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Message no. 1
From: Pete Sims <petesims@********.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Misery
Date: Sun, 6 Oct 1996 21:33:36 +0100
It seems a shame that when one of my players plucks up the courage to
write into this newsgroup and ask for information about a subject they
are dealing with. Primarily what can people tell them about their
interpretation of England in 205*, albeit that they asked *in
character*, that

A) They get no answers.
B) The few answers they do get are not on the subject asked (OK, this
happens, and was amusing to most.)
C) The one answer they do get that is almost on topic, actually tells
them to sod off over to another group. When the player does this, they
get a rather blunt and to the point message to go away as this is not a
suitable place to ask a question like that, even though it *IS* game
related.

Those of you who answered in this fashion will know who you are, and I
would like to take this moment to take you to task over it. The player
is rather upset over the reaction she received over what is essentially
game related and in keeping with this group. She wanted everyones take
(primarily players - some GM) on their view of 205* England.

It strikes me as a shame that she got told off for this, seeing as it is
not exactly a new thing for this group and has been dealt with in the
past in good taste.

OK, maybe a mistake was to ask the question and answer *in character*,
but because it was very much an in-character question, she and I felt it
was suitable. If we were wrong sorry, but being pointed to another
group that had nothing to do with the subject, and to get flamed for
this misdirection was in my opinion unacceptable.

The initial thread seems to have got onto a strange subject regarding
"tea" and what it is and what people do with it, again the questions
were answered light heartedly, and in the most, were taken in that vein
by the people who answered. I feel that enough smileys were attached
to the post to indicate it was meant as a light hearted answer, while
the people who answered in the vein it was intended, information,
received a similar reply.

There is *NO* actual Shadowrun area for asking this type of question,
which is why this group was chosen, *THAT* is *my* choice and *my*
responsibility. If I was wrong, then have a go at me, directly, by
Email.

Shadowtk - where my playere was pointed, is for the discussion *(in
character* of ongoing games and apparently not for the idle banter and
questioning of players

<Quote:>

Incindary Cluster Bomb AWAY!!!
should have been sent to plotd@********.itribe.net not the shadowtk main
list which contains the running story plots. If you wanted to have your
character ask around, fine, but check out the shadowtk FAQ's at
http://www.itribe.net/shadowrun/ and follow the posting guidelines
listed
there. Regretibly, I have no further information opon the British.

<end quote.>


PlotD, is for the discussion of Game plots, but seems to be used as an
ongoing game area.

NERPS is for the discussion and submission of material for the NERPS
series of books editied by GURTH.

SO, PRECISELY where is it suitable to ask questions relating to games.

Well.... I'm, waiting.

There have been several discussions in this group regarding rules
interpretation, views on the world in general and countless other
subjects. I feel that a very few treated my player wth contempt and are
in my mind at least held accountable for poor taste.

If the discussion of Shadowrun is not part of this list, then I have
made a seriously fundamental mistake in recommending this list to my
players and other people. I believed, obviously mistakenly, that they
would be permitted to ask questions like the one fielded originally
under the "London's Calling" thread. This would appear not to be the
case. Not even privately over e-mail.

I am surprised, and not a little disappointed by a couple of people
here, although not all should take this letter personally,

The majority have been really big about this, and accepted the initial
apology from the player regarding the question and making mistakes - I
would like to thank those people gratefully for their handling of the
new poster, and their friendliness and humour when replying to her
posts.

One or two of you have not, and that is not nice. :(

Just my two minutes of rambling to defend the reasoning behind my
players' posting. This should not be take as a personal affront to
anyone. It's just me ranting after my player got a little upset over
something that was sent from the group over email. This person will be
ignored, he's obviously had a bad day.

I would like to thank Jeffrey Mach in Shadowtk for pointing out that
that list was the wrong place, and doing so with humour and good taste,
and would like to thank a certain other person for suggesting she post
there.

Quote

Could you drop the in-character crap please?
Keep in character stuff to shadowTK where it belongs.

(And no Andrew H, she didn't know about Captain Luc from Enterwhatsit,
she doesn't watch the program and has no interest in it, however, the
answer was meant to be light hearted, I apologise for that, I wasn't
aware of the answer, or I may have asked her to add a few more smileys
and things. I will monitor her posts more closely in future - OK)

Apparently it doesn't belong there either. There you go.

So - maybe someone here could tell me exactly WHERE such in character
behaviour does belong. If a player can't ask a question about a subject
that is closely related to Shadowrun, in fact had an entire sourcebook
devoted to it. Then it becomes a sad day when a list devoted to
Shadowrun devolves into a "Rules Only!" area.

Maybe it might be a good idea to start up a "Players group/list" where
players can communicate *in character* and swap data about the stuff
they're doing, about experiences in cities and areas, how a particular
run went, information on contacts, etc. A "Player Shadowrun Resource"
if you like. The only place I have found where this behaviour is
acceptable is SHADOWLAND, but it's a long way to get there, and can only
be joined "on-line", not a cheap way to communicate.

Or, Would it be acceptable to have a "PLAYER QUESTIONS ONLY" thread,
seeing as two of the other lists are for ongoing games and don't like
invasion, and another is for net books. I'm sure there are a lot of
posters in here that don't mind getting *in character* occassionally.

But then, that wouldn't be in keeping with the flavour of Shadowrun
would it?

My five minutes ranting.


Pete
--
Pete Sims
Heroes or Fools? That's a determination others will make in hindsight. But by
being here now, we make that determination for ourselves, and it's neither.
Lt.Col.T.C.McQueen
Message no. 2
From: dbuehrer@****.org (David Buehrer)
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Sun, 6 Oct 1996 20:11:32 -0600 (MDT)
Pete Sims wrote:
|
|It seems a shame that when one of my players plucks up the courage to
|write into this newsgroup and ask for information about a subject they
|are dealing with. Primarily what can people tell them about their
|interpretation of England in 205*, albeit that they asked *in
|character*, that
|
|A) They get no answers.
|B) The few answers they do get are not on the subject asked (OK, this
|happens, and was amusing to most.)
|C) The one answer they do get that is almost on topic, actually tells
|them to sod off over to another group. When the player does this, they
|get a rather blunt and to the point message to go away as this is not a
|suitable place to ask a question like that, even though it *IS* game
|related.

Hmmm... I didn't answer for a couple of reasons. I'm a GM
and the only information I could give that would apply come
from the London Sourcebook. But, if I were to do that I
might spoil things for the player's GM. That's an open
invitation for a Flame. Anything else I might offer
probably wouldn't apply, as it's from my game and not your
game. Ditto if I were a player.

And as to the blunt responses, did your player read the FAQ
for ShadowTK? For that matter, did your player read the
FAQ for ShadowRN? I'm pretty sure I remember a section
about not posting in character. This isn't meant as a
flame, just trying to point out why some anomosity might
have occured. I've seen a few "Read the fucking FAQ"
messages in the last year. The responses your player got
were fairly mild :)

IMHO, if a person has questions about rules or the SR
universe, whether factual or hypothetical, this is the
place. If a person has questions that relate to a specific
campaign, they should be handled by that GM.

Tell Blaze(sp?) to come on back and enjoy the ride :)

