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Mailing List Logs for ShadowRN

Message no. 1
From: Steve Kenson <TalonMail@***.COM>
Subject: New Seattle
Date: Mon, 22 Dec 1997 15:41:14 -0500
As the saying goes, I have some good news and some bad news:

The good news is: the first draft of the New Seattle book is done and in to
FASA. It's a biggie (around 100,000 words) and covers a lot of ground.

The bad news is: the tight space requirements did not allow me to use the few
submissions I got from listmembers. I apologize to everyone who took the time
to send submissions in, but the book ended up running longer than expected
as-is, without even factoring in the additional material, so I decided that
to be fair I wouldn't use any of it. It was a good idea (and I got some good
material) but it just didn't work out. Sorry, all.

I thank everyone who sent me their ideas, and I hope that you will continue
to develop Seattle as your own unique setting.

Take care,
Steve
Message no. 2
From: David Buehrer <dbuehrer@******.CARL.ORG>
Subject: Re: New Seattle
Date: Mon, 22 Dec 1997 14:31:51 -0700
Steve Kenson wrote:
/
/ The good news is: the first draft of the New Seattle book is done and in to
/ FASA. It's a biggie (around 100,000 words) and covers a lot of ground.

100,000... gah. Okay, I can write a short story. I can contemplate
writing a book (I'm gonna do it someday). But what do you go through
to write a sourcebook like Seattle? (Remember Jak's post on the
process he goes through to write a book?) An inquiring (and curious)
mind wants to know :)

-David
--
"Creativity is allowing yourself to make mistakes.
Art is knowing which ones to keep."
--
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1068/homepage.htm
Message no. 3
From: Kevin R Mohondro <mohkev@******.COM>
Subject: Re: New Seattle
Date: Mon, 22 Dec 1997 14:49:41 -0800
> From: Steve Kenson <TalonMail@***.COM>
> To: SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET
> Subject: New Seattle
> Date: Monday, December 22, 1997 12:41 PM
>
> As the saying goes, I have some good news and some bad news:
>
> The good news is: the first draft of the New Seattle book is done and in
to
> FASA. It's a biggie (around 100,000 words) and covers a lot of ground.
>
> The bad news is: the tight space requirements did not allow me to use
the few
> submissions I got from listmembers. I apologize to everyone who took the
time
> to send submissions in, but the book ended up running longer than
expected
> as-is, without even factoring in the additional material, so I decided
that
> to be fair I wouldn't use any of it. It was a good idea (and I got some
good
> material) but it just didn't work out. Sorry, all.
>
> I thank everyone who sent me their ideas, and I hope that you will
continue
> to develop Seattle as your own unique setting.
>
> Take care,
> Steve

Has there been any thought to bundling all of the submissions together and
posting it as a "Net Supplement" to the new Seattle guide?

--
-Moe
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kevin R Mohondro mohkev@******.com
Software Engineer
SalePoint/Retail Interact (619) 552-2026
Message no. 4
From: Tony Rabiola <rabiola@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Re: New Seattle
Date: Tue, 23 Dec 1997 14:41:13 -0600
On 12/22/97 14:49:41 you wrote:
>
>> From: Steve Kenson <TalonMail@***.COM>
>> To: SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET
>> Subject: New Seattle
>> Date: Monday, December 22, 1997 12:41 PM
>>
>> As the saying goes, I have some good news and some bad news:
>>
>> The good news is: the first draft of the New Seattle book is done and in
>to
>> FASA. It's a biggie (around 100,000 words) and covers a lot of ground.
>>
>> The bad news is: the tight space requirements did not allow me to use
>the few
>> submissions I got from listmembers. I apologize to everyone who took the
>time
>> to send submissions in, but the book ended up running longer than
>expected
>> as-is, without even factoring in the additional material, so I decided
>that
>> to be fair I wouldn't use any of it. It was a good idea (and I got some
>good
>> material) but it just didn't work out. Sorry, all.
>>
>> I thank everyone who sent me their ideas, and I hope that you will
>continue
>> to develop Seattle as your own unique setting.
>>
>> Take care,
>> Steve
>
>Has there been any thought to bundling all of the submissions together and
>posting it as a "Net Supplement" to the new Seattle guide?
>
>--
Best idea I have heard today.

