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Message no. 1
From: Doctor Doom <JCH8169@***.TAMU.EDU>
Subject: More Replies, and More Replies, and More Replies ...
Date: Mon, 31 Oct 1994 02:50:38 -0600
VII. Von Skrub: (Magic in Space)

>Hmmm, actually the recently posted story about Knight and the Invae, err,
>Insect Spirirts, implies that magic is NOT limited to earth. Yeah I know,
>FASA said somewhere that the lack of mana above a certain height from earth
>acts like a vaccuum on mages sanity if they try to cast or view astrally or
>something. Whatever. That may well be commen opinion. Let's see though. Ares

Regarding the barrier at the boundary of the atmosphere . . . it is my opinion
that a mere depression in the levels of mana is insufficient to explain the
various phenomena reportedly observed at the termination of the biosphere.

It does not require much imagination to accept the notion that death could be
induced in magicians subjected to a mana vacuum; however, is this a sufficient
explanation for insanity? For my own purposes, no.

I /believe/ it was in NAGRL that reference was made to unsightly beasties
witnessed by a magician as he fell to Earth after an abortive attempt to
cross the threshold, this element of the anecdote finds echoes in statements
of the magician in "Hunter and Prey."

Furthermore, the story asserts that magic is also more difficult in orbit,
presumably to decreased mana levels -- although no mention is made of its
ABSENCE.

There is apparently /something/ out there, whe'er or not these are the Horrors
can not be /categorically/ stated at this point.

One may be Horror Marked from the practicing of "Raw" Magic, a variety of
metaphysical manipulation which corresponds to all forms of magic in ShadowRun.
The Great Ghost Dance, as mentioned in "Voices From the Past," would count as
Raw Magic of a magnitude heretofore /rarely/ witnessed; as was stated by (we
assume) Vestrial, "The humans have danced their little dance, Har'lea'quinn.
They shook this world, and the others. Now they pay the price."

A comment which sounds disturbingly like a Horror Mark on a planetary scale.
It therefore stands to reason that such a cataclysmic wielding of Raw Magic
could expedite the forging of the bridge the Horrors utilize to gain access
to this Reality.

I am not asserting with certainty that Horrors exist in space, but it is a
plausible explanation and would satisfy all known facts.

However, this suggestion that the Horrors much find their origins in a specific
physical location I believe to be fallacious. Horrors, in all their myriad
forms, are magical beings ... to pre-suppose that they issue forth from a
planet or moon is to discount this preternatural nature and to commit an
logical misstep at the initiation of divining their origins.


>Maybe FASA is gonna start tieing SR into MechWarrior :) We had to colonize
>the inner sphere for some reason. Magic is fairy tale, no one really
>believes Demons chased us off of Old Earth, that's just old world
>superstition. In the 3000's magic would still be around, on Earth...

>Think about it. Don't thwap me.

Nay, I shall not THWAP thee; although I shall not guarantee that FASA
shall not. It was once mentioned that someone had inquired as to the
usage of Orcs and Trolls in MechWarrior, as they reasoned that BattleTech
was merely the world of ShadowRun one thousand years in the future. The
FASA representative in question -- no identification was provided --
actually found the suggestion so ludicrous he laughed out loud. After
some time he divined that their query was intended to be interpreted as
in earnest and stated unequivocally that ShadowRun and BattleTech are two
entirely disassociated gaming universes.


VI. Wieder von dem Shadowdancer: (Gaia Theory)

>Whistler, I don't know what your problem is, but I think you have been
>listen to professors way to much. "Mother Nature", Gaia, Is a strange
>and interesting being. You cannot know Her ways, nor will a mere
>mortal ever understand what She does. The fish story is an example.

Ah, I believe, Shadowdancer, this qualifies as an infusion of religion
onto the list. Although I do not deprecate your doing so, you have run
afoul of an admonition you delivered to Magister earlier.

Religion are legitimate explanations to Believers, and I have a passing
familiarity with the Gaia Theory of nature; however, I would hardly
claim it scientific -- no more so than I would claim that an espousing
of Creationism is scientific.