-David

/^\/^\/^\/^\/^\/^\/^\ dbuehrer@****.org /^\/^\/^\/^\/^\/^\/^\
"His thoughts tumbled in his head, making and breaking
alliances like underpants in a dryer without Cling Free."
~~~http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1068/homepage.htm~~~~
Message no. 3
From: Faux Pas <fauxpas@******.net>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Sun, 6 Oct 1996 23:02:00 -0500
At 09:33 PM 10/6/96 +0100, Pete Sims wrote [with bits snipped]:
>It seems a shame that when one of my players plucks up the courage to
>write into this newsgroup and ask for information about a subject they
>are dealing with. Primarily what can people tell them about their
>interpretation of England in 205*, albeit that they asked *in
>character*, that
>
>A) They get no answers.
>B) The few answers they do get are not on the subject asked (OK, this
>happens, and was amusing to most.)
>C) The one answer they do get that is almost on topic, actually tells
>them to sod off over to another group. When the player does this, they
>get a rather blunt and to the point message to go away as this is not a
>suitable place to ask a question like that, even though it *IS* game
>related.

>SO, PRECISELY where is it suitable to ask questions relating to games.
>
>Well.... I'm, waiting.

Here's where the question should have been asked, and here's where it should
have been answered. When everybody started to turn the initial thread over
to a debate about the northerners vs the southerners, or the Americans vs
Everyone Else, or the tea-drinkers vs the non-tea-drinkers, the list failed
its purpose. I stopped reading the London Calling thread because of this,
like I've dropped reading many other threads on this mailing list.

It is a shame that nobody answered the original poster. Doesn't anyone run
in Shadowrun's UK? Has anyone run in the UK? I didn't contribute to the
thread because my game is centered on the North American continent. If you
didn't intend to help out the person asking for help, then why were you
filling everyone's e-mail accounts with irrelavent mailings about the merits
of tea?

It's a greater shame that someone told the poster to sod off and find
another group. Whoever did that [and I don't know who that was] needs to
think about what this mailing list is for.

Like Digital Mage said, can we please stay on the topic of the conversation
- and if we drift, change the damn headers?

-Thomas Deeny
the Cartoonist at large is on the web at www2.cy-net.net/~fauxpas

"She twisted her engagement ring and Flash's costume flew out of it."
-one of a list of reasons why Lois Lane and Superman broke up (they're back
together).
Message no. 4
From: "A Halliwell" <u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Mon, 7 Oct 1996 12:50:11 +0100 (BST)
|A) They get no answers.

He did get answers. In fact, I saw quite a lot of (possibly) useful stuff.
The thing that bugged me was that he wasn't obviously *in character* and I
was trying to explain to some moron what tea is.....

|B) The few answers they do get are not on the subject asked (OK, this
|happens, and was amusing to most.)

And slightly irritating....

|C) The one answer they do get that is almost on topic, actually tells
|them to sod off over to another group. When the player does this, they
|get a rather blunt and to the point message to go away as this is not a
|suitable place to ask a question like that, even though it *IS* game
|related.

I didn't tell him to "SOD OFF". When it became apparent that he was supposed
to be totally in character, I sent him to shadowtk because that's where In
character stuff goes.
Unfortunately, shadowtk has a specific in character format, which, if he'd
bother to read the FAQ or even some of the posts, he could have duplicated.

Unfortunately (again), he just jumped right in without reading anything (or
that's what it looked like from where I was sitting.....
(I wasn't the one to tell him to get off that group however.....)

|Those of you who answered in this fashion will know who you are, and I
|would like to take this moment to take you to task over it. The player
|is rather upset over the reaction she received over what is essentially
|game related and in keeping with this group. She wanted everyones take
|(primarily players - some GM) on their view of 205* England.

It might have helped if she hadn't played the "I have no idea what Tea is.
Please tell." bit so long, and had actually asked something more relevant.

|It strikes me as a shame that she got told off for this, seeing as it is
|not exactly a new thing for this group and has been dealt with in the
|past in good taste.

Come on. It was getting rather silly.
You can't deny that.

|OK, maybe a mistake was to ask the question and answer *in character*,
|but because it was very much an in-character question, she and I felt it
|was suitable. If we were wrong sorry, but being pointed to another
|group that had nothing to do with the subject, and to get flamed for
|this misdirection was in my opinion unacceptable.

The other group is totally for "In Character" stuff.
However, it has to be sent in a format similar to the comments in the
sourcebooks. It is the equivalent of shadowland.
(If she'd done it in the correct way, she would have got in character
responses!)

|There is *NO* actual Shadowrun area for asking this type of question,
|which is why this group was chosen, *THAT* is *my* choice and *my*
|responsibility. If I was wrong, then have a go at me, directly, by
|Email.

The *is* a place, and that place *is* shadowtk.....

|Shadowtk - where my playere was pointed, is for the discussion *(in
|character* of ongoing games and apparently not for the idle banter and
|questioning of players

It is for any in character stuff. The fact that a character might ask a
question *IN CHARACTER* means it is game relevant there.
(The format must be strictly adhered to however.)
|SO, PRECISELY where is it suitable to ask questions relating to games.
|
|Well.... I'm, waiting.

Well, I think I've answered with my opinions.....

|There have been several discussions in this group regarding rules
|interpretation, views on the world in general and countless other
|subjects. I feel that a very few treated my player wth contempt and are
|in my mind at least held accountable for poor taste.

I didn't treat anyone with "contempt". I just got fed up with the "in
character thing and Tea". Especially as it took a while to realise it WAS in
character. I simply pointed out that shadowtk was the correct place for in
character discussion, which it is.

|If the discussion of Shadowrun is not part of this list, then I have
|made a seriously fundamental mistake in recommending this list to my
|players and other people. I believed, obviously mistakenly, that they
|would be permitted to ask questions like the one fielded originally
|under the "London's Calling" thread. This would appear not to be the
|case. Not even privately over e-mail.

I'm sorry, but I don't know what you're talking about.
This is a shadowrun list. It is for rules discussions etc etc etc.

|I am surprised, and not a little disappointed by a couple of people
|here, although not all should take this letter personally,

And I should I suppose?
I think you should spend some time reading the FAQs for both shadowrn and
shadowtk. I admit I might have been a bit blunt, but it was irritating me at
the time....

|Quote
|
|Could you drop the in-character crap please?
|Keep in character stuff to shadowTK where it belongs.

As I said, a bit blunt, but I was irritated.....

|(And no Andrew H, she didn't know about Captain Luc from Enterwhatsit,
|she doesn't watch the program and has no interest in it, however, the
|answer was meant to be light hearted, I apologise for that, I wasn't
|aware of the answer, or I may have asked her to add a few more smileys
|and things. I will monitor her posts more closely in future - OK)

Well, I thought everyone would've at least heard of Star Trek the next
Generation (and the film Generations).
Obviously, I was wrong.


If I was too blunt, sorry.
--
______________________________________________________________________________
|u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk | |
|Andrew Halliwell | "ARSE! GERLS!! DRINK! DRINK! DRINK!!!" |
|Principal subjects in:-| "THAT WOULD BE AN ECCLESIASTICAL MATTER!...FECK!!!!|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | - Father Jack in "Father Ted"
|
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ 5++ |
|X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! >*SULK*<|
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 5
From: Pete Sims <petesims@********.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 01:09:40 +0100
In article <199610070402.XAA21807@****.cy-net.net>, Faux Pas
<fauxpas@******.net> writes
[snip]
>Here's where the question should have been asked, and here's where it should
>have been answered. When everybody started to turn the initial thread over
>to a debate about the northerners vs the southerners, or the Americans vs
>Everyone Else, or the tea-drinkers vs the non-tea-drinkers, the list failed
>its purpose. I stopped reading the London Calling thread because of this,
>like I've dropped reading many other threads on this mailing list.
>
I appreciate that the thread did get kinda screwy, but as you know this
happens sometimes.
It's nice to know that we were right in asking the question here, it
seems that this is the busiest list, and would therefore have the most
diverse and informative views on the subject without going into a long
drawn out "specifically" formatted manner.
I know what you mean about the threads, I've dropped a couple myself
(FAB springs to mind).

>It is a shame that nobody answered the original poster. Doesn't anyone run
>in Shadowrun's UK? Has anyone run in the UK? I didn't contribute to the
>thread because my game is centered on the North American continent. If you
>didn't intend to help out the person asking for help, then why were you
>filling everyone's e-mail accounts with irrelavent mailings about the merits
>of tea?
Initially I think it started as a joke, but turned into a bit of a
debate that got out of hand. :) Oh well, such is life :(
>
>It's a greater shame that someone told the poster to sod off and find
>another group. Whoever did that [and I don't know who that was] needs to
>think about what this mailing list is for.

The mail unfortunately came via E-Mail, but I am watching for the person
on all four lists, and when I see him, he will be reminded of a few
facts of life. I read the posts that were sent to my player (who is
female) and they were *extremely* unpleasant and personal. I must
confess, that it was a result of this that the "Misery" thread and
another were born. :( My player was very upset over the mails, and is
now tending her wounds beofre braving the list again. :( Sometimes
people just don't understand the word "moderation". :(

>
>Like Digital Mage said, can we please stay on the topic of the conversation
>- and if we drift, change the damn headers?
Agreed. Header changes should become an essential part of this list
when topics stray, Unfortunatel my mailer ignores this, and looks to
the originating post, and builds threads from there, so whether or not I
change the thread header, it still appears under the old one, I don't
know how other mailers are dealing with it, I'm hoping that they reflect
the changes.

Thanks for the support Thomas, 've shown this and other posts to my
player, to prove that she isn't "universaly hated" because of one small
error, that really is *my* fault in the first place. :*(

Pete
--
Pete Sims
Heroes or Fools? That's a determination others will make in hindsight. But by
being here now, we make that determination for ourselves, and it's neither.
