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Message no. 1
From: Jamz Jamz@*********.Net
Subject: MITS for Lunch
Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 00:37:54 -0500
Wow, I finally got my copy of MITS so I now join in the MITS threads!
As I was flipping through it today, I saw some good and some bad but
more good than bad changes. Centering seems to suck even more now not that I
liked it much before. Gee, now I can have two skills to suck up more Karma
to be able to possibly get 1 or maybe even 2 more successes on my
spellcasting/drain. Is it just me or does anyone else think that all of that
wasted karma would be better spent on Foci or increasing your magic pool for
more dice like Initiation??? Although it looks like Centering is pretty
decent for Adepts now.
I liked how they explain and modified Geasa though I am confused a bit
about it. They go back and forth about the Magic point that you lost isn't
lost but really is lost but you act like it's not lost......Another words,
is it lost for all aspects except when determining whether the spell drain
is physical or stun? Or if you use your geasa, do you halve your full magic
rating then for determining spell pool, spell defense, banishing, astral
combat, etc? It seems that if you're going to Initiate, and ever plan to
erase your geas via initiation, you're better off just not taking the geas
in the first place and instead take the magic point and metamagic ability. I
do like the fact that Adepts can accept geas now for there powers. I can't
quite remember but in SR2, didn't you have to take a geas for every 2 points
of magic loss and then that only let you cast magic normally with your lower
magic rating? So, the big difference now is a mage with magic 6 losses 4
points due to cyberware use to have a Magic 2 and 2 geasa but now you have a
Magic 6 and 4 geasa (if you want the geasa)?
Otherwise, I would say, MITS is great! It has all the great and improved
material of the Grimoire and Awakenings but cut out all of the "junk &
fluff" of Awakenings. I'd say it's packed full of information and unlike the
Companion, is well worth the nuyen!

BTW, anyone else disappointed in the cover art they've been using? The
New Seattle sourcebook and MITS both seem a little to cartoonish and not as
detailed as some other artwork...

Peace,
Jamz@*********.net
http://ww2.netnitco.net/users/keldon
Message no. 2
From: Mongoose m0ng005e@*********.com
Subject: MITS for Lunch
Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 01:45:58 -0500
: Wow, I finally got my copy of MITS so I now join in the MITS threads!

Yeah, I'm no longer a one man thread.

: As I was flipping through it today, I saw some good and some bad but
:more good than bad changes. Centering seems to suck even more now not that
I
:liked it much before. Gee, now I can have two skills to suck up more Karma
:to be able to possibly get 1 or maybe even 2 more successes on my
:spellcasting/drain. Is it just me or does anyone else think that all of
that
:wasted karma would be better spent on Foci or increasing your magic pool
for
:more dice like Initiation??? Although it looks like Centering is pretty
:decent for Adepts now.

How is it good for adepts, but lame for others? For spellcasters etc,
it applies to all magic skills- that's pretty handy! And the skills are not
all that costly at low levels, due to SR3's skill cost adjustments.
Rmeber, SR3 has smaller / less freqently refreshed pools, so "a single extra
succes" is actually rather a signifigant bonus.

: I liked how they explain and modified Geasa though I am confused a bit
:about it. They go back and forth about the Magic point that you lost isn't
:lost but really is lost but you act like it's not lost......Another words,
:is it lost for all aspects except when determining whether the spell drain
:is physical or stun? Or if you use your geasa, do you halve your full magic
:rating then for determining spell pool, spell defense, banishing, astral
:combat, etc?

The latter. If you obey all your geassa, its as if the "geased" points
were never lost.

It seems that if you're going to Initiate, and ever plan to
:erase your geas via initiation, you're better off just not taking the geas
:in the first place and instead take the magic point and metamagic ability.

Thats one way to look at it, though if you take the geas, you get to use
the point most of the time, even BEFORE intiation. Note that NOT taking a
geas may make it hard (or impossible) to intiate, also.

: I
:do like the fact that Adepts can accept geas now for there powers. I can't
:quite remember but in SR2, didn't you have to take a geas for every 2
points
:of magic loss and then that only let you cast magic normally with your
lower
:magic rating? So, the big difference now is a mage with magic 6 losses 4
:points due to cyberware use to have a Magic 2 and 2 geasa but now you have
a
:Magic 6 and 4 geasa (if you want the geasa)?

Correct. Geas didn't used do do anything but PENALIZE the mage. Its
like "oh, I just bough the grimoire, and now my cybered mage really sucks
rocks". MiTS makes them an option that can both help and hurt you.

Also interesting is how "physical mages" (now called adpets who practice
"The magians way") do not automatically start out with geas, as they buy
thier "active" magic like an adept power, instead of sacrificing active
magic to buy adept powers.

: BTW, anyone else disappointed in the cover art they've been using? The
:New Seattle sourcebook and MITS both seem a little to cartoonish and not as
:detailed as some other artwork...

