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Message no. 1
From: "Victor Rodriguez, Jr" <sedahdro@*****.COM>
Subject: Optional Character creation system
Date: Tue, 8 Aug 1995 14:08:00 EST
The following is an optional character creation system that one of my GM's
used. I don't know if it has been posted anywhere, but if it has forgive
for the redundancy.
pts MAGIC ATTRIBUTES SKILLS TECH MAGIC&TECH RACE
40 Full 30 40 1mil 300k/50 ---
38 Para 28 38 800k 270k/50 ---
36 ---- 27 36 700k 240k/50 ---
34 ---- 26 34 600k 210k/50 ---
32 ---- 25 32 500k 180k/50 ---
30 Adept 24 30 400k 150k/50 Elf
28 ---- 23 28 300k 115k/40 Troll/Minotaur
27 ---- 22 27 150k 90k/35 Ork/Ogre
26 ---- 21 26 75k 55k/30 Dwarf
25 ---- 20 25 35k 35k/25 ---
24 ---- 20 24 20k 20k/20 ---
23 ---- 19 23 15k 15k/18 ---
22 ---- 19 22 8k 8k/16 ---
21 ---- 18 21 4k 4k/14 ---
20 ---- 17 20 1k 1k/14 ---
19 ---- 16 19 700 700/9 ---
18 ---- 15 18 400 400/7 ---
17 Mundane 14 17 100 100/5 human


Heres how it works. To create a character one has 134 pts. A minumum of 17
pts must be spent in each category, although no more than 40 pts can be
used. No you can't pick a category twice. In case you notice each pnt spent
in skills gives you one point to spend in skills. The "Para" category is
an optional category, left to GM's discretion. It is meant to be use for
those people who wish to play Paranormal characters, ie vampires,
shapeshifter, etc. By the way if you wondering how much points each thing
is worth it the number in the far left column. If your wondering why
different metahumans are worth more than others, it is because certain
metahumans have better advantages than others, both attribute-wise and
predudice toward-wise. Feel free to adapt this chart as you see fit.
Finally if you plan on playing a full blown Mage (those of you who like
mages) it is much better to use the book rules. The above system allows for
more diverse characters, at least thats what we figured.
Please tell me what you all think.
---Sedah Drol
Message no. 2
From: "Brian A. Stewart" <bstewart@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Optional Character creation system
Date: Tue, 8 Aug 1995 13:54:52 -0700
Sedah writes:

>30 Adept 24 30 400k 150k/50 Elf
>28 ---- 23 28 300k 115k/40 Troll/Minotaur
>27 ---- 22 27 150k 90k/35 Ork/Ogre
>26 ---- 21 26 75k 55k/30 Dwarf
____
How did you come up with the division of points for the races.
Just curious.

Brian
<Healing Touch> Curiosity killed the cat.
<Nurse Wratchet>Yes, but satisfaction brought her back.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Essence: It is a descending stream of pure activity which is the dynamic
force of the universe.
-Kabbalah (B.C.E.~1200-~700 A.C.E.)
*****************************************************************
"Nurse Wratchet": bstewart@***.uug.arizona.edu
or brian-stewart@**.arizona.edu
*****************************************************************
Message no. 3
From: "Victor Rodriguez, Jr" <sedahdro@*****.COM>
Subject: Re: Optional Character creation system
Date: Tue, 8 Aug 1995 22:39:00 EST
I wrote:

30 Adept 24 30 400k 150k/50 Elf
28 ---- 23 28 300k 115k/40 Troll/Minotaur
27 ---- 22 27 150k 90k/35 Ork/Ogre
26 ---- 21 26 75k 55k/30 Dwarf
____
>Brian wrote:
>How did you come up with the division of points for the races.
>Just curious.
>
Funny you should ask, 'cause I ask my old GM the same thing. He told me
Elfs are worth more because out of all the metahuman races they are
precjudiced against less by humans. Although Trolls and Ork are prejudiced
a lot by
humans and elves they get better skill bonuses. Dwarfs because they are
small are prejudiced against most often, plus their bonuses aren't all that
great. Does it make any sense.
---Sedah Drol
Message no. 4
From: Damion Milliken <adm82@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Optional Character creation system
Date: Wed, 9 Aug 1995 18:31:38 +1000
Victor Rodriguez, Jr writes:

> Funny you should ask, 'cause I ask my old GM the same thing. He told me
> Elfs are worth more because out of all the metahuman races they are
> precjudiced against less by humans. Although Trolls and Ork are prejudiced
> a lot by
> humans and elves they get better skill bonuses. Dwarfs because they are
> small are prejudiced against most often, plus their bonuses aren't all that
> great. Does it make any sense.

Too a degree. But I don't really agree myself. All metahumans, as Rat often
tells us, have an overall bonus of +3 Attribute points. Obviously the
difference is _where_ these points are allocated on each particular
metahuman, but this kind of argument is completely circumstantial. In a
combat intensive game, Trolls are going to be better because of their huge
physical stats (and this is a vast overgeneralisation). In a magic intensive
game, Elves and Dwarfs are by far superior. In different kinds of
circumstances in each style of game each metahuman will find his or her self
suited perfectly. There's no 'better' or 'worse' metahuman to choose, it's
all subjective and circumstantial. In a game where the racist side of
society is played up, nobody'd want to play a Troll, but in a game where
this is less of an issue, then there's no problem. I say they're all pretty
much equivalent myself.

--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong E-mail: adm82@***.edu.au

(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+@ H s++:-- !g p0 !au a19 w+ v(?) C++ US++>+++ P+ L !3
E? N K- W M@ !V po@ Y+ t+ 5 !j R+(++) G(+)('''') !tv(--@)
b++ D B? e+$ u@ h* f+ !r n----(--)@ !y+
Message no. 5
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Optional Character creation system
Date: Wed, 9 Aug 1995 12:42:37 +0200
>>How did you come up with the division of points for the races.
>>Just curious.
>>
>Funny you should ask, 'cause I ask my old GM the same thing. He told me
>Elfs are worth more because out of all the metahuman races they are
>precjudiced against less by humans. Although Trolls and Ork are prejudiced
>a lot by
>humans and elves they get better skill bonuses. Dwarfs because they are
>small are prejudiced against most often, plus their bonuses aren't all that
>great. Does it make any sense.

Not to me, really. If you (and your GM) look at the Attribute bonuses
received by the various metahumans, they all average out at +3 and some
other bonus not directly related to stats (vision, mostly). Making a troll
cost more points than an elf because "they're less discriminated against" is
bullshit in my book... I certainly wouldn't use this character generation
system -- hell I've been trying to get away from people taking elves
"because they're so cool" all the time. Orks are my current favorite :)


Gurth@******.nl - Gurth@***.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Wicked mental dope
GC3.0: GAT/! dpu s:- !a>? C+(++) U P L E? W(++) N K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP-
t(+) 5 X R+++>$ tv+(++) b+@ DI? D+ G++ e h! !r(--) y? Unofficial Shadowrun
Guru :)
Message no. 6
From: Ian Smith <KildTheCat@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Optional Character creation system
Date: Wed, 9 Aug 1995 14:37:21 -0400
>In a game where the racist side of
>society is played up, nobody'd want to play a Troll, but in a >game where
>this is less of an issue, then there's no problem. I say they're >all pretty
>much equivalent myself.