Lt.Col.T.C.McQueen
Message no. 6
From: Pete Sims <petesims@********.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 01:43:55 +0100
In article <15040.199610071150@******.cc.keele.ac.uk>, A Halliwell
<u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk> writes
>|A) They get no answers.
>
>He did get answers. In fact, I saw quite a lot of (possibly) useful stuff.
>The thing that bugged me was that he wasn't obviously *in character* and I
>was trying to explain to some moron what tea is.....

"She", and yes some answers were supplied. These were printed and are
now stored in the characters file. I noticed thed tea debate got a
little strange. :(
>
>|B) The few answers they do get are not on the subject asked (OK, this
>|happens, and was amusing to most.)
>
>And slightly irritating....
>
Occassionally, yes, especially for those who have to pay for mail space
with their ISP.

>|C) The one answer they do get that is almost on topic, actually tells
>|them to sod off over to another group. When the player does this, they
>|get a rather blunt and to the point message to go away as this is not a
>|suitable place to ask a question like that, even though it *IS* game
>|related.
>
>I didn't tell him to "SOD OFF". When it became apparent that he was supposed
>to be totally in character, I sent him to shadowtk because that's where In
>character stuff goes.
>Unfortunately, shadowtk has a specific in character format, which, if he'd
>bother to read the FAQ or even some of the posts, he could have duplicated.

No, Andy, *you* didn't, you just asked that the "in-character crap
stop". The "sod off" mail came seperately, I apologise if you felt that
the mention was taken as an implication of *You* being rude, it wasn't
inteded that way, the "sod off" messages were over private mail, and
believe me "sod off" is a VERY mild translation. Sorry if you took it
that i meant you. I didn't :)

>
>Unfortunately (again), he just jumped right in without reading anything (or
>that's what it looked like from where I was sitting.....
>(I wasn't the one to tell him to get off that group however.....)
No you weren't.

>
>|Those of you who answered in this fashion will know who you are, and I
>|would like to take this moment to take you to task over it. The player
>|is rather upset over the reaction she received over what is essentially
>|game related and in keeping with this group. She wanted everyones take
>|(primarily players - some GM) on their view of 205* England.
>
>It might have helped if she hadn't played the "I have no idea what Tea is.
>Please tell." bit so long, and had actually asked something more relevant.
Towards the end of the tea bit, the player did point out that the
question was originally for information "in character" regarding
England. unfortunately, this came too late, to stop a couple of bigots
from getting "wierd".

>
>|It strikes me as a shame that she got told off for this, seeing as it is
>|not exactly a new thing for this group and has been dealt with in the
>|past in good taste.
>
>Come on. It was getting rather silly.
>You can't deny that.
I don't deny it, it was getting *really* silly. :*(

>|OK, maybe a mistake was to ask the question and answer *in character*,
>|but because it was very much an in-character question, she and I felt it
>|was suitable. If we were wrong sorry, but being pointed to another
>|group that had nothing to do with the subject, and to get flamed for
>|this misdirection was in my opinion unacceptable.
>
>The other group is totally for "In Character" stuff.
>However, it has to be sent in a format similar to the comments in the
>sourcebooks. It is the equivalent of shadowland.
>(If she'd done it in the correct way, she would have got in character
>responses!)

Maybe, maybe not, it was something that occured as a result of the not
formatted correctly bit that she was told in no uncertain terms that
Shadowtk is for *on going* games, not character questions about other
things. This response is what prompted my posting "Misery".

>
>|There is *NO* actual Shadowrun area for asking this type of question,
>|which is why this group was chosen, *THAT* is *my* choice and *my*
>|responsibility. If I was wrong, then have a go at me, directly, by
>|Email.
>
>The *is* a place, and that place *is* shadowtk.....
Apparently not :( regardless of what it states in the FAQ. :(

[snip]
>It is for any in character stuff. The fact that a character might ask a
>question *IN CHARACTER* means it is game relevant there.
>(The format must be strictly adhered to however.)

The format must be adhered to, this was made clear by some chap called
Marc, who contacted us privately, and explained what was expected.
However, the other responses recieved where *very* clear that Shadowtk
is for *ongoing games* not asking stupid questions about the game or
game material.

"If she wasn't invited to play, she should go soak, is a basic summary."

>|There have been several discussions in this group regarding rules
>|interpretation, views on the world in general and countless other
>|subjects. I feel that a very few treated my player wth contempt and are
>|in my mind at least held accountable for poor taste.
>
>I didn't treat anyone with "contempt". I just got fed up with the "in
>character thing and Tea". Especially as it took a while to realise it WAS in
>character. I simply pointed out that shadowtk was the correct place for in
>character discussion, which it is.
Again, you have taken this post personally and I apologise for this, I
should have made it clear at the beginning that I wasn't having a go at
*you*, you merely made it clear that you were fed up with the "in
character crap, and the tea discussion".

[snip]
>|If the discussion of Shadowrun is not part of this list, then I have
>|made a seriously fundamental mistake in recommending this list to my
>|players and other people. I believed, obviously mistakenly, that they
>|would be permitted to ask questions like the one fielded originally
>|under the "London's Calling" thread. This would appear not to be the
>|case. Not even privately over e-mail.
>
>I'm sorry, but I don't know what you're talking about.
>This is a shadowrun list. It is for rules discussions etc etc etc.
>
That's what I thought, but a couple of unpleasant people don't seem to
think so. I've not seen regular posts from them and I've been here for
quite a few months, so I must assume they are lurkers, but the mail
recieved was *very specific*. I was a teeny bit miffed, and "Misery"
was born.

>|I am surprised, and not a little disappointed by a couple of people
>|here, although not all should take this letter personally,
>
>And I should I suppose?
Most definately not :)

EVERYBODY PLEASE NOTE I AM NOW SHOUTING. :)

I AM NOT INTENTIONALLY ACCUSING A.HALLIWELL OF MISBEHAVING BADLY.

I should have been a little more specific, as I said, and as you
probably gathered from this diatribe, I was a bit miffed after my player
became upset over a couple of things that had been said to her.

>I think you should spend some time reading the FAQs for both shadowrn and
>shadowtk. I admit I might have been a bit blunt, but it was irritating me at
>the time....
Fine, it was irritating you, I appreciate that, but this post was not
intended to have a go you personally, but at a couple of people here
with odd attitudes towards newcomers, and females in particular. I
apologise to you Mr. Halliwell if I have implicated that you are the
deserving recipient of this post. That was *not* the intention, though
reading through it again I can see how you would make that mistake. :(

>As I said, a bit blunt, but I was irritated.....
As I was in light of the email recieved - which was NOT from you. :)

[snip moan about Halliwell comment]
>Well, I thought everyone would've at least heard of Star Trek the next
>Generation (and the film Generations).
>Obviously, I was wrong.

Unfortunately, and unbeknownst to you yes. I only caught the end of it
all myself when I visited a friends house, and he happened to be
watching it. We went through several years of "non-television", having
an intense dislike of the programs supplied by the "entertainment
industry", and indulged ourselves in other things, usually in rural
areas :). That is until my disability prevented that entertainment.

>If I was too blunt, sorry.
I personally have received more blunt posts than yours, but I have
*never* been the recipient of something like what she recieved over e-
mail. Sorry if you took it as an attack on you. It wasn't intended as
such.

It was a general moan at the nasty buggers who hang in the shadows here
and Shadowtk, and object to women posting, and the general lack of
clarity as to the actual purpose of the Shadowtk area. The FAQ states
it's for "in character" discussion, but it was made very clear to my
player by an unpleasant little oik from the list that it is *actually
for ongoing PBEM games* (unqoute), and NOT character discussion. As
Shadowland is an on-line area, we chose this list as the more
financially sensible.

I re-read the FAQ, and as you so rightly state it is for

Shadowtalk is an interactive fiction mailing list based on Shadowrun.
Members of the list post as characters in genre, and by responding to
each other's posts "in character", stories are developed. These stories
may then be used by players and GMs alike as a basis for contacts, NPCs,
and adventure plots in their own campaigns.

(unqoute)
This apparently (taken from the FAQ) is inaccurate :(. I got confused,
as did my player. Well, nobody ever said life was simple. :(

Angain, Mr. Halliwell, I'm sorry if this post seemed as a personal
attack on you, this was *NOT* the intention of the post.

Pete (on behalf of Blaze)
--
Pete Sims
Heroes or Fools? That's a determination others will make in hindsight. But by
being here now, we make that determination for ourselves, and it's neither.
Lt.Col.T.C.McQueen
Message no. 7
From: Pete Sims <petesims@********.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 01:00:56 +0100
In article <9610070211.AA28704@******>, David Buehrer
<dbuehrer@****.org> writes
[snip]
>Hmmm... I didn't answer for a couple of reasons. I'm a GM
>and the only information I could give that would apply come
>from the London Sourcebook. But, if I were to do that I
>might spoil things for the player's GM. That's an open
>invitation for a Flame. Anything else I might offer
>probably wouldn't apply, as it's from my game and not your
>game. Ditto if I were a player.
>
>And as to the blunt responses, did your player read the FAQ
>for ShadowTK? For that matter, did your player read the
>FAQ for ShadowRN? I'm pretty sure I remember a section
>about not posting in character. This isn't meant as a
>flame, just trying to point out why some anomosity might
>have occured. I've seen a few "Read the fucking FAQ"
>messages in the last year. The responses your player got
>were fairly mild :)
>
The FAQ problem was that it was a quick browse, and the "formatting of
the players question was wrong". Apparently if it had been done in the
recognised format it would have been answered accordingly. However, a
couple of posts via E-Mail were not quite so explanatory, and a *lot*
more descriptive. (not nicely). Apparently there are a couple of
bigots who reside in these places - though whether as lurkers or posters
remains to be seen. I'm watching :).

>IMHO, if a person has questions about rules or the SR
>universe, whether factual or hypothetical, this is the
>place. If a person has questions that relate to a specific
>campaign, they should be handled by that GM.
The wuestion was intended for general "player character" views of
England in 205*. Specific information is supplied by me (GM). She was
trying to get "in character" responses to the question, but as I said,