Argent

Rabiola@**.netcom.com
Argent - Elven Fixer Extrodinaire
It was hot, the night we burned Chrome...
Message no. 5
From: AirWisp <AirWisp@***.COM>
Subject: Re: New Seattle
Date: Wed, 24 Dec 1997 00:08:22 EST
In a message dated 97-12-22 16:10:41 EST, you write:

> The bad news is: the tight space requirements did not allow me to use the
> few
> submissions I got from listmembers. I apologize to everyone who took the
> time
> to send submissions in, but the book ended up running longer than expected
> as-is, without even factoring in the additional material, so I decided that
> to be fair I wouldn't use any of it. It was a good idea (and I got some
good
> material) but it just didn't work out. Sorry, all.
>
> I thank everyone who sent me their ideas, and I hope that you will continue
> to develop Seattle as your own unique setting.
>
> Take care,
> Steve
>
Have you considered posting to the gaming group some of the material that you
decided to leave out, that was contributed to you by the gaming group ?

Have a Merry Christmas,

Mike
Message no. 6
From: Dvixen <dvixen@********.COM>
Subject: Re: New Seattle
Date: Wed, 24 Dec 1997 01:28:04 -0800
Steve Kenson wrote:

> The bad news is: the tight space requirements did not allow me to use the few
> submissions I got from listmembers. I apologize to everyone who took the time
> to send submissions in, but the book ended up running longer than expected
> as-is, without even factoring in the additional material, so I decided that
> to be fair I wouldn't use any of it. It was a good idea (and I got some good
> material) but it just didn't work out. Sorry, all.

Pity. Would been a nice coup to annoy people with here. ;)

> I thank everyone who sent me their ideas, and I hope that you will continue
> to develop Seattle as your own unique setting.

Heck, drop your ideas for places my way, I'll format and drop them on my
site for everyone to access.

--

Dvixen Code-word : Weevil-chuck. dvixen@********.com
"And I thought First Ones were rare." - Ivanova - Babylon 5
FAQ Flunky of the SRcard and ShadowRN Mailing Lists
http://coastnet.com/~dvixen/shadowrn/srnfaq1.html <= Get it. Memorize!
Required Reading => http://coastnet.com/~dvixen/srtcg/tcgfaq1.html
Message no. 7
From: XaOs [David Goth] xaos@*****.net
Subject: New Seattle
Date: Thu, 4 Feb 1999 01:16:50 -0600
<grumble...choke>

:)

Okay, for those of you who are lucky enough to have New Seattle...what do
you think? How does it compare with the original (both in terms of format
and content). What sorts of changes are you noticing to specific locations?
How are the art and maps?



-XaOs-
xaos@*****.net
-David Goth-
Message no. 8
From: Mark A Shieh SHODAN+@***.EDU
Subject: New Seattle
Date: Thu, 4 Feb 1999 14:35:14 -0500 (EST)
"XaOs [David Goth]" <xaos@*****.net> writes:
> Okay, for those of you who are lucky enough to have New Seattle...what do
> you think?

I just posted in the another thread (on the other list, I
think) about this... I thought it was pretty good. Not the best I've
seen out of FASA, but that's mainly because it's a revision of an old
book and not entirely new material, and because I'm an SR junkie who's
got all of the old books it summarizes.

> How does it compare with the original (both in terms of format
> and content).

I've always felt that the original felt a little bit amateur
in format, but don't tell FASA that. :) The content I liked... They
go and do a couple of things I thought were silly, like list every
hospital in each district by name, but they also go into a lot more
detail on the things I wanted to hear more. They list the mayor of
each district, and their stances and policies on issues such as
metahumans, and how the laws vary between the districts. They give
a history of each district, so you know, for example, what was in the
Redmond Barrens before it became the barrens.

> What sorts of changes are you noticing to specific locations?

I didn't see many changes, to be honest. I usually saw stuff
built on top of old background material. Places like the needle,
Dante's Inferno, and club penumbra are still rated important enough to
get a few paragraphs of description, and I saw most of the others I
remember listed in the table in the back of the book. (Icarus
Descending was the big one for me. It was the only reference to Triad
activity I could find for years...)
However, they do go into more detail within the districts.
They give a better description of the various neighborhoods,
especially the racially dominant ones like the International Quarter?
where Hanzo Shotozumi calls home and places like the Orc Underground,
Talislar, and the UCAS military base.