You are unable to prove to me that Gaia exists or that the Gaia theory is
true. Contrariwise, I probably cannot disprove it. The same situation
applies to arguments as to the existence of God. No, I can not /prove/
that He exists to you, nor can the reverse be proven; although there is
quite persuasive evidence in either direction. It is a matter of Faith.


VII. On Elves and Immortality

According to EarthDawn, most Elves can expect to experience lifespans on the
order of approximately four centuries; however, there are individuals known
who have lived on the order of 5000 years ... which would obviously cast a
dubious light over such conservative projections.

Immortality could be defined as possessing the capacity to live forever, but
forever is an insanely long duration, and naturally none has thus far bridged
such a tremendous span of time ... so one might suggest Elves are not immortal,
but certainly five millennia is a particularly lengthy stretch of time. Hence,
at what point does mere prosaic longevity become immortality?

For most intents and purposes, Harlequin and Ehran could with some safely
be considered impervious to the debilitating effects of Age, a version of
Immortality, even during cycles of low mana. It has been observed that
their capacity for healing does wane with the tide of Magic, as some may
have noted in the case of Harlequin's amputated ear which failed to
regenerate (by means unknown) as Ehran's did.

It has e'er been my contention that Elves can typically expect to live within
the vicinity of 400 years, but beyond that biological limitation they must
seek some manner of metaphysical means of lengthening their span.


VIII. On Hermeticism and Shamanism:

Shamans are fond of saying that they are unbound by rules.

Permit me to submit an assertion to you: If you do not acknowledge the
Law of Gravity, are you bound by it?

"But that's silly," you say. "Who would possibly deny Gravity?"

Bear with me. Most would concede, save the animators at Warner Brothers, that
e'en if wholly unaware of the Law of Gravity, all are subject to it. If there
Laws of Nature in Metaphysics, then Shamans, e'en if they chose not to assent
to them, are yet confined by their regulations.

The central difference in Weltanschauung betwixt Hermeticism and Shamanism
/could/ be defined thusly:

Hermetics perceive the world and magic as mechanistic, with defined laws and
strictures, and it is via the knowledge gained in the exploration and
determination of these Laws that the Hermetic feels he may wield such power.
Magic is a Science, and as is true with Science, one /must/ analyze the
mechanism of its workings for one to effectively utilize it.

Shamans dismiss most notions of rules as they are entirely immaterial to their
purpose. Whe'er there are natural laws are not, such is incidental to their
quest to commune with the universe, to achieve enlightenment. Magic is an Art;
what need does Art have of Laws? (notice this does not discount the idea that
there may be laws ... merely that they are of no consequence) Tell me how it
feels. Tell me what and how it makes you think ... as I converse with the
Cosmos.

Shamans aren't about breaking laws; they are merely unconcerned with them.
However, I would suggest, just as the person denying Gravity, they are still
governed by them. Contrariwise, not all aspects of something so esoteric as
Magic shall lend themselves to the mechanistic definitions of the Hermetic,
and as such his task to unlock the Metaphysical secrets of the Universe shall
be made more difficult by the arcane elements of Magic as Art.


IX. Von Star: (Dictionaries Housed in One's Cranium)

Von Star

>Hey, Rat, are you a walking dictionary or something??
>Just kidding... <big red-cheeked *grin*>

Nay, that office is occupied (either by choice or't being thrust upon my
person) by me, as often have I been subjected to jibes and snide commentary
as well as garnered compliments for my particular mode of anachronistic
sesquipedalian speech.


Colonel Count von Hohenzollern und von Doom, DMSc, DSc, PhD.

Doom Technologies & Weapon Systems -- Dark Thought Publications
>>> Working on solutions best left in the dark.
<<<
[ Doctor Doom : jch8169@********.tamu.edu ]
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These messages were posted a long time ago on a mailing list far, far away. The copyright to their contents probably lies with the original authors of the individual messages, but since they were published in an electronic forum that anyone could subscribe to, and the logs were available to subscribers and most likely non-subscribers as well, it's felt that re-publishing them here is a kind of public service.