it didn't follow the standard formatting recognised by people in
Shadowtk. What caused the *real* problem was the extremely abusive E-
Mails recieved. :(

>
>Tell Blaze(sp?) to come on back and enjoy the ride :)
She's a tad tender at the moment, as I said the e-mails were *very*
personal, but hse is fairly robust, and will probably turn up again. :)

Thanks.

Pete, on behalf of Blaze
--
Pete Sims
Heroes or Fools? That's a determination others will make in hindsight. But by
being here now, we make that determination for ourselves, and it's neither.
Lt.Col.T.C.McQueen
Message no. 8
From: The Jestyr <s421539@*******.gu.edu.au>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 18:20:13 +1000 (EST)
> It was a general moan at the nasty buggers who hang in the shadows here
> and Shadowtk, and object to women posting,

Yeah? Just TRY and shut *me* up... *grin*

Seriously, though, I think your player should know that this is most
definitely a minority view. The response to my computer fixation, my RPG
fixation, and the combination of the two culminating with my presence
here on this list has resulted in only positive feedback about female
gamers, and a general bemoaning the lack of more of them.

And I only have one problem with the list myself - it's too busy! I'm so
busy trolling through SR posts that I never get to answer personal email!
(Sorry Gurth... it IS on the way...)

Lady Jestyr

------------------------------------------------------
A titanic intellect... in a world full of icebergs
------------------------------------------------------
Elle Holmes s421539@*****.student.gu.edu.au
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1503
------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 9
From: "Mark Steedman" <M.J.Steedman@***.rgu.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 11:32:38 GMT
Pete Sims <petesims@********.demon.co.uk>

> It seems a shame that when one of my players plucks up the courage to
> write into this newsgroup and ask for information about a subject they
> are dealing with. Primarily what can people tell them about their
> interpretation of England in 205*, albeit that they asked *in
> character*, that
>
I think the primary problem was that you jumped to in character
without warning, folks assume its players or GM's on here and a
second person wws writing from the account without warning and your
.sig, i think that threw a few more :(

> A) They get no answers.
you have a point the topic drifted fast.

> B) The few answers they do get are not on the subject asked (OK, this
> happens, and was amusing to most.)
> C) The one answer they do get that is almost on topic, actually tells
> them to sod off over to another group. When the player does this, they
> get a rather blunt and to the point message to go away as this is not a
> suitable place to ask a question like that, even though it *IS* game
> related.
>
The in character posts could have done with some warning, i recon you
managed to confuse people, considering >100 mails a day consider the
speed folks have to process mail at!

> There is *NO* actual Shadowrun area for asking this type of question,
> which is why this group was chosen, *THAT* is *my* choice and *my*
> responsibility. If I was wrong, then have a go at me, directly, by
> Email.
I think you were right to use shadowrn, its a general forum, go
ahead, just you needed to let folks know somehow so when a mail comes
up that seems very uninformed folks realise why. I suspect some folks
should have checked your email address and wondered but not everyones
mail programme makes that easy.
>
> quote
>
> Could you drop the in-character crap please?
> Keep in character stuff to shadowTK where it belongs.
>
could have done with some warning of what was going on. As long as
the discussions valid, ok. we have been getting a lot of excessive
quoting and 'thats great' posts which are a pain.

Mark
Message no. 10
From: "Gurth" <gurth@******.nl>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 13:19:53 +0100
The Jestyr said on 18:20/ 8 Oct 96...

> Seriously, though, I think your player should know that this is most
> definitely a minority view. The response to my computer fixation, my RPG
> fixation, and the combination of the two culminating with my presence
> here on this list has resulted in only positive feedback about female
> gamers, and a general bemoaning the lack of more of them.

But you have to admit you're more or less a rarity. I don't know (of)
many women using computers and/or playing RPGs, though that may be
because I don't know many women at all. Female members are few and far
between on this list (three or so who post regularly now?), although the
number goes up and down a bit.

> And I only have one problem with the list myself - it's too busy! I'm so
> busy trolling through SR posts that I never get to answer personal email!
> (Sorry Gurth... it IS on the way...)

I was starting to wonder... :)

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Learn their rules, play their game, deceive yourself in haste.
-> NERPS Project Leader & Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
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Y PGP- t(+) 5+ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
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Message no. 11
From: "A Halliwell" <u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 13:48:27 +0100 (BST)
|The format must be adhered to, this was made clear by some chap called
|Marc, who contacted us privately, and explained what was expected.
|However, the other responses recieved where *very* clear that Shadowtk
|is for *ongoing games* not asking stupid questions about the game or
|game material.

Actually, it is for "In character stuff". If some of those list members get
a bit too big for their boots, then that's their problem.....
(She should ask as a character in an on-going campaign along the lines
of....

>>>>>[Hey doods, anyone know what the English are like, 'cos I'll be
runnin'
there soon.....]<<<<<<
[Blaze: 12:53:40 08:10:57]

Or however the format is meant to go..... Also, there is a way to actually
become a "Cast Member" which might help.

If anyone started getting nasty then, just report them to Mr J D Falk, 'cos
they're abusing their rights, (or wrongs, in this case).

|"If she wasn't invited to play, she should go soak, is a basic summary."

You don't need to be invited to "play" on shadowtk. Anyone can subscribe,
and anyone can become a cast member. (Even if they only commment on other
characters views without actually taking part in the fiction. I've poked my
nose in as RandomLurker a couple of times....)
|EVERYBODY PLEASE NOTE I AM NOW SHOUTING. :)
|
|I AM NOT INTENTIONALLY ACCUSING A.HALLIWELL OF MISBEHAVING BADLY.

Ahhh, but you did qoute me..... :)
(I understand)

|It was a general moan at the nasty buggers who hang in the shadows here
|and Shadowtk, and object to women posting, and the general lack of
|clarity as to the actual purpose of the Shadowtk area. The FAQ states
|it's for "in character" discussion, but it was made very clear to my
|player by an unpleasant little oik from the list that it is *actually
|for ongoing PBEM games* (unqoute), and NOT character discussion. As
|Shadowland is an on-line area, we chose this list as the more
|financially sensible.

The list can be used for on-going PBeM games, but if these people think they
own the list, then they're sadly mistaken....

|I re-read the FAQ, and as you so rightly state it is for
|
|Shadowtalk is an interactive fiction mailing list based on Shadowrun.
|Members of the list post as characters in genre, and by responding to
|each other's posts "in character", stories are developed. These stories
|may then be used by players and GMs alike as a basis for contacts, NPCs,
|and adventure plots in their own campaigns.
|
|(unqoute)
|This apparently (taken from the FAQ) is inaccurate :(. I got confused,
|as did my player. Well, nobody ever said life was simple. :(

No, it's accurate. Just some people on the list seem to have taken it into
their heads that they own it....
I'd set my heals in and start seriously irritating these arseholes....

|Angain, Mr. Halliwell, I'm sorry if this post seemed as a personal
|attack on you, this was *NOT* the intention of the post.

S'hokey...
--
______________________________________________________________________________
|u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk | |
|Andrew Halliwell | "ARSE! GERLS!! DRINK! DRINK! DRINK!!!" |
|Principal subjects in:-| "THAT WOULD BE AN ECCLESIASTICAL MATTER!...FECK!!!!|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | - Father Jack in "Father Ted"
|
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ 5++ |
|X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! >*SULK*<|
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 12
From: The Digital Mage <mn3rge@****.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 14:00:01 +0100 (BST)
On Tue, 8 Oct 1996, Pete Sims wrote:

> Thanks for the support Thomas, 've shown this and other posts to my
> player, to prove that she isn't "universaly hated" because of one small
> error, that really is *my* fault in the first place. :*(
Blaze is _not_ universally hated, in fact I liked the question (it gave me
an excuse to talk about my home country :) so please pass that on to
Blaze.

And I'll take the chance to apologise if my replies weren't quite what was
being looked for -I don't play in the England background and can't
remember most of the London Sourcebooks. I hoped that a few of the current
attitudes and opinions which might have carried over into 205X would be
helpful.

Anyway, enough from me on this subject :)

The Digital Mage : mn3rge@****.ac.uk
"Life is a choice, Death....an obligation."-Me
Shadowrun WWW site at http://www.bath.ac.uk/~mn3rge/Shadowrun
Message no. 13
From: dbuehrer@****.org (David Buehrer)
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 08:46:12 -0600 (MDT)
Pete Sims wrote:
|
|><dbuehrer@****.org> writes
|
|What caused the *real* problem was the extremely abusive E-
|Mails recieved. :(

It happens. She can either blow it off or respond. At
this point I would suggest blowing it off (but remember the
names though). If someone persists in being an ass then
continue to blow them off. Trying to deal with them just
wastes time and bandwidth. If, however, someone is an
one-time ass, then chalk it up to a misunderstanding and
try to resolve it :)

|>Tell Blaze(sp?) to come on back and enjoy the ride :)
|
|She's a tad tender at the moment, as I said the e-mails were *very*
|personal, but she is fairly robust, and will probably turn up again. :)

Hey, tell her she's got some battle scars she can brag about :)

|Thanks
|
|Pete, on behalf of Blaze

Your welcome.

-David

/^\/^\/^\/^\/^\/^\/^\ dbuehrer@****.org /^\/^\/^\/^\/^\/^\/^\
"His thoughts tumbled in his head, making and breaking
alliances like underpants in a dryer without Cling Free."
~~~http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1068/homepage.htm~~~~
Message no. 14
From: "Sascha Pabst" <Sascha.Pabst@**********.Uni-Oldenburg.DE>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 18:08:04 +0000
On 8 Oct 96 at 1:00, Pete Sims wrote:
> In article <9610070211.AA28704@******>, David Buehrer
> <dbuehrer@****.org> writes
> >Tell Blaze(sp?) to come on back and enjoy the ride :)
> She's a tad tender at the moment, as I said the e-mails were *very*
> personal, but hse is fairly robust, and will probably turn up again. :)
But I do hope the personal mails didn't come from this list?!?! *glares around
and threatens to throw in yet more page references*
I agree with David. But please ask her to make it _understandable_ for us when
she talks IC ("<foobar> -- Blaze (Whatever Character she is)" like).