> How are the art and maps?

The art is Shadowrun par. Your favorite artists made decent
things, and the artists you wish FASA would fire are still drawing. I
still want to know how they fix cracks in the floor at Dante's inferno
though... The floor appears to be one solid thing of glass, not
tiled as I originally envisioned. :)
Maps are nice. They've got almost full-page maps of each
district, with major regions listed. So, the map of downtown not only
has stuff like the Sea-Tac airport on it, but also stuff like major
highways, the International Quarter, and 2 of the larger shopping
malls. <shrug> I wasn't blown away by the maps or anything, but
they're pretty good, and better than what was there before.

Mark
Message no. 9
From: Airwasp@***.com Airwasp@***.com
Subject: New Seattle
Date: Thu, 4 Feb 1999 19:01:16 EST
In a message dated 2/4/1999 2:21:07 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
xaos@*****.net writes:

> Okay, for those of you who are lucky enough to have New Seattle...what do
> you think? How does it compare with the original (both in terms of format
> and content). What sorts of changes are you noticing to specific locations?
> How are the art and maps?

A lot of nice things for the moment, especially the fact that my old screen
name is mentioned as providing a shadow-comment ... Airwisp ... Dvixen also
says something too ... gee that makes two or three for her now too ...

-Herc
Message no. 10
From: Dvixen dvixen@****.com
Subject: New Seattle
Date: Thu, 04 Feb 1999 17:01:58 -0800
At 07:01 PM 2/4/99 , Airwasp@***.com annoyed me by writing:
>In a message dated 2/4/1999 2:21:07 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
>xaos@*****.net writes:
>
>> Okay, for those of you who are lucky enough to have New Seattle...what do
>> you think? How does it compare with the original (both in terms of format
>> and content). What sorts of changes are you noticing to specific locations?
>> How are the art and maps?
>
>A lot of nice things for the moment, especially the fact that my old screen
>name is mentioned as providing a shadow-comment ... Airwisp ... Dvixen also
>says something too ... gee that makes two or three for her now too ...

Gee. Am I telling someone else to shut up?

;)

--
Dvixen - dvixen@********.com - dvixen@****.com
Herkimer's Lair - http://shadowrun.html.com/hlair
"What's your sign?" - "Trespassers will be shot."
Comments/Questions accepted, flames dropped into the abyss.
Message no. 11
From: Patrick Goodman remo@***.net
Subject: New Seattle
Date: Sun, 7 Feb 1999 10:07:46 -0600
Walking in late on this one, but it's been that sort of week....

From: XaOs [David Goth]
Sent: Thursday, February 04, 1999 1:17 AM

>Okay, for those of you who are lucky enough to have New Seattle...what
>do you think? How does it compare with the original (both in terms of
>format and content). What sorts of changes are you noticing to specific
>locations? How are the art and maps?

Haven't had much of a chance to look through it, though it did get put to
minor use last night. The layout and presentation are gorgeous, IMHO; the
content I've yet to really evaluate, but it seems to have a bit of meat on
it, unlike the GM screen. The art is good, the maps aren't as detailed as
they could be (Anders Swenson, I think it was, has already noted the lack of
a detailed map of Seattle proper, and no real way to determine where some of
the renamed streets are in the real world). Overall, though, at first blush
I'm quite satisfied. More details at a later time, if someone else hasn't
given a more detailed review by the time you get this.

--
(>) Texas 2-Step
El Paso: Never surrender. Never forget. Never forgive.
Message no. 12
From: Tony Rabiola rabiola@**.netcom.com
Subject: New Seattle
Date: Sat, 13 Feb 1999 22:25:20 -0600
Finally got ahold of it here, and on first skim looks very nice. I
like the layout and the details, without getting bogged down in
minutiae.

And my fixer/alter-ego Argent gets five shadow comments!

Thanx, Steve!

