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Message no. 1
From: Menard Steve <menars@***.UMONTREAL.CA>
Subject: New Character Generation System.
Date: Thu, 25 May 1995 12:17:35 -0400
One of my players suggested something, giving a new character a
certain number of point and then letting him "buy" his options. What he
suggested was that a character starts with 15 points and then hehis
options. yes that give the possibility for someone to have 2 priority A
option(lets say you buy race and magic at one, thats to say none). Might
be good, but then while re-designing the table, why not give more
options! I've always found that the difference between 400,000 and
1,000,000 nuyen was to big(not enough with one, too much with the other).
Has anyone designed a similar system? Or should I design mine and post it
to the list?

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--- |\_/| Still The One and Only Wolfbane! ---
--- |o o| " Hey! Why ya lookin' at me so weird? Ain't ya 'ver seen a ---
--- \ / decker witha horn ?" --- Scy, Troll decker with a CC ---
--- 0 Steve Menard menars@***.UMontreal.Ca ---
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Message no. 2
From: P Ward <P.Ward@**.CF.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: New Character Generation System.
Date: Thu, 25 May 1995 17:20:20 BST
There've been a few points systems floating around, but I still
haven't found one I;m particularly hapyp with, (not enough
disadvantageous quirks to balance the good ones, etc), so
post yours.

Phil (Renegade)
Message no. 3
From: Marc A Renouf <jormung@*****.UMICH.EDU>
Subject: Re: New Character Generation System.
Date: Thu, 25 May 1995 13:17:38 -0400
On Thu, 25 May 1995, Menard Steve wrote:

> One of my players suggested something, giving a new character a
> certain number of point and then letting him "buy" his options...

> Has anyone designed a similar system? Or should I design mine and post it
> to the list?

I've lost track of the number of times this has been done. My
first Shadowrun GM did it back in '89 under SRI rules, and there have
been countless others since.

Marc
Message no. 4
From: Andy Butcher <Fiend@*********.CO.UK>
Subject: Re: New Character Generation System.
Date: Mon, 5 Jun 1995 09:29:53 +0100
Menard Steve (Steve Menard?) wrote:

> One of my players suggested something, giving a new character a
>certain number of point and then letting him "buy" his options. What he
>suggested was that a character starts with 15 points and then hehis
>options. yes that give the possibility for someone to have 2 priority A
>option(lets say you buy race and magic at one, thats to say none). Might
>be good, but then while re-designing the table, why not give more
>options! I've always found that the difference between 400,000 and
>1,000,000 nuyen was to big(not enough with one, too much with the other).
>Has anyone designed a similar system? Or should I design mine and post it
>to the list?

Here's mine, that I posted a while ago. It's just a simple extrapolation of
the basic system, and nobody flamed it too badly back then... ;)

Points Attributes Skills Tech/Force
^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^
8 30 40 1,000,000/50
7 26 34 600,000/40
6 24 30 400,000/35
5 22 26 175,000/30
4 20 24 90,000/25
3 18 22 30,000/20
2 17 20 5,000/15
1 16 18 1,500/10
0 15 17 500/5

Players use this table instead of the standard priorities table in the
rules, and recieve a number of points to spend depending on their
race/magical ability:

Mundane humans - 18 pts
Human Magicians - 12 pts
Human Adepts - 14 pts

Metahumans - 16 pts
Metahuman Magicians - 8 pts
Metahuman Adepts - 10 pts

In addition, a character capable of casting spells can shift the Tech/Force
column in either direction by sacrificing the other amount. For example, a
spell-casting magician spending 4 points on Tech/Force could have 90,000 and
25, 400,000 and 15, 30,000 and 30 or any other combination.

Andy Butcher | "Whether you think you will succeed
PC Gamer Magazine | or not, you are right."
Fiend@*********.co.uk | Henry Ford
Message no. 5
From: Theobalt Nolasco <theobalt@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: New Character Generation System.
Date: Mon, 5 Jun 1995 18:43:14 -0600
On Mon, 5 Jun 1995, Andy Butcher wrote:

> Points Attributes Skills Tech/Force
> ^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^
> 8 30 40 1,000,000/50
> 7 26 34 600,000/40
> 6 24 30 400,000/35
> 5 22 26 175,000/30
> 4 20 24 90,000/25
> 3 18 22 30,000/20
> 2 17 20 5,000/15
> 1 16 18 1,500/10
> 0 15 17 500/5
>
> Mundane humans - 18 pts
> Human Magicians - 12 pts
> Human Adepts - 14 pts
>
> Metahumans - 16 pts
> Metahuman Magicians - 8 pts
> Metahuman Adepts - 10 pts
>
> In addition, a character capable of casting spells can shift the Tech/Force
> column in either direction by sacrificing the other amount. For example, a
> spell-casting magician spending 4 points on Tech/Force could have 90,000 and
> 25, 400,000 and 15, 30,000 and 30 or any other combination.

I have had problems with the existing character creations and I
would like to try out your use of a point system instead of priorities.
How many points do you start with by the way, I'm not sure wether you
mentioned it on your post.