(oh, and Pete - no, I will not jump for your comment about Germans or the
Germany Sourcebook - Aetsch :-)
(Another sidenot: Looking for people on Lists is done with the "who
<list>"
command to "listproc@********.itribe.net")
Message no. 15
From: "A Halliwell" <u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 19:01:00 +0100 (BST)
| (oh, and Pete - no, I will not jump for your comment about Germans or the
|Germany Sourcebook - Aetsch :-)
|(Another sidenot: Looking for people on Lists is done with the "who
<list>"
|command to "listproc@********.itribe.net")

I think you mean majordomo@*******.itribe.net

It changed about 8 or so months ago....
--
______________________________________________________________________________
|u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk | |
|Andrew Halliwell | "ARSE! GERLS!! DRINK! DRINK! DRINK!!!" |
|Principal subjects in:-| "THAT WOULD BE AN ECCLESIASTICAL MATTER!...FECK!!!!|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | - Father Jack in "Father Ted"
|
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ 5++ |
|X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! >*SULK*<|
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 16
From: Pete Sims <petesims@********.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 23:54:57 +0100
In article <17997.199610081248@******.cc.keele.ac.uk>, A Halliwell
<u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk> writes

[big snip]
>The list can be used for on-going PBeM games, but if these people think they
>own the list, then they're sadly mistaken....
>
Then I can only assume they are mistaken, there is no response to my, my
players or some others from this list who have posted.
>|I re-read the FAQ, and as you so rightly state it is for
>|
>|Shadowtalk is an interactive fiction mailing list based on Shadowrun.
>|Members of the list post as characters in genre, and by responding to
>|each other's posts "in character", stories are developed. These stories
>|may then be used by players and GMs alike as a basis for contacts, NPCs,
>|and adventure plots in their own campaigns.
>|
>|(unqoute)
>|This apparently (taken from the FAQ) is inaccurate :(. I got confused,
>|as did my player. Well, nobody ever said life was simple. :(
>
>No, it's accurate. Just some people on the list seem to have taken it into
>their heads that they own it....
>I'd set my heals in and start seriously irritating these arseholes....

I'd love to, but I don't want to get involved in a flame war. Yes I
have some interesting softweare for producing mail bombs and flames, but
I *really* don't want to follow this route - you see, contrary to
popular belief, I *am* a nice guy. :)

Maybe an en-masse invasion of Shadowtk, from the Shadowrn mailing list,
"in character" as it where, would create enough of an example, for these
nitwits to realise that it's not their own personal playground. :)

My player has no intention of joining any PBEM stuff, she want's to talk
to other people-as characters, not succumb to the "game". She says she
has quite enough "game time" with her own GM. :) (I think that was a
thinly veiled insult - looks like she's getting back on form) :)

About the en-masse "in character" invasion of Shadowtk - any ideas,
comments, volunteers??? Tactics?? :)

TTFN
Pete (and from the shadows - Blaze)
--
Pete Sims
Heroes or Fools? That's a determination others will make in hindsight. But by
being here now, we make that determination for ourselves, and it's neither.
Lt.Col.T.C.McQueen
Message no. 17
From: Pete Sims <petesims@********.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 23:47:35 +0100
In article <Pine.SOL.3.91.961008181723.22535D-100000@*****.student.gu.ed
u.au>, The Jestyr <s421539@*******.gu.edu.au> writes
>
>> It was a general moan at the nasty buggers who hang in the shadows here
>> and Shadowtk, and object to women posting,
>
>Yeah? Just TRY and shut *me* up... *grin*

I don't think too many people would even dream of trying. They all know
you too well :) - not that I do of course. :(

>
>Seriously, though, I think your player should know that this is most
>definitely a minority view. The response to my computer fixation, my RPG
>fixation, and the combination of the two culminating with my presence
>here on this list has resulted in only positive feedback about female
>gamers, and a general bemoaning the lack of more of them.

It struck my players as strange that there was only one other female
poster on this list, (you), and thought she'd join in, but if her
treatment is an example of some of things newcomers can expect, I'm not
surprised that there aren't. Bigots will be bigots wherever they are
met, and unfortunately this world is still full of them.

Hopefully Blaze will return soon, after she's finished healing, and wil
be better prepared to deal with the nitwits. It's kinda difficult to
stuff a Beretta up someones nose and say "Pardon - you said - What???"
over E-Mail. :)

>
>And I only have one problem with the list myself - it's too busy! I'm so
>busy trolling through SR posts that I never get to answer personal email!

I actually prefer it busy - there, tha'll make me unpopular with some.
:) It means there's lots of threads I can blow off in. :)

>(Sorry Gurth... it IS on the way...)

He's a good guy :), I'm sure he's waiting (im)patiently. :)

Pete (Blaze will be back!)

--
Pete Sims
Heroes or Fools? That's a determination others will make in hindsight. But by
being here now, we make that determination for ourselves, and it's neither.
Lt.Col.T.C.McQueen
Message no. 18
From: Pete Sims <petesims@********.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 00:00:52 +0100
In article <3DA0D50299D@******.eee.rgu.ac.uk>, Mark Steedman
<M.J.Steedman@***.rgu.ac.uk> writes

[snip]
>I think the primary problem was that you jumped to in character
>without warning, folks assume its players or GM's on here and a
>second person wws writing from the account without warning and your
>.sig, i think that threw a few more :(
>
Actually, there was a warning and apology, in the first post, and a
refresher reminder later on, but that seems to have slipped the net.

>> A) They get no answers.
>you have a point the topic drifted fast.

Very fast, in the time I've been with the Shadowrn list I don't think
I've seen something metamorphose so fast before :)

[snip]
>The in character posts could have done with some warning, i recon you
>managed to confuse people, considering >100 mails a day consider the
>speed folks have to process mail at!
>
There was warning, the rael confusion was that the headers hadn't
changed, I am in the process of kicking my mailer to fix that problem
now. :)

>> There is *NO* actual Shadowrun area for asking this type of question,
>> which is why this group was chosen, *THAT* is *my* choice and *my*
>> responsibility. If I was wrong, then have a go at me, directly, by
>> Email.
>I think you were right to use shadowrn, its a general forum, go
>ahead, just you needed to let folks know somehow so when a mail comes
>up that seems very uninformed folks realise why. I suspect some folks
>should have checked your email address and wondered but not everyones
>mail programme makes that easy.

