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Mailing List Logs for ShadowRN

Message no. 1
From: Marc A Renouf <jormung@*****.umich.edu>
Subject: Re: Modifiers
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 1996 20:05:27 -0500 (EST)
On Mon, 22 Jan 1996, Sebastian Wiers wrote:

> > The average target number for a firearms roll in my campaign is
> > generally in excess of 10. Movement, visibility, recoil, shooter's
> > cover, target's cover, you name it. It all applies.

> Shooters cover? what/where is the mod for that? And recoil? what are you
> shooting with? TN 3 is not uncommon, and if tn goes over 8, it is usually
> time to change position of vision systems, not to shoot. Why is TN3 common?
> Because we sit in well lit areas and let people attack us, capping them when
> we winn initiative.

The modifier for shooter's cover is on page 78 of Fields of Fire,
in the second paragraph of the section entitled "Cover Modifiers."
The modifiers that are generally most grievous are those of
movement and cover. If both parties are in partial cover (which would be
smart) they both apply a +6 modifier to their shots (+4 for the target's
cover and +2 for the shooter's cover). Most combats take place in at
least medium range (when was the last time you were 15 feet from a guy
shooting at you with a heavy pistol?), so the base target number is 5.
Even with clear visibility, a smartlink, and no recoil, your final target
number is (5-2+6 = 9). As you can see, the addition of any wound,
visibility, relative movement, recoil, or further cover makes the target
number much higher.
Typical situation: drive-by shooting on a Seattle street.
Shooter opens up from long range, base target number 6.
Smartlink -2
Night-time (Partial light w/lowlight) +1
Recoil from burst +3
Gas Vent 2 -2
Leaning out of car window
(Half of shooter's cover) +2
Shooting from a speeding car
(As running) +4

At this point, the target is unaware of the attack and is walking across
the sidewalk towards his car. Thus, the target adds no further movement
or cover mods...yet. Thus, we have a target number of (6-2+1+3-2+2+4 =
12). If the shooter is strong enough to negate that last point of
recoil, that drops to an eleven. If there are innocent bystanders in the
way (say, a crowded sidewalk), that could easily rise to a 15 or higher.
If you wait until you get closer to open fire, you don't get as many
chances. Thus, you eat the target mods and hope for the best. Once the
target is aware of the attack, he can run for cover, adding even more
mods to the soup.
I'm not saying that no one should ever get hit. I'm saying that
it's extremely difficult to hit and kill people (especially in a single
volley) in quite a few of the situations that Shadowrunners find
themselves in.
Most gunshot fatalities happen in close range surprise
situations. The hold-out under the table, the pistol from the back seat,
the shotgun down the hall, the waiter's 9mm "special dish", etc. As the
saying goes, "three rounds, three feet, three seconds."
Maximizing your sammy potential comes not from being able to make
the trick shots but from being able to take control of the situation to
get the advantage over your opponent. Surprise them from close range,
shock them with brutality, and run the hell away before anyone knows
what's happening. Unfortunately for the sammies, there is no skill or
rule that covers this kind of planning (other than in the most abstract
sense with Military Theory). It's purely a role-playing thing.

Marc
Message no. 2
From: jpinnow@***.im.med.umich.edu (Justin Pinnow)
Subject: Re: Modifiers
Date: Tue, 23 Jan 1996 08:13:25 -0500
On Monday, 22 January, 1996, Marc. A. Renouf wrote:

<Example and supporting data snipped>

I would have to say that this makes more sense than low TN's for most
gunfights, IMHO. It also makes the combats more interesting and deadly. Why?
Well, interesting because you can see more action and more stunts that way.
Deadly, because this means just being quick won't guarantee your safety. Now
you have to know when and how to shoot, not just roll a higher initiative.


> Most gunshot fatalities happen in close range surprise
>situations. The hold-out under the table, the pistol from the back seat,
>the shotgun down the hall, the waiter's 9mm "special dish", etc. As the
>saying goes, "three rounds, three feet, three seconds."

Waiter's 9mm special dish, eh? I remember that. ;) Yes it there was a
fatality in that surprise situation. Yes it was quick. The twist is that it
backfired for the poor waiter. ;) (I still remember that shot with fond
thoughts.)

Justin :)

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