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Message no. 1
From: "Jason Carter, Nightstalker" <CARTER@***.EDU>
Subject: Nightstalker Scores!
Date: Fri, 29 Jul 1994 23:29:28 -0700
He shoots! He scores! 2 points for the Nightstalker.

More seriously, I'm glad we can start seeing things from the other's viewpoint
Ivy. But remember that the SRII rules are far from flawless, despite the vast
improvement over SRI. Contradictions and lack of clarification run wildly
through the rulebooks. Still, given all of that, there is only one big flaw
in Shadowrun.

THE SEARCH FOR SIXES!

Definition - The tendency from most critical, and often less than critical
events to be decided on the bases of whether or not the player can get enough
sixes on a Test.

Examples:
Shooting at someone with cover
Most test in the Matrix (or at least the ones that count)
Resisting damage after being shot with APDS ammo
Resisting damage after being punched by a Ork or Troll Sammi
Need I go on?

*******************************************************************************
* See Ya in Shadows * * "Trust No One." *
* Jason J Carter * Carter@***.EDU * The late Deep Throat *
* The Nightstalker * * The X-Files *
*******************************************************************************
Message no. 2
From: Mercenary X <kdye@*****.STANFORD.EDU>
Subject: Re: Nightstalker Scores!
Date: Sat, 30 Jul 1994 09:11:58 -0700
On Fri, 29 Jul 1994, Jason Carter, Nightstalker wrote:

> THE SEARCH FOR SIXES!
>
> Definition - The tendency from most critical, and often less than critical
> events to be decided on the bases of whether or not the player can get enough
> sixes on a Test.
>
> Examples:
> Shooting at someone with cover
> Most test in the Matrix (or at least the ones that count)
> Resisting damage after being shot with APDS ammo
> Resisting damage after being punched by a Ork or Troll Sammi
> Need I go on?
>

No, I see. I once played a campaign using d10's for tests,
worked good. If you roll a ten you roll again, if you roll a one its
very bad.....

Try it sometime.

MercenaryX
Message no. 3
From: Ivy Ryan <ivyryan@***.ORG>
Subject: Re: Nightstalker Scores!
Date: Sat, 30 Jul 1994 10:37:43 -0700
Yep, you got one in that time. But actually,

On Fri, 29 Jul 1994, Jason Carter, Nightstalker wrote:

> He shoots! He scores! 2 points for the Nightstalker.
>
> More seriously, I'm glad we can start seeing things from the other's viewpoint
> Ivy. But remember that the SRII rules are far from flawless, despite the vast
> improvement over SRI. Contradictions and lack of clarification run wildly
> through the rulebooks. Still, given all of that, there is only one big flaw
> in Shadowrun.
>
> THE SEARCH FOR SIXES!
>
> Definition - The tendency from most critical, and often less than critical
> events to be decided on the bases of whether or not the player can get enough
> sixes on a Test.
>
> Examples:
> Shooting at someone with cover
> Most test in the Matrix (or at least the ones that count)
> Resisting damage after being shot with APDS ammo
> Resisting damage after being punched by a Ork or Troll Sammi
> Need I go on?

I really LIKE the way the odds work in this game. Your "Search for 6s"
is my idea of perfection. As things get harder to do, and the odds drop
of success, the number of 6s necessary goes up. This works so well in my
eyes that I am sometimes boggled that they got it so perfectly on only
the second try.

Wenh things _should_ be hard, in SRII they actually _are_ hard. No other
game comes close. Funny that the part I like best is the part you don't
like...

Ivy
Message no. 4
From: Joseph Cotton <Joseph.Cotton@*******.OIT.UNC.EDU>
Subject: Re: Nightstalker Scores!
Date: Sun, 31 Jul 1994 02:10:52 EDT
On Sat 30 Jul 1994, Ivy Ryan wrote:

> On Fri, 29 Jul 1994, Jason Carter, Nightstalker wrote:
> >
> > THE SEARCH FOR SIXES!
> >
>
> I really LIKE the way the odds work in this game. Your "Search for 6s"
> is my idea of perfection. As things get harder to do, and the odds drop
> of success, the number of 6s necessary goes up. This works so well in my
> eyes that I am sometimes boggled that they got it so perfectly on only
> the second try.

As much as I hate to admit it :), I have to agree with Ivy in this
case. I think 'the rule of 6' or 'bonus dice' (for you ED players out
there) work much better than the critical successes of other games,
like those based on 3D6 rolls. Although I still prefer the house rule
of 'reroll on 5 or 6, and add 4', to avoid that annoying feature that
makes a TN of 7 equivalent to a TN of 6 (or 12 and 13, or...).

Joe Cotton
Joseph.Cotton@*********.unc.edu
Message no. 5
From: "Jason Carter, Nightstalker" <CARTER@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Nightstalker Scores!
Date: Sun, 31 Jul 1994 02:05:44 -0700
Joe Cotton says:

>As much as I hate to admit it :), I have to agree with Ivy in this
>case. I think 'the rule of 6' or 'bonus dice' (for you ED players out
>there) work much better than the critical successes of other games,
>like those based on 3D6 rolls. Although I still prefer the house rule
>of 'reroll on 5 or 6, and add 4', to avoid that annoying feature that
>makes a TN of 7 equivalent to a TN of 6 (or 12 and 13, or...).

I other words, Joe, you agree with me. I say this because the house rule you
perfer destroyes the Search for Sixes. I also alters the percentage change
of achieving all target numbers of 6 for better. Look below to see how.

Roll Normal System Your System
1 100% 100%
2 83% 83%
3 66% 66%
4 50% 50%
5 33% 33%
6 17% 27%
7 17% 22%
8 14% 17%
9 11% 11%
10 8% 9%
11 6% 7%
12 3% 6%
13 3% 4%

Ironically, this makes rolling a 6-8 markedly easier, but has litle effect
on rolls of 9 or better. Maybe it would be easier to use an eight-sided die
with a rule of eights :)

*******************************************************************************
* See Ya in Shadows * * "Trust No One." *
* Jason J Carter * Carter@***.EDU * The late Deep Throat *
* The Nightstalker * * The X-Files *
*******************************************************************************
Message no. 6
From: Joseph Cotton <Joseph.Cotton@*******.OIT.UNC.EDU>
Subject: Re: Nightstalker Scores!
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 09:48:10 EDT
On Sun 31 Jul 1994, Jason Carter wrote:

> Joe Cotton says:
>
> >As much as I hate to admit it :), I have to agree with Ivy in this
> >case. I think 'the rule of 6' or 'bonus dice' (for you ED players out
> >there) work much better than the critical successes of other games,
> >like those based on 3D6 rolls. Although I still prefer the house rule
> >of 'reroll on 5 or 6, and add 4', to avoid that annoying feature that
> >makes a TN of 7 equivalent to a TN of 6 (or 12 and 13, or...).
>
> I other words, Joe, you agree with me. I say this because the house rule you
> perfer destroyes the Search for Sixes. I also alters the percentage change
> of achieving all target numbers of 6 for better. Look below to see how.
>

Hurm. Perhaps I misunderstood your point. I was under the impression
that you were saying that you didn't like having increasing target numbers,
as opposed to say, GURPS, where your 'target number' gets _lower_ as
your odds increase. Yes, I agree that the house rule I quoted above
changes the odds of achieving higher TNs - did I not say that myself?
But yes, I suppose it does stop 'the search for sixes', and substitutes
'the search for fives and sixes' in its place. :)

Joe
Joseph.Cotton@*********.unc.edu

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