That's what I thought, as I said earlier, a warning was in the original
post, and again later on, but by then the therad had grown so much that
the reminders got lost in the mound.

Oh, well. Better luck next time. :)

Pete (with a shadowy Blaze lurking behind him) :)

--
Pete Sims
Heroes or Fools? That's a determination others will make in hindsight. But by
being here now, we make that determination for ourselves, and it's neither.
Lt.Col.T.C.McQueen
Message no. 19
From: Pete Sims <petesims@********.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 00:09:04 +0100
In article <m0vAeh5-0004wbC@*******.Informatik.Uni-Oldenburg.DE>, Sascha
Pabst <Sascha.Pabst@**********.Uni-Oldenburg.DE> writes
>On 8 Oct 96 at 1:00, Pete Sims wrote:
>> In article <9610070211.AA28704@******>, David Buehrer
>> <dbuehrer@****.org> writes
>> >Tell Blaze(sp?) to come on back and enjoy the ride :)
>> She's a tad tender at the moment, as I said the e-mails were *very*
>> personal, but hse is fairly robust, and will probably turn up again. :)
>But I do hope the personal mails didn't come from this list?!?! *glares around
>and threatens to throw in yet more page references*

At this point in time I would rather not say *where* the posts came
from, suffice it to say that actions I considered necessary have been
taken, and these people will be contacted shortly, either by their ISP,
or several men in leather jackets carrying baseball bats. Whichever
gets there first. :)

>I agree with David. But please ask her to make it _understandable_ for us when
>she talks IC ("<foobar> -- Blaze (Whatever Character she is)" like).
>
> (oh, and Pete - no, I will not jump for your comment about Germans or the
>Germany Sourcebook - Aetsch :-)

I had a feeling you'd notice that comment, I was in two minds about
writing what I did, but decided to go with my heritage and admit it. :)

No good getting funny, *we* Germans are like that. :) :) :)

>(Another sidenot: Looking for people on Lists is done with the "who
<list>"
>command to "listproc@********.itribe.net")
Forgot that trick, I went a slightly longer route. :(

Pete
--
Pete Sims
Heroes or Fools? That's a determination others will make in hindsight. But by
being here now, we make that determination for ourselves, and it's neither.
Lt.Col.T.C.McQueen
Message no. 20
From: "Gurth" <gurth@******.nl>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 13:09:28 +0100
Pete Sims said on 23:47/ 8 Oct 96...

> It struck my players as strange that there was only one other female
> poster on this list, (you),

I count at least three, excluding Blaze, plus one or two I'm not certain
of... perhaps there are more, but they don't post?

> Hopefully Blaze will return soon, after she's finished healing, and wil
> be better prepared to deal with the nitwits. It's kinda difficult to
> stuff a Beretta up someones nose and say "Pardon - you said - What???"
> over E-Mail. :)

You could always give it a try with ASCII art -- we've had flamethrowers,
carps, and flame shotgun rounds lately, so maybe a Beretta can be done
too? :)

> >(Sorry Gurth... it IS on the way...)
>
> He's a good guy :), I'm sure he's waiting (im)patiently. :)

How can you know if I'm a good guy? :)

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Learn their rules, play their game, deceive yourself in haste.
-> NERPS Project Leader & Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version 3.1:
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE
Y PGP- t(+) 5+ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
Message no. 21
From: "A Halliwell" <u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 12:18:47 +0100 (BST)
|>No, it's accurate. Just some people on the list seem to have taken it into
|>their heads that they own it....
|>I'd set my heals in and start seriously irritating these arseholes....
|
|I'd love to, but I don't want to get involved in a flame war. Yes I
|have some interesting softweare for producing mail bombs and flames, but
|I *really* don't want to follow this route - you see, contrary to
|popular belief, I *am* a nice guy. :)

I'd never condone the use of flame-bombs.... =(;-})

|Maybe an en-masse invasion of Shadowtk, from the Shadowrn mailing list,
|"in character" as it where, would create enough of an example, for these
|nitwits to realise that it's not their own personal playground. :)

That was more of what I had in mind.....

|My player has no intention of joining any PBEM stuff, she want's to talk
|to other people-as characters, not succumb to the "game". She says she
|has quite enough "game time" with her own GM. :) (I think that was a
|thinly veiled insult - looks like she's getting back on form) :)
|
|About the en-masse "in character" invasion of Shadowtk - any ideas,
|comments, volunteers??? Tactics?? :)

Something to discuss perhaps???
--
______________________________________________________________________________
|u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk | |
|Andrew Halliwell | "ARSE! GERLS!! DRINK! DRINK! DRINK!!!" |
|Principal subjects in:-| "THAT WOULD BE AN ECCLESIASTICAL MATTER!...FECK!!!!|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | - Father Jack in "Father Ted"
|
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ 5++ |
|X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! >*SULK*<|
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 22
From: "Sascha Pabst" <Sascha.Pabst@**********.Uni-Oldenburg.DE>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 14:17:36 +0000
On 8 Oct 96 at 19:01, A Halliwell wrote:
> |command to "listproc@********.itribe.net")
>
> I think you mean majordomo@*******.itribe.net
>
> It changed about 8 or so months ago....
*slap forehead* Sure, you're right.

Sascha
--
+---___---------+------------------------------------+------------------------+
| / / _______ | Jhary-a-Conel aka Sascha Pabst |Things that try to look |
| / /_/ ____/ |Sascha.Pabst@ | like things often do |
| \___ __/ | Informatik.Uni-Oldenburg.de | look more like things |
|==== \_/ ======|*Wearing hats is just a way of life*| than things. Well known|
|LOGOUT FASCISM!| - Me | fact. - E.Weatherwax |
+------------- http://www.informatik.uni-oldenburg.de/~jhary -----------------+
Message no. 23
From: "Sascha Pabst" <Sascha.Pabst@**********.Uni-Oldenburg.DE>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 16:57:37 +0000
On 8 Oct 96 at 23:54, Pete Sims wrote:
[snip]
> About the en-masse "in character" invasion of Shadowtk - any ideas,
> comments, volunteers??? Tactics?? :)
When?
*putting on sunglasses, straightening coat, holster pistol and lights a
cigarette*
I'm ready.
Message no. 24
From: "A Halliwell" <u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 16:08:23 +0100 (BST)
|
|On 8 Oct 96 at 23:54, Pete Sims wrote:
|[snip]
|> About the en-masse "in character" invasion of Shadowtk - any ideas,
|> comments, volunteers??? Tactics?? :)
|When?
|*putting on sunglasses, straightening coat, holster pistol and lights a
|cigarette*
|I'm ready.
|

Well, I bags the name "Inferno". It's the name of one of my mages....
As for when.... There's no time like the present....
--
______________________________________________________________________________
|u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk | |
|Andrew Halliwell | "ARSE! GERLS!! DRINK! DRINK! DRINK!!!" |
|Principal subjects in:-| "THAT WOULD BE AN ECCLESIASTICAL MATTER!...FECK!!!!|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | - Father Jack in "Father Ted"
|
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ 5++ |
|X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! >*SULK*<|
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 25
From: chaos@*****.com (Steven Ratkovich)
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 14:26:52 -0500 (EST)
>|About the en-masse "in character" invasion of Shadowtk - any ideas,
>|comments, volunteers??? Tactics?? :)
>
>Something to discuss perhaps???
>
England! And maybe tea... <big evil grin>

-Bull-the-just-asking-for-it-decker-turned-GM



****************************************************************************
*******
-Bull, aka Chaos, aka Rak, aka Steven Ratkovich
chaos@*****.com
Order is Illusion! Chaos is Bliss! Got any fours?
****************************************************************************
*******
"I've got a bad feeling about this..."
-Just about everyone, in "Star Wars"
Message no. 26
From: chaos@*****.com (Steven Ratkovich)
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 15:00:48 -0500 (EST)
>On 8 Oct 96 at 23:54, Pete Sims wrote:
>[snip]
>> About the en-masse "in character" invasion of Shadowtk - any ideas,
>> comments, volunteers??? Tactics?? :)
>When?
>*putting on sunglasses, straightening coat, holster pistol and lights a
>cigarette*
>I'm ready.
>
Well, Bull's now resubscribed and ready to help us take over, so just give
the word Pete... I think you're the unofficial team leader in this op...

BTW, will this be a standup fight or a bughunt?

