Back to the main page

Mailing List Logs for ShadowRN

Message no. 1
From: Gweedo The Killer Pimp <yawas@****.COM>
Subject: One simple question
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 1997 19:27:33 -0500
Hey,

I gots a question for you's peoples. Which would rather have in
a roleplaying group (any group, not just SR.), a rules lawyer, or a
munchkin? I know munchkind get harped on a lot, but nobody ever talks
about those people who will slow down a game to a standstill, just so the
rules will be followed to the letter, and not the spirit. I wouldn't say
anything about it if I just didn't come back from walking away from a
game because of one player who wouldn't let the GM fudge something, like
dodging a fist. Oh yeah, I exclude nobody from this question.

"Here we go" -- Gweedo the Killer Pimp right before a run.
Message no. 2
From: Shaun Hall <Hard.master@********.ATT.NET>
Subject: Re: One simple question
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 1997 18:35:12 -0700
I gots a question for you's peoples. Which would rather have in
: a roleplaying group (any group, not just SR.), a rules lawyer, or a
: munchkin? I know munchkind get harped on a lot, but nobody ever talks
: about those people who will slow down a game to a standstill, just so the
: rules will be followed to the letter, and not the spirit. I wouldn't say
: anything about it if I just didn't come back from walking away from a
: game because of one player who wouldn't let the GM fudge something, like
: dodging a fist. Oh yeah, I exclude nobody from this question.
:
:
Tough call, but I'd have to say I'd rather have a rules lawyer. You can
break rules lawyers of their bad habits by pointing out that the rules are
just a guideline, use of house rules, and a bit of consistency. The GM has
to buy into the rules lawyer's bad habit for it to work. If he doesn't then
the rules lawyer has nowhere to go with his more annoying questions.
Although it might be possible to train a munchkin away from his bad
habits, it isn't easy. In addition there is no guarantee that he will not
regress (trust me on this). The real problem with a munchkin is that they
are only interested in the most primitive sort of game. If you manage to
give them what they want they will eventually grow bored with the game and
it will die. Barring that YOU will grow bored with the game and that will
kill it even faster.
Message no. 3
From: Fade <runefo@***.UIO.NO>
Subject: Re: One simple question
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 1997 03:32:07 +0000
Gweedo wrote:
> I gots a question for you's peoples. Which would rather have in
> a roleplaying group (any group, not just SR.), a rules lawyer, or a
> munchkin? I know munchkind get harped on a lot, but nobody ever talks
> about those people who will slow down a game to a standstill, just so the
> rules will be followed to the letter, and not the spirit. I wouldn't say
> anything about it if I just didn't come back from walking away from a
> game because of one player who wouldn't let the GM fudge something, like
> dodging a fist. Oh yeah, I exclude nobody from this question.
>
> "Here we go" -- Gweedo the Killer Pimp right before a run.

Depends a bit actually.. :)

I'd say I'd prefer the rules lawyer.. you can tell him to shut up and
let's discuss that afterwards. That will ruin my day *after*
playing, while the munchkin will ruin mine - and the players' - day
*while* playing. The least sum of frustration will then be with the
lawyer.

Reminds me of a sig file...
"Why settle for the lesser of two evils? Vote CHUTULU for president!"

--
Fade

And the Prince of Lies said:
"To reign is worth ambition, though in Hell:
Better to reign in hell than to serve in heaven."
-John Milton, Paradise Lost
Message no. 4
From: Dave Repp <darepp@***.NET>
Subject: Re: One simple question
Date: Sun, 31 Aug 1997 18:46:21 -0700
Gweedo The Killer Pimp wrote:
>
> Hey,
>
> I gots a question for you's peoples. Which would rather have in
> a roleplaying group (any group, not just SR.), a rules lawyer, or a
> munchkin? I know munchkind get harped on a lot, but nobody ever talks
> about those people who will slow down a game to a standstill, just so the
> rules will be followed to the letter, and not the spirit. I wouldn't say
> anything about it if I just didn't come back from walking away from a
> game because of one player who wouldn't let the GM fudge something, like
> dodging a fist. Oh yeah, I exclude nobody from this question.
>
> "Here we go" -- Gweedo the Killer Pimp right before a run.

Why put up with either (unless they are related to you, then you have
to). I'm all for developing rookies into players, but I run out of
patience with those who detract from the game after a realistic learning
period.
Message no. 5
From: James Lindsay <jlindsay@******.CA>
Subject: Re: One simple question
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 1997 07:10:16 GMT
On Wed, 3 Sep 1997 19:27:33 -0500, Gweedo The Killer Pimp wrote:

> Hey,
>
> I gots a question for you's peoples. Which would rather have in
> a roleplaying group (any group, not just SR.), a rules lawyer, or a
> munchkin? I know munchkind get harped on a lot, but nobody ever talks
> about those people who will slow down a game to a standstill, just so the
> rules will be followed to the letter, and not the spirit. I wouldn't say
> anything about it if I just didn't come back from walking away from a
> game because of one player who wouldn't let the GM fudge something, like
> dodging a fist. Oh yeah, I exclude nobody from this question.

Since I am being "encouraged" to vote (ouch-- hey!), I'd rather have
to deal with a rules lawyer than a munchkin (assuming that the RL
isn't a munchkin him/herself).

RLs can usually be weaned away from a certain level of the rules by
simply saying before play even begins "we are using the basic rules
and maybe these two optional rules". If s/he doesn't like it, s/he
doesn't play.

Munchkins are only interested in building kick-ass characters for
combat sake-- they have nothing to offer during the actual roleplaying
stuff. If the RL is as disinterested in roleplaying as the munchkin,
however, I'd ax them both and hide the bodies.