Don't forget that trolls tend to be very prejudiced against breeders too. . .
so there are also advantages, socially speaking, to being a troll. Breeders
don't last very long when they try to get into those trog enclaves in the
Barrens. . .
Message no. 7
From: Sebastian Wiers <seb@***.RIPCO.COM>
Subject: Re: Optional Character creation system
Date: Wed, 9 Aug 1995 15:47:07 -0500
>
> I wrote:
>
> 30 Adept 24 30 400k 150k/50 Elf
> 28 ---- 23 28 300k 115k/40 Troll/Minotaur
> 27 ---- 22 27 150k 90k/35 Ork/Ogre
> 26 ---- 21 26 75k 55k/30 Dwarf
> ____
> >Brian wrote:
> >How did you come up with the division of points for the races.
> >Just curious.
> >
> Funny you should ask, 'cause I ask my old GM the same thing. He told me
> Elfs are worth more because out of all the metahuman races they are
> precjudiced against less by humans. Although Trolls and Ork are prejudiced
> a lot by
> humans and elves they get better skill bonuses. Dwarfs because they are
> small are prejudiced against most often, plus their bonuses aren't all that
> great. Does it make any sense.
> ---Sedah Drol
>
Actually, in our campaign, the higher costs exactlyparalel the more popular
metahuman types.
It would seem not all meta types are created equal. Yes, they all get a basic
+3 to thier stats, and improved vision. By those crititerion, trolls are best
because they get armor and reach.
But, actually, having minuses to stats and lowered racail maximums, turns out
to be a real drag.
and of course, youve all noticed that with allergy's and proirity c, bieng a
meta can pay for itself. But trolls can't usually duplicate a humans stats.
as a matter of fact, all meta's but elves have reduced combat pools.

just some thoughts
sebastain
aka
Mongoose (elven samurai)
Message no. 8
From: "Victor Rodriguez, Jr" <sedahdro@*****.COM>
Subject: Re: Optional Character creation system
Date: Wed, 9 Aug 1995 17:03:00 EST
>>>How did you come up with the division of points for the races.
>>>Just curious.
>>>
>>Funny you should ask, 'cause I ask my old GM the same thing. He told me
>>Elfs are worth more because out of all the metahuman races they are
>>precjudiced against less by humans. Although Trolls and Ork are prejudiced
>>a lot by
>>humans and elves they get better skill bonuses. Dwarfs because they are
>>small are prejudiced against most often, plus their bonuses aren't all that
>>great. Does it make any sense.
>
>Not to me, really. If you (and your GM) look at the Attribute bonuses
>received by the various metahumans, they all average out at +3 and some
>other bonus not directly related to stats (vision, mostly). Making a troll
>cost more points than an elf because "they're less discriminated against" is
>bullshit in my book... I certainly wouldn't use this character generation
>system -- hell I've been trying to get away from people taking elves
>"because they're so cool" all the time. Orks are my current favorite :)
Gurth,
Are you looking at the same chart I'm looking at. Elves are worth 30 pts.
Trolls are worth 28pts. Orks are worth 27 pts. Dwarves are worth 26 pts.
Therefore Trolls are much cheaper than elves, and so are orks. But if you
want to make people pay 40 for elves and 20 for Orks feel free. After all
this system is not written in stone. It's written on paper or in binary
translated into physical icons.

Here a Troll I created with the above mention system
Street Name: Ug
B: 12(14) C:1(3)
Q: 6 (7) I:3 (2)
S: 10(11) W:3(4)(5)
Reaction: 10(12)
Intiative: 3d6+10(12)
Essense: .05
Body Index: 10.75

Skills:
Projectile: 6
Armed: 6
Stealth: 6
Street Ettiquette: 4

Cyberware:
Smartlink
CyberEyes:
Flare Comp
Thermographic
Mag 3
Wired 2
Titanium bone lacing

Bioware:
Platelet factory
Level 3 symbiotes
Level 3 synthacardium
Adrenal Pump Level 1
Cerebal booster level 2
Muscle Aug Level 2
Enhaced Articulation (oh no, not that, who knows what it does now)
Superthyroid gland
Toxin Exhaler (seven-7)
Pain Editor
Tailored pheromones


