Adventure Begins a few two many times...... :-)
> Still, those others sound fairly interesting. :)

..and maybe he even read the books? Check 'em out if you haven't...they
are cool. Don't wory, there is only about 150 of 'em.

Nigel
Message no. 2
From: Marc A Renouf <jormung@*****.UMICH.EDU>
Subject: Re: mage-heavy games
Date: Fri, 18 Nov 1994 13:17:27 -0500
On Fri, 18 Nov 1994, Wesley W. Walker wrote:

> Though your character concepts are pretty interesting, the fact
> still remains that Magic is rather unbalanced in SR. If a mage don't
> wanna get hurt, he won't get hurt.. unless another mage can fight him.
> So I really can't see the relevance of this response? =)

No, magic is not "unbalancing." And if a mage doesn't want to
get hurt, too damn bad. Physical barrier doesn't do much against a
falling building. Personal detect enemies doesn't pick up anti-personnel
mines. Have you ever seen what an AP mine can do to a guy? Not pretty.
And every good sam could probably get his hands on one.
For every example I give, I know you can think of a counter. And I
could probably counter that counter or come up with a new idea. The
point is that every character type has its strengths and weaknesses, and
mages are no exception. All you have to do is find a way to use that
weakness and you're set.
As for mages only being vulnerable to other mages, that is
patently untrue. I played a fairly badass combat mage for two years.
What did I do when I encountered another mage? I drew my gun and blew
his head off. Shadowrun is not like **&*. You don't see too many epic
magic-on-magic duels because they aren't practical. Both parties are
allocating spell defense/shielding to themselves, and neither can really
afford to use enough dice to break through without leaving himself wide
open. Most of the time the typical "mage duel" in Shadowrun consists of
two guys trying to see who can get their gun out first. As the old
saying goes, "the best way to keep a mage from casting a spell is to put
a bullet in his head."

Marc
Message no. 3
From: "Wesley W. Walker" <wwalker@****.UARK.EDU>
Subject: Re: mage-heavy games
Date: Fri, 18 Nov 1994 13:32:25 -0600
On Fri, 18 Nov 1994, Marc A Renouf wrote:

> No, magic is not "unbalancing." And if a mage doesn't want to
> get hurt, too damn bad. Physical barrier doesn't do much against a
> falling building. Personal detect enemies doesn't pick up anti-personnel
> mines. Have you ever seen what an AP mine can do to a guy? Not pretty.
> And every good sam could probably get his hands on one.

Uh, yeah. I don't see many building falling on people... and if
they did, that's one dead group of runners. End of discussion. As for
AP mines, sure, that works on everyone... except for a levitating mage..
but then again, here I go with specifics.. The truth of the matter is
that the mage is a unbalancing feature in the game. And a new spell can
clear out most problems.

> For every example I give, I know you can think of a counter. And I
> could probably counter that counter or come up with a new idea. The
> point is that every character type has its strengths and weaknesses, and
> mages are no exception. All you have to do is find a way to use that
> weakness and you're set.

True, but the mage does not seem to have enough. Drain is not
as big of a deal as it should be. But I'm still pretty much
inexperienced with the game mechs.. so please bare with me.. :)

> As for mages only being vulnerable to other mages, that is
> patently untrue. I played a fairly badass combat mage for two years.
> What did I do when I encountered another mage? I drew my gun and blew
> his head off. Shadowrun is not like **&*.

If he doesn't have a barrier up.. or is even visible. How about
the Astral attacks that everyone rants and raves about?

> You don't see too many epic
> magic-on-magic duels because they aren't practical. Both parties are
> allocating spell defense/shielding to themselves, and neither can really
> afford to use enough dice to break through without leaving himself wide
> open. Most of the time the typical "mage duel" in Shadowrun consists of
> two guys trying to see who can get their gun out first. As the old
> saying goes, "the best way to keep a mage from casting a spell is to put
> a bullet in his head."

True. But get enough mages in the party.. some putting up
barriers protecting the ones throwin' the real salt... then things get
ugly and few Runners really stand a chance. Remember, we're not talkin'
-one- mage, we're talkin' a whole stinkin' group of mages. A*&* at least
limited the mages in hit points.. Though the system is still pretty much
a mess otherwise.. :/


My two cents again. :)

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- Wes W. Walker (wwalker@****.uark.edu) * "But...Ego *IS* everything." -
- CSCI Major and General Slave * -
- Artiste Wanna-be (accepting donations)* -Me -
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Further Reading

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