James W. Lindsay Vancouver, British Columbia
"http://www.prosperoimaging.com/ground_zero";

"Give me the strength to change the things I can,
the grace to accept the things I cannot,
and a great big bag of money."
Message no. 6
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: One simple question
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 1997 11:35:02 +0100
Fade said on 3:32/ 4 Sep 97...

> Reminds me of a sig file...
> "Why settle for the lesser of two evils? Vote CHUTULU for president!"

IIRC that was the advertising slogan Chaosium used around the 1996
American elections, complete with bumper stickers and everything.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Well, I have no opinion about that, and I have no opinion about me...
-> NERPS Project Leader & Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version 3.1:
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE
Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
Message no. 7
From: niteGlo Messiah <levbar@*******.BERGEN.ORG>
Subject: Re: One simple question
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 1997 09:11:21 -0400
On Wed, 3 Sep 1997, Gweedo The Killer Pimp wrote:

> Hey,
>
> I gots a question for you's peoples. Which would rather have in
> a roleplaying group (any group, not just SR.), a rules lawyer, or a
> munchkin?

I think rules lawyers (although not any more pleasant) are easier to
control. You can just say "No, I don't do it that way". Players are not
supposed to refuse. They can quit, but who wants a player that quit
beacause the GM changed the rules?

Metal Phoenix
Message no. 8
From: "J. Keith Henry" <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: One simple question
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 1997 23:52:01 -0400
In a message dated 97-09-04 13:29:16 EDT, runefo@***.UIO.NO (Fade) writes:

> I'd say I'd prefer the rules lawyer.. you can tell him to shut up and
> let's discuss that afterwards. That will ruin my day *after*
> playing, while the munchkin will ruin mine - and the players' - day
> *while* playing. The least sum of frustration will then be with the
> lawyer.
>
OH geesh, all of the sudden your comment Rune makes sense in that letter.
You thought I was being a "rules lawyer"...oh my god, now this is one of
those days I -NEVER- thought I would see happen...

-K
Message no. 9
From: Stefan <casanova@***.PASSAGEN.SE>
Subject: Re: One simple question
Date: Fri, 5 Sep 1997 20:27:21 +0000
> Hey,
>
> I gots a question for you's peoples. Which would rather have in
> a roleplaying group (any group, not just SR.), a rules lawyer, or a
> munchkin? I know munchkind get harped on a lot, but nobody ever talks
> about those people who will slow down a game to a standstill, just so the
> rules will be followed to the letter, and not the spirit. I wouldn't say
> anything about it if I just didn't come back from walking away from a
> game because of one player who wouldn't let the GM fudge something, like
> dodging a fist. Oh yeah, I exclude nobody from this question.

This is like choose between two very borring and bad things but I
would rather have the "munchkin" than the "rules lawyer" since it is
nothing worse then as a GM all of a sudden being interupted by some
player saying that what I just did as the allmight GM is not correct
by the rules ... bad things happends to players like that ... :)

/Stefan

------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Frag you and the datastream you came on!" - Sinjin the decker
------------------------------------------------------------------------
... E-Mail .............................. casanova@***.passagen.se ...
... HomePage .................... http://hem.passagen.se/casanova/ ...
... ICQ .................................................. 1403212 ...
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 10
From: Mike Hartmann <Hartmann@***********.M.EUNET.DE>
Subject: Re: One simple question
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 1997 23:40:47 +0100
> Hey,
>
> I gots a question for you's peoples. Which would rather have in
> a roleplaying group (any group, not just SR.), a rules lawyer, or a
> munchkin? I know munchkind get harped on a lot, but nobody ever talks
> about those people who will slow down a game to a standstill, just so the
> rules will be followed to the letter, and not the spirit.

There is another type of that: the "reality"-lawyer.
Standard quotes:
"that doesn't make sense", "that is impossible, even in 2059"

bye mike

---
Download SRCG now:

http://www.fortunecity.com/tinpan/newreed/15/index.html
Message no. 11
From: Tobias Berghoff <Zixx@*****.TEUTO.DE>
Subject: Re: One simple question
Date: Sat, 6 Sep 1997 20:56:00 GMT
on 03.09.97 yawas@****.COM wrote:

y> Hey,
Ho!

y> I gots a question for you's peoples. Which would rather have in
y> a roleplaying group (any group, not just SR.), a rules lawyer, or a
y> munchkin? I know munchkind get harped on a lot, but nobody ever talks
y> about those people who will slow down a game to a standstill, just so the
y> rules will be followed to the letter, and not the spirit.

I'd take the lawyer. You can always tell them to shut up. I've never seen
a person who doesn't get it when *everybody* on the table offered a punch
to the face.



Tobias Berghoff a.k.a Zixx a.k.a. Charon, your friendly werepanther physad.

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK------------
GAT/CS/S/IT d--- s+:- !a>? C++(++++)
UL++(++++) P+ L++ E W+ N+(+++) o? K?(-)
w---() O- M-- V- PS+ PE- Y+>++ PGP-
t+(++) 5+ X++ R* tv b++ DI(+) D++ G>++
e>+++++(*) h! r-- z?
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK-------------

Further Reading

If you enjoyed reading about One simple question, you may also be interested in:

Disclaimer

These messages were posted a long time ago on a mailing list far, far away. The copyright to their contents probably lies with the original authors of the individual messages, but since they were published in an electronic forum that anyone could subscribe to, and the logs were available to subscribers and most likely non-subscribers as well, it's felt that re-publishing them here is a kind of public service.

Thwap!