-Bull-the-bughunting-equipped-decker-turned-GM



****************************************************************************
*******
-Bull, aka Chaos, aka Rak, aka Steven Ratkovich
chaos@*****.com
Order is Illusion! Chaos is Bliss! Got any fours?
****************************************************************************
*******
"I've got a bad feeling about this..."
-Just about everyone, in "Star Wars"
Message no. 27
From: olafurg@******.is (olafur gunnarsson)
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 18:51:35 GMT
>>|About the en-masse "in character" invasion of Shadowtk - any ideas,
>>|comments, volunteers??? Tactics?? :)

Why not just go in there and start up our own little ic game we could eac=
h
"donate" one pc and a few contacts to this little project then sort of wr=
ite
the story as we go.
Eweryone acting as GM for the others pcs and use the contacts to gather i=
nfo
as well as the pcs. am i making any sense or should i start taking my dri=
ed
frog pills again ????????

Im willing to donate the following
Smudge Failed shaman who can still do magic but suffers if he tries to
summon anything
Corvette A Job fixer in seattle who charges an arm and a leg but you can =
be
sure that
if the johnson tries to scam you he´l come in on your side.And if you m=
uck
up a run
he will come down on you with all the weight of injustice.
Sneaky Sam a snitch in Renton who has an in with a cuple of the megas and
the criminal syndicates.
Roadkill Rigger for hire drives a modified English Taxi

Watcha say?
-Olafur Gunnarsson/Smudge/Madbyron-
Message no. 28
From: Marty <s457033@*******.gu.edu.au>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 07:47:16 +1000 (EST)
> > About the en-masse "in character" invasion of Shadowtk - any ideas,
> > comments, volunteers??? Tactics?? :)
> When?
> *putting on sunglasses, straightening coat, holster pistol and lights a
> cigarette*
> I'm ready.
>
Ooook. (In character ork-speak)
.....Putting together his trusty WA2100.

"Paleface speak with forked toungue, so I pull toungue out."

Tactics? What do you mean tactics? These drekheads are merely
shadow-wannabees. The equivalent of a generic security guard, if you
will; Meat for the machine.
Message no. 29
From: "Caric" <caric@*******.com>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 17:21:27 -0700
> >> About the en-masse "in character" invasion of Shadowtk - any
ideas,
> >> comments, volunteers??? Tactics?? :)
> >When?
> >*putting on sunglasses, straightening coat, holster pistol and lights a
> >cigarette*
> >I'm ready.

Caric is willing to go in on the invasion just lemme know when to send him
in and how to go about it :)

> -Bull-the-bughunting-equipped-decker-turned-GM
>
Caric-the-Ruger-totin'-fetish-wearin'-shaman
Message no. 30
From: Pete Sims <petesims@********.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 01:15:03 +0100
In article <199610091111.NAA20449@**********.xs4all.nl>, Gurth
<gurth@******.nl> writes
>Pete Sims said on 23:47/ 8 Oct 96...
>
>> It struck my players as strange that there was only one other female
>> poster on this list, (you),
>
>I count at least three, excluding Blaze, plus one or two I'm not certain
>of... perhaps there are more, but they don't post?

I've noticed Lady Jestyr, and I think, recently DVixen, but they are
very much in the minority, it was as a result of me saying there *were*
other female players here that prompted my player to pop in, for a short
visit, never mind, the new cyberware is working fine, and the burns have
almost healed. :)

>
>> Hopefully Blaze will return soon, after she's finished healing, and wil
>> be better prepared to deal with the nitwits. It's kinda difficult to
>> stuff a Beretta up someones nose and say "Pardon - you said - What???"
>> over E-Mail. :)
>
>You could always give it a try with ASCII art -- we've had flamethrowers,
>carps, and flame shotgun rounds lately, so maybe a Beretta can be done
>too? :)

No good at ASCII art, give me a pencil and a paint brush, and I'm fine,
but keyboard drawing - too dyslexic. :(

[snip]
>How can you know if I'm a good guy? :)

Well, allowing for the possibility that it could be a charade, I have
used my highly developed psychic powers, several watchers, and a small
team of *employees* watching you for the past six months. I'm sorry
Gurth, but you *are* a nice guy. I have it here, on film/tape and paper.
:)

Sorry chummers, there's no dirt on Gurth, if he was any cleaner, he'd
squeek when he walked. :)

Pete
--
Pete Sims
Heroes or Fools? That's a determination others will make in hindsight. But by
being here now, we make that determination for ourselves, and it's neither.
Lt.Col.T.C.McQueen
Message no. 31
From: Shad Owens <shadow@******.linfield.edu>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 20:49:37 -0700 (PDT)
On Thu, 10 Oct 1996, Pete Sims wrote:

> >I count at least three, excluding Blaze, plus one or two I'm not certain
> >of... perhaps there are more, but they don't post?
>
> I've noticed Lady Jestyr, and I think, recently DVixen, but they are
> very much in the minority,

There must be more than three -- I'm here, too -- I know Shad
isn't normally how one spells Jennie, but I've always been horrible at
spelling...

Jennie *trying to find the dictionary right now...*
Message no. 32
From: Pete Sims <petesims@********.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 01:19:06 +0100
In article <199610091926.OAA09328@***.ncweb.com>, Steven Ratkovich
<chaos@*****.com> writes
>>|About the en-masse "in character" invasion of Shadowtk - any ideas,
>>|comments, volunteers??? Tactics?? :)
>>
>>Something to discuss perhaps???
>>
>England! And maybe tea... <big evil grin>
You *know* better. :) :)
Can you *really* imagine it, 2 dozen shadowrn specialists turn up in
Shadowtk, and start talking about TEA!, Oh dear, it's amost bad enough
for me to *want* to do it. :)

>
>-Bull-the-just-asking-for-it-decker-turned-GM

OKAY YOU ASKED FOR IT!!!!


>
>
> th
> thwa
> thwapth
> thwapthwa
> thwapthwapth
> thwapthwapthwa
> thwapthwapthwapt
> thwapthwapthwapthw
> thwapthwapthwapthwapt
> thwapthwapth thwapthw
> thwapthwpath wapthwap
> thwapthwapthwa wapthwapth
> thwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthwa
> (thwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthwap)
> thwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthwapth
> thwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthw
> thwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthw
> apthwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthwapt
> ththwpthwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthwthwap
> apthwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthwap
> thwapthwapth thwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthwa hwapthwapth
> thwapthw thwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthw thwapthwap
> thwap thwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthw thwap
> thwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthwapt
> thwapthwapthwapthwapthwapthwa
> thwapthwapthwapthwapthwapth
> thwapthwapthwapthwapthwa
> thwapthwapthwapthwapth
> thwapthwapthwapthwap
> thwapthwapthwapth
> thwapthwapthwpt
> thwapthwapthw
> thwapthwapt
> thwapthwa
> thwapth
> thwap
> thw
> thwap
> thwapth
> thwapthwap
> thwapthwapth
> thwapthwapthwap
> thwapthwapthwapth
> thwapthwapthwapthwa
> thwapthwapthwapthwapt
> thwapth thwapthw
> thwapt thwapth
> thwa thwa
> thw thw
> th th
>
>

hehehehehe :)

Pete

--
Pete Sims
Heroes or Fools? That's a determination others will make in hindsight. But by
being here now, we make that determination for ourselves, and it's neither.
Lt.Col.T.C.McQueen
Message no. 33
From: Paolo Marcucci <paolo@*********.it>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 08:42:59 +0200
Steven Ratkovich wrote:

> Well, Bull's now resubscribed and ready to help us take over, so just give
> the word Pete... I think you're the unofficial team leader in this op...
>
> BTW, will this be a standup fight or a bughunt?

I just want to know one thing: where they are...

P :)
Message no. 34
From: The Jestyr <s421539@*******.gu.edu.au>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 17:19:41 +1000 (EST)
> > >I count at least three, excluding Blaze, plus one or two I'm not certain
> > >of... perhaps there are more, but they don't post?
> >
> > I've noticed Lady Jestyr, and I think, recently DVixen, but they are
> > very much in the minority,
>
> There must be more than three -- I'm here, too -- I know Shad
> isn't normally how one spells Jennie, but I've always been horrible at
> spelling...