I'd like it if the MITS cover were more "finished", though the concept
is good (and rather uniquely to SR). I think the MiTS interior artwork is
pretty good- the Grimoire had some bad interior art, MiTS's is almost all at
least decent.

Mongoose
Message no. 3
From: dghost@****.com dghost@****.com
Subject: MITS for Lunch
Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 01:12:04 -0500
On Sat, 8 May 1999 00:37:54 -0500 "Jamz" <Jamz@*********.Net> writes:
<SNIP>
>I
>do like the fact that Adepts can accept geas now for there powers.
<SNIP>

I don't know why this is a big deal... In SR (pg 112, Awakenings) Adepts
could reduce their power costs by taking a geasa or is this different in
MitS?

--
D. Ghost
(aka Pixel)
"Hello, my name is Stephen. This is Dick. He'll see if he has something
your size." -- Jug Ears

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Message no. 4
From: dghost@****.com dghost@****.com
Subject: MITS for Lunch
Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 01:20:10 -0500
On Sat, 8 May 1999 01:45:58 -0500 "Mongoose" <m0ng005e@*********.com>
writes:
<SNIP>
> Also interesting is how "physical mages" (now called adpets who
practice
>"The magians way") do not automatically start out with geas, as they buy
>thier "active" magic like an adept power, instead of sacrificing active
>magic to buy adept powers.

Woa! Does this mean that you can now have a physad that becomes a
physmage or do physmages still turn into overpriced adepts when their
"active" magic points drop to zero?

>: BTW, anyone else disappointed in the cover art they've been using?
The
>:New Seattle sourcebook and MITS both seem a little to cartoonish and
not as
>:detailed as some other artwork...
<SNIP>

I haven't seen MitS but I like New Seatle's cover ... However it isn't
quite SR (It looks more Sci-Fi-ish than shadowrun-ish :)

--
D. Ghost
(aka Pixel)
"Hello, my name is Stephen. This is Dick. He'll see if he has something
your size." -- Jug Ears

___________________________________________________________________
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Message no. 5
From: Razors Edge. razrzedge@*****.com
Subject: MITS for Lunch
Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 11:04:33 -0700 (PDT)
--- dghost@****.com wrote:
> On Sat, 8 May 1999 01:45:58 -0500 "Mongoose"
> <m0ng005e@*********.com>
> writes:
> <SNIP>
> > Also interesting is how "physical mages" (now
> called adpets who
> practice
> >"The magians way") do not automatically start out
> with geas, as they buy
> >thier "active" magic like an adept power, instead
> of sacrificing active
> >magic to buy adept powers.
>
> Woa! Does this mean that you can now have a physad
> that becomes a
> physmage or do physmages still turn into overpriced
> adepts when their
> "active" magic points drop to zero?
>
Yes, it does. The other thing about Magicians is that
not just any adept can become one. The only time you
can take Magical Abilitiy is at character creation.
And never at any point after. They can increase their
magic stat through initiation. When they increase
their grade they can either spend the point on Adept
powers or use it to increase their Magic attribute.

IMPORTANT NOTE: Magicians cannot buy power points like
adepts. Initiation is the only way to increase their
powers. This is an excellent limit to an
UBER-archtype. When I first read BABY and saw the
Power Point concept for adepts, I fear Physical
Magicans becoming munchkins. This makes them a bit
more practical and ballanced.
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Message no. 6
From: Mongoose m0ng005e@*********.com
Subject: MITS for Lunch
Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 14:29:16 -0500
:> Also interesting is how "physical mages" (now called adpets who
:practice
:>"The magians way") do not automatically start out with geas, as they buy
:>thier "active" magic like an adept power, instead of sacrificing active
:>magic to buy adept powers.
:
:Woa! Does this mean that you can now have a physad that becomes a
:physmage or do physmages still turn into overpriced adepts when their
:"active" magic points drop to zero?

You have to spend priority A to be a "physmage", and buy at least one
point worth of the "Magical Power" abilty. If you loose magic points, that
power is always the first reduced; If you loose that abilty, you become a
normal adept forever. Oh, and they can't purchase power points for 20 karma
like normal adpets; when the intiate, they can choose to gain a power point
instead of learning a metamagic technique. That seems odd, since normal
adepts gain a power point just for increasing thier magic rating, so perhaps
intiation also increases thier "active" magic rating.


Mongoose
Message no. 7
From: Aerio Chrome aeriochrome@****.com
Subject: MITS for Lunch
Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 02:56:25 -0500
On Sat, 8 May 1999 01:45:58 -0500 "Mongoose" <m0ng005e@*********.com>
writes:
<snip centering talk>
<here's JamZ's post that Mongoose is replying to>
>: I liked how they explain and modified Geasa though I am confused
>a bit about it. They go back and forth about the Magic point that you
lost
>isn't lost but really is lost but you act like it's not
lost......Another
>words, is it lost for all aspects except when determining whether the
spell
>drain is physical or stun? Or if you use your geasa, do you halve your
full
>magic rating then for determining spell pool, spell defense, banishing,
>astral combat, etc? It seems that if you're going to Initiate, and ever
plan to
>:erase your geas via initiation, you're better off just not taking the
>geas in the first place and instead take the magic point and metamagic
>ability.

