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Message no. 1
From: Matthew Diederich <matthew@****.BAKA.COM>
Subject: New Topic: (Dive for cover boys and girls): HMHVV.
Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 14:57:08 -0500
Okay, here goes. First, a caveat. While I love this list while I love my
Macintosh, it does tend to give me information overload. So, please
respond to my personal e-mail address if you have any comments. Or at
least carbon copy me. Otherwise I may lose your valuable input. Now, with
that said...


The latest saga in Matt's game goes something like this:

I managed to get the two female players in my game to settle into their
street sams. Alright. Edged them away from the 'cold heartless killer'
stereotype and injected some humanity into the game. Good so far. The
friend who is playing a Shaman (brand new to SR) was awarded a copy of my
Awakenings sourcebook and given a rundown on the magic system, as well as
some key paperbacks I've found that - while not canon - provide a good
understanding of magic in the SR universe, particularly shamanism.

So, onward! Life is good. Switched everyone to SR3, and life is beautiful.
But, I made an error. After ten years of playing this game, I finally have
to admit I may be in over my head:

I infected the two street sams with HMHVV. Now, granted, I (duck everyone
- you've heard this before) had good intentions. It was my -intent- to
give them a harsh injection of humanity. Let me realize what kind of
nasties were out there.

However, like all good things - it backfired. Now the PCs are physically
enhanced, and have almost even convinced the Shaman (who, to his credit
and roleplaying skill, is not just flipping over for the fact that his two
running buddies are Essence sucking fiends)


Now, as I'm sure we all know, the hard data on this virus is sketchy at
best. Here is what I know, of the basics:

It's a virus. I played it off as being blood borne.

You get all the powers listed in the Critters section.

Setbacks:

You need to breathe. IF you can't, you go into a form of statis.
+3 TN to resist drowning/bouyancy.
Weakness vs wooden weapons.
And Essence loss, you have to feed.

Now, I play it off as thus - you lose a point of Essence a day, or double
that, depending on how much exertion you place on your new body. At two
essence, you grow feral, at one you are positively animalistic.

Furthermore, your aura is READILY apparently to anyone that has the
ability to see it. Granted, they may not recognize you for what you are,
but it is patently obvious that you are Not Nice <tm>. The description I
gave to the shaman was looking at them, and at their aura, gave him a
severe case of the chills, and he had to hold off my his instinctive
'fight or flight' reaction.

I also made them dual natured, but they CANNOT see into the astral. They
can, however, perceive the relative Essence levels in their targets.

Now. What I need from you guys is subtle ways (beyond the obvious mages
hunting them) to steer these two into WANTING to find a cure for their
affliction.


Please pardon me if any of my details are off, the critter stats/etc I am
quoting from memory.

Matt.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Beta's Rules Of Living:
35. Better living through denial.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Message no. 2
From: Seraph <seraph4plm@*********.NET>
Subject: Re: New Topic: (Dive for cover boys and girls): HMHVV.
Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 11:18:55 -0800
----- Original Message -----
From: Matthew Diederich <matthew@****.BAKA.COM>
To: <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sent: Friday, January 15, 1999 11:57 AM
Subject: New Topic: (Dive for cover boys and girls): HMHVV.