Here are the points I spent
Magic: 17 (Mundane)
Attribute: 28 (23 pts to distribute amongst attributes)
Skills: 21 (21 pts to distribute amongst skills)
Tech: 40 (1 million nuyen)
Race: 28 (Troll)
Total: 134
not to mention equipment

note: This character would be impossible using the SRII rules.
Message no. 9
From: Jeff Riordan <corwin6@***.NET>
Subject: Re: Optional Character creation system
Date: Wed, 9 Aug 1995 20:15:08 -0400
>
> Not to me, really. If you (and your GM) look at the Attribute bonuses
> received by the various metahumans, they all average out at +3 and some
> other bonus not directly related to stats (vision, mostly). Making a troll
> cost more points than an elf because "they're less discriminated against"
is
> bullshit in my book... I certainly wouldn't use this character generation
> system -- hell I've been trying to get away from people taking elves
> "because they're so cool" all the time. Orks are my current favorite :)
>
>
>
> Gurth@******.nl - Gurth@***.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
> Wicked mental dope
> GC3.0: GAT/! dpu s:- !a>? C+(++) U P L E? W(++) N K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP-
> t(+) 5 X R+++>$ tv+(++) b+@ DI? D+ G++ e h! !r(--) y? Unofficial Shadowrun
> Guru :)

Actually I don't see the Attribute "average Bonus" as being +3. Unless
I've been creating the characters wrong you start out with zeros in all stats.
Hence Trolls Actually start out with a -1 overall stat bonus.
because you Have to spend 2 points in Q and W and at least 3 in C and I.
With Plus 5 B and plus 4 S you still end up -1 for stat creation just to
get 1s in the other areas. Since A is already Assigned to Meta you are somewhat
limited in chosing to got Cyber with low stats or Magic with even lower stats.
Elf race is the only one who doesn't suffer this problem of having Negative
mods to over come just to have a 1 in all stats. I prefer limiting the max
level in a stat for a character then to inflict the additional negative modifier.
And No, I don't play elves.... never have and probably never will. I prefer
human stock although I'm going to be running a Troll next weekend.




----------------------------------------------------------------------
"Never trust a relative. It is far worse than trusting strangers. With
strangers there is a possibility that you might be safe. Of course it
does not apply to me. I am the soul of honor, kindness, mercy and
goodness. Trust me in all things." Prince Corwin "The Guns of Avalon"
Message no. 10
From: "Victor Rodriguez, Jr" <sedahdro@*****.COM>
Subject: Re: Optional Character creation system
Date: Wed, 9 Aug 1995 21:05:00 EST
I just notice an error in the character I used for an example, before
anybody tears it to shread. Please change Body from 12(14) to 11(13) and
Willpower from 3(4)(5) to 4(5)(6). Sorry, I forgot about ratial maximums.
By the way another note the numbers in parenthesis are what the attributes
equal when certain bioware implants are active, except for body where the
number in parenthesis is from titanium bone lacing.
---thank you
Sedah Drol
Message no. 11
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Optional Character creation system
Date: Thu, 10 Aug 1995 11:37:06 +0200
> Are you looking at the same chart I'm looking at.

Oops, this was a typical case of me thinking with my keyboard again. I got
it switched around :( :(


Gurth@******.nl - Gurth@***.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
I'll live through this even if it kills me
GC3.0: GAT/! dpu s:- !a>? C+(++) U P L E? W(++) N K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP-
t(+) 5 X R+++>$ tv+(++) b+@ DI? D+ G++ e h! !r(--) y? Unofficial Shadowrun
Guru :)
Message no. 12
From: "Brian A. Stewart" <bstewart@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Optional Character creation system
Date: Fri, 11 Aug 1995 09:33:12 -0700
----
>>Brian wrote:
>>How did you come up with the division of points for the races.
>>Just curious.
>>
>Funny you should ask, 'cause I ask my old GM the same thing. He told me
>Elfs are worth more because out of all the metahuman races they are
>precjudiced against less by humans. Although Trolls and Ork are prejudiced
>a lot by
>humans and elves they get better skill bonuses. Dwarfs because they are
>small are prejudiced against most often, plus their bonuses aren't all that
>great. Does it make any sense.
> ---Sedah Drol
-----
Yes, I do not agree. But yes, I see your gm's point.

Thanks
Brian
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Essence: It is a descending stream of pure activity which is the dynamic
force of the universe.
-Kabbalah (B.C.E.~1200-~700 A.C.E.)
*****************************************************************
"Nurse Wratchet": bstewart@***.uug.arizona.edu
or brian-stewart@**.arizona.edu
*****************************************************************

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