<and of course Mongoose's reply>
> The latter. If you obey all your geassa, its as if the "geased"
>points were never lost. Thats one way to look at it, though if you take
the geas, you get
>to use the point most of the time, even BEFORE intiation. Note that NOT

>taking a geas may make it hard (or impossible) to intiate, also.

I'm just replying to this to see if I have a good handle on what the
geasa rules are saying. So, you loose a point of magic and decide to take
a geas. In effect you now have two magic ratings, an "actual rating," and
a "virtual rating." The actual rating is the character's actual magic
rating, and if that ever gets to zero the character becomes a mundane.
The virtual rating is used for everything the magic attribute is used
for. If the character initiates he can choose to just take the magic
point (increasing both his actual and virtual ratings by one), or can
attempt to shed the geas, which increases his actual rating. Here's an
example with numbers.
Joe's having a hard time, he's lost two magic points and has decided to
take two geasa. He has an actual magic rating of 4, and a virtual rating
of 6. He uses the rating of 6 for everything which requires the magic
attribute (determining whether drain is physical or stun for example).
Joe initiates, he can either take the magic point increasing his actual
rating to 5, and his virtual rating to 7, or he can try and shed the geas
which, if successful, will raise his actual rating to 5, and leave his
virtual rating at 6 (he still has one geas to get rid of).

Is this pretty much what they're trying to say? I'm just trying to get a
handle on it.

<snip adepts and voluntary geasa stuff>
> Also interesting is how "physical mages" (now called adpets who
>practice "The magians way") do not automatically start out with geas, as
they
>buy thier "active" magic like an adept power, instead of sacrificing
>active magic to buy adept powers.

Yes, I like how they handled the physical magician. They've solved some
big problems associated with them. Now the spellcasting ability is
treated like a standard power, you can purchase when you initiate and
gain a power point.

I'm really impressed by MITS. I don't like many of the changes made to
the magic system, but the book is really well written.

So, of the spells that haven't been included in third edition (Disregard
and X-ray vision to name two of them) is that because it was decided that
for some reason they shouldn't be in 3rd ed? Or is this foreshadowing
some other FASA magic book which will have more spells in it?
Overall, it's a good book. Well worth the investment even if you aren't
playing 3rd ed. It provides enough clarification and new material to make
it worth while.

Aerochrome
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Message no. 8
From: Gurth gurth@******.nl
Subject: MITS for Lunch
Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 10:09:40 +0200
According to Mongoose, at 14:29 on 8 May 99, the word on
the street was...

> You have to spend priority A to be a "physmage", and buy at least one
> point worth of the "Magical Power" abilty. If you loose magic points, that
> power is always the first reduced; If you loose that abilty, you become a
> normal adept forever.

Do I understand this correctly, or am I misunderstanding what you said?
From this, it seems to me that being a physical magician is worth drek --
the first time you suffer from Magic loss, you've lost your "Magical
Power" ability and are a normal adept on the spot?

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Another year and then you'll be happy.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
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Message no. 9
From: Mongoose m0ng005e@*********.com
Subject: MITS for Lunch
Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 03:49:56 -0500
> You have to spend priority A to be a "physmage", and buy at least one
> point worth of the "Magical Power" abilty. If you loose magic points,
that
> power is always the first reduced; If you loose that abilty, you become a
> normal adept forever.

Do I understand this correctly, or am I misunderstanding what you said?
>From this, it seems to me that being a physical magician is worth drek --
the first time you suffer from Magic loss, you've lost your "Magical
Power" ability and are a normal adept on the spot?

Gurth@******.nl
++++++++++++++++

Only if you only bough one point in "magical power", and don't offset
the loss with a Geas, do you permanently loose the use of "active" magic.
As long as you keep one point in magic power (through luck, or taking Geas)
you are OK.

Mongoose
Message no. 10
From: Marizhavashti Kali xenya@********.com
Subject: MITS for Lunch
Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 16:20:00 -0700
Gurth wrote:
>
> Do I understand this correctly, or am I misunderstanding what you said?
> >From this, it seems to me that being a physical magician is worth drek --
> the first time you suffer from Magic loss, you've lost your "Magical
> Power" ability and are a normal adept on the spot?

I think that you can put one or more points into it, so if you put, say,
three or four points in, you have a good chance to hold on to magical
power.

--
Deird'Re M. Brooks | xenya@********.com | cam#9309026
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Further Reading

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