>Okay, here goes. First, a caveat. While I love this list while I love my
>Macintosh, it does tend to give me information overload. So, please
>respond to my personal e-mail address if you have any comments. Or at
>least carbon copy me. Otherwise I may lose your valuable input. Now, with
>that said...
>
>
>The latest saga in Matt's game goes something like this:
>
>I managed to get the two female players in my game to settle into their
>street sams. Alright. Edged them away from the 'cold heartless killer'
>stereotype and injected some humanity into the game. Good so far. The
>friend who is playing a Shaman (brand new to SR) was awarded a copy of my
>Awakenings sourcebook and given a rundown on the magic system, as well as
>some key paperbacks I've found that - while not canon - provide a good
>understanding of magic in the SR universe, particularly shamanism.
>
>So, onward! Life is good. Switched everyone to SR3, and life is beautiful.
>But, I made an error. After ten years of playing this game, I finally have
>to admit I may be in over my head:
>
>I infected the two street sams with HMHVV. Now, granted, I (duck everyone
>- you've heard this before) had good intentions. It was my -intent- to
>give them a harsh injection of humanity. Let me realize what kind of
>nasties were out there.
>
>However, like all good things - it backfired. Now the PCs are physically
>enhanced, and have almost even convinced the Shaman (who, to his credit
>and roleplaying skill, is not just flipping over for the fact that his two
>running buddies are Essence sucking fiends)
>
>
>Now, as I'm sure we all know, the hard data on this virus is sketchy at
>best. Here is what I know, of the basics:
>
>It's a virus. I played it off as being blood borne.
>
>You get all the powers listed in the Critters section.
>
>Setbacks:
>
>You need to breathe. IF you can't, you go into a form of statis.
>+3 TN to resist drowning/bouyancy.
>Weakness vs wooden weapons.
>And Essence loss, you have to feed.
>
>Now, I play it off as thus - you lose a point of Essence a day, or double
>that, depending on how much exertion you place on your new body. At two
>essence, you grow feral, at one you are positively animalistic.
>
>Furthermore, your aura is READILY apparently to anyone that has the
>ability to see it. Granted, they may not recognize you for what you are,
>but it is patently obvious that you are Not Nice <tm>. The description I
>gave to the shaman was looking at them, and at their aura, gave him a
>severe case of the chills, and he had to hold off my his instinctive
>'fight or flight' reaction.
>
>I also made them dual natured, but they CANNOT see into the astral. They
>can, however, perceive the relative Essence levels in their targets.
>
>Now. What I need from you guys is subtle ways (beyond the obvious mages
>hunting them) to steer these two into WANTING to find a cure for their
>affliction.
>
>
>Please pardon me if any of my details are off, the critter stats/etc I am
>quoting from memory.
>
>Matt.
>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
-=-=
>Beta's Rules Of Living:
>35. Better living through denial.
>-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
=-=-
>


If it was my PC you would have to kill him to get me to play another. I love
vampires, even with the crappy Shadowrun rules for them. We usually change
em.
But for a suggestion to get em to want to be cured(which I wouldnt make
possible): Make the Blood Lust hit every time they smell blood. Have a roll
for willpower each time with a target # varying by how low their essence is
and how much blood is spilled on the floor.
An example: they are at essence 12 and they have several bleeding bodies
lying around. Give a willpower 4 test or they take a bite out of the nearest
living but bloody person.
You could also make it cost essence to regenerate, say 1 point every 10
boxes. That could drop them into the feral stage quick.
Message no. 3
From: David Buehrer <dbuehrer@******.CARL.ORG>
Subject: Re: New Topic: (Dive for cover boys and girls): HMHVV.
Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 12:59:45 -0700
For the mere cost of a Thaum, Matthew Diederich wrote:
/
/ I infected the two street sams with HMHVV. Now, granted, I (duck everyone
/ - you've heard this before) had good intentions. It was my -intent- to
/ give them a harsh injection of humanity. Let me realize what kind of
/ nasties were out there.
/
/ However, like all good things - it backfired. Now the PCs are physically
/ enhanced, and have almost even convinced the Shaman (who, to his credit
/ and roleplaying skill, is not just flipping over for the fact that his two
/ running buddies are Essence sucking fiends)

/ Now. What I need from you guys is subtle ways (beyond the obvious mages
/ hunting them) to steer these two into WANTING to find a cure for their
/ affliction.

You could go the V:tG route and subject them to the politics of more
powerful vampires or beings that are trying to control/enslave them.
They find out that if they're cured the Vampires will A) be unable to
control them and B) won't care to try anymore.

They find out Blade is in town <EG>. (If you don't know what I'm
talking about see the movie of the same name with Wesley Snipes.)
Blade doesn't negotiate with vampires so their only option is to get
themselves cured. If they move, Blade shows up again.

