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Message no. 1
From: Greg Symons <gsymons@******.TEMPLE.EDU>
Subject: Mass Produced Vehicles
Date: Tue, 11 Aug 1998 22:09:36 -0400
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OK, I alluded to these in my post about the Analyzer drones. They address a
small problem I have with the Rigger 2 design rules... they seem tailored
to designs that _PCs_ come up with on their _own_. The truth of this is
obvious to anyone who has ever tried to design one of the vehicles in the
book from scratch, as not only do the prices not match up, neither do the
point costs. In fact, most point costs seem to be around half to a quarter
of what they should be.

Because of these discrepancies in the design point, I have created a method
for creating mass-produced designs which adjusts not only the final price
(i.e. the multiplier) but also the point cost. It _still_ can't be used to
design anything in the book, but it comes close (I was able to design the
TADS Firebird for the same price, but the point cost was about 100 points
off. I also tested it on others, of course:)

First of all, on mass-produced items, the following parts are available at
half the point cost:

Chassis (makes sense...)
Powerplant (again, makes sense)
BattleTac FDDM
BattleTac IVIS
others I haven't tested yet:)

I don't quite know why BattleTac is half price on mass-produced items...
it's just the way the numbers fell (maybe manufacturers have reduced price
distribution licenses:)

Also, if a chassis includes sensors, and those sensors are upgraded,
subtract the point cost of the original sensor package from the final point
cost.

When calculating the mark-up multiplier, apply an additional .5 secondary
multiplier for mass-produced items.

In all cases, round up.

For example (I'll use the Analyzer)

Analyzer point cost (normal method): 1,996 (you can figger it out yourself
if you don't believe me;)

Analyzer mark-up (normal method): (1 (car) + 1.2 (unusual accesories)) *
3 (sec-grade vehicle) * .1 (drone) = .66

Analyzer price (normal method): 132,000 =Y=

Now, for a comparison, this is almost 2-and-a-half times the cost of the
Hedgehog, which does everything the Analyzer does, except actually
interface with the CCSS system. Sounds a bit overpriced to me:) 'Course the
Hedgehog had a mark-up of .01 ::: shrugs and scratches head :::

Now, let's redo it using my system:

Point cost: 1,884 (OK, this isn't much different, I'll admit. But ground
chassis are cheap, anyway:)
Mark-up: .33 (I actually used .4)
Price: 62,000 =Y= (That sounded _too_ much lower, so .4 came up with 75k)

So, whaddya'll think? Am I way off base here? Of course, this'll prolly be
errata'd soon, so it doesn't make much difference:)

Greg

***********************************************************************
* *
* \ (__) Greg Symons <gsymons@******.temple.edu> *
* \\(oo) Seanchai/ and Follower of Bri\de *
* /-----\\\/ *
* / | (##) "Hearken closely and you shall hear the *
* * ||----||" sound of cows and bagpipes upon the heath" *
* ^^ ^^ *
* *
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Message no. 2
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Mass Produced Vehicles
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1998 12:37:54 +0100
And verily, did Greg Symons hastily scribble thusly...
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Your sending this part as a attachment, much hated on the list because a lot
of mailers auto-save attachments to their hard disk.

Please configure the PGP thingy to append the PGP sig to the end of your
e-mail instead of sending it as an attachment.

Thank you.
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
| Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
| Finalist in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
| Computer Science | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
Message no. 3
From: Mike Bobroff <Airwasp@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Mass Produced Vehicles
Date: Wed, 12 Aug 1998 07:36:52 EDT
In a message dated 8/11/98 9:53:26 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
gsymons@******.ocis.temple.edu writes:

> OK, I alluded to these in my post about the Analyzer drones. They address a
> small problem I have with the Rigger 2 design rules... they seem tailored
> to designs that _PCs_ come up with on their _own_. The truth of this is
> obvious to anyone who has ever tried to design one of the vehicles in the
> book from scratch, as not only do the prices not match up, neither do the
> point costs. In fact, most point costs seem to be around half to a quarter
> of what they should be.
>
> Because of these discrepancies in the design point, I have created a method
> for creating mass-produced designs which adjusts not only the final price
> (i.e. the multiplier) but also the point cost. It _still_ can't be used to
> design anything in the book, but it comes close (I was able to design the
> TADS Firebird for the same price, but the point cost was about 100 points
> off. I also tested it on others, of course:)
>
Hmm, seems like a lot of math to me, but then again, I'm used to it. However,
perhaps a simpler method. Take a d6 and roll it, do not reroll if a 6,
multiply the die roll by 5 and this represents how much cheaper it is to
-BUILD- the vehicle overall, not for getting components cheap.

As for costs being far less than the cost for building one, yes, that is very
correct, but most car companies would still keep the price high to keep their
profit margin and pay for other businesses they own which are currently taking
losses.

-Herc
------- The Best Mechanic you can ever have.
Message no. 4
From: Greg Symons <gsymons@******.TEMPLE.EDU>
Subject: Re: Mass Produced Vehicles
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1998 00:19:41 -0400
[snip explanation of why I created MPV rules]

>Hmm, seems like a lot of math to me, but then again, I'm used to it. However,
>perhaps a simpler method. Take a d6 and roll it, do not reroll if a 6,
>multiply the die roll by 5 and this represents how much cheaper it is to
>-BUILD- the vehicle overall, not for getting components cheap.

I don't really like the randomness of that. I'd much prefer a formula that
consistently works. It's much more tidy:) (of course if you looked at my
desk right now you'd wonder why I cared:)

>
>As for costs being far less than the cost for building one, yes, that is very
>correct, but most car companies would still keep the price high to keep their
>profit margin and pay for other businesses they own which are currently taking
>losses.

But that wouldn't explain why the drones and vehicles in R2 are far cheaper
than they should be. I think if they can produce the things cheaper they'd
lower the price and actually _increase_ their profit margin by selling more
units. Why buy that 214,000 =Y= Wandjina when you can build it yourself for
the same price, and customize it how you like?

You have to consider too, that the listed prices are to _licensed_ and
legal buyers. Add in street index for a vehicle designed with the design
system, and it's not worth it for the GM to even bother creating drones
that their players can buy (a possible way of directing them without
directing them. You want them to be sneaky, show them how well that sneaky
new reccy drone sneaks up on them. Then tell them it's on the market:), as
the players can have their characters design them for less.

Greg

***********************************************************************
* *
* \ (__) Greg Symons <gsymons@******.temple.edu> *
* \\(oo) Seanchai/ and Follower of Bri\de *
* /-----\\\/ *
* / | (##) "Hearken closely and you shall hear the *
* * ||----||" sound of cows and bagpipes upon the heath" *
* ^^ ^^ *
* *
* PGP Fingerprint: 694E 3B0B 4834 7831 BBCA C9E8 4299 0765 15F5 E599 *
* *
***********************************************************************


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Further Reading

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