And Angela J Schaafsma (sp?) who normally only posts as A.J. so noone
notices she's female :)


Lady Jestyr

------------------------------------------------------
A titanic intellect... in a world full of icebergs
------------------------------------------------------
Elle Holmes s421539@*****.student.gu.edu.au
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1503
------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 35
From: Paolo Marcucci <paolo@*********.it>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 09:24:37 +0200
Pete Sims wrote:

> [snip]
> >How can you know if I'm a good guy? :)
>
> Well, allowing for the possibility that it could be a charade, I have
> used my highly developed psychic powers, several watchers, and a small
> team of *employees* watching you for the past six months. I'm sorry
> Gurth, but you *are* a nice guy. I have it here, on film/tape and paper.
> :)
>
> Sorry chummers, there's no dirt on Gurth, if he was any cleaner, he'd
> squeek when he walked. :)

Heh, Pete... you obviously don't have access to the secret info I have.
Gurth is involved in a wide conspiracy that involves &&^%.___ and
*(&^*$^ secre$#@$&^$vices.
(Gosh, he also have a dataline scrambler)

:)

Bye, Paolo
Message no. 36
From: Guardian <s777317@*******.gu.edu.au>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 17:30:16 +1000 (EST)
> Heh, Pete... you obviously don't have access to the secret info I have.
> Gurth is involved in a wide conspiracy that involves &&^%.___ and
> *(&^*$^ secre$#@$&^$vices.
> (Gosh, he also have a dataline scrambler)

*ROTFL* This sounds familiar. A certain mailing-members-brother used a
similar thing on us... *grin*

Guardian

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It's called tourist season, so why can't we shoot them?"
Adam Treloar aka Guardian
s777317@*****.student.gu.edu.au http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1900/
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 37
From: "A Halliwell" <u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 10:50:04 +0100 (BST)
|
|>|About the en-masse "in character" invasion of Shadowtk - any ideas,
|>|comments, volunteers??? Tactics?? :)
|>
|>Something to discuss perhaps???
|>
|England! And maybe tea... <big evil grin>

* SIGH *

###### ###
# # # # # ## ##### ###
# # # # # # # # # ###
# ###### # # # # # # #
# # # # ## # ###### #####
# # # ## ## # # # ###
# # # # # # # # ###

NOT! tea again..... PLEASE....
--
______________________________________________________________________________
|u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk | |
|Andrew Halliwell | "ARSE! GERLS!! DRINK! DRINK! DRINK!!!" |
|Principal subjects in:-| "THAT WOULD BE AN ECCLESIASTICAL MATTER!...FECK!!!!|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | - Father Jack in "Father Ted"
|
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ 5++ |
|X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! >*SULK*<|
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 38
From: "A Halliwell" <u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 10:54:28 +0100 (BST)
|
|>On 8 Oct 96 at 23:54, Pete Sims wrote:
|>[snip]
|>> About the en-masse "in character" invasion of Shadowtk - any ideas,
|>> comments, volunteers??? Tactics?? :)
|>When?
|>*putting on sunglasses, straightening coat, holster pistol and lights a
|>cigarette*
|>I'm ready.
|>
|Well, Bull's now resubscribed and ready to help us take over, so just give
|the word Pete... I think you're the unofficial team leader in this op...
|
|BTW, will this be a standup fight or a bughunt?

Start it as the general lead up to a run... And don't forget to ask everyone
on shadowland for info on various things.... (Anyone know what aussie
land's like????)... Hehehehe. (What's a "Roo"?)....
--
______________________________________________________________________________
|u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk | |
|Andrew Halliwell | "ARSE! GERLS!! DRINK! DRINK! DRINK!!!" |
|Principal subjects in:-| "THAT WOULD BE AN ECCLESIASTICAL MATTER!...FECK!!!!|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | - Father Jack in "Father Ted"
|
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ 5++ |
|X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! >*SULK*<|
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 39
From: "Gurth" <gurth@******.nl>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 13:58:17 +0100
Paolo Marcucci said on 9:24/10 Oct 96...

> Heh, Pete... you obviously don't have access to the secret info I have.
> Gurth is involved in a wide conspiracy that involves &&^%.___ and
> *(&^*$^ secre$#@$&^$vices.
> (Gosh, he also have a dataline scrambler)

That's all just the tip of the iceberg. You understand I can't say more
than that, except that if you think the X-Files is full of conspiracies, you
should get out more often :)

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Anyone home?
-> NERPS Project Leader & Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version 3.1:
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE
Y PGP- t(+) 5+ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
Message no. 40
From: Pete Sims <petesims@********.DEMON.CO.UK>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 01:14:45 +0100
In article <640.199610100954@******.cc.keele.ac.uk>, A Halliwell
<u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk> writes
>|>I'm ready.
>|>
>|Well, Bull's now resubscribed and ready to help us take over, so just give
>|the word Pete... I think you're the unofficial team leader in this op...

WORD!!!!

>|
>|BTW, will this be a standup fight or a bughunt?
>
>Start it as the general lead up to a run... And don't forget to ask everyone
>on shadowland for info on various things.... (Anyone know what aussie
>land's like????)... Hehehehe. (What's a "Roo"?)....
Now, Mr. Halliwell, you were the one that got so confused and upset
about TEA!! Now you want to talk about Roo's. C'mon, please, you were
our last mentally stable hope, don't tell me we've destroyed your sanity
as well. ???

:)

Pete
--
Pete Sims
Heroes or Fools? That's a determination others will make in hindsight. But by
being here now, we make that determination for ourselves, and it's neither.
Lt.Col.T.C.McQueen
Message no. 41
From: Dvixen Vidi Vici <dvixen@****.SPYDERNET.COM>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 21:18:32 -0700
On Thu, 10 Oct 1996, The Jestyr wrote:

> > > I've noticed Lady Jestyr, and I think, recently DVixen, but they are
> > > very much in the minority,
>
> And Angela J Schaafsma (sp?) who normally only posts as A.J. so noone
> notices she's female :)

That's me! (Dvixen) With a nick like mine, I tend to get strange emails,
so I don't normally go around using my full name. (You got the spelling
right, congrats!) I've been around Shadowrn in one form or another for
nearly two years, lurking mostly. Never saw much to post about, and I
tend not to do a lot of talking. (And sometimes, when I do talk, I wish
later that I had kept my mouth shut, 'cause I make my self look like an
idiot with an IQ lower than my... *shoe* size.)

Remind me one day to tell you about getting assigned to the male dorm
when I was 14. At least now, people notice I am female when they meet me.
<G>

--
AJ Schaafsma Dvixen@****.spydernet.com
This post in no way reflect the opinions of the myriad voices in my head.
Message no. 42
From: kumquat@*****.COM
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 17:46:24 -0500
SH>On 8 Oct 96 at 23:54, Pete Sims wrote:
SH>[snip]
SH>> About the en-masse "in character" invasion of Shadowtk - any ideas,
SH>> comments, volunteers??? Tactics?? :)
SH>When?
SH>*putting on sunglasses, straightening coat, holster pistol and lights a
SH>cigarette*
SH>I'm ready.
Hmmm... I'm in, provided I can hire a small team of others without lives
to help me sort through the 300+ mails per day...<smirk>
I like this Idea... this way, if none of the "established" cast members
responds to any of our character posts, then we'll respond to each
other's.... soundz great... when is it happening?

Just My Two Pence.
The Kumquat.

Support Whirled Peas.
Message no. 43
From: Pete Sims <petesims@********.DEMON.CO.UK>
Subject: Re: Misery
Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 00:35:31 +0100
In article <Pine.LNX.3.91.961010211218.2862D-100000@****.spydernet.com>,
Dvixen Vidi Vici <dvixen@****.SPYDERNET.COM> writes
>On Thu, 10 Oct 1996, The Jestyr wrote:
>
>> > > I've noticed Lady Jestyr, and I think, recently DVixen, but they are
>> > > very much in the minority,
>>
>> And Angela J Schaafsma (sp?) who normally only posts as A.J. so noone
>> notices she's female :)
>
>That's me! (Dvixen) With a nick like mine, I tend to get strange emails,
>so I don't normally go around using my full name. (You got the spelling
>right, congrats!) I've been around Shadowrn in one form or another for
>nearly two years, lurking mostly. Never saw much to post about, and I
>tend not to do a lot of talking. (And sometimes, when I do talk, I wish
>later that I had kept my mouth shut, 'cause I make my self look like an
>idiot with an IQ lower than my... *shoe* size.)

Interesting, I never worry about my shoe size, I *know* it's larger than
my IQ, I once took a mensa test, and they sent me a rock and a piece of
string - never did figure that one out ??? :)

>
>Remind me one day to tell you about getting assigned to the male dorm
>when I was 14. At least now, people notice I am female when they meet me.
><G>

OK, you're reminded. :) :)

Pete
--
Pete Sims
Heroes or Fools? That's a determination others will make in hindsight. But by
being here now, we make that determination for ourselves, and it's neither.
Lt.Col.T.C.McQueen

Further Reading

If you enjoyed reading about Misery, you may also be interested in:

Disclaimer

These messages were posted a long time ago on a mailing list far, far away. The copyright to their contents probably lies with the original authors of the individual messages, but since they were published in an electronic forum that anyone could subscribe to, and the logs were available to subscribers and most likely non-subscribers as well, it's felt that re-publishing them here is a kind of public service.

Thwap!