Tony Rabiola
rabiola@**.netcom.com
Fourth and Sixth World Adept
(still working on the Fifth)
Proud owner BABY #972
Message no. 13
From: Ereskanti@***.com Ereskanti@***.com
Subject: New Seattle
Date: Sun, 14 Feb 1999 14:01:11 EST
In a message dated 2/13/1999 11:26:26 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
rabiola@**.netcom.com writes:

>
> And my fixer/alter-ego Argent gets five shadow comments!
>
> Thanx, Steve!

Uhm, Tony, unless you have "Argent", the really nasty-assed street samurai now
in two novels, that ain't your guy...

-K
Message no. 14
From: Tony Rabiola rabiola@**.netcom.com
Subject: New Seattle
Date: Sun, 14 Feb 1999 15:54:21 -0600
>> And my fixer/alter-ego Argent gets five shadow comments!
>>
>> Thanx, Steve!
>
>Uhm, Tony, unless you have "Argent", the really nasty-assed street
samurai now
>in two novels, that ain't your guy...


True enough, but my Argent has been around since 1990, before that
obvious name-stealer appeared! I beleive shadow comments predate that
other Argent as well.

Tony Rabiola
rabiola@**.netcom.com
Fourth and Sixth World Adept
(still working on the Fifth)
Proud owner BABY #972
Message no. 15
From: Adam J adamj@*********.html.com
Subject: New Seattle
Date: Sun, 14 Feb 1999 20:28:28 -0700
At 14:01 2/14/99 -0500, Ereskanti@***.com wrote:

>Uhm, Tony, unless you have "Argent", the really nasty-assed street samurai
now
>in two novels, that ain't your guy...

He's in way more than two novels.. he made appearances in 3 of Nigel
Findley's, if not all 4... :-)

-Adam
Message no. 16
From: Mike and Jill Johnson shadowrn@*******.micron.net
Subject: New Seattle
Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 11:39:15 -0700
At 02:35 PM 2/4/99 -0500, you wrote:

Okay just 2 questions. Where did you get it? My local game store keeps
telling me its not yet available. And What new list? Did I miss something?

Michael Johnson

> I just posted in the another thread (on the other list, I
>think) about this... I thought it was pretty good. Not the best I've
>seen out of FASA, but that's mainly because it's a revision of an old
>book and not entirely new material, and because I'm an SR junkie who's
>got all of the old books it summarizes.
>
Message no. 17
From: Paul Gettle RunnerPaul@*****.com
Subject: New Seattle
Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 14:21:14 -0500
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

At 11:39 AM 2/15/99 -0700, Mike and Jill Johnson wrote:
>Okay just 2 questions. Where did you get it? My local game store
keeps
>telling me its not yet available.

Tell your local game store that it most certainly is available. I'm
sure at least a few list members can tell you that they got their copy
from their local stores, and I saw a copy at one of my own local
stores. Over the weekend, Borders.com just sent me an email
notification that they had just shipped my copy of it out.

FASA's web page lists it as in stock, and both Amazon.com and
BarnesAndNoble.com also list it as being in stock.

I'd ask your local game store just who told them that it's not yet
available. I'd suspect it's their distributer. Your local store
probably needs to have a long talk with their distributer about
keeping current with what's available and what's not, especially
seeing as how it's so easy for someone to order books online now. I
doubt your local store would like to lose a sale, but if it's their
position that a book isn't available when it actually is, then it's
their own fault.




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--
-- Paul Gettle, #970 of 1000 (RunnerPaul@*****.com)
PGP Fingerprint, Key ID:0x48F3AACD (RSA 1024, created 98/06/26)
C260 94B3 6722 6A25 63F8 0690 9EA2 3344
Message no. 18
From: Ratinac, Rand (NSW) RRatinac@*****.redcross.org.au
Subject: New Seattle
Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 11:06:38 +1000
> In a message dated 2/13/1999 11:26:26 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
> rabiola@**.netcom.com writes:
>
> > And my fixer/alter-ego Argent gets five shadow comments!
> >
> > Thanx, Steve!
>
> Uhm, Tony, unless you have "Argent", the really nasty-assed street
> samurai now in two novels, that ain't your guy...
>
> -K
>
>
Errr, K...

That's FOUR novels, off-hand.

Argent has a bit role in Shadowplay, a guest-starring role in 2XS, a
supporting role in Lone Wolf and is the star of Run Hard, Die Fast. I
don't THINK he pops up in House of the Sun - but it's been a while since
I read that one.