Have them lose it and suck a few contacts dry. After losing enough
contacts and friends they will probably decide on their own that being
a vampire isn't all it's cracked up to be and start looking for a
cure.

Now that they've got HMHVV they're susceptible to a disease that isn't
so nice. Perhaps during a run they retrieve a biological cocktail for
Mr. Johnson. Then they hear rumors that vampires are falling prey to
some sort of disease. Through the rumor mill they discover that the
cocktail they retrieved was a flawed antivirus for HMHVV (it kills the
host too) that Mr. Johnson used to tailor an airborne virus to kill
vampires (cuz vampires killed his wife and two kids). They have two
options: go see the creators of the original antivirus, or track down
Mr. Johnson. Then you can present them with the option of being cured
(used as experimental subjects by the lab, or if they can talk Mr.
Johnson into believing that they're "good" vampires he will cure them
of the HMHVV). In either case a band of vampires attacks while the PCs
are recovering and destroy the lab or kill Mr. Johnson, so the cure is
a one time deal.

-David B.
--
"Earn what you have been given."
--
email: dbuehrer@******.carl.org
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1068/homepage.htm
Message no. 4
From: Chris Maxfield <cmaxfiel@****.ORG.AU>
Subject: Re: New Topic: (Dive for cover boys and girls): HMHVV.
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 13:47:27 +1100
At 14:57 15/01/99 -0500, Matthew Diederich wrote:
>
>Now. What I need from you guys is subtle ways (beyond the obvious mages
>hunting them) to steer these two into WANTING to find a cure for their
>affliction.

Off the top of my head, here's some ideas (assuming they were originally
human), some subtle, some not:

1. If they did not lose all of their cyber when they were transformed (the
cyber rejected by a now regenerating body), have them start to lose their
cyber each time they regenerate a wound. That is, a local piece of cyber is
ejected near each regenerating injury each time. Of course, the first time
they assumeGaseous Form, they'll lose the lot. Most Sams hate to lose their
chrome.

2. People sense/feel that there's something wrong and very dangerous about
them. Give them a penalty for all social tests. Further, have their
contacts, colleagues, friends, lovers and family become steadily more
distant until, finally, the Sams are rejected altogether by the people they
care about.

3. Have them make a Willpower roll each time they're in a stressful or
bloody situation. Add penalties for their wounding and, especially, for low
essence. If they fail, they go into berserk feeding frenzy. Once they FUBAR
a few runs because of this, they'll have problems getting anymore jobs.

4. As you say above, mages hunting them. How about a vampire mage - Martin
de Vries anyone?

5. Storyline out how they're slowly losing their souls, their sense of
self, as another monstrous nature starts to dominate their mind. Have them
feel less and less in control as, increasingly, the blood lust overwhelms
them. Make it clear that eventually their "selves" will be completely wiped
by this alien nature.

6. Surely there were hobbies/things they liked to do that were out under
the daylight? They can't do these things anymore. Make that point known
often and in a way that causes frustration and loss.

7. Someone finds out about their vampirism and they're blackmailed. Make it
bad.

8. The bounty-hunter network finds out about their vampirism and the hunt
is on. Jonty Geldenhuys anyone?

9. More storyline - they really, really (I mean really) hate the taste of
(meta)human blood/flesh.

10. Pride. This can be a powerful motivation. Some people would be too
proud to not fight the obscene perversion of vampirism.






Chris Maxfield We are restless because of incessant
<cmaxfiel@****.org.au> change, but we would be frightened if
Canberra, Australia change were stopped.
Message no. 5
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: New Topic: (Dive for cover boys and girls): HMHVV.
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 11:49:37 +0100
According to Matthew Diederich, at 14:57 on 15 Jan 99, the word on
the street was...

> Okay, here goes. First, a caveat. While I love this list while I love my
> Macintosh, it does tend to give me information overload. So, please
> respond to my personal e-mail address if you have any comments. Or at
> least carbon copy me. Otherwise I may lose your valuable input. Now, with
> that said...

Done.

[HMHVV]
> Now, as I'm sure we all know, the hard data on this virus is sketchy at
> best. Here is what I know, of the basics:
>
> It's a virus. I played it off as being blood borne.