Carnage
Message no. 6
From: Gary Carroll <gary@****.COM>
Subject: Re: New Character Generation System.
Date: Mon, 5 Jun 1995 17:57:57 -0700
>On Mon, 5 Jun 1995, Andy Butcher wrote:
>
>> Points Attributes Skills Tech/Force
>> ^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^
>> 8 30 40 1,000,000/50
>> 7 26 34 600,000/40
>> 6 24 30 400,000/35
>> 5 22 26 175,000/30
>> 4 20 24 90,000/25
>> 3 18 22 30,000/20
>> 2 17 20 5,000/15
>> 1 16 18 1,500/10
>> 0 15 17 500/5
>>

POINTS START HERE
>> Mundane humans - 18 pts
>> Human Magicians - 12 pts
>> Human Adepts - 14 pts
>>
>> Metahumans - 16 pts
>> Metahuman Magicians - 8 pts
>> Metahuman Adepts - 10 pts
POINTS END HERE

>> In addition, a character capable of casting spells can
>>shift the Tech/Force column in either direction by sacrificing
>>the other amount. For example, a spell-casting magician
>>spending 4 points on Tech/Force could have 90,000 and
>> 25, 400,000 and 15, 30,000 and 30 or any other combination.
>
> Carnage replied:
> I have had problems with the existing character creations
>and I would like to try out your use of a point system instead
>of priorities. How many points do you start with by the way,
>I'm not sure wether you mentioned it on your post.

oops you missed you perception check HUH!
look again.
Thanks Gary C.
Message no. 7
From: Theobalt Nolasco <theobalt@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: New Character Generation System.
Date: Tue, 6 Jun 1995 01:48:15 -0600
On Mon, 5 Jun 1995, Andy Butcher wrote:
> Players use this table instead of the standard priorities table in the
> rules, and recieve a number of points to spend depending on their
> race/magical ability:
>
> Mundane humans - 18 pts
> Human Magicians - 12 pts
> Human Adepts - 14 pts
>
> Metahumans - 16 pts
> Metahuman Magicians - 8 pts
> Metahuman Adepts - 10 pts

What if one was allowed to use the More Metahumans rule which
lowers the Race priority from A to C, shifting all magicians (regardless
of race) to A and adepts (...ditto) to B? That would mean more points
for metahuman players instead of the ones listed above, right? It's
seems pretty limiting as to how much one gets in terms of
stats/skills/tech/force for metahumans vs. normals.

Carnage
Message no. 8
From: Sebastian Wiers <seb@***.RIPCO.COM>
Subject: Re: New Character Generation System.
Date: Tue, 6 Jun 1995 13:02:47 -0500
>
> On Mon, 5 Jun 1995, Andy Butcher wrote:
>
> > Points Attributes Skills Tech/Force
> > ^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^
> > 8 30 40 1,000,000/50
> > 7 26 34 600,000/40
> > 6 24 30 400,000/35
> > 5 22 26 175,000/30
> > 4 20 24 90,000/25
> > 3 18 22 30,000/20
> > 2 17 20 5,000/15
> > 1 16 18 1,500/10
> > 0 15 17 500/5
> >
> > Mundane humans - 18 pts
> > Human Magicians - 12 pts
> > Human Adepts - 14 pts
> >
> > Metahumans - 16 pts
> > Metahuman Magicians - 8 pts
> > Metahuman Adepts - 10 pts
> >
> > In addition, a character capable of casting spells can shift the Tech/Force
> > column in either direction by sacrificing the other amount. For example, a
> > spell-casting magician spending 4 points on Tech/Force could have 90,000 and
> > 25, 400,000 and 15, 30,000 and 30 or any other combination.
>
I would definately suggest limiting how much mages can shift tech for force,
as high tech mages will have an easy time aquiring spells later on. But i
like it. Have you used this much (I think our GM uses something similar to
get a base for npc's)
Also, why does a mundane metahuman get 2 points less than a mundane human,
but metahuman mages and adepts get four points less than human? does this
relate to the SRII mechanics somehow, or is it a tested, gives similar results
kind of thing? (we play methumans priority c, which means lots more
methumans, but hey, we play in chicago, which is about 20% elf)
Message no. 9
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: New Character Generation System.
Date: Wed, 7 Jun 1995 09:59:31 +0200
>chicago, which is about 20% elf)

What, still? :)


Gurth@******.nl - Gurth@***.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Leave the making of mistakes to the government
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B? e+ u+@ h! f--(?) !r(--)(*) n---->!n y? Unofficial Shadowrun Guru :)
Message no. 10
From: Andy Butcher <Fiend@*********.CO.UK>
Subject: Re: New Character Generation System.
Date: Wed, 7 Jun 1995 15:52:32 +0100
Carnage wrote:

>> Players use this table instead of the standard priorities table in the
>> rules, and recieve a number of points to spend depending on their
>> race/magical ability:
>>
>> Mundane humans - 18 pts
>> Human Magicians - 12 pts
>> Human Adepts - 14 pts
>>
>> Metahumans - 16 pts
>> Metahuman Magicians - 8 pts
>> Metahuman Adepts - 10 pts
>
>What if one was allowed to use the More Metahumans rule which
>lowers the Race priority from A to C, shifting all magicians (regardless
>of race) to A and adepts (...ditto) to B? That would mean more points
>for metahuman players instead of the ones listed above, right? It's
>seems pretty limiting as to how much one gets in terms of
>stats/skills/tech/force for metahumans vs. normals.