*Doc' wonders why a guy with BLACK cyberarms is called 'Silver'...*

Doc'

.sig Sauer
Message no. 19
From: Ratinac, Rand (NSW) RRatinac@*****.redcross.org.au
Subject: New Seattle
Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 15:23:55 +1000
> At 14:01 2/14/99 -0500, Ereskanti@***.com wrote:
>
> >Uhm, Tony, unless you have "Argent", the really nasty-assed street
> samurai now
> >in two novels, that ain't your guy...
>
> He's in way more than two novels.. he made appearances in 3 of Nigel
> Findley's, if not all 4... :-)
>
> -Adam
>
>
Feel free to forward this to the list, Adam, if you like - I don't think
I'm getting through...again...

That's four novels, off-hand.

Argent has a bit role in Shadowplay, a guest-starring role in 2XS, a
supporting role in Lone Wolf and is the star of Run Hard, Die Fast. I
don't THINK he pops up in House of the Sun - but it's been a while since
I read that one.

*Doc' wonders why a guy with BLACK cyberarms is called 'Silver'...*

Doc'

.sig Sauer
Message no. 20
From: Tony Rabiola rabiola@**.netcom.com
Subject: New Seattle
Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 02:23:44 -0600
>*Doc' wonders why a guy with BLACK cyberarms is called 'Silver'...*
>


Just cause it's such a cool handle, Doc...

Tony Rabiola
rabiola@**.netcom.com
Fourth and Sixth World Adept
(still working on the Fifth)
Proud owner BABY #972
Message no. 21
From: Rand Ratinac docwagon101@*****.com
Subject: New Seattle
Date: Mon, 28 Jun 1999 21:34:49 -0700 (PDT)
Well, I'm finally getting through the "To Read" pile that sits beside
by bed (it's about a foot, foot and a half thick now :) ) and I've
gotten on to New Seattle. Funny thing is, I was reading Lone Star just
before that and I decided to check the new cop stats against the old
cop stats.

What I found is that, apart from skills, the old cops stats were pretty
much lifted straight from Lone Star and dumped into New Seattle. Now,
this isn't all that bad (although I would've liked stats more in line
with the newer, bigger stats in SR3)...until you get to the mage-cop.

What they've done there is to drag the spells, magical items and their
effects straight across from Lone Star, forgetting that certain spells
don't work the same in SR3 as they did in SR2.

Wanna know what's really funny? The spell effects as given in Lone Star
were wrong in the first place anyway!!!

Fer shame, Steve!

*Doc' tuts reprovingly. "You really should do better. After all, it's
not like I make tose kins of Miss Takes."
==Doc'
(aka Mr. Freaky Big, Super-Dynamic Troll of Tomorrow)

.sig Sauer
_________________________________________________________
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Get your free @*****.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
Message no. 22
From: Mik Williams legion@******.net.au
Subject: New Seattle
Date: Thu, 2 Sep 1999 13:05:20 +1000
any one else think New Seattle lack as much info as Old Seattle??

Legion

legion@******.net.au
micheal.williams@***********.newcastle.edu.au
URL : http://welcome.to/hangfires.home
ICQ : 15142762
Message no. 23
From: Schizi@***.com Schizi@***.com
Subject: New Seattle
Date: Thu, 2 Sep 1999 19:46:37 EDT
In a message dated 9/1/99 11:05:04 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
legion@******.net.au writes:

> any one else think New Seattle lack as much info as Old Seattle??
myself, since I already have Seattle, I like the additional info inclosed in
those Hallowed pages :-)
AS Jon said once, his section on Military and Fort <whatever> was a lot of
new material, very nice info indeed.
The new material on politics was nice.
A lot of the history was just a compilation <shrug>

All in all, very nice, but it does not make obselete the original. In
addition, those many detailed descriptions in Seattle, were one of thopse
things they wanted to scale back.

Further Reading

If you enjoyed reading about New Seattle, you may also be interested in:

Disclaimer

These messages were posted a long time ago on a mailing list far, far away. The copyright to their contents probably lies with the original authors of the individual messages, but since they were published in an electronic forum that anyone could subscribe to, and the logs were available to subscribers and most likely non-subscribers as well, it's felt that re-publishing them here is a kind of public service.

Thwap!