Good enough call, seeing that FASA never defined this.

> You get all the powers listed in the Critters section.
>
> Setbacks:
>
> You need to breathe. IF you can't, you go into a form of statis.
> +3 TN to resist drowning/bouyancy.
> Weakness vs wooden weapons.
> And Essence loss, you have to feed.

All true. Plus they're allergic to sunlight.

> Now, I play it off as thus - you lose a point of Essence a day, or double
> that, depending on how much exertion you place on your new body. At two
> essence, you grow feral, at one you are positively animalistic.

By the book, you lose 1 point of Essence a _month_ -- check the
description of the Essence Loss weakness in SRII, PANA, PAoE, Predator &
Prey, or the 3rd edition GM screen's Critters book.

I've always found this to be a ridiculously low rate -- it means vampires
would need to feed about two or three times a year... But a point a day
sounds just a bit too much to me, for some reason.

> Furthermore, your aura is READILY apparently to anyone that has the
> ability to see it. Granted, they may not recognize you for what you are,
> but it is patently obvious that you are Not Nice <tm>.

It should be immediately obvious that you're not human even though you
look like one physically, yes.

> I also made them dual natured, but they CANNOT see into the astral. They
> can, however, perceive the relative Essence levels in their targets.

Vampies are not dual-natured according to Critters. Also, if you say
they're dual-natured, I feel you have to have a damn good explanation for
why they DON'T get astral perception -- it's one of the basic things all
dual-natured critters have...

> Now. What I need from you guys is subtle ways (beyond the obvious mages
> hunting them) to steer these two into WANTING to find a cure for their
> affliction.

Play up the disadvantages: going out during the day? Better buy good sun
tan lotion. Any magicians they know will find something odd about them as
soon as they assense them, and _will_ tell their friends about it. Thus,
people they thought were friends leave these PCs to fend for themselves.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
And that's as far as the conversation went.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
->The Plastic Warriors Page: http://shadowrun.html.com/plasticwarriors/<-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 6
From: Paul Gettle <RunnerPaul@*****.COM>
Subject: Re: New Topic: (Dive for cover boys and girls): HMHVV.
Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 22:08:51 -0500
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

At 12:59 PM 1/15/99 -0700, David B. wrote:
>You could go the V:tG route <<snip rest>>

I have to ask. V:tG? What's the G stand for? :)

Yes, I know you're actually talking about White Wolf's Vampire: The
Masquerade, but it's usually abreviated V:tM. (If I had to guess,
either you accidently mixed up Magic: The Gathering with V:tM, or you
were thinking Vampire: the Game.)

:)


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--
-- Paul Gettle, #970 of 1000 (RunnerPaul@*****.com)
PGP Fingerprint, Key ID:0x48F3AACD (RSA 1024, created 98/06/26)
C260 94B3 6722 6A25 63F8 0690 9EA2 3344
Message no. 7
From: Nexx Many-Scars <nexx@********.NET>
Subject: Re: New Topic: (Dive for cover boys and girls): HMHVV.
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 11:56:22 -0600
----------
> From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
>
> > Now, I play it off as thus - you lose a point of Essence a day, or
double
> > that, depending on how much exertion you place on your new body. At
two
> > essence, you grow feral, at one you are positively animalistic.
>
> By the book, you lose 1 point of Essence a _month_ -- check the
> description of the Essence Loss weakness in SRII, PANA, PAoE, Predator &
> Prey, or the 3rd edition GM screen's Critters book.
>
> I've always found this to be a ridiculously low rate -- it means
vampires
> would need to feed about two or three times a year... But a point a day
> sounds just a bit too much to me, for some reason.

Well, then, how about something else? A human can live about 2 weeks
without food, if he feels like pushing himself and has plenty of water.
Humans can last about 3 days without water. Average that out to about 10
days between feedings, though that's if they push hard... they prefer
closer to 5 or six. Sound good?