I apparently forgot to mention it (doh!), but the table was devised using
the 'C priority for methumans' optional rule already. For those who prefer
the standard A priority the numbers are:

Metahumans - 12 pts
Metahuman Magicians - 6 pts
Metahuman Adepts - 6 pts

Loadsa fun, eh? ;)

Andy Butcher | "Whether you think you will succeed
PC Gamer Magazine | or not, you are right."
Fiend@*********.co.uk | Henry Ford
Message no. 11
From: Gary Carroll <gary@****.COM>
Subject: Re: New Character Generation System.
Date: Wed, 7 Jun 1995 08:53:50 -0700
>>> race/magical ability:
>>>
>>> Mundane humans - 18 pts
>>> Human Magicians - 12 pts
>>> Human Adepts - 14 pts
>>>
>>> Metahumans - 16 pts
>>> Metahuman Magicians - 8 pts
>>> Metahuman Adepts - 10 pts
>>
>>What if one was allowed to use the More Metahumans rule which
>>lowers the Race priority from A to C, shifting all magicians
>(regardless of race) to A and adepts (...ditto) to B? That
>>would mean more points for metahuman players instead of the
>>ones listed above, right? It's seems pretty limiting as to
>>how much one gets in terms of stats/skills/tech/force for
>>metahumans vs. normals.
>
>Andy Butcher
>I apparently forgot to mention it (doh!), but the table was
>devised using the 'C priority for methumans' optional rule
>already. For those who prefer the standard A priority the
>numbers are:
>Metahumans - 12 pts
>Metahuman Magicians - 6 pts
>Metahuman Adepts - 6 pts

Ummm shouldn't it be.......
Metahumans - 12 pts
Metahuman Magicians - 4 pts
Metahuman Adepts - 6 pts

Thanks
Gary C.
Message no. 12
From: Andy Butcher <Fiend@*********.CO.UK>
Subject: Re: New Character Generation System.
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 1995 11:06:10 +0100
Sebastian Wiers wrote:
> I would definately suggest limiting how much mages can shift tech for force,
>as high tech mages will have an easy time aquiring spells later on. But i
>like it. Have you used this much (I think our GM uses something similar to
>get a base for npc's)
> Also, why does a mundane metahuman get 2 points less than a mundane human,
>but metahuman mages and adepts get four points less than human? does this
>relate to the SRII mechanics somehow, or is it a tested, gives similar results
>kind of thing? (we play methumans priority c, which means lots more
>methumans, but hey, we play in chicago, which is about 20% elf)

The table is just a simple extrapolation of the basic Shadowrun A, B, C, D,
and E priority system, so that:

Old Priority New Points
^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
A 8
B 6
C 4
D 2
E 0

So, a normal human, who before would have got to assign priority's A, B and
C to Skills, Attributes and Tech (SAT) in whatever combination, now gets
8+6+4 = 18 pts to spend.
The table already uses the C priority for metahumans (I forgot to mention
it), so a metahuman would have got to assign A, B, and D to SAT, so gets
8+6+2 = 16 pts.
A methuman magician would have had B, D and E to assign to SAT (C goes for
metahuman, A for magician), so they get 6+2+0 = 8 pts, and so on.

Hope this helps

Andy Butcher | "Whether you think you will succeed
PC Gamer Magazine | or not, you are right."
Fiend@*********.co.uk | Henry Ford
Message no. 13
From: Andy Butcher <Fiend@*********.CO.UK>
Subject: Re: New Character Generation System.
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 1995 11:06:40 +0100
Gary Carrol wrote:
>Andy Butcher wrote:
>>I apparently forgot to mention it (doh!), but the table was
>>devised using the 'C priority for methumans' optional rule
>>already. For those who prefer the standard A priority the
>>numbers are:
>>Metahumans - 12 pts
>>Metahuman Magicians - 6 pts
>>Metahuman Adepts - 6 pts
>
>Ummm shouldn't it be.......
>Metahumans - 12 pts
>Metahuman Magicians - 4 pts
>Metahuman Adepts - 6 pts

Sorry - I've got to remember to proof my mail b4 sending it ;)
It should be:

Metahumans - 12 pts
Metahuman Magicians - 6 pts
Metahuman - 8 pts

Check out my other post for details of how it works - I don't want to waste
bandwidth by repeating myself ;)

Thanks for pointing out the mistake.

Andy Butcher | "Whether you think you will succeed
PC Gamer Magazine | or not, you are right."
Fiend@*********.co.uk | Henry Ford

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