*****
Nexx Many-Scars
aka Mark Hall
*
I used to say I was in a dry spell, but that's before I realized I didn't
have a clue as to what rain was.
Message no. 8
From: David Buehrer <dbuehrer@******.CARL.ORG>
Subject: Re: New Topic: (Dive for cover boys and girls): HMHVV.
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 1999 08:01:49 -0700
For the mere cost of a Thaum, Paul Gettle wrote:
/
/ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
/
/ At 12:59 PM 1/15/99 -0700, David B. wrote:
/ >You could go the V:tG route <<snip rest>>
/
/ I have to ask. V:tG? What's the G stand for? :)
/
/ Yes, I know you're actually talking about White Wolf's Vampire: The
/ Masquerade, but it's usually abreviated V:tM. (If I had to guess,
/ either you accidently mixed up Magic: The Gathering with V:tM, or you
/ were thinking Vampire: the Game.)
/
/ :)

Okay, so I haven't played V:tM in several years and I play *way* to
much M:tG ;)

-David B.
--
"Earn what you have been given."
--
email: dbuehrer@******.carl.org
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1068/homepage.htm
Message no. 9
From: Paul Gettle <RunnerPaul@*****.COM>
Subject: Re: New Topic: (Dive for cover boys and girls): HMHVV.
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 1999 10:42:36 -0500
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

At 08:01 AM 1/18/99 -0700, David B. wrote:
>/ >You could go the V:tG route <<snip rest>>
>/
>/ I have to ask. V:tG? What's the G stand for? :)

>Okay, so I haven't played V:tM in several years and I play *way* to
>much M:tG ;)

Of _course_ you play way too much M:tG. Wizards of the Coast planned
it that way. At the factory, each card is dusted with a highly
addictive psychotropic powder, that is absorbed through skin contact.
This is why new magic cards feel and smell different from old magic
cards; the powder has worn off of the older cards, and doesn't give
the same mood altering effect anymore.

This was also why magic cards were printed in Belgium for the first
few years (up until the Mirage set), it took WotC that long to get the
proper licenses and FDA aproval to be able to dust the cards in this
country too.

This is also why they switched to foil wrappers after the first few
sets, because the foil keeps the powder fresh for longer periods of
time. (If you'll notice, Fallen Empires, the last set to be packaged
in the older style white plastic wrappers, can still be found on store
shelves in large quantities. This is because the powdered addicting
agent had lost its potency, and the cards no longer provide the
required "fix".)


:)



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--
-- Paul Gettle, #970 of 1000 (RunnerPaul@*****.com)
PGP Fingerprint, Key ID:0x48F3AACD (RSA 1024, created 98/06/26)
C260 94B3 6722 6A25 63F8 0690 9EA2 3344
Message no. 10
From: David Buehrer <dbuehrer@******.CARL.ORG>
Subject: Re: New Topic: (Dive for cover boys and girls): HMHVV.
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 1999 10:36:40 -0700
For the mere cost of a Thaum, Paul Gettle wrote:
/
/ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
/
/ At 08:01 AM 1/18/99 -0700, David B. wrote:
/ >/ >You could go the V:tG route <<snip rest>>
/ >/
/ >/ I have to ask. V:tG? What's the G stand for? :)
/
/ >Okay, so I haven't played V:tM in several years and I play *way* to
/ >much M:tG ;)
/
/ Of _course_ you play way too much M:tG. Wizards of the Coast planned
/ it that way. At the factory, each card is dusted with a highly
/ addictive psychotropic powder, that is absorbed through skin contact.
/ This is why new magic cards feel and smell different from old magic
/ cards; the powder has worn off of the older cards, and doesn't give
/ the same mood altering effect anymore.

This powder, like new car smell, clean linen smell, and cute toy look,
is allowed by the government because something is needed to conteract
the addictive cocain present in 90% of the bills in circulation.
Otherwise the addictive quality of the cocain would prevent people from
spending money (and in fact would encourage hording) and would cripple
the economy.

:)

-David B.
--
"Earn what you have been given."
--
email: dbuehrer@******.carl.org
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1